Hello, just a quick question...

If I was to adopt a dog how would I be able to get it used to horses? I plan to train as an equine dentist and also adopt a dog and take it to work with me (plus I would eventually get my own horse and take the dog to the yard with me). I wouldn't want it running about around the horses but what I would mostly be worried about is if it started barking and trying to chase. The most likely type I would adopt would be a sighthound but if another dog from a rescue took my fancy I might go for something else- more than likely large size. I would really like to rescue but I would consider a pup if it's likely to be very difficult with an adult- the last thing I would want is to upset any horses or run the risk of the dog being kicked. The adoption wouldn't be for a while yet (need to get the business up and running first).

Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks.

Hi

It totally depends on the horses to be honest - they are bigger and can cause most damage.  My chum's welsh cob is fine with dogs, and my dogs think he is just a big dog and have walked between his legs (not something I would advise, I was frantic at the time). Obviously a calm breed of dog (or a calm dog) is one you want.  Also a dog that won't mind sitting int the car on it's own for a short time.  Farms and rural areas are prone to rabbits and cats etc so I am not sure how you would cope with a sighthound if you were going to have it loose - you would have to make sure you have complete recall.  It will also depend on the property you are visiting, many say that all dogs must be on a lead.  My mate is a self employed mobile groom/dog walker so gets around and would like a dog herself.

I don't know if I have any advice, I don't go near horses after being kicked by one ;-) but I used to walk past them regularly. At first my dogs were frightened to go near, but as the weeks went on they would get closer to them (on a lead) until they eventually would touch noses. I think it would depend on the dog and the horse, and how much time you had to let them get used to one another.

I think the most important thing to train the dog to respect the horses.. ie keep a safe distance and absolutely no barking. I grew up with horses and dogs and we never once had a problem, however we always kept a watchful eye if the horses were having a funny five minutes and the dogs looked like they wanted to join in!! I can't really think of how we specifically trained our dogs to behave around the horses, it was almost like they instinctively respected them.

If you are getting a rescue I would definitely take it for a trial run around horses and see how it goes. Keep in mind that horses are funny characters and even the most reliable can get a bee in their bonnet over the smallest thing. I have heard of many a dog getting kicked/trampled... which IMO can be avoided by keeping closer tabs on the dog.

Best of luck becoming an equine dentist... you won't be making any friends of the horsey variety any time soon- mine HATED having their teeth done, the most head strong of the lot had to be sedated which was a complete nightmare! Very interesting job though :-)

PS: Kinda unrelated and gross, but my dogs used to come running when the farrier arrived- they scavenged the bits of hoof that were cut off and used to chew them for days. Filthy!!! :-P

To be completely honest I don't think a sighthound is best suited for the sort of life you want to lead. Sighthounds love their comfort too much to want to be in a van in the middle of winter while you're working. They like to chase too much for most stable yards which usually have cats, often chickens, almost always other dogs. They love to be near you so wouldn't be content sitting a distance away while you work. They hate to be tied up, but couldn't be trusted off lead as you wouldn't be paying them full attention while rasping a horses teeth.....I just can't see it working. I know several zoi people who have horses too and none of them leave the dogs wandering while doing anything with the horses.

Now a collie would love that life, they'd happily sit in a van all day, or wander round different stable yards, skulking past the horses and ignoring the cats. They'd lie a distance away watching you work, although they may want to 'help' now and again too. (help to a collie could mean nipping a young horse that won't stand still!!)

Stormy...I actually used to gather up the trimmings after my horse had a visit from the farrier and take them home for the dogs :-)

We've never had issues with our dogs around horses but then they were pups and raised around them.
My current had a silly spurt with them when very little and got kicked and now stays well away from their rear ends. He also loves to hoof clippings after the farrier has been and chews for hours on the remains.

I'm sure a rescue centre can do the relevant checks to see if any dogs which take your fancy are good around horses. I know some rescue centres have horses as well as the small creatures..

IMO i would contact breed rescue of the relevant breed your interested in and ask their opinion, failing that i would consider a pup where you can raise it and train it to what you require.

Good luck.

BTW, we have Jacks and a Bernese and used to have a Lab. Other people who keep their horses have chi's, poms, spaniels and a staffy, all dogs are good around horses.

