Some education required here please.

An elderley relation is to appear in court as his dog fouled in the street, but was only a number one.

He was fined £60, but refused to pay it.

I thought fines were only payable and the law applied to number two's?

I mean how can you pick a wee up?? was hard enough trying to collect a sample from our dog when the vet required one.

Absolutely rediculous (sp)!

It would be intresting to see what the results will be of the court case.

They can only fine a person with fouling if their is a notice warning of it.  Otherwise you are just asked to remove waste, if you dont remove it then you are charged the cost of someone else to remove.  No where near £60.  But the only reason dog fouling laws were introduced is because dog number 2's are hazardous to health.  Unlike for example a horse which isnt.  So surely wee fits under the catergory of sterile so how can they be charged??

Bit different if the dog had a wee on a shop floor but in the street, thats silly!! 

Emma

best of luck to your relative, thats just daft!

Is the issue that they are disputing it was just urine?

If you look at the 'picture' given with the dog fouling warning, I thought it was a 'poo'......how the heck can you take enough water and disinfectant with you to wash down where the dog has had a wee? Obviously you discourage the dog from weeing up a car wheel or something similar, but....well, I would like to see what happens here too!

Found this..http://www.crimereduction.homeoffice.gov.uk/dogfouling01.htm and it says poo, not wee.

Wow, you can't help it if your dog needs a wee in the street, that's awful! Obviously poos should be picked up, and you don't let you dog wee up someone's leg or belongings, but just up a lamp post or on the grass verge, it would never occur to me to prevent that! :-(

How on earth do you stop a male dog weeing up a lampost? (ok, every lampost? ;-) ) Males will ry to mark everywhere :-D It is ridiculous to ask someone to try to pick it up. Don't they need photographic evidence if it goes to court? I would expect the courts to chuck it out. The case, not the 'fouling' ;-)

Oh I don't understand this at all? Was the dog perhaps in an area where dogs are prohibited - like a kids playground?

> but just up a lamp post

I would never allow a male in my care to wee up lampost or walls and gateposts.  Trees and bushes yes.

Ok, according to the dog fouling of land act 1996 the actual offence is if the dog defecates, not pees ;-)

"Offence

(1) If a dog defecates at any time on designated land and a person who is in charge of the dog at that time fails to remove the faeces from the land forthwith, that person shall be guilty of an offence"

The above act has now been repealed and replaced by local acts but this is the basis of them. So unless his local council have included urinating then he should be ok.

Well seen you only actually have bitches Brainless, I think it's normal dog behaviour to pee on lampposts :-D

I'm still wondering if the prosecution is actually for leaving feaces even if the owner feels it is a misunderstanding.  I recall reading about such a case recently, a disabled man if I remember correctly.  Some dogs do position themselves to look like they are pooing when the are in fact peeing so making it is hard to distinguish on a CT tape.  Perhaps the best defence is to cite the lack of evidence of the actual deposit.

I often get this when my ruby has a long pee on the way to the feild we walk on, i just ignore it. As to the court case i hope its laughed out of the building, again redicularse lol.

Louise

I would never allow a male in my care to wee up lampost or walls and gateposts.  Trees and bushes yes.

Gosh you are one amazing woman!!!  Sorry but when my dog wants to go he wants to go and he's quite a strong lad when he has the urge.

>> I would never allow a male in my care to wee up lampost or walls and gateposts.  Trees and bushes yes

I have never owned a male dog but will hopefully have one by the end of the year and wonder how realistic it is to control where a dog pees.  My bitch will pee on command but most of the dogs I know will pee on anything more than a few inches raised off the ground.  Is it practical or possible to have an entire male who will pee on demand rather than mark on desire?

My Rottie bitch cocks her leg at anything!!!!!
I got her home from a week in the kennels today, she got straight out the car and onto the grass verge to squat and mark!!!!
Only time I stop her is when I am running with her, but even then I end up several times nearly having my arm wrenched off as she stops to mark!!!
Lea :)

Neither of my two male dogs, so far, cock their legs - one is 3 years old and the other is 18 months. They now and again will vaguely lift one back paw off the ground but it is quite rare. Both dogs will go on command :)

> Sorry but when my dog wants to go he wants to go and he's quite a strong lad when he has the urge.

If they can hold it for 8 hours overnight they can hold it if we are in an inappropriate place,

LOL Harley you could have written my post, with one difference - 1 pupster age 10 months :-D

> I would never allow a male in my care to wee up lampost or walls and gateposts.  Trees and bushes yes.
>
> Gosh you are one amazing woman!!!  Sorry but when my dog wants to go he wants to go and he's quite a strong lad when he has the urge.

