I would just like a little advice from Staffie owners/breeders.  We are thinking of getting two male staffies from the same litter and would like to know your view and advice on this.  We have owned a staffie previously, so know the breed however he was an only dog.  We would like to get two pups however we are bit concerned about the fact some staffies seem not to get on with other dogs and the fact we have been told in the past you should not keep two male staffies.  We would like two, so they can be company for each other when we are not with them however it seems pointless if we have to separate them when we are out.  Your advice would be really appreciated.  The pups wil be ready in approx 4 weeks.

Thanks.

Julie

> We are thinking of getting two male staffies from the same litter

two pups of any sex of any breed is a nightmare that i cannot suggest you avoid enough. they will keep each other company, to the extent that they will not be inclined to listen to you.

consider how much harder it is to deal with a couple of toddlers rather than 1 child.

they will bond more with each other than with you which makes it far harder for you to train them.

In addition to what Astarte has written,

Staffies often dislike other dogs when they are mature, what would you do if they started to fight?  It can and does happen, then you would be faced with vets bills, keeping them separate and eventually rehoming one of them :(

Even if this doesn't happen, in the meantime, they would be much more than twice the work to bring up.  Think realistically of about 4 or 5 times the work.  They would have to be walked separately and together, trained separately and together, this is very time consuming.  Then with toilet training, how will you know which dog has done what so you can reward the one who has performed.  How will you know which one needs a bit of extra toilet training?

I'd say anyone willing to let you have 2 Staff pups together is thinking only of the money and getting rid of the pups.  I doubt there will be much in the way of helpful advice and backup after you've bought the pups :(

Why not wait until one is housetrained and reliably trained and then get another - preferably of the opposite sex?    That way you'll have more chance of success ;)

They are not letting us have them for the money, they could sell them to others for a much higher price than we are paying (friend of a family member) they are just happy they will be going to a good home.

He does have reservations about us taking 2 males as he has 3 staffies himself.  We were thinking of having one of each sex however one of the bitches died and they are keeping the other so that is no longer an option.

I know its going to be hard in terms of training etc, it is the two males living in harmony side by side that I would like advice about.  Does anyone have two male staffies that live together from the same litter and can I leave them in the same room together unsupervised?

Just don't do it please!!! Your life could be hell and even in breeds that do get on and are 'dog friendly' shouldn't have 2 pups together. I certainly would never ever sell 2 pups to one family. Far too many pitfalls and I'm sure everyone on here will be able to relate tales of woe and a final heartbreaking decision!

In all honesty, don't you think if the seller has reservations about you taking two...?????? It really isn't worth the heartache! If you're desperate for another, wait a while, let the first one mature, find out if he is dog friendly, THEN take action? Please!

And NO! You cannot leave them unsupervised, even in gentle breeds I am very wary at leaving them! Things can get out of hand very quickly

> And NO! You cannot leave them unsupervised, even in gentle breeds I am very wary at leaving them! Things can get out of hand very quickly

i am keeping two pups from my litter (a dog and a bitch admittedly-sp-) and they will be left unsupervised for short periods during the day (they will be coming to work with me), but i wont be able to keep an eye on them the whole time. so i dont really see the problem with that as long as they're getting the right amount of training and excercise i dont see why there would be much of a problem with it. the only thing i would be worried about is the fact they're both dogs but (i'm presuming that you wouldn't be offering them as stud dogs) if they were both castrated they wouldn't have much of a problem living together. in my line of work i see lots of dogs who were bought together as pups get along fine. but thats just my opinion :) each to their own and all that :)

You've been given lots of good advice.

I have two siblings together sisters, they are Boxers so another 'bull breed'.
I bred them myself and wasn't intending on ever keeping two from the same litter.

It's been hard work they do tune into each other at times which is really
infuriating especially if only one of you (the humans) seems to be doing all the work.
Also being a bull breed they can be more of a challenge to train and at times can be very stubborn
x that by two lots of stubborn and challenges...and sometime it's just like 'speak to the paw' attitude arrgghh.

They do bond very strongly with each other, to the extent it is quite difficult seperating them as the other creates.
Mine are not just them alone - they have 3 other members in their pack so you'd think they'd be happy with the others
for company. Not so, they seem to want each other as a comforter. You have to consider what happens when one has to be left in the vets for an operation.
Would you be able to/or want to take time off to keep the other company or risk the other being so unhappy at being on it's own that
it howls your house down.

