Took my lab to vet yesterday for anal gland expression and whilst there got him weighed.  He weighs 35k at present and has come down from 41k (weighed that a year ago).  I know he could do with shifting a bit more from around his top half over shoulders but he has a nicely defined waist, can feel his ribs and he tucks up underneath.  I have cut treats right down and he has a 1/4 less of his food per day.  Bearing in mind he is fed on Burns and these are not the bulkiest of foods but the nurse said she would like to see him weigh in at 28k!! 

I was dumbstruck!! He is a Poolstead lab and for any of you that know them I am sure you will agree that they are big well built labs and are not working type skinny labs.

I just can't justify letting him lose that much weight and maybe I am wrong so please tell me if you think I am.......

Then came the big hard sell from the nurse....."try this food, its vetinary food, its wonderful, it will get the weight off him and only costs a zillion pounds etc etc...."

I always listen to advice from nurses and vets but I just feel on this occasion, i was being railroaded into buying their food whilst allowing my beautiful boy to become too thin imo.

From what I have described of Henry's shape, breed lines and his weight would any of you think that he needs to lose another 7k??

The only way to tell if a dog is a healthy weight is by physical examination - the scale means nothing.

If you can feel his ribs when you run your hands down his sides he is the correct weight.  By "feel his ribs" I mean you can easily feel the outline of each rib underneath your hands with almost no pressure. 

I can feel the lower ribs easier than the higher that is why I think he needs to shift a bit more. 

He is very muscular so would this account for weight on the scales too?  from my school days I seem to remember someone saying muscle weighs more than fat.....

My vets tried to get me to feed Hills when i registered with them 2 years ago, they then tried to make me switch to Eukanuba when one of my girls had a skin problem. I was quite angry and explained to them that gaining the respect and trust of a new customer is not done by pushing sales onto them just for a commission. I had a mubled response and am now looked at like i have two heads when i walk through the door.

I never take just veterinary advice when it comes to weight, i am guilty of allowing my dogs to gain weight but i also know how much is enough to lose. The vets take on seeing the ribs repulses me and i will not allow them to become so thin. If you think he looks fine, he is healthy and not restricted in his activities than 1-2kg will be enough but not a full 7.

TBH, I would agree, 28kgs for a mature male dog is too low, especially for a "show" bred Lab.................my girls weigh in at 32.5kgs and 34.5kgs.....stick with what you're happy with and don't be bullied............most Vets and Vet nurses believe they should look like Dalmations/Dobermans for build

As far as I am concerned he sounds like he would be too skinny at that weight. Also, it is really hard to lose the weight over the shoulders so as long as you can feel his ribs then take no notice. Every dog is different just like people. Some can be very overweight and still weigh only the same as another that looks just right. My bitch when at the height of her showing career weighed in at 38kgs!!!!. Now even the Vets couldn't believe that she weighed that much as she was just right to look at. Don't forget also that muscle weighs heavy.

Thanks everyone. 

He is a muscular strong boy and has so much stamina!  He goes on 3 walks a day (1 very long) and does 30 mins obedience training in the evening i.e sendaways, heelwork, recalls, retrieves, scent etc and keeps going and going and going.  In fact he wears us out sometimes!  He is by no means fat and lethargic and copes excellently with the heat etc.

That nurse has annoyed me now tho.  He would look dreadful at 28k. 

I was planning on doing some uphill walking with him to see whether that gets it off his shoulders and also some swimming. 

One of the vets I saw once couldnt believe he weighed that much because he doesnt look it at all.

I was once told by a vet that my GR was obese - she said he weighed in at 35kg which was shocking for a dog his age. I was shocked as there was no way in the world that he was obese. I was told he needed to go on prescription food and that being fed raw was the cause of his obesity. She booked me in to the obesity clinic and when I took him the nurse asked me what I was doing there. I explained why I was there and she gave a wry smile and said that she thought the vet must have misread the scales or that the scales weren't working properly. She re-weighed him and he was 33kg. She also commented that he looked in perfect proportion to her and that the only guide that you could really go by was that he should look and feel the correct weight.

