That's where using smilies comes in very useful.
:)

That is what I was trying to do, but do not enjoy coming under personal attack.  I think it is a shame if we cannot have an adult conversation with sniping at someone with a different view.  I suspect I am not the only person in the country with this view and I have every right to hold them.  What a pity we cannot seem to have civilised convos!

of course I meant to say "without sniping", not with!

Oh.   Do you mean that after all we have done here in defending HRH, we're not going to receive any gongs???? :(

I was getting my hat all ready :D :D :D

Margot ;)

Looks like I am the only person here with an invitation then!

In fact HM also attended the funeral of Winston Churchill.
:)

I think that was because Winston Churchill was one of the only, if not the only, "commoners" to be awarded a state funeral and has of course since been voted the greatest ever Briton, which shows the esteem in which he is held.

I see that further pressure is being put on Charles to help foot the security bill which, apparently, is expected to double to £2m now that the wedding has been put back a day.

is anyone going?

Yes I am as I was on the 'reserves list'. It was incase anybody dipped out last minute so I will report back after the event to tell you all about it ;) :D

Lucy
xx

.are you the "spare"???

Margot (dipping a curtsey....just in case ;)  )

Yes but you can call me Lucy until the situation changes on Saturday and then will be known as 'Your Royal Highness the something or other' as haven't quite decided what I want to be known as yet ! :p

Lucy
xx

Drat! I thought I was higher up the alphabet than you! ;) :D

I obviously mix in higher circles than one does JG :D

Lucy
xx

*mutters resentfully*
;) :D

Might have to part Ex some of the Labs for those Corgi things aswell , does CD have a PX thread one can use ? :D

Lucy
xx

<Winston Churchill was one of the only, if not the only, "commoners" to be awarded a state funeral > Er Winston Spencer Churcil was hardly a commoner being the eldest son of   Lord Randolph Churchill & a member of the Churchill family that has been closely linkd to the Royal Families of England for nearly 400 years. As for being the Greatest ever I'm saying nothing

Erm - even Lady Diana Spencer was a commoner (before she married, of course!)!
:)

He was not royal and was classed officially as a commoner

From The Oxford English Dictionary
Commoner
1.A person who is not born into a position of high social rank

So the 1st born son of a Lord(not Life Peerage) is not of high social rank eh ? Especially as his father was a member of the Acristocracy going back nearly 400 years ! as well as a senior member of the Conservative Party. Definitely only of the common horde wasn't he ? Owning Blenheim Palace to boot quite common & ordinary

Of course once a mistress becomes the wife a *position vacant* becomes available, or so the saying goes ;)
Anyone fancy applying, don`t think one needs be of high social rank, more, one should say *cough* being ameniable???? :D :D

Christine, Spain.

A commoner is a person without a royal title, below the rank of peer.
Churchill was a member of the house of commons, so therefore was a commoner. He wouldn`t accept a peerage because he wanted to continue sit in house of commons, if he`d accepted he wouldn`t have been able to sit there & would have had to sit in house of lords.
Tony Benn, was Lord Stansgate & gave up his title to be able to sit in house of commons, as did Lord Hume & he became Sir Alex Douglas Hume who was once Prime Minister of England.

Is that of any help to anybody????? think I`m madder for answering it
No comments please :D :D

Christine, Spain.

Churchill was born into a socially high ranked family ergo he was not a commoner

Being a commoner & using the term correctly & not as it has been used in the 19th century onwards, has nothing to do with being royal or having a title !

