Have just been reading on another forum a debate about vaccinating puppies and I am now very confused.
Some say 8 and 10 weeks but then others say if you vaccinate before 12 weeks it has an effect with the immunity they got from Mum so doesn't work.
Then someone else said there has to be at least a 3 week gap between vaccinations.
Thoughts/opinions/experiences please?

Different vaccine manufacturers have different protocols for their products. Generally the first jab is given at 8 weeks and the second between 2 and 4 weeks later. With the vaccine my vet uses, the second jab must be given no earlier than 10 weeks of age, and no less than 14 days after the first.

The need for socialisation is usually (depending on area and current disease level) greater than the risk of illness, so waiting till 12 weeks can have its own risks.

I have mine done at 8 and 10 weeks, have done for years and never had any problems. 

My old vet used to do them at 10 and 12 weeks and we never had problems (apart from the frustration of the longer wait), but the vet I'm with now does them at 8 and 10, and we don't see pups coming back with problems from it.

If they're done too early (at 6 weeks, say) then the maternal antibodies will be more likely to cause problems with effectiveness, which is why it's best to wait a little longer.

I prefer to have the second done after 12 weeks. I don't feel socialisation is a problem, and (with my vets approval) I take puppies out both being carried, and for short walks in 'low risk' areas, (not lots of doggy traffic, and the beach) prior to their second vaccination.

One of the pups (well, 9 months old) pups we have here was vaccinated by her owners at 8 and 10 weeks, so I'll be interested to see if that has affected her immunity when I get her titre tested at a year old. Everytign I have had vaccinated at 12 weeks plus has still been immune at 3+ years. Next time I won't be vaccinating at all until I have titre'd.

My last puppy came from a breeder that made me promise not to have her second jab until 12 weeks. This is because she has had new owners lose their pups to diseases they should have been protected by due to what we assume, was vaccination too early. But I didn't leave her in the house all that time. I chose what I considered acceptable risks. I took her to friends houses that had healthy, vaccinated dogs for visits. I also took her to my training club - all dogs have to be vaccinated to join. I didn't let her visit the dogs there or put her on the ground but she could see the dogs and visited loads of people. I carried her around the streets and shops, visited dog loving neighbors. She had quite a bit of exposure to the world without putting her paws on the ground. Oh yes, I also have another dog in the house and she's a golden so not the most difficult breed around other dogs and people.

So you have to look at your own circumstances and make a personal decision. Have you discussed this with your breeder? There own experiences with their lines and breed should help guide you.

Thanks Everyone and Lori, it is advice I need to give to buyers of my puppies. I had intended to have them all vaccinated at 8 weeks before they left but have now found this isn't sucha good idea as different vets use different vaccination brands and also I don't want them travelling just after they have been jabbed and some owners are keen to pick up at 8 weeks and vaccinate their own.
My own vet says 8 and 10 weeks but once again their is conflicting advice on here so it really is a job to know what to do.

Certainly I wouldn't recommend that a pup is homed less than a week after its first injection - far too much stress on its body on top of the change of water, change of environment, possible change of food, emotional upheaval and all the rest of the possible causes of temporary illness.

I read a report from America a few months back which said that the parvo virus is not effective if given too early. There is a definite increase in parvo in the US, and they have done quite a bit of research into the subject. I know that vaccines are more advanced nowadays but I also think that there is a tendency on the part of vets to bow to customer pressure and vaccinate too early. I never have mine vaccinated before 12 weeks.

To be honest, I have learned form experience that whatever advice you give to puppy buyers, they will do whatever they like regardless, even if they are the best of homes. The fact is, they will believe their vet over whatever you tell them, so if you say 10 and 12 weeks, and their vet says 8 and 10, and uses the socialisation issue as a reason to vaccinate early, they will go with the vet, as they want to get their pup out as early as possible.

I would never vaccinate a puppy of mine before 10 weeks, and I explain to the new owners why I have chosen not to vaccinate them. It has nothing at all to do with money, and they can see that. They still don't listen though.... LOL

some breeds,  mainly black and tan in colour i.e.  rotts, dobes, man terriers, min pins, ect are LESS likely to get full immunity from vaccinating at 8 and 10 weeks,  it is felt that they need a third injection at 14 weeks, to give full cover for parvo.

i had a rott done at 8 and 10 weeks, then due to her litter sister, also done at 8 & 10, contracting parvo i had my rott titre tested and she NO immunity to parvo at all, so i had to have her re vaccinated.
with my next litter i had the puppy i kept done at 8, 10 & 14 weeks, then had her titre tested and she had full immunity.

i know this has been the case with many rotts and dobes and alot of reserch has been carried out which can be found on the internet if you do a few searches.