Onlead mine are only allowed to wee if I think they really need to, I don't let them mark every few feet. Off lead they can sprinkle as much as they want.

I don't have any problems with dogs weeing up lamp posts, walls, gates and even car tyres (dog wee is preferable to the stuff we all drive through on a daily basis).

I once was told by an elderly gentleman when my Pomeranian had a wee that it was no wonder the country was so dirty etc !!

I do keep only bitches full time but I do have males visit which I walk, and have Friends with males.  It is normal behaviour for males to want to water vertical surfaces, what I am saying is that it is up to the handler to not let them do so.

> Is it practical or possible to have an entire male who will pee on demand rather than mark on desire?

Yes it is a matter of training.

When I first take a male out I allow him to pee on a tree or bush, I then do not allow him to stop and attempt to pee on any upright objects, but do stop from time to time at appropriate places to see if he needs (not wants) to pee again.

Once their off lead of course it is another matter, but then they would only be off in an open space etc, hopefully not full of lamp posts or peoples gates and walls.

>I would never allow a male in my care to wee up lampost or walls and gateposts.  Trees and bushes yes.
>Gosh you are one amazing woman!!!  Sorry but when my dog wants to go he wants to go and he's quite a strong lad when he has the urge.

It's even worse with two, because after one's cocked his leg the other has to do likewise to mark it, but I don't allow my boys to cock their legs wherever and whenever they want, and they're pretty strong and powerful. It's impossible for them to cock their legs if you're still walking briskly and they have to follow! A firm "No! Heel!" until we get to a more suitable place and then they're told "Busy", and they can wee then.

My male marks frequently when offlead in appropriate places but like you two, I don't let him wander down the road weeing on everything.

I was appalled to see people letting their dogs wee on posts ringside during my first show. Disgusting and unnecessary to allow that indoors.

That is good to hear.  I have walked a neighbours dog with my bitch before and he was torture for peeing on anything and everything and it annoyed the life out of my bitch who just wanted to get to the park.  Yet another neighbour has a dog who doesn't stop and pee so hopefully with a bit of work at the start, when I finally get my dog we can have harmonious peeing.

> They can only fine a person with fouling if their is a notice warning of it. Otherwise you are just asked to remove waste, if you dont remove it then you are charged the cost of someone else to remove. No where near £60.

This isn't true...there does not need to be a warning notice. Even if given a fixed penalty notice you are not required to remove the faeces or asked to pay for it's removal...although some decent folk will go and pick it up. The fixed penalty for not removing dog faeces in my local authority is £80...£50 if paid within 10 days. You are of course able to go court if you wish as the fixed penalty only offers you the opportunity to discharge any liability to conviction by payment of such a notice.

I've never heard anything so ridiculous that someone was given an fpn for their dog urinating.....although i've heard many protests from the public that their dog was only having a wee <<rolleyes>>

> Is it practical or possible to have an entire male who will pee on demand rather than mark on desire?

My boy does both, he does like to mark things, but will also go on command, all my dogs do this, it's very handy before long journeys or at shows. And after the one time as a junior he weed up my leg and got sternly told off, he never wees up peoples' legs, or in the house even when my girl is in season, apart from twice when a grooming client had weed on the sofa and I hadn't cleaned it well enough.

Is this in the UK?  I did hear from a friend that in China you have to clear up both number 1's and number 2's.  Apparently people walk around shoving newspapers underneath at the appropriate time or carry disinfectant solution!

Uk, and certainly relates to his dog going for a number in the street, not a play area or anywhere where dogs are banned.

Will post the outcome.

At a show yesterday my boy was showing interest in the poles that hold the ring tape. I just gave him a slight tug and told him no!. I realised that if left he would have been marking and so I stopped him. When out on a lead walk he doesn't bother, but off lead he runs around the perimeter of the park weeing up the bushes.

My boys mark constantly when out, they both have too wee in the same spot, and try to aim higher than the other. :-)

My boys mark constantly when out, they both have too wee in the same spot, and try to aim higher than the other. :-)

I stop mine from weeing up gates and peoples front walls as kids play on the street here around their front gardens..

They are allowed to pee on certain lamp posts and fence posts (borders the motorway, isnt someones front fence!), as thats where ALL the estate dogs pee and its like their version of Champdogs!

I find that since they know where they can pee and where they cant AND they wait to be told its ok first, we do tend not to have many problems.. I do have to limit where they can and cannot pee as its not just one..

Its two boys AND one bitch all doing it.. and the bitch can pee the highest, rofl! (Shes also the worst for stopping to have a good sniiiifffffffffffffffffffffffffffff at other dogs scent marks!)

