In a similar idea to the retired potential owners, i was wondering what people thought on selling to families with children.Scenario- If a family came to view puppies, brought children along, child A 6 years old loves the cute little puppies constantly plays with the puppies and pesters the adults (you can vision the child constantly annoying the dog as dog gets older bigger and cant put up with it anymore and dog snaps, from then on no good with children, or adults wont have time to train socialise puppy while busy with children the dog gets too big to control and out of hand no manners and they can no longer cope) would you let them have a puppy? If not how would you explain to them and children that they cant have one. I myself wonder particularly with my breed, big large powerful dogs, best suited with no children under 10 because of size and could easily knock them down. Also as they are quite a stubborn breed they need time and effort training them. My younger sister just turned 12, we dont live with her and rarely sees the dogs, when she visits she is constantly winding them up pulling tails etc etc and even after a slap from my mum carries on doing it. Mason has got used to it now but still gives her the odd grumble if hes had enough or when hes in the mood to play she winds him up with rough wrestling play and then it gets to much for her and she ends up getting hurt because he is so big and strong. My mum has a much smaller ACD and she pesters him to death too, but when they rough play it still ends up the same way.

I just cant help but generalise, especially if they havent got experience of big dogs

Would totally depend on the family and the children. I have three children, they have grown up with dogs all their lives and have been taught exactly how to handle dogs. I too have a very powerful breed, SBT's, while they are not large they are boisterous and very playful, they can easily knock a child off their feet.

My youngest is 5 and the dogs listen to him just as much as they do me, he has learnt that dogs are  great for cuddles and kisses and play but they also need their own space and that there is a proper way to play with them. He never pulls tails or torments and had total respect for the dogs and they do him. When he calls out @bed@ in his most authorative voice they definitly listen!! LOL

My eldest is 9 and she is already handling the dogs for the ring. SBT;s are a playful, fidgety, very powerful breed and she has no problem letting them know she is in charge and how to handle them perfectly.

I would make it very clear to potential pup owners all the downfalls of owning a pup of my breed around children, almost to the point of putting them off, if they are stil detemined then I would need to see how the children react to the older dogs, who are fully grown, how they interact with the dogs and puppies and make it very clear that proper training of both the dog AND the children is needed.

I think children and dogs are a perfect combination together when it is done right and I certainly wouldn't turn down a family for a dog just because they have kids, in my opinion all children should grow up around animals, makesthem more understanding and loving of them.

It depends on how the children behave and if they aren't brilliant, how the parents deal with it.  It doesn't matter how big the breed is really, a small breed may not knock the children over, but it could have just as miserable a life if the children aren't taught to respect it ;)

>My younger sister just turned 12, we dont live with her and rarely sees the dogs, when she visits she is constantly winding them up pulling tails etc etc and even after a slap from my mum carries on doing it. Mason has got used to it now but still gives her the odd grumble if hes had enough or when hes in the mood to play she winds him up with rough wrestling play and then it gets to much for her and she ends up getting hurt because he is so big and strong. My mum has a much smaller ACD and she pesters him to death too, but when they rough play it still ends up the same way.

I'm surprised thatyour 12 year old sister is allowed to pester your DDB :(  Just because he hasn't snapped doesn't mean he doesn't deserve to be treated with respect by your sister. As his owner it's up to YOU, as well as your mum to ensure that he is, or remove him from her company telling her that you will not allow his temperament to be spoiled by her ;)  You are being unfair to both of them, he is being patient with her but not being protected from her attention and she is not learning to respect dogs and treat them right, one day she could well be bitten :(

I've seen just this sort of situation turn bad, the dog was "marvellous with children, they can do anything with him" but he was being treated as yours (by your sister) Eventually he turned on another child unrelated to the family  :(   IMHO the dog had been 'living on the edge' for all his life :(

To be honest, the situation with your sister is exactly what I want to avoid for any pup of mine :(  If I thought this would be the situation I wouldn't let them have 5 minutes with a pup and they certainly wouldn't get one from me.  I'd also report them to the breed club puppy co-ordinator in case they left the brats at home next time.

hi as many of you know i have five sons they have all grown up with dogs and know how to behave around them and i have never had any problems with them. i have recently had a litter of pups the kids were great with them and we kept one pup, the most confident one of the litter my 4yr old son today told the pup to touch ( which my husband is teaching the pup to do it is a trick that the pup touches his nose on your hand) some kids that have grown up with dogs can be very good with them but those that have not had dogs before can be difficult. my pups went to people that had grown up kids and i was very pleased with that as not every body that had kids can find the time and patents to train them i personally make the time but do have teen age kids as well so they are happy to baby sit during the week and on Saturday or Sunday mornings so i will not judge the book by its cover but ask enough questions to find out if they are suitable to have my pups.

see to me it would totally depend. my parents got their first bullie bitch around the time my big sis was 1, i was born about a year later. however the cassie (the bitch) was acquired as an older pup from my aunt and uncle. georgie, even at that young age, had had lots of exposure to the bullies my aunty had and my parents have always been very strict about how we treat the dogs so she was fine. i was born inot the house and grew up with solid rules as well, growing up with my darling Chad who we bred from Cassie. but as i say we were all strongly discaplined about our behaviour with the dogs. bullies are excellent with well behaved kids and are very patient with the less well behaved and are (this sounds terrible but...) seemingly immune to pain (don;t mean you should ever cause it! just that they totally shrug off an uneducated childs advances where a smaller more delicate dog might!)

the only incident we ever had with the dogs growing up was when my aunt and uncles lovely dog Saul knocked my sis out- was an accident though! he swung his head round as someone called him and she was sitting next to him, crack! she was fine though!

anyway, its all about the kid, thats why you should always have the whole family see pups i think  

> some kids that have grown up with dogs can be very good with them but those that have not had dogs before can be difficult

childhoods the best time to learn though so if the parents are able to teach good behaviour its probably the best time

depends entirely on the individual...i had a fmily with one 9 year old come to look at hounds and were sent packing as their chold was unruly nd obnoxious....however a hound from last litter went to family of 3 teenage boys...all well behaved...another from previous litter went to family with 3 and another to family of 5.....i was astounded at how well their children behaved.

