Well, we changed from royal canin to burns just over two weeks ago, since then my dog has lost weight and developed small scabs (arond 20 now) He started vomiting this morning so I took him to the emergency vet.  He may have eaten something he shouldnt have which has made him sick today, I have to wait and see how he gets on over the weekend BUT we think the scabs and the weight loss could be due to change of food.  I've learnt a valuabe lesson 'if it aint broke. dont try fix it'  He was fine on his previous food but wanting the best for my dog I took someones advice/opinion who I looked up to, the other food may suit their dogs better but not mine, from now on hes staying on the food I chose regardless of who thinks what is better.

> He was fine on his previous food but wanting the best for my dog I took someones advice/opinion who I looked up to, the other food may suit their dogs better but not mine

It's so easy to be swayed by recomendations and seeing how well other dogs do on a particular food, but as you've found that doesn't mean it will suit your dog!

I hope your dog is better soon xx

Angelz if you look around the feeding forum here,there are many reports of dogs losing weight and developing dry skin ,due to low fat/protein content of the food,amongst other issues.I wouldn't recommend Burns to anyone.. There are many better foods out there than Burns and RC.

>'if it aint broke. dont try fix it'

I hate this saying.. And this isn't directly directed at you angelz,but at those few who love to bandy about this adage.
But how do you KNOW it ain't broke if you don't even TRY to fix it? It just seems like such an apathetic, defeatist attitude. Why not try to make improvements, and better your dog's life, if there is a chance of doing it?

> Why not try to make improvements

Because, as the poster has found out, you can make a perfectly fit dog unwell.

I still wouldn't throw in the towel after one food,especially not a particularly decent food...

You don't need a towel when you are not in any fight with your dogs condition :-)

I know what you mean Ktee and I do also understand why some people say it BUT for me it is like people who stop smoking after years doing it not because of any obvious problems but just they know it is really bad for their their health , after stopping they then suffer from a cough for 6 months due to the change in the body. The persons doctor doesn't say you better go back to doing what you were doing before the cough IE smoking. 

Sometimes everyone including dogs experience problems with changes.

Hi Angelz,

What made you change in the first place? Was it just the recommendation for Burns?

I personally don't like Burns , the rice content in Burns is really a bit too mcuh considering the price as much as 70% in some bags.  I think the Burns is more expensive that the RC also.    

Yes, I only changed because of the reccomendation, I think you just feel like you want to give your dog the best and when someone says you arnt it makes you feel bad and so you change as you feel its the best thing for the dog.  I was told that higher % protein in foods meant that the protien was of poorer quality and Burns being a lower protien meant a higher quality meat was used in it plus all the other stuff like hypo-allergenic, holistic and free from artificial flavourings, colourings and preservatives.

>I've learnt a valuabe lesson 'if it aint broke. dont try fix it'  He was fine on his previous food but wanting the best for my dog I took someones advice/opinion who I looked up to, the other food may suit their dogs better but not mine, from now on hes staying on the food I chose regardless of who thinks what is better.

I learned that the hard way too. I changed my dog's diet to one with a high level of fresh meat and veg (just as I'd read being recommended) and he ended up requiring emergency lifesaving surgery for a problem caused directly by the new diet. I know now not to be swayed by anonymous internet 'experts'.

Blue, we are talking about a perfectly nutritious food not smoking.  

If your dog is doing well on a food that you can afford then what is the point of changing it.

Have changed my mob onto Burns lately to try to get some weight off, I know from past experiance they do well on it with good body conformation but very little weight. Once I am happy with the weight I will be putting them back onto AG because that suits my pocket better.

Dog food is a mine feild, you have low protein, low fat, low carbs, low purine and high protein, bla bla bla every kind of food is avaible all ment to be the best for your dog and costing from 7quid for 15kg to 70 quid. But every dog is different and has different needs depending on breed, lifestyle and medical history. As well as every owner having different opions on ethics, additives and persevitives, time to prepare food and money to spend on food, and if like me a dalmatian owner its even more complacated as our dogs are unique with there diegestion systems. I have spent hours reading on the net about food trying to decide am i giving my pair the right food, reserched alot of foods ingreadiants and how there made/tested and still have no idea if i am feeding the best food for my pair lol. Burns is a good food for dalmatians as its high in rice low in meat (some reason dallys thrive on rice think its to do with their diet in acient Egypt) however other breads may struggle to get enough protein out of it for there needs. I would say dont give up yet and try Arden grange lamb and rice. http://www.ardengrange.com/Pet-Food/dog-food.asp?id=24
as for protein most things have it in them but not all protein is digestible, Meat is most easy to digest for dogs then you have the rice/potato then cereals and veg i know that feathers protein cant be digested but will still count towards the overall protien in the food so a cheap food that has meat byproducts in and says 25% protien may only have 12% that is able to be used by the dog.
Like i said mine feild but if your worried about the protein try a different brand with higher protein % and a named meat or meat meal as the main ingrediant eg lamb or chicken

