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By Quinn
![[gb]](/images/flags/gb.png "United Kingdom")
Date 24.10.02 10:57 UTC
Okay, I've noticed over time that many dog people in the UK believe routine spaying and neutering isn't healthy for dogs. Being from the states, it's been ingrained in me to get my pets altered at no later than 6 months of age in order to....
1. Control pet population
2. Prevent reproductive system diseases
I realise there is an enormous wealth of knowledge here on the board. I also know that vets know a thing or two about animal health. Why don't the majority of you agree with what vets tell their patients with regard to reproductive health? Are we being lied to by our doggie doctors?
By issysmum
Date 24.10.02 11:01 UTC
I was always brought up to believe that if you weren't going to become a 'proper' breeder then it was the responsible thing to do to have your pet neutered.
I'm still of the opinion that the majority of dog owners haven't got the sense or understanding needed to keep an in season bitch safe. Holly isn't spayed yet, but if we get a male puppy then we will have her done.
Fiona
x x x
By Sharon McCrea
Date 24.10.02 12:19 UTC
Quinn, I don't know how the majority of UK vets feel about it but mine do not actively advocate neutering to committed and switched on dog owners.
I don't think its that people in the UK or on Champdogs believe routine spaying and neutering never has advantages for dogs. As well as the obvious contraception there are benefits, especially to bitches, but most of the conditions prevented are very treatable and should be picked up fast by an on-the-ball owner. Also with the exception of some inner city areas, few dogs are allowed to roam in the UK and I gather that roaming dogs are more common in some other countries.
So its more that we also see both sides of the neutering coin - and there is another side with some degree of incontinence in an unknown but possibly quite high percentage of bitches, anaesthetic and surgical risk (with the best will in the world, veterinary anaesthesia is rarely carried out with the back up available to human anaesthetists, and even human anaesthesia / surgery is not risk free), coat changes (often not as minor a disadvantage as it sounds), pack placing disruption, and even sometimes worsening of behavioural problems.
I doubt that many using this forum would not want to neuter, say, an OES bitch that is allowed to wander (so she may well get pregnant), is never groomed (so mammary lumps won't be picked up early) with an owner who doesn't know enough to recognise a pyo or care enough to have it treated as an emergency.
What we do instinctively recoil from is "if it movers, neuter it" thinking, and the subtle - and sometimes not so subtle - insinuation from some organisations that everyone who does not routinely neuter non-breeding stock is irresponsible. I also think we feel uncomfortable with any campaign that is so absolutely one sided that it screams the pros and all too often completely omits the cons.
Too many of us have kept too many entire but non-breeding dogs and bitches, often together, into healthy old age to accept that neutering is an absolute necessity for the health and welfare of responsibly owned dogs, and too many of us have had/known of too many problems after neutering to accept it as a risk free procedure.
So if we sometimes sound completely anti-neutering, I suspect its mainly a reaction to the fervour of the pro routine neutering lobby in the US, and increasingly here in the UK. In reality most of us would just be happier if the facts were presented in a more balanced way :-).
By Pammy
Date 24.10.02 18:35 UTC
I spoke to my vet yesterday as she rang for an update on how the Tardak vac'n had gone on Jasper and while she said they do routinely recommend neutering she fully understood and supported my reasons for not neutering my boys unless it is absolutely necessary. She acknowledges what good specimins they are and how it would be a shame not to have some progeny from them - her parents used to breed Cockers. I find this attitude so very refreshing. She takes a view as to how responsible and "switched on" the owners are before determining how important neutering may be as an option.
Pam n the boys
By Reefer
Date 24.10.02 21:26 UTC
Pammy - how did the Tardac injection go? Did it help? Just wondering if your boys are OK:)
By Pammy
Date 24.10.02 21:42 UTC
Hi Anita
Thanks for asking - guess it's good news in one way - the Tardak has not made the slightest difference to Jasper - so he'll be keeping his bits:D
Next step is a behaviourist recommended by my vet. Got to give her a call to see what she thinks. It's clearly a dominance problem with Jasper feeling incredibly insecure and I need to find out how to re-inforce where he sits. Hah! easy said:D But at least the Tardak allowed us to see if castration would help at all and now we know it won't - we can look at other solutions as we have ruled out hormones:D
So things have stayed very much the same. The only difference I would say was a marked increase in Jasper's appetite. He would eat his kibble dry with nothing on it - something he would never do before!! But it did not ease his energy levels or his anxieties over Buddy:( Poor Buddy - he sits and sleeps so peacefully - usually ignoring the fact that Jasper is trying to hump him:D.
I'll let you know what the behaviourist suggests.
Pam n the boys
xx
By Reefer
Date 26.10.02 07:10 UTC
Well I'm glad he's keeping his bits:D Good job Buddy is so unerstanding:) I do hope you get Jasper sorted, poor little chap, but at least you've narowed it down.
Good luck:)
By pinky
Date 27.10.02 14:49 UTC
Hi Pammy
We are due to collect our new addition to our family on the 8th Nov. How ignorant must I sound. But after owning a lab bitch for 7 years neutered at 2 years old, and before that bitches also. I have now decided to get a male Bullmastiff obviously will be 8 weeks old when we get him. We have been told that the male bullmastiff is very dominant and needs firm control ie. training classes! ANYWAY my point or question is: What an earth is a Tardak???? We will be taking the puppy to the vets the day after we get him for jabs and check up. And I would like to know a non vets view on tardak.
Thankyou
pinky
By Jackie H
Date 27.10.02 15:00 UTC
Tardak is a short term way of controling a dogs libido and is very useful if you have both sexes in close kennels and have a bitch in season. It is also used to see if a dogs aggresion will be helped by castration. It is not cheap and can't be used on a stud dog, at least not if you are wanting to use him. The effect is short term 3 to 6 weeks and it is not cheap.
Neither Tardak or castration is the answer to controling the "teenage" difficulties, hard work and perserverance is the only way with adolesent boys. Ja:)kie
By pinky
Date 27.10.02 23:50 UTC
Thank you Jackie Here's to a brief and easy (haha) teenage problem few months??? WE HOPE
pinky
By sharie
Date 24.10.02 20:58 UTC
A very well thought out post sharon.
Well done.
Totally agree with you.
Sharon
Bullywood Bull Terriers
By Sharon McCrea
Date 24.10.02 23:55 UTC
Thanks :-)
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