I have been lucky so far in that one is the more dominant of the pair, so as yet I haven't had fighting between them.
If you have two of similar status and not one clear leader you will have fighting as each tries to establish itself as leader of the pairing.
As others have said you may end up having to seperate them if this happens as some will never see eye to eye once they start fighting.
Also do you have a secure home that you could safely seperate the dogs if they do start fighting. Do you have children that may inadvertently leave
open a door etc that the dogs could get to each other and then have a fight. What happens if this starts when you aren't home children wouldn't be able
to stop or seperate the dogs. Would you feel happy about living on tenter hooks with having to shut all the doors and keep one dog in one part of your home
and the other dog in another part of your home. Two different walks, feeding areas, only one dog in the garden at anyone time etc etc.
Some people have found this situation so stressful that they have had to rehome one for their own sanity and for the dogs safety too.

Then you have twice the cost of innoculations, castration, worming, de-fleaing, insuring etc etc all at the same time.

To be honest most people that have come to me for a puppy and have mentioned about having two I always always
advise them to wait to the puppy is approx 18 months old, well trained and all it's problems ironed out, then it's not too long
since you've had to cope through the puppy stage so you haven't forgotten what it entails and you have a good role model
that the puppy can copy and learn from. So toilet training does become easier with the second dog as it follows the older
dog out to toilet etc.
I would never sell two pups to the same home unless I felt 100% certain that the owners would cope, have the commitment to put all the
extra work in if needed and were very experienced in dog ownership and probably breed ownership too so I'd guess there would only be a
very, very small percentage of people that woud fit this criteria. As when Boxers go through the 'kevin stage' boy it's horrible.
Not sure if Staffies go through the same or a similar 'kevin stage'.

i would have to agree with everyone else.
especially as i have been on the receiving end of the situation.
i worked in rescue and a few times people handed in one dog of two that were bought as litter mates,
as they couldnt get the 2 dogs together to respond to them.
any behaviorist or trainer worth their salt would also advise you not to do it.

I can only repeat what others have said - don't do it! I have two litter-brothers myself (unsold pups from my last litter - I wanted to keep a bitch but couldn't possibly have kept three pups!) and it has been much, much, much harder, and not nearly as much fun, as just having one puppy at a time.

Staffies in particular must (according to the experts) be separated when alone, so not much company for each other then.

I know of someone who had two staffie brothers, fine whilst young but started fighting when they got towards maturity.  She ended up having to rehome one.

Apart from Staffies not being easy male to male, let me tell you about my dogs. I have 3 set of littermates -none of them were planned but this happens when you breed, sometimes you have to keep an extra pup from a large litter if the right home does not come along.

In the first litter the two pups are now 6 ½ years old, one dog, one bitch. They are utterly devoted to each other and nothing means more to them than their littermate. I.e. they bonded to each other instead of to people.  In the same litter another person had two littermates, one of which died last week of cancer. The one that is left behind is distraught, never having been without his sister before, and it worries me a LOT that one day I will have the same problem.

The second set is again dog and bitch, and they are fine, no problems whatsoever. Why? Because I only kept the bitch as a pup, the dog was sold but was returned to me aged 18 months. Hence they grew up apart and bonded with people instead of each other. Perfect! But you can of course not PLAN to send one pup away for 18 months.....

The third set again dog and bitch, and they are only 14 weeks old yet. (Again last pup did not find a home, it was a large litter of ten.) It's a NIGHTMARE. Total, utter nightmare. Getting one puppy housetrained is hard work, but two? Virtually impossible. These two are not really interested in people at all, they have each other. I am having to take each one out for training and socialisation on their own -they have to be split up both from each other and from other dogs and it is very, VERY hard work. In fact it is harder work than having a baby -and I've had 3 of them in my life so I do know.

I wouldn't wish littermates on my worst enemy!

I own Staffords Julie and my best advice is not to get two pups, especially not two males that you want as company for each. You will have to seperate them, even if they get on like the best mates in the world you can never be 100% sure and it is never worth taking the risk that you could come home and find one or both of them dead.

I would get one, let it grow up (Staffords never get past that Kevin stage I dont think lol) then when your dog is about a year to 18 months old get another one if you are ready to, and get a female as they are morelikely to get on better. I would still keep them seperated though, even dogs and bitches have been known to argue.

Best of luck with your new arrival, enjoy the one you do get, he will benefit so much more from your one on one time and training rather than having to share all the attention.

Staffords definitely need human company more than other dogs.

Think you're in the minority! I think you have been very lucky, but here we are talking about Staffies, a bull breed...read everyone elses opinion...they feel the same way I do, it just might work, but are they prepared to live with the consequences if it doesn't??

I  have four staffords 1 male and three females, i also had a male bulldog, when my male bulldog got to maturity all hell broke loose with him and my male stafford, i would strongly not recommend you have two males when you have staffords.  My male is the most gentle great temperment type dog out the house loves all dogs and human, but trust me just does not work in the house.  I know of other stafford people, who have to keep there dogs completely away from each other in the same house, so doors having to be kept shut and cages one in one out.  Its hard work, what i would recommend is buy in a male pup and then for the next couple of years research and buy in a bitch puppy.
Good luck with what you decide to do.

