Have you accessed the story from one members online area? I cant see it :-) :-(

It's in the digital edition for 3rd October, on page 2.

M.

The litter on here says 30th Sept :-O

> which meant that the children and the in-whelp bitch had to be taken.
>

Nobody had to go.

Isabel....
OK....so call me a cynical old wotsit then!  :-)

Perrodeagua
Really?  Funnily enough it doesn't happen on the working gundog sites that I'm on.  Also, you have no idea of my experiences with a show bred bitch I bought and the reaction from those involved in breeding her when a health issue arose, so kindly don't make the show fraternity out to be holier than thou either - especially in light of certain TV programmes.

At least working dogs stand by what they DO.

>> which meant that the children and the in-whelp bitch had to be taken.
>>
> Nobody had to go.

Oh no, Isabel, I entirely agree - particularly as litter is listed as due on 30th September! Was just recounting the article.

M.

Yes, I understand that :-)  I'm just shocked that anyone could consider that going to a show is more important than anything else in the world.

Perrodeagua
In case you hadn't appreciated, this debate is about WELFARE - not health testing, known problems in lines or any such thing. 
Why move the debate on?

But dogs, although generally clockwork, can whelp a week either way.  It's the equivalent of being 8 months pregnant nearly!  She should have NOT gone to the show had her plans been changed - I would have classed that as a family emergency.  Well, each to their own, but I still shink she was wrong and very shortsighted.

She states in OD that she only left the bitch for 10 minutes whilst she showed her bitch in PG, however, I was at the ringside the whole time the breed was been judged & she was also present for more than PGB!

I cannot see the reasoning of a breeder subjecting a pregnant bitch to all the stresses of such a trip. I hope she feels the RCC she won was worth all the flack she will now have to take.

I find it incredible that anyone would take a heavily-pregnant bitch on any but the shortest and most essential of journeys - and going to a show doesn't come anywhere close to being essential! It sounds like 'pot-hunting' of the worst kind.

It's also utterly stupid to even enter a show once you have mated a bitch. The moment I had my bitch mated I counted forward and decided on which shows there would be NO point in going to. That was any show 2 weeks before the due date and 2 weeks after -even ones close to home. It's just not worth it. (And that's with leaving the bitch at home!) Whichever date is correct for this bitch's due date, she would have been a least on day 58 the day of the show, and that's the day I personally would always count as first possible day for pups to be born.

> It's also utterly stupid to even enter a show once you have mated a bitch.

Your breed must be far more reliable than mine for getting in whelp then, Marianne! LOL

M.

It's all down to whether you want to risk having to throw the money away or not, isn't it. :)

Indeed - I'd rather risk the money and be able to go if the bitch misses.

M.

Gunner you made out as though "show" people hide things, so I was just stating that it also happens in the Gundog websites I've been on and unfortunately in some cases has made certain websites finish.

I am never hollier than though, it was just a statement from a statement that you made! 

From there I will leave it because as you say it is going away from the subject.

I also cannot understand how anyone could justify herself by saying that she was only away from the dog for one class, she shouldn't of even had the dog there!

I find it incredible that anyone would take a heavily-pregnant bitch on any but the shortest and most essential of journeys - and going to a show doesn't come anywhere close to being essential! It sounds like 'pot-hunting' of the worst kind.

I agree. I wonder if it had anything to do with the number of entries there are at Belfast each year?

Cynical? Moi? :-)

>I wonder if it had anything to do with the number of entries there are at Belfast each year?

Nail. On head.

Whichever date is correct for this bitch's due date, she would have been a least on day 58 the day of the show, and that's the day I personally would always count as first possible day for pups to be born.

Yes, both my last two litters have been whelped 3 days early and she was in first stages of labour the day before that.

All that and she still didn't get the ticket

Ahh but she did win something else didn't she!!  I still cannot believe that anyone could do this myself???

> Apparently the bitch wasn't due for a week, and wasn't meant to be going but for a last minute change of plans which meant that the children and the in-whelp bitch had to be taken.

To me that last minute change of plan means she shouldn't have gone....

> Apparently the bitch wasn't due for a week, and wasn't meant to be going but for a last minute change of plans which meant that the children and the in-whelp bitch had to be taken.
>

Or which meant that the show had to be missed! According to the advertisement I saw the litter was due on September 30th - 3 days is a very short week!