I think most sensible dogs would know not to take on a horse. 

My 2 chows have a very high prey drive but are fine with my MIL's horses.  I introduced them on a lead first and they tried to sniff noses,  when I let them off the lead one just ignored them and the other was wagging his tail, whining and trying to make friends. 

The only scarey time was when they squeezed under the sheep fencing into a neighbours field where there were 2 small ponies, the ponies came over to see what was going on and my guys were really panicked and got cornered.  Luckily for them they squeezed back under as the ponies were a bit put out. 

I've now learnt that sheep proof fencing is not the same as Chow proof fencing so I avoid that field :-D

My two dogs were brought up around horses but when they went through their teenage phases they would run across the field and bark at the them. They both went through this phase even though they are five years apart.

When they got to about two they grew out of this and just ignored the horses.  

I would suggest that you adopt an older dog. 

Hi,

The best way to get a dog used to horses would be if you have access to a calm horse or pony that could be tied up in a yard with a haynet or something and keep the dog onlead at a distance that it isn't too interested and feed the dog lots of yummy treats, reward all calm behaviour.  When the dog is relaxed at that distance then gradually decrease the distance.  That way the dog will start to build up a good association with the horse. 

When the dog is relaxed and can be up close to the horse then would be a good time to enlist the help of someone else to walk the horse/pony along with you walking the dog, again rewarding for all calm relaxed behaviour.  If you have access to more than one horse/pony that you could do this with after the first then it would be a good idea so that the dog can generalise this behaviour to other horses.

When the dog is calm around them in general then take him/her to the edge of a field on a loose lead where the horses aren't restricted and will be moving about natuarally and go through the same process of rewarding calm behaviour.

Depending on the nature of the dog will depend on how long it takes, some aren't interested in horses.  I've got both my girls used to horses in a similar way, one of themweas scared of horses and the other thinks anything that moves is fair game to chase.  That said I would never have either of them loose around horses that I didn't know, they would always be on a lead.

HTH :-)

I have to say that generally speaking  I do think a sighthound would be the wrong dog for the job, because I suspect at some time it would want to chase whatever was in the various stableyards - hens, ducks, foals, whatever. I think for this sort of thing one needs to try for a breed by looking perhaps at what the dgo was originally bred for and then see if that can happily adapt for the job you have in mind :)

I think it will be a lucky dog that find you, as long as it is the correct dog for the job IYSWIM! :) :)

The other issue is that although many dogs can be trained to be good with horses, often horses are suspicious of dogs. My friend owns a flatcoat and a golden and owns 2 horses, and one horse has never really accepted the dogs and will chase them even now after about 7 or so years. And these are her own horses who see her well trained dogs most days.

Mind you, you could of course leave the dog in the car if the horse was not dog friendly (but be aware of thieves!).

Good luck

Lindsay
x

> Now a collie would love that life, they'd happily sit in a van all day, or wander round different stable yards, skulking past the horses and ignoring the cats. They'd lie a distance away watching you work, although they may want to 'help' now and again too. (help to a collie could mean nipping a young horse that won't stand still!!)
>

I disagree with that, i have seen collies trying to heard children and all sorts of animals lots of times which a horse wouldn't take too kindly too.
I have a friend (the owner of the stud we use), who keeps the sheep and horses seperate.. and the collie can only be let near the sheep as it will try and herd the horses.. the labradors on the other hand get on fine with the horses

I think your best bet is to get a very calm domesticated dog, maybe a dog 5 years + ... especially if you want to take it to work with you

I have had horses and dogs together all my life and not had a problem so far...but they do need to be correctly trained not to chase or bother them or they will come off worse.
I have mostly had Goldens so are pretty easy to teach.
once a horse chases or turns on a dog they learn quickly to keep out of the way.....but one of mine didnt get out the way quick enough one day and got broken toes,she was very wary after that.

we always have them at 8 weeks of age so they are brought up with horses from the start of their life,not sure how a rescue dog could react you would have to keep a watchful eye as horses are so unpredictible.