Angela x

Julie.. my advice would be as everyone else - DONT do it!

I have two staffords, one male one female.

I would very strongly advise against getting two litter mates to start with, the fact that they're both male could just double your trouble.
As someone has already said, your first stafford puppy will benefit so much more from your individual attention.

I would also advise not to do it, the training issues and the human to dog bonding would be affected unless you have a lot of time for one to one, in which case what is the point in getting two? As they would need to be seperated for much of the time to get two well behaved well balanced dogs.

Secondly, you must not ask does anyone have two Staff males together to see if it can work out. It may work out it may not, the breed can be intolerant of other males, it would depend on the characters which you could not know until they are adults.

What you do need to ask and take into consideration is not can I have two males, but can I have two male pups together?

This causes huge problems as they would be the same age, there is no heirarchy which dogs adhere to, you would have two babies jostling for the top position, to start with it would be games and play fighting, they would get along well, you'd probably think they were great buddies, but then they get to be teenagers, same with all species they need their pecking order and then play fights become real fights, become often re-homing of one of them if there is no real leader in size or character, if they are both evenly matched the fights would become extremely serious.

I would never recommend two pups together the future is too uncertain, they look cuddly now, but give it a few months it is a different story.

I would only ever risk it with a dog and bitch pup and only if I knew I had the time and patience to do justice to both pups serparetly.

The time and effort we put into our pups moulds that finished adult, having a well behaved, well balanced, obediant dog is only down to what we put into them, if we don't take the time to do it properly, we have an adult dog with all sorts of problems, by all means have two dogs but put everything into raising a pup at a time, that is best served doing each dog with a 1-2 year age difference. :-)

Hi Julie

not a Staff owner but like the many of the others replying I would strongly advise against getting two pups of any breed at any time due to training, socialising and lack of bonding with their humans first and foremost.  Added to that males in the breed of your choice are not renowned for getting along with their own s@x and hopefully you will realise that even very experienced owners of Staffs and others with multi dog households are thinking of your best interests in recommending you only buy one puppy at this stage.

One dog is more than enough even in experienced hands until fully trained and mentally mature - in most breeds that's a minimum of 2 years, some upwards of 3 years :)   Most family pets are singletons or have been for some time before a playmate is added to the mix so please don't assume that having another pup for company is in any way necessary to your new addition.  The most important issues are that you spend quality time with the pup yourself and ensure that it is never left unattended for longer than a couple of hours in the first few months of it's life in order to establish good house training and avoid destructive behaviour.

I hope you're open to the advice offered and that you don't let your heart rule your head :)

best wishes, Teri

I'm afraid I'm with the others - we got 2 different breed spaniels at the same time, when they were 3.5 years they started to fight and now we have to keep them apart just in case they kick off again. In our case it was likely to do with the bitch puppy we had bought who was then 5 months old, but I have heard so many stories of siblings or similar age dogs fighting as adults. As long as your puppy is exercised and played with when you are home, he will be fine while you are out (within reason), and then you can get a bitch to keep him company when he's 18 months old or so. :-)

Alternatively of course, there are innumerable Staffords languishing in rescues around the country. Maybe when your pup is settled and house-trained, you could look for an older bitch to keep him company?

M.

i agree with everyone please dont get 2 pups together. and as i have sbts myself i would not advise to have 2 males in the same house unless you are prepared to keep them seperate or be prepared to pull them apart when they have a fight not an easy task when 2 staffs are in a scrap
my advise would be to have one of the pups and then after 18 mths or so if you still feel you need another dog get one then. 

When I first got my EBT my friend also got a black lab. Mine Snoop was 12 wks & Samson my friends was 14 wks.
She had booked a holiday abroad for a fortnight- so asked me and my family to move into her house and puppy sit so I had both boys together.

As she had a pupped out area with bed/ toys behind a gate that's where they both stayed over night, well it took the English bull terrier about 3 days of savage teeth gnashing to be front at the baby gate so much that poor Samson would be about 3 ft behind him, Snoop defended that gate with so much attitude- little flying leaps at Samson's face also in the front room the beanbag became the bed of choice Snoop won that also...

They looked great together 'playing' but with my bull terriers dominant personality bullied a chilled out lab to death. At such a young age it was funny as they only had baby teeth and never had a fight-they were babies- but I could see who would be top dog. Which with age and hormones only lead to serious heartache in the long run.

Please listen to the advice 2 pups just cause twice as much mess. Best to get one boy first, train that one up so brill dog- then later on get a companion.
You never know the personality of a young dog so your lad might be a laid back sort so I would wait and see.
However I know what terriers can be like! I do own 2 boys & a bitch now but Snoop is now 9 years old. But still the boss!