To me that last minute change of plan means she shouldn't have gone....

Exactly! It happens, you sometimes enter shows you can't go to for one reason or another -nobody is forced to go once they've entered, after all.

I can't believe a breeder could be so selfish  and go to a show with an inwhelp bitch,  the poor thing  must have been scared stiff.Not as if the show was down the road either.  some people grrrrrr

So she whelped a puppy, went a showed a bitch and then went back (contaminated????) to the whelping bitch. Considering most people won't even take another dog to a show and go back to puppies in case they bring an infection back, well I rest my case.

It would beggar belief......but in her case not so I'm afraid

Diane

> I'm just shocked that anyone could consider that going to a show is more important than anything else in the world.

Me too.  I would actually question the woman's mental state that she wouldn't even contemplate NOT going to the show.  She is obviously obsessional.

The story is also in this weeks Dog World...you can read it online.

Reading her story made me even more angry - I cannot believe anyone would watch one puppy arrive THEN go on to show another bitch in the ring I also feel really sorry for the children, they are 11 and 3 years old, fancy being left in charge of a whelping bitch at that age - it just beggars belief. I hope this lady is severely punished as reading that article, it doesn't seem like she thinks she did anything wrong.

cant believe she'd even comtemplating going to the show.one minute she says the bitch whelped a week early  yet according to her website the due date is not a week on from Belfast.

Is it a punishable offence??  if so by whom?  . I'd like to think it was.

I just read that she only left the bitch for 10 minutes in the care of her daughter aged 11!!

Dog wellfare apart, what about the responsibility of not leaving children alone? They could have been abducted or anything. Aren't there laws regarding what age you can leave a child alone and how old they must be to take responsibility for a sibling? She was seriously lacking any form of judgement.

Aren't there laws regarding what age you can leave a child alone and how old they must be to take responsibility for a sibling?

No, there aren't. I don't see the harm in an 11 year old being left to take care of themselves, most 11 year olds would be allowed out to play, but an 11 year old should not be left with the responsibility of a 3 year old sibling, nor a whelping bitch. Nor any dog, for that matter.

"I made the best of a bad situation, rightly or wrongly."
The best of the situation would have been to stay at home!
I wonder if the bitch was allowed to be attended as she continued to deliver on the ferry home.

AFAIK, perhaps this is Scotland Specific, the parent must decide if the child is capable of coping on it's own, but generally the accepted age is 12.  I got my house keys when I was 12 and went home for my lunch from this time.  No child under the age of 16 can be responsible for a younger sibling (I think this is UK law), my brothers were not allowed home for lunch until they were 12 or I was 16, whichever happened first.  In Scotland this woman may have well been charged with child neglect/abandonement.  This case in particular would be judged according to the laws of the land it occured in - so whatever the Irish Law states.  But also, no minor can be held responsible for an animal, the children should not have been left with the dogs.  So there are a catalogue of wrongs here as you can see.

In Scotland, the first time I recall being left on my own I was 6 - I understood that in Scotland there was no fixed age. It was only for 5 minutes.

But leaving an 11 year old in charge of a 3 year old and whelping bitch... while you take another dog into the ring...

Travel I believe is known to induce birth in some individuals - not just dogs - the movement and stress etc.... did she not think of that? And that is leaving aside the point that travelling a bitch that close to whelp that distance was... well... there are no words I can use on a public forum...

But leaving an 11 year old in charge of a 3 year old and whelping bitch... while you take another dog into the ring...

Completely and utterly selfish!  And it's not like the kids were even left at home - they were left alone in a busy carpark in ANOTHER COUNTRY!  I could not believe how lightly the DW reporter appeared to take the story.  Hopefully the KC and her breed club will take a tougher stance.

I wonder how easily it will be for her to find homes for the pups now?  I would have thought people considering purchasing a pup from her would be put off.  I certainly would.

this is the bitch 3rd or 4th litter but jo public will not know what happen

If I was on her waiting list for one of these puppies I'd withdraw.  This isn't the standard of care that I'd be looking for from a breeder

Read the article in DW last night, what a disgrace I am disgusted. She should know better, reading it made me so angry that poor dog, the Kennel Club should take action against her, ignorance is no excuse. I wonder how people in her breed feel about this?  

Unfortunately I doubt that many people buying the pups off her will know unless they are in the show world.