>I was told that higher % protein in foods meant that the protien was of poorer quality and Burns being a lower protien meant a higher quality meat

Not true at all

I always thought burns was a good food and my dog did ok on it but with many dietry improvements there is the bad which comes before the good as in blue's smoking analogy.  the same goes with detox diets and often any diet.  Cutting out carbs and processed food can cause blinding headaches, skin outbreaks, lethargy etc but it doesn't mean that a carb heavy diet is the way to go to avoid this.

>I changed my dog's diet to one with a high level of fresh meat and veg (just as I'd read being recommended) and he ended up requiring emergency lifesaving surgery for a problem caused directly by the new diet.

Obviously there was something very wrong with your dog to begin with.Most dogs don't need "emergency lifesaving surgery" due to a change in diet. The majority of healthy canines shouldn't have a problem with a new food,or a variety of different foods.

>I know now not to be swayed by anonymous internet 'experts'.

Unless,that is,you agree with them....

> Obviously there was something very wrong with your dog to begin with.Most dogs don't need "emergency lifesaving surgery" due to a change in diet.

Ktee, you are perfectly aware of the tendancy of Dalmatians as a breed to urinary stones and yes,

>The majority of healthy canines shouldn't have a problem with a new food,or a variety of different foods. :-)

Isabel.

who is " WE"      I dont think I was responding to you or any of the " we" s whoever they may be..

My reply to was Ktee and she was very clear what she said which is what I replied to

She said >'if it aint broke. dont try fix it'  I hate this saying..

My reponse was just to that to her comments about the saying :-)

I noticed Isabel both Ktee and I both replied to the poster about her direct question and passed comments on just that the QUESTION.  You replied and only past comments on what Ktee had to say and didn't even reply to the poster.  Don't see the point in that at all except to start a debate . Why not just stick to the post and reply to the question without pulling peoples replies to bits. :-)

> Why not just stick to the post and reply to the question without pulling peoples replies to bits.

Quite ;-)

I always thought burns was a good food and my dog did ok on it but with many dietry improvements there is the bad which comes before the good as in blue's smoking analogy.  the same goes with detox diets and often any diet.  Cutting out carbs and processed food can cause blinding headaches, skin outbreaks, lethargy etc but it doesn't mean that a carb heavy diet is the way to go to avoid this.

Good post it may help the poster deciding whether to continue to change as it does often take a few weeks  :-) ( although it looks like she has decided to go back to what she was on and of the two I do think the RC better)

As a general rule I dont mind most foods but I just think one or two foods are so so expensive and then when you read the ingredients makes it worse. I think most could replicate Burns dog food in the kitchen for a fraction of the price.

>and didn't even reply to the poster.  Don't see the point in that at all except to start a debate .

Thanks Blue,and don't worry I'm wise to the games being played here... I've made my comments to the OP,and if she needs any further clarification I'll be happy to answer.
As for the debates with the same old people,I've made a concerted effort to stay out of those  of late,they are boring,unhelpful and go nowhere,except to a pot of trouble!

Blue, I think you may be going off topic here.  The OP has not posted looking for a change of food but rather to comment on the dangers of changing diet when the dog does not require it.

Yes, I only changed because of the reccomendation, I think you just feel like you want to give your dog the best and when someone says you arnt it makes you feel bad and so you change as you feel its the best thing for the dog.  I was told that higher % protein in foods meant that the protien was of poorer quality and Burns being a lower protien meant a higher quality meat was used in it plus all the other stuff like hypo-allergenic, holistic and free from artificial flavourings, colourings and preservatives.

Been there and done it myself Angelz over the years and I agree we do it because it makes us feel we are doing the very best we can for our dogs. Most people will have done the same.

The protein Vs Carbs, holistic and all the other wording it a mind field at times, I hold my hands up and change my mind often about different foods after trials and errors.

