A puppy that I bred earlier in the year and homed with somebody I counted as a friend has been moved on to another home without me being informed.  I found out by chance through the good old rumour mill.  I'm so upset as had she contacted me, I would have bought the pup back off her and she knew this.  Now I have to face the fact that I may never have a relationship with the new owners and therefore never see that pup again and I can honestly say, of the few pups that I have rehomed, I have a fantastic relationship with all  of their owners and they are regularly in touch with me.  So sad and hurtful under the circumstances but I do believe my friend now feels entirely ashamed and will do what she can to rectify this but its still such a massive breach of trust.  I don't know if she was thinking straight, I just can't understand but hopefully I'll be able to strike up some sort of relationship with the new owners.  If that doesn't happen, I don't know what that means for our friendship going forward. Feel so low about the whole situation that could have been avoided so easily.

Can i just say although this is a very sad situation and i can understand your anger and want to see the doggi and meet the new owners etc... but can i just say what a fantastic breeder you must be to care so much about the dog having moved on and wanting to follow it up even now!! I think thats amazing and you should be proud of yourself!!

Now get a book, bop your friend on the head and get the details of whom she gave it too!! :-P... maybe you could leave the book and bopping out, but can she not give you the details or not to chase? Surely the new people wont have a problem and if they do, ask to buy the doggi back? Its a lot of change for the poor pup, bet he or she is so confused!

yorkies4eva...I like your attitude :)

Yes the friend should have the contact details and I'm sure the new owners would welcome you contacting them and offering support and/or advice as needed.  What an underhanded way to treat a friend, does the pup a disservice as well.

The new owners could be great and whatever the reason fro your friend not telling you, I'm sure she would have chosen some good people to rehome the puppy with.  Try and get their contact details from your friend and write to them.  Tell them about your ethos, the after care service you provide, the type of help and support you can offer and I'll bet they'll be in touch.

If they haven't had a responsibly bred dog before they might be surprised at the help you can offer but not ungrateful.  It may be a nice touch to offer them the opportunity to meet their pup's parents or siblings.  We have one dog that came as a rescue and another from an amazing breeder - the contrast was quite something - and my children always say how much they'd like to know what the rescue dogs parents looked like!

I have a great relationship with my breeder but also some of the other owners of pups from the same litter - it's so helpful to compare experiences and photographs.  If you have a website or shared online photo album it might be a good place for them to start.

Good luck and what a welcome post - I just read on another thread about a breeder who refuses to take a pup back, shame on them...

Thanks everyone.  The new owners knew that she didn't breed her and that my friend would need to inform me, why that didn't happen is such a long story I don't have the energy or time.  My friend is trying to get in touch with them today to see if they are happy with me being in contact with them.  Keeping fingers and paws crossed that its a yes.  If its a no, I'm going to insist that she passes on a letter about me and my dogs and where I am should they change their mind to them.  I own the pups Mum, Auntie, older sister and two of her siblings.  I just want to know who has her and that she's happy.

hi mini this happend to me ,my best friend had a pup off me and didnt tell me ,it took her 3days to ring me !!! i was heart broken but luckly the lady that had him lives in the same town and i see him still ,but our friendship asnt been the same since , !!

That's why I feel so low.  I've lost contact with one of my dogs and my friend has plummeted in my estimation.  I don't want to lose her friendship over this but whatever the outcome with the new owners is, its going to niggle away at me that this happened. 

I shall now put my tiny violin back in its case and wait and see what happens next.

Good luck Mini and i hope you manage to have a friendship with the new owners and of course your pup that you bred.  Your attitude is exactly the same as mine and really understand how hurt you must be.  Lets hope they are lovely people and giving the dog a brilliant home.  If people have never bred a litter before themselves they don't understand the emotional bonds that you make with the puppies and the hope for them all to have a really nice life with their new owners. Just try to bear that in mind about your friend as she obviously doesn't realise how you are really feeling.

Mini,

good luck with building a relationship with the new owner first.

Secondly since your relationship with your friend has been badly affected anyway, I would try and sit down with her and talk it all through. Tell her exactly how hurt and angry and betrayed you feel. You will feel better and I think it's the best chance you have to get it all out of your system and get back to anywhere near normal with the friend.

Hope to hear good news about it soon

All the best

Julie

guess this can happen to all of us .. it happened to me ..
i was surfing on internet .. looking at some sites with choc labs .. then .. there was the name , the pic of a puppy i have bred .. now already a young dog!
i send the new owner an email asking about this dog, telling i was the breeder and wanting to know how he got this dog etc! Then i called the person i had sold the dog to while still a puppy ... she answered that she just had to cut down on dogs .. so the youngsters first to sell ..
when asking her if it had ever came to mind to contact me, the breeder, first .. she said "  Oh but this way i got more money for him then just the puppyprice" ... Needless to say i got furieus .; forwarded her name to friends with the story .. hoping they never sell her a puppy!
The new owner is a very nice person .. who  just adores the boy ... he is much better off there ..
It shows that even those you think will be good owners can turn out to be the wrong ones ..
But DO call the previous owner .. ASK her .. at least you get some answers .. maybe not those you like to hear .. but ... it will help to ease your mind!