A girl I knew could not cope with her 3 yr old border collie Phoenix anymore due to her having a baby and him being a farm breed dog was very high energy.  A good mate was interested in getting a dog for a while and asked me to help, she didn't want the hassle of a young puppy to raise so I put them in touch with Phoenix's owner, my friend said she would take him on, but it all depended on Phoenix and how he would cope with her horses- she worked every day with training young hunters- so we went out on the horses and took the dog with us and he was fantastic with them, he kept an healthy distance away and lived with his second owner til he was 16 years old. Only thing my friend did was clip his coat as with his long hair became very muddy all the time but he had a fantastic life.
Getting a rescued dog will be a great idea and they will let you check that this dog will cope with farm animals first.

My dog was only 5 months old when I took him to meet horses for the first time and sadly was left with my ex BF while I went riding. I came back to a terrified BF and pup as Snoop had gone into a field to have a look at this 17hh 3 year old colt and ended up being chased by him!  My then BF was terrified of horses and just shouted/screamed from the fence so that transferred to Snoop and stuffed him up for life with any horse- so he is still a nightmare around horses all due to fear. So that is the wrong way lol

My little mongrel bitch I have now is brilliant with all farm animals- as I was the one who introduced her to them when she was about 2 yrs. She is far more intelligent than Snoop well he is a bull terrier so he can't help that :-)

We have some Border Terriers, who have been around horses since they were puppies, and they also follow us out hacking/driving, they seem to know not to go near horses, ours will lie around the stables/ courtyard, and not bother with them , the horses are getting older too, and been used to dogs since they were young, but i would recommend being around Horses that are used  to dogs.
Our Border Collie at the stables used to try and nip the horses heels, and she has a few kicks, but she still did it!
Depending on the breed of dog you decide on also, some have more herding instinct than others!!

I have 5 dogs and live in the new forest so ponies are about all the time on our walks - 4 of my dogs (2 springers, and 2 terriers) dont bother with ponies at all, they just carry on as normal BUT my little 2 yr old terrier is a nightmare. She runs up to them screaching and barking and if they run then the chase is on and she will not come back til she thinks we're too far away. She is the same with cows also. She has been used to walking within the forest and seeing ponies ever since she was allowed out but nothing stops her, even on a lead she is a screachy hyper mess and cannot be calmed till she cant see them anymore.

Hence now she is kept on a lead unless we can see far enough to know that no ponies are around.

We did not train our others to ignore the ponies they just seemed to learn not to bother them so I'm not sure how to get our youngest as seeing them as a threat or prey or where she has learnt it from - i bred her so know she has no other influence as a young puppy.

luckily when I had mine as pups a lady who had a horse let my two sit down and both horse and dog sniffed each other, decided they coud not eat each other and my two have ignored horses, and cows for that matter since then. Jake eyes up sheep but as a BC he would but never moves towards them off lead or on lead just lays down and eyeballs them. I think possibly a younger dog may train easier but thats I guess, someone else will advise better than me. But thats what I did in an area that has cows and a bridle way. Familiarity may be all a dog needs to put the horse in non play, non eat position.

mm

Im not sure that this is a realistic idea ...

Most yards don't allow dogs on them. Those that do may well have their own dogs and these may well not be friendly to your prospective new dog.

Whilst you are working all your attention is going to be on the horse, or the horses owner or the yard manager/owner.. the bulk of your wage is going to come from multiple horse owners who call you out to do lots at once.... which implys fairly big, busy yards - racing yards, big full livery yards, riding schools... all places fraught with danger for a dog relatively unsupervised... and whilst youd be present, will your clients be happy wiht you constantly having to stop to deal with your dog?

On the face of it, it sounds wonderful for a dog but honestly, the majority of 'dog on yard' scenarios are causing someone annoyance at best, and at worst... someone gets hurt. Dogs learn also when their owner is nto paying attention and will pee off, find something better to do, or bark... none of that is good for business.

So likely your dog would spend a lot of time in the car or van, in winter thats going to be cold.. in summer not possible.