Again it depends on the children and the family. If the children are not brought up to respect the dogs they never will do.

I have mastiffs and have had since my daughter was a toddler. But she has been brought up round dogs and horses and would NEVER tease or annoy any of them. She is responsible at 7 years old and regularly helps me with them. She even took the oldest bitch into the ring at a breed club open show last year, that isn't a regular occurence not because I'm worried about what her or the bitch would do but because you never know what other dogs will do.

If somebody came to look at a litter of puppies and the children were unruly and not nice around the dogs they wouldn't be getting a puppy.

It's also worth remembering that puppies have teeth like little needles and can accidentally do small children a great deal of harm. The parents then think the dog has bitten the child aggressively and the poor puppy is either sent back to the breeder, labelled by the buyers as aggressive, or shut outside for most of the time, or simply got rid of. I am VERY careful about selling to people with young children and will only do so if the buyers are experienced dog owners. I insist that they come and visit the puppies several times and watch very carefully to see how the children behave around the puppies and, more importantly, how the parents manage the childrens behaviour. That said, children and puppies can be a wonderful combination, what bliss for a puppy to have little people around who NEVER get tired of throwing the ball. I always keep in very close contact with families with small children and they are only too happy to keep me on the phone for ages telling me in the minutest detail everything that the puppy has been doing since I rang a few days ago. This way, I can nip any small problems in the bud before they become big problems. 

I've sold puppies to families with children....... but lovely families and lovely children.
If they can make a good job of rearing their own family - then they and their children deserve to grow up with a dog ... just as I did and my son too.

As for kids who pester dogs and "pull their tails" etc.... they would be off my property before they knew it.

We bought a puppy (we already had 2 dogs!) when my son was 5, to grow up with him. It was weird the way she automatically attached herself to him rather than us (the adults) who were the ones who did the caring bit!

We bought a puppy (we already had 2 dogs!) when my son was 5, to grow up with him.

Same here!:-)
I think there is a world of difference between children who have always had dogs around them and those who don't.
It's just not a big deal and they generally leave the dogs alone.

I never had a dog when I was growing up so I must admit it makes me less keen to sell to families because I don't know how the children will get on, and I have a smallish breed that could be hurt by accident by over boisterous play. But my dogs do love my young nephew, so I wouldn't rule it out altogether. :-)

> I think there is a world of difference between children who have always had dogs around them and those who don't.
> It's just not a big deal and they generally leave the dogs alone.

I can relate to that statement, the children that visit our house that have experience with dogs are normally very relaxed etc around our dogs where as the children with no experience are either very wary or constantly wanting to play with the dogs (which I do not allow!)

If someone had children that were unruly and were only interested in the puppies as opposed to showing an interest in the older dogs then if it was me I wouldn't allow them to have one of my dogs (hypotheically speaking as i'm not a breeder) but if they all showed a real respect for the dogs and I felt that if the children were very young that the parents had control over them and would teach them the right way to behave around dogs then I would go for it.

As I said in a previous post, some breeders felt that a cavalier should not go to a home with children under 5 but we found the right breeder and our dogs and children love each other to bits...in fact they prefer to listen to the children than us lol!

I am going to answer from the other side, being a person who brought a large breed with young children. My son was 2 1/2 and my daughter 7 1/2 when we got our first dobe. The breeder we got him from did say that she had never sold to a family with such a young child before.... but because of how my son and daughter acted around the dogs/puppies and how we handled the children, she was quite confident things would be ok. I'm not going to say it was easy as Blade was a very big and boisterous puppy, often leaving my son bleeding from his limbs :-O through puppy play not aggression.
My daughter also attended all puppy training classes with me to get her to learn how to react to his behaviour and how to train him also. By the time we got our next dobe  although her being a bitch so smaller, the kids didn't have any problems in dealing with the nipping puppy and snatching of their toys etc. I think the most valuable thing I ever taught them was to not run and to not squeal loudly as this would have excited them even more. I always say that to other children that come in the house, even though Blade and Xena are 3 and 2 years old, they will still get excited easily and could definately knock someone over. If i have any problems about how other children that come to our home react with the dogs then I don't allow them to come back again. 

I second that too Emz77 . my kids were small but at the breeders house , they were just their usual selves and never grabbed or screamed and squealed at the pup's . they waited for the breeder to offer the pup to them and then held them .. my elder one, 8 at the time even put the pup back in her bed , because she could see that the mother dog was getting anxious ...I know the breeder recognised this as she commented on her thoughtfulness ...and gave her a different pup to hold ...I personally would not let my children just grab and paw any dog , and i am in the stages of training my grandson the same ... he is 2 .. but he has some knowledge already about dog respect ...lol... he tells me to shush because the dogs are sleeping ..lol...But he has a tendancy to just grab and hug when he feels like it , or to pull an ear , but he is young and will soon learn ...lol...Maybe you should ask the parents their views on how pup's should be with kids ......

My sister did grow up with my mums dog so it was usual rough and tumble with him but because mine are bigger, she doesnt seem to understand that she cant do the same. i think i will make her energy slightly more constructive, start with her training one of the pups and do some junior handling as i know she does want to do that, take them to the ringcraft when they are smaller and they can give her a little responsibility. Which will teach her to teach the pups learning through play. Obviously she wont be unsupervised, but i know it will also teach her some respect for the dogs and give her some responsibilty which she definately needs.