I would just send a letter of introduction to the new owners, unfortunatley they don't know you, so may feel as though you are being intrusive if you should call them, a nice letter with some photo's of your bitch and explaining how you love to hear how your pups are doing from time to time and are here if they have any problems or questions, will get you on the right side of them and hopefully strike up a relationship.

How horrible of the previous owner to do that, I'm sure if you go about things the right way the new owners will be happy to stay in touch. :-)

Had a similar thing happen to me again only found out by chance, was very angry when the new owners told me - the breeder is a right nasty piece of work apparently and doesn't deserve a dog which is why his buyer sold him to us coz she didn't want him going back to a nightmare home ----------- imagine their faces when I told them I WAS that breeder! 

Unfortunately the damage was done and no matter how much my vet and other buyers tried to reassure them I was the good guy they were having non of it, which is sad as the previous owner moved a total of 15 dogs on to start a new 'project' money talks I'm afraid I'm advised this dog was sold for more than was paid for him.  Keep your fingers crossed all will work out with this pup and good luck.

> Had a similar thing happen to me again only found out by chance, was very angry when the new owners told me - the breeder is a right nasty piece of work apparently and doesn't deserve a dog which is why his buyer sold him to us coz she didn't want him going back to a nightmare home ----------- imagine their faces when I told them I WAS that breeder! 
>

LOL!! As if that happened, talk about a situation!!

> Had a similar thing happen to me again only found out by chance, was very angry when the new owners told me - the breeder is a right nasty piece of work apparently and doesn't deserve a dog which is why his buyer sold him to us coz she didn't want him going back to a nightmare home ----------- imagine their faces when I told them I WAS that breeder!

Charming!!! LOL oh i bet it was a picture.

Don't think my '

oh really that bad eh, would you like to come and visit the dogs in their natural environment ie MY house where he was bred?  I can show you his parents if you like as well as his litter sister who's still at MY house, oh and did I tell you I am an Accredited Breeder at MY house?'

Helped to cement a good relationship but I was so upset and livid to be honest I just couldn't help myself, they had to admit I did SEEM a nice person. lovely folk eh lol

Gosh I am so sorry to hear about this, I would be devastated too. I do really hope everything works out for you, Its hard enough in the begining parting with the pups, but to find this out you must be gutted, I would be too, I have just bred my first litter and they are  due to go next week and I am really Happy with all the people who are having one of my puppies and at this time I totally trust them, but its does make you think, I hope this never happens to me,
It just goes to show, it doesn't matter how vigourisly you vet petentional buyers and build up a really good realationship with them that this could still happen, But like others say I commend you, I would do the same and as a Responsible breeder, well done you.

Well its not a good outcome.

My friend won't pass me the persons address or phone number as the new owner quite understandably doesn't feel that she has to prove herself as a suitable owner again to somebody she has never met.  I don't think my friend has explained my motives very well to the new owner.  I have sent her an email to read to the new owner tonight on the phone but all hope seems to be dashed.  its been handled very badly by my friend.  I have not expressesed my anger with her yet as I'm trying to keep this as calm as possible to get the best possible outcome.

Is there anything I can now do or do I just have to give up? 

hi mini, thats really sad, horrible situation to be in hope it can be worked out in the end.

Oh dear!! Can i just ask, i hope you dont mind, but she cant be a very good friend to you to of been able to do that to you can she! I mean if she was really a friend, she would never of done what she did in the first place, then instead of making things right, she goes the opposite way by not handing the number over etc...
I can see where she is coming from tho because if they told her not to give it, it puts her in the tricky situation, however she only has herself to blame for being in the situation and should be doing the right thing by you!
I am not surprised you are so angry and i dont know if there is anything you can do now, only try and hope that the email rings some bells and makes them realise that you are not checking up on them..

Is there no law where you can get it back by law or something as you did breed the dog... tricky situation tho...

Gosh Mini, how hard is it to explain that the breeder would like to offer free advice and support if needed.  Your friend either has no communication skills what so ever or she has deliberately done this as she doesn't think you will approve of the new home.  I wonder if she has made a profit from selling this pup on. Shame on her for not fixing something so easily fixed :(

Just to say when we got our dogs, one from rescue, I traced the breeders, even took the dogs up to see them and sent photos and information regarding health and hip scores etc.  Unfortunately they weren't the type of breeders I'd pick but that's another story!  I think that breeder/owner relationship is so important, kind of like having an extended family for the dog and also feeding back info ref health to help the breeder's programme for the betterment of the breed.