Lori - I was shocked when at a champ show last year, I saw several 'top' exhibitors allowing their males to mark in the ring (indoors), on ring posts and also the boards when they were placed in the group - it seems to happen quite a lot, I know they are male dogs and will want to mark when there's other dogs around, but surely the handlers could control them a little better ??

I don't keep males as I personally don't like the leg cocking etc, however our Malamute bitch would mark everywhere, given the chance! She always marks when I come back from a walk with my other two, over a particular bush in the garden - funny dog. All 3 of mine will mark over each others wee in the garden, but nowhere else. My Cavalier is just about to come into season, so she is marking lots on walks - doesn't cock her leg though!

No, I don't let my boy wee up the ring poles - someone has to pick up those poles and put them away, and I think it's disgusting when dogs are allowed to wee on them. But as I said before, I don't see the problem with lamp posts, nobody has to touch them do they??

You wouldn't invite them into your house would you Alice ;-)

> I don't see the problem with lamp posts, nobody has to touch them do they??

The popular ones can get pretty pongy in the summer.  Not nice for other road users or people who live nearby.

> The popular ones can get pretty pongy in the summer.&nbsp; Not nice for other road users or people who live nearby.

Never know that to ever happen round my area and there are loads of dog walkers!
If someone had a go at me for letting my dog wee up a lamp post I would tell them very quickly where to go and also add would they prefer it if I let my dog wee on their lawn and kill their grass or on the street where it can be stepped in?
Vant have it both ways and if people start picking where dogs can wee then it will be disallowed whatever they want, lets just be careful we dont get to PC as dogs weing up lamp posts is completely normal same as a wall!!

My dogs will comtinue to wee where they want and I will continue to pick up their poos, no reason to change!!

I've never known lamp-posts to get smelly either, but then we have so much rain up here everything is washed on a daily basis :-D

I wouldn't dream of letting mine pee indoors, or even outdoors at the ringside - in fact I don't think they've ever tried as they're exercised before going in the ring. Another pet hate of mine is people allowing dogs to pee on binbags - someone has to pick them up! I don't let them pee on peoples cars either but other than that I don't really mind where they do and view it as normal dog behaviour.

> I wouldn't dream of letting mine pee indoors, or even outdoors at the ringside - in fact I don't think they've ever tried as they're exercised before going in the ring.

I cant believe people let their dogs pee inside a show ring at a show!!
That is nasty and I would tell the person letting their dog doing it that it was nasty too, eeegh!!

>My dogs will comtinue to wee where they want

Against other people's doorposts, making their hallway stink, or against their car? I'd consider that to be extremely rude, and if I allowed my boys to do that I'd expect to get shouted at!

I wouldn't be too keen on allowing them to wee on lampposts either - dogs have had electric shocks that way, when the wiring's been faulty!

For crikeys sake why does everyone take things so litrally on here lol!!

I clearly said earlier that lamp posts is what I meant and I never said my dog wee on cars in the first place and theyve never tried either also why would you do that anyway? Wee can corrode the paint never mind the smell!!
No one is gonna tell me what my dogs cant wee on and that includes lamp posts and pavements, people who let their dogs wee on people doorposts are just inconsiderate and nasty and if I caught someone doing that to my house I would confront them about it!!!

So my dogs will continue to wee where they want and just to make sure everyone knows where I mean, grass, verges which are used to park cars on outside front gardens on the pavement, lamp posts, fences and any bush they please :)
And maybe the leg of anyone who is stupid enough to complain about my dog weeing on the street lol! That last bit WAS a joke before I get any backlash lol.

Sorry, but like guide dogs, my dogs pee where I allow them to, not where they choose. I'm the one in charge of the walks, not them ...

Again taking my words way to litrally :)

Did anyone see the hi lights of Crufts this year when a small WHW peed up the handlers leg!!!

Missed that! My dog wouldn't dream of cocking his leg on any person

Reminds me of our first male dog when I was a child.  It's first cock was against my mothers leg.  My father instructed her "stand still, woman, you will put him off!".  This was the last male dog we owned :-)

Blimy if I talk to anyone in the street or in the field the boys wee wherever. My most embarrasing is in the vets up the counter! I aplogised and wiped it up. Our two are usually off lead in a field or a country park. When we walk on the road its up a bush or in Whistlers case with his bum halfway up a tree. I once counted 11 wees a block up bushes and trees. But he does not wee on command, I had no idea you could do that?
There pets ! I guess as we are v. countryside here we very very seldom walk on streets at all. But i know what you mean they have a bladder like a pea not torrential like rain, I too get furious when I see pooh all over the local playing field but wee washes off in the rain, its not radioactive, a bit literal here folks.. The lady said a grass verge. My pup went up the local constabularies wheelie bin yesterday - but i wasn't walking him at the time.. thank goodness.