I have a Shetland and a donkey at home and a horse on a yard.  My GSD was only introduced to equines at 7 yrs old and she really doesn't like them, she puts up with the 2 at home but I would never take her to the yard (I know she'd hate it, and just end up causing trouble!).  However, my 12 mth Leo who has been brought up with horses is fantastic with them (with very little input from me apart from a gradual introduction i.e. pony tied up and him on lead).  He plays with the Shetland (they're about the same size!) and keeps a safe distance from the donkey (unless he's being cheeky and stealing a carrot!).  Both the Shetland and the donkey are very good with both my dogs and completely ignore them wandering around, but god help a strange dog that dares set foot in their paddock!  I also took my Leo to the yard for the first time last week and he was impeccably behaved - he stayed a respectable distance from all the horses, didn't hassle anyone, played nicely with the other dogs, and kept coming to find me if I wandered out of sight! 

I guess what I'm trying to say is it really depends on the individual dog/horse.  But from my experience I would think it's harder to introduce an older dog to a lifestyle like this.

I've got three horses and a donkey. I also run a dog rescue, so naturally all my dogs are used to horses. I am pretty sure there must be a rescue in the UK who has both dogs and horses?

Just to clarify cos i think my post might have been a little unclear...

I dont think its a problem teaching a dog, most dogs, rescue or not, adult or pup, to behave sensibly around horses.

What is a problem is expecting every horse that dog then meets, in a potentially less supervised situation (the owner is working after all..) to be fine, calm and sensible around dogs.

You just cant expect a dog to be steady and calm if it comes across a horse who behaves like an utter lunatic and unfortunately there are a lot of horses out there who do when faced with a strange dog.

Sighthounds especially are not known for reacting calmly when faced with a half ton of terrified, pratting about horse, in fact my oldie who is steady with horses (though not if they might eat her...)... will still find one boinging around in fear extremely tempting to chase and she would if she thought for a single second that i wasnt actually 'in charge' (ie looking!).

So yes, horse proofing a dog can be done.

No i dont think its sensible to expect this to be safe when workign with other peoples animals on other peoples property and the owner cannot have their full attention on the dog.

I think the most important point made is that the kind of job your are talking about needs 100% concentration on the horse, I've not met a horse yet that didn't get worried or fidget about when having it's teeth rasped.  That won't allow you any concentration for what your dog is doing and like I said I would never have my girls who are reliable around horses off lead with horses that I/they didn't know.  Even when they are off lead around horses they do know they have my complete focus, as it only takes one kick to cause serious injury or worse.

I do think it is possible with the right kind of dog to have a dog traveling with you.  If you give them walk/play/training breaks in between each appointment and make sure your van is suitably equipped.  I work with dogs and have my girls with me all year round, my van is set up to make sure they are comfortable and safe in the summer and winter.  The top of my van is covered with sun screens that I can roll down so the top and sides of the van are covered and then I put another over the screen.  I've bought adapters and an auxiliary battery so that I can have regular size fans aswell as vents etc and they have cooling mats.  My van is cooler for them in the summer than my house is.  In the winter the same applies except the fan switches to a heater and they have snuggles safe heat pads aswell as coats.  They always have water and a kongs/chews available. They are never left for more than half an hour at a time.

That said it really needs to be the right kind of dog and you really need to go that extra mile to make sure the dog is safe in the vehicle.  You would still need to make sure your dog is safe and comfortable around the horses as nobody is going to be happy with a dog reacting in a vehicle near by.

I think you just really need to be 100% sure it's practical and that you'll have the time to attend to the needs of a dog while your working

That is the kind of thing I meant- sorry if everyone had images of me turning up at a yard and letting the dog run about mad amongst the horses. I've seen how a loose dog can set back a horse and potentially cause a rider injury. The main horse proofing I would want would be near my own horse (when I get one) on a hack and in view of other horses but by no means anywhere near me or the horse I was working on's feet! The dog would not be left to wander around a strange yard on his own. But I would need the dog not to go ballistic at the mere sight of a horse in the distance. It would take a long time to get to the stage where I would be ready to adopt- have to head off to Australia or New Zealand to do the course for 3 months at least! Then there's starting up the business, buying equipment, transport, insurance etc. The dog would be a travelling companion and a friend and would be made comfortable. The main concerns I had were if it could be done with an older dog and if certain breeds were more inclined to get on with equine shaped animals! If it was the height of summer I would probably leave the dog home and get a dog walker to look in on him during the day.

Thanks for your responses anyway people.. lots of food for thought.