Such a shame that the new owner won't welcome the chance to meet and communicate with the breeder.  I don't understand some folk; I just hope this works out.

> the new owner quite understandably doesn't feel that she has to prove herself as a suitable owner again to somebody she has never met

> I don't think my friend has explained my motives very well to the new owner

If your friend gave her the impression that she must prove herself to you then obviously she has not explained your motives at all. 

At this point I'm not sure how much you can trust what your friend has said, or if she has said anything at all to the new owners.  If she is feeling guilty about what she has done she may not want them to know that she has acted improperly, OR she might just chuck all responsibility in your direction and tell them it is you that is being unreasonable.  Either way I'm not sure that you will ever get the whole truth about what has happened.

It's a shame that there isn't a 3rd party that could independantly approach the new owners to explain the situation.  Perhaps the new owners might join CD at some point and find this thread.  Sad as it may be, I'm not sure if there is anything else you can do.  So sorry xx

> kind of like having an extended family

I just said that today to a person who is waiting for a puppy from my boys breeder.  'You don't just get a puppy you get us lot as well' (a network of owners, and friends, with same breeder pups) sending photos, asking for advice and just generally keeping in touch with one another

When pups are growing and developing it's so useful to be able to ask the breeder about what is normal, or expected and to compare notes with others from the same litter.  Sadly this new owner will miss out on a great source of knowledge because of the 'friends' mishandling of the situation.

Mini even though she is a 'friend' did you not do a contract when she originally had your puppy?  In mine now i state that - "in the event of the purchaser being unable to keep ......dog for any reason and at any age it must be returned to the breeder". If you breed another litter make sure you put this in the contract.

I am so sorry for you that things are not working out and maybe it is time to talk to her and tell her how you feel.  See how she reacts and take it from there, then you decide whether you are able to carry on any relationship with her.  Maybe she will pass on the details of the new owners to you after listening to how you really feel and she will just have to 'suffer any consequences'..

Good Luck Mini

I don't know what to believe and what to take with a chunk of salt.  So much is said and then gone back on.  I'm assured that the pup wasn't sold on for a profit and that she definitely took a "hit".  Silly, as I would have given her all her money back had she contacted me.  I don't know where the lies stop.

Wendy - yes I had a contract with her as I do with all of my pups owners however as you'll see from other posts on CDs, contracts have never been challenged in so far as actual results being gained.  I work with solicitors who have helped draw up my contract as a favour to a friend type thing and now they are helping me to prepare a letter to send to her informing her of her breach of contract but I need to think what I want the end result to be.  Do I/can I demand that she refund the  purchase price of the pup to these people and return it to my care?  Is that fair to these people who have found themselves in this position, is it fair to the pup, that would be a third home in such a short life, is it likely to get me anywhere????  I don't want to blow this out of the water if no good is going to come of it in the end.

Once this is over, she will no longer be a friend.  This is the ultimate breach of trust.

How awful, would she perhaps forward a letter or have you tried that? Then you can just explain you are not asking them to prove themselves, but just that you would like to keep in touch to make sure the puppy is getting on well and that they are happy with him. :-(

I'm wondering if it would be possible or even advisable (you could ask your legal team ;) ;) )  to put out an advert (on the web or in the papers or both) to the effect of 'to whom it may concern' and expressing your sadness that this pup was sold on without your knowledge and offering support to the new owners?  I'm sure you would have some way of identifying the owners of the right dog if they were to get in touch ;)

Just a thought really.  Not sure if it helps tho :(

Hope something turns up.  

Write a letter to the KC addressed to whom it may concern, give your details, send pictures of the parents/siblings etc. and ask the KC to pass it on to the new owners - if of course the KC documents have been changed over.  This is how I tracked down one of my pups that had been sold on without my knowledge, the first owners said they had lost the bit of paper they had written the new owners details on, when I finally tracked my pup down her now owners said they didn't take any details from them just took their money!!!

I agree with Sharon on this. A letter to the KC asking them to pass it on to the new owners, so long as they have changed ownership, might be the only way to go ahead with this one.

Sharon/Lindylou

Thanks.  That had crossed my mind as the KC did confirm to me that the pup is in the new owners name.  I'm glad it got you results, lets hope it works out for me.  I've drafted a letter to the KC and now I'm just trying to gather my thoughts to get the content of the letter to the new owner correct.  Any thoughts appreciated as i really want it to strike a chord.

Well, pics of your dogs obviously, the litter together, what your dogs favourite things are (toys, treats, unusual positions they like to sleep in) - anything that makes you smile basically (then hopefully it will make them smile too!)

I wouldn't go into detail about your disappointment in your friend, in fact I'd leave her out of it completely.  Just mention that you are available if they want to meet the mummy etc, need advice on feeding/grooming etc.  Just as if they were the first owner.