My dog is extremely well muscled and very fit. Having a longer coat his figure is often disguised but, having been in the water, he is very lean.

The weight incident rather put me off seeing that particular vet but she was the only one there on the day I had Harley's booster vacs done and she commented to me on how fit and healthy he was and how he was the perfect weight - 33kg.

I think I found it so annoying at the time as I firmly believe that over feeding a dog is just as bad a form of neglect as under feeding is (but I do realise that some dogs can be over/under weight through medical conditions).

next time you take him in, if you are asking about his weight, insist they tell you how much they think he needs to loose BEFORE giong on the scales. It may be that they are worried about the 35kg, which must be pretty heavy compared to a lot of dogs in there.
I need to keep my Mastiff as lean as pos due to ED, so whenever I ask the vets about his weight I pin them down on it before they've had chance to weigh him., that way they can only go on the feel of the dog and how much should be lost according to body condition, not some numbers on the scales.

As he put any more back on since i last saw him?  was that nats?
She was just trying to sell the food!

I don't go by the chart, there are lot's of diferent sizes of labs my girls weighs 24kg, but she looks great she is small working. My boy is 30kg and is also spot on, they both look healthy. My friend has a lab who is 42kg! he is tall, but he doesn't look over weight.

you can tell by looking if a dog is 'heavy' or not, if you think he;s fit for his lines then you'll know best. the vets and nurses etc know about the average size for a breed and work on that i suppose, but still, if he looks healthy weight wise and is healthy whats the bother?

Weight in Labs is a very contentious issue... ideally what you should be looking for is a fit healthy Lab.. good waistline (not pinched) feel ribs but not see them...

the density of bone in labradors varies tremendously.. and with Poolstead lines.. I would expect a heavier boned dog...

His ideal weight could be around 35K...

I have 9 adult labs... with seriously varying weights.. but all are in top condition ...

the show critique for my heaviest boy... Good solid hard working condition.. his weight at that time.. qualifying at GBDAS in Dec last year was a whopping 48Kg... there wasnt an ounce of fat on him.. yet another of my boys.. who is poolstead linebred.. looks heavy over the shoulders at the moment.. and only weights 36kg... and yet another boy.. who is only just a year old.. looks skinny in comparison to him.. is actually 4kg heavier...

My 5 girls all weight between 28 and 38kg.. the lightest actually looks the fattest.. which she possibly is.. she is now 11 and is more sedentary than the more muscular, heavier, but leaner looking girls...

I do find it interesting how dogs carry their weight differently. I have Rotties my girls weigh in at around 40kg, they are muscular but have a waist and you can feel the ribs when stroked (can see the last 1/2), my boy is just 9 months and we've been careful not to "allow" him to grow too fast (a problem we had with our youngest bitch), but to me he looks like he needs feeding up. Just been back to the vets with him as he keeps getting a dodgy tum. They agreed that he could do with a bit of extra weight although going by the charts he was bang on for his age - he's 37kg. They couldn't believe he was that heavy, when you look at him he's does look ribby.

For Mish...

No he has lost weight since then....

Yes she was just trying to push that food on me and when I looked at the ingredients it was full of things that as a rule I try and avoid giving him.

He can keep up with the best of them at training so surely he must be fit.... if he was overweight, he would be lagging and struggling to keep up in hw etc.

Jen saw him at walsall and said he looked so well.

x

KAYC...

Everything you have said makes perfect sense.  When I look back at generations of his line, poolstead and rocheby they ALL look such big labs and Henry actually looks a lot leaner than them.

When u stand over the top of him he definately goes in at the waist.

Its mainly his shoulder area that looks bigger.

Hi Em

I saw your lovely Henry win his 2nd Beginners in my friend's class at BAGSD, he isn't overweight at all, in fact I said to her on the way home what a change to see such a fit Lab !

Don't take any notice of the VN as he does so much work & is muscled up, isn't she aware that dense muscle weighs more than fat ??

Hope to see you at Wakefield or BAGSD on the Sunday

Oh thank you so much MM.  You've made my day saying that :-D

I had booked into Wigton but its been cancelled so I'm gutted now cos I was doing that instead of Wakey.