> the same goes with detox diets and often any diet.  Cutting out carbs and processed food can cause blinding headaches, skin outbreaks, lethargy etc but it doesn't mean that a carb heavy diet is the way to go to avoid this.

Wouldn't gradually 'weaning' your dog onto a new food prevent these types of problems? I have changed my dogs food a couple of times, taking over a week to gradually wean over, both times I have not been happy with the rusults after giving the new food a few weeks trial, I found no imidiate issues, but in time found changes in skin, coat  & stool conditon (for the worse). 'Detox' type problems are normally associated with a sudden change in food aren't they?

This is a genuine question, I am not trying to agrravate anybody

>> Wouldn't gradually 'weaning' your dog onto a new food prevent these types of problems? I have changed my dogs food a couple of times, taking over a week to gradually wean over, both times I have not been happy with the rusults after giving the new food a few weeks trial, I found no imidiate issues, but in time found changes in skin, coat  & stool conditon (for the worse). 'Detox' type problems are normally associated with a sudden change in food aren't they?

I don't know if the OP did a sudden or gradual change but toxins can take a while to be removed from the body.  The toxins will be eliminated ( assuming animals are not totally different to people) in urine, stools, breath and through the skin.  When I fed burns I recall a lot of the literature on the site and that they sent through related to problems like excess shedding, ear problems, itching, wind etc was linked to poor nutrition.

I am not a nutritionist but would say that if someone has tried something and it isn't working don't keep on doing it.  That is my common sense hat rather than a nutritionist hat ;)  With regards to your first point, I suspect that gradually introducing a new food should reduce any problems linked to changing a diet.

Hi Angelz

To go back to your original post "stick to what food suits your dog - lesson learnt" - I do hope that your dog is now improving.   As you say, he might have picked up a bug of some sort, but like you, I would be thinking that it's all my fault - I changed his diet, etc etc etc.

If he was flourishing on RC, and the only reason you were changing his food was on the recommendation of a friend, whose dog seems better on another, then I too would revert to the RC.

There will always be people who swear by certain foods - and it seems to me, often the more obscure, the better - but I too feed what suits my particular dogs - even if it does mean that I have four or five different basic foods on the go at any one time!  

Hope he's feeling better soon - and don't feel guilty - you were doing what you thought best for your dog - and that's what you have to do!

Margot

Thanks for that cheekycow :)
I had never thought of a possible detox-effect when changing dog foods, but as I have always gradually weaned over it seems that shouldn't be the reason for the unwanted effects I've found.

I think you are quite righe mastifflover.  I can understand alcohol and drug detoxification but I cannot see why you would need to detoxify from a perfectly healthy diet.

> I think you are quite righe mastifflover.  I can understand alcohol and drug detoxification but I cannot see why you would need to detoxify from a perfectly healthy diet.

it is only healthy if it suits you Isabel.

> it is only healthy if it suits you Isabel.

Oh yes, anybody or animal could have an intolerance for something in their diet but that is different to the idea that food can build up toxins in the body. UK food should not contain any toxins that a healthy body cannot safely deal with as explained in the link I have given.

>Obviously there was something very wrong with your dog to begin with.

Not in the slightest - unless of course you think that being a dalmatian is 'something very wrong'.

>>I know now not to be swayed by anonymous internet 'experts'.
>Unless,that is,you agree with them....

Again, not at all. I'll listen to genuine experts with experience and not just theory, and whose real names and qualifications are known.

> There will always be people who swear by certain foods - and it seems to me, often the more obscure, the better - but I too feed what suits my particular dogs - even if it does mean that I have four or five different basic foods on the go at any one time!  
>
>

I'll agree with this train of thought.  I feed different foods to my different breeds, based on my own experiences.  i.e. what suits each individual dog.  As long as energy levels are fine, coat and skin looking good, and the dogs enjoy it, and are healthy, I don't normally change what I feed.

Hi Angelz,
Just wanted to put my 2p in! first of all- I hope your dog is getting better, and is over the worst of it. Secondly I don't think you should worry yourself about changing his food and directly link it to his illness. Both foods you have fed are respectable foods and there is no DEFINATE way that you can say its this or that foods fault. Unfortunately dogs get ill (as we all do) and its not always due to diet, although this will have some effect.

Same here Jake was on Brents when we got him home we tried to put both the cocker and BC on the same food, both dogs ill and runny. Jake is on the same Brents only adult now and ditto my cocker on Natures Best if it aint broke don't change it indeed!!