Sadly the terminology started to be used incorrectly as meaning one had to have a "title"if one did not wish to be a commoner

Defintion of common people: commonality, commoners, great unwashed, huddled masses, infrastructure, masses,  multitude, plebians, proletariat, rabble, rank and file, riffraff, the herd, the many, the masses, the working class, vulgus

Antonym-aristocracy

Defintion-elite, gentility, gentry, government, haute monde, high society, nobility, noblesse, patricians, patriciate, peerage, society, upper class, upper crust

One would hardly say the Churchills were ever commmoners at least not in the last 400 years or so & even today

BTW  Hereditary peers were allowed to disclaim their titles, although the only peer to do so and become Prime Minister, Sir Alec Douglas-Home  the 14th Earl of Home,
John Spencer-Churchill, 7th Duke of Marlborough had three sons & Randolph was the third of these
John Winston Spencer-Churchill, 7th Duke of Marlborough (1822-1883)
George Charles Spencer-Churchill, 8th Duke of Marlborough (1844-1892)
Charles Richard Spencer-Churchill, 9th Duke of Marlborough (1871-1934)
John Albert William Spencer-Churchill, 10th Duke of Marlborough (1897-1972)
John George Vanderbilt Spencer-Churchill, 11th Duke of Marlborough (b. 1926)
Heir Apparent: Charles James Spencer-Churchill, Marquess of Blandford (b. November 24, 1955)

As you will see Randolph Spencer Churchill was never the Duke of  Marlborough ! so Churchill never had a peerage to give up, However he was actually The Right Honourable Winston Leonard Spencer Churchill(this is the specific wording used to convey honor to one perceived as a social superior)all his life irrespective of whether he was an MP etc Only the sons of Dukes can be called Lord(unless they are given a peerage)

Sorry to be so perdantic but hereditary peerages are something I have done a paper on in the past-it's funny how many people think that Churchill gave up a peerage to become an MP when in fact he did nothing of the sort, I think the error comes becasue ALL the sons of Dukes are called Lord ---- ------, but only one can inherit the title. Also the terminology of commoner is also incorrcetly used as meaning non royal or royal blood when in fact it means born in to a family of lower social status

The House of the Commons as it should correctly be called was originally meant to have no one of "noble"birth as a member, however as right up until the 1920's the MP's were usually from high social ranking(just not hereditary peers)& their membership was"bought"with little opposition as both Conservative & Liberal parties were both run from the upper house in all but name. In fact some constituencies always elected the son of the previous member in the same way that hereditary titles are inherited

LOL The only title he turned down was to become the Duke of London after the electoral defeat in 1945 he was however knighted in 1953

Winston Churchill's biography, by Piers Brandon states the following:

"I am ready to meet my Maker," Churchill had said on his seventy-fifth birthday; "whether my Maker is prepared for the great ordeal of meeting me is another matter". Churchill remained a member of parliament, though an inactive one, and announced his retirement from politics in 1963. This took effect at the general election the following year. Churchill died on 24 January 1965 - seventy years to the day after the death of his father. He received the greatest state funeral given to a commoner since that of the Duke of Wellington. He was buried in Bladon churchyard beside his parents and within sight of his birthplace, Blenheim Palace.

You will see that Churchill and the Duke of Wellington are described as "commoners".

Also, the Havengore Trust describe Churchill's funeral thus:

The coffin of Sir Winston Churchill was borne on a Gun Carriage drawn by a Gun's crew of naval ratings. The gun carriage, used for four royal funerals, had been stored at H.M.S. Excellent, the Royal Navy gunnery school at Portsmouth. It was built in 1880 and first used for Queen Victoria's funeral. The bodies of Edward VII, George V and George VI were carried on it. This was the first time the carriage has been used for the funeral of a commoner.

I guess it is no surprise then that it could be believed that Churchill was indeed a commoner.

Hi M/M :) I got my definition from consise oxford dictionary 4th edition so blame them if its wrong ;)
And never said Churchill gave up his peerage, more he turned it down. I believe he was offered a peerage it? and said no thanks, or something along those lines ;) ??
But does it really matter, I was only having a light hearted laugh like the last few posts & rememberd what my mum used to say....I always blame her anyway :D

Christine, Spain.

[link http://www.google.co.uk/search?hl=en&lr=&oi=defmore&q=define:commoner]Commoner definition[/link].

According to British law, even Prince William is a commoner. ;)

Edit: Drat! What went wrong there? Sorry, you'll have to copy and paste.