I will be doing BAGSD tho...wouldnt miss it for the world!

If u need any help with stays etc just let me know.

How is my favourite judge by the way? ;-)

On her jolies @ the moment she stwearded me for me @ Hull, Carol(the senior)is stewarding for me @ Wakey & BAGSD.She is now known as Carol(the not so senior) & I'm Dyane(the Junior) LOLOL

Carol(the not so senior)has a new GSD she lost her rescue bitch before Xmas, the new one is called Wolfie & Wukee thinks she is his mum & she thinks he is her puppy LOLOLOLOL

Glad to hear she is well.

She has no idea how happy she made me that day!!! :-D

Hope to see you and her soon

If he lost anymore weight he would be far to thin and definately not look like any Poolstead lab I have ever seen.
My boy weighs in at 40kgs and he doesn't have an ounce of fat on him he is just a big dog. My girls weigh in at anything from 33kgs - 37kgs. All are a good weight and not fat.

Most vets go by there weight chart which is displayed in the waiting room normally but it is rubbish unless you have a working bred lab. Your vet nurse obviously knows nothing about labs, it is all very well reading the books!!!

Thanks Freespirit

Its such a shame that they dont perhaps ask basic questions about the type of lab you have got I suppose before they go shouting their mouths off about how much the dog weighs and is overweight according to their chart. 

There is a huge difference between a working lab and a show lab and it would be bordering on cruel to get him right down to 28k!  He would look like a lollipop with a big set head and a tiny body! 

You know the Poolstead labs then.... Henry's sire is Puffin...

I think you can always tell whether a dog is over or underweight by looking at them, just like people, we don't have to jump on the scales to let us know.  In my opinion, vets, and vet nursers do a great job but they are not that clued up when it comes to nutrition. So please don't worry, your boy sounds absolutley spot on! 

I think sometimes the professionals can get a bit bogged down with their charts and graphs. I remember being told by the school nurse that my daughter (5 at the time) would always have a tendency to be overweight! I nearly fell off my chair laughing as she is pure muscle without a scrap of fat on her. The problem was the graph - not my daughter.
If you're happy with your boys weight then I'm sure its fine :-)

You can't tell if a dog is overweight just by looking at them - a dog with a small frame for a breed can carry a lot of extra fat before that dog really looks overweight.  You can tell if a dog has gone from plump to obese by looking at them, but not that they are carrying too much weight.  You have to feel them to tell - for exactly the same reason judges do a hands-on examination in the ring - a lot can be disguised by coat or even well placed muscle or fat - that can't be hidden by a close hands-on examination.  And the reverse is true too -  my trim dogs can look overweight if I allow their coats to build up.  After I groom them properly - they magically slim down.   (Wish that worked on me too!)

he def dosent need to lose anymore then

I think maybe if you have a good eye, you can tell whether someone or something is carrying too much weight, but as you say cairnmania it would confirm it one way or the other to feel the dog.  I am assuming in this instance that the owner of the dog had probably felt the dog in question and therefore knows her dog quite well!

Yes I have checked him and felt him and I think he is fine. 

I was just so shocked that she said he needed to lose another 7k that's all.  I was just wondering whether others think that that seems a bit excessive for a lab such as henry.

Really appreciate everyone's comments.

Thanks

Mish,

I forgot it was Oldham wasnt it where you saw him last.  Well since then he has lost about 1.5lb so if you think he looked ok then he must look good now.

See you at Lichfield........

In my experience, a lot of vets just look at the breed weight chart on their wall and say that's what your dog should weigh.  There seems to be no allowance made for sex or if the dog is large for the breed. 

My vet wants both my Chows to weigh 30 kg because that is what the chart says but one of my boys is a heavier build with bigger bone than his brother and at 34kg I can feel his ribs and his spine.  I need to keep them lean due to joint problems but don't want my big guy to lose anymore.  It seems obvious to me that he is very lean but my vet doesn't seem able to make the judgement by look and feel.  I also don't trust the chart they have, as being sponsered by Hills I imagine the weights are based on dogs in the USA which have slightly different breed standards than us.