Lori's breeder sounds really sensible, maternal antibodies protect pups until 12 weeks, so after 12 weeks only one vaccination is needed for parvo and distemper.  The only reason 2 are given before this age is the first one wipes out maternal antibodies and therefore a second is needed.  The lepto one should be given in 2 parts but not at the same time as parvo/distempter, again this is making sure too many chemicals are not pumped into our dogs at any one time. And, always give Thuja a few days before and after a vaccine, I found this out from Richard Allport's website.

> again this is making sure too many chemicals are not pumped into our dogs at any one time.

Is this belief arising out of the MMR thing?   I thought it was generally well known now that it had been completed debunked.   As I understand it the only reason some vaccines are not given together is when one is likely to deactivate the other, never because it is "too much chemicals"

Is this belief arising out of the MMR thing?

No, nothing to do with the MMR 'thing' I haven't researched this as my children are adults, therefore the MMR debate wasn't around when they were young, it was the 'whooping cough thing' we had to worry about.

I'm talking dogs, vaccinations and common sense, too many chemicals are no good for any living being.

Sorry can't see any sense in that, let alone common :-)  We are surrounded by, absorbing and imbibing "chemicals" all day long in all manner of combinations and suffering no harm what so ever. 

Oh boy! Now I don't know what to do!

Ask your vet.  Tell him about your worries and I'm sure if they feel they do not know the answers they will certainly have the study skills to look into it properly for you but I expect most vets will be extremely familiar with the subject already as it represents such a large part of their work.

Personally I would never vaccinate a puppy without a titre test being done first. the reason is I had a dog who never needed to be vaccinated(he was from a working BC bitch who had never been vaccinated)the lab that did the testing told me that to have vaccinated him at any time in his life would have been a total waste of money, he was titre tested annually & never needed vaccinating at all

I didn't have Wukee titre tested because his brother was titre tested in the Netherlands & needed vaccinating & IMHO if one puppy needs doing the whole litter will need doing(this is also the opinion of the vet in the Netherlands where titre testing is norm), he has been subsequently been titre tested & is at a level that shows the vaccinations worked.

I find it very strange that people accept that Rabies Titre tests show coverage for Rabies, but the self same people don't think titre testing for Core diseases shows nothing !

> to have vaccinated him at any time in his life would have been a total waste of money

Surely all that testing adds up to a fair bit.  How much are they charging for the Leptospirosis test or are you getting it free as it is only on a trial at present?
If you end up vaccinating as well because the levels are low, something I would imagine to be rather likely with Lepto as it is often said to not even cover a year, then your costs are getting even higher still.

What I pay is my business & the annual tests are @ cost as are the lepto all part & parcel of ongoing research into the vaccinations of dogs. Having had one dog die within hours of a Lepto booster & another days after her fourth year vaxs(not mine a rescue dog) I never ever vaccinate without titre testing first(except for Wukee as mentioned above)titre testing is the norm in the Netherlands

> What I pay is my business

Fair enough :-) although veterinary costs are not generally taboo on the board are they and may interest others considering going that route plus it was you that raised the subject of cost implications within this debate.
If you are not going to consider vaccinating a dog for leptospirosis for fear of the vaccine itself I'm not clear on the point of titre testing.

If you are not going to consider vaccinating a dog for leptospirosis for fear of the vaccine itself I'm not clear on the point of titre testing

One of the reasons I chose to titre test was because the dogs had to go into kennels and it was a kennels that accepted high titre readings.  Another reason some people choose to titre test is to put their minds at rest, just so they know.

>some breeds,  mainly black and tan in colour i.e.  rotts, dobes, man terriers, min pins, ect are LESS likely to get full immunity from vaccinating at 8 and 10 weeks,  it is felt that they need a third injection at 14 weeks, to give full cover for parvo.

I've never heard that before - could you point me in the direction of the evidence please, so that I can discuss it with my boss?