Anyone got any good ideas on where to get one from?
I have a 25 litre one but, even though I have done everythig correctly I loose most fish :( :(
People say the larger the tank, the better they are to sustain fish sooo I am looking for a larger tank. 75+ litres either second hand or new
I have looked on Ebay wth no luck, soooooooo
Anyone have any other ideas where I can get a 75+litre tank with filter and pump for less than £100??????
Lea :) :)

Have you tried your local Freecycle Lea, I bet a lot of people give up on fishes :-D

yep :( 2 of them. but no luck :( :(
I check every day and also put up a request.
Lea :)

I have tropical fish and used to reguarly lose some.  So I bought a smaller tank to use as an isolation tank when I bought new fish until I was sure they were ok and put in large tank.  This has worked well for me - to add new fish to your existing ones can bring in unknown disease.

Have a look in your free ads newspapers or the classifieds in your local area newspaper. You could even try shop windows or boot fairs - means trolling around them though, and you never know what else you might come back with :-D

Can't believe ebay hasn't got anything :(

Just keep looking, they do turn up eventually.  Also you could try here - www.aquarist-classifieds.co.uk - I got my 6' x 2' x 2' tank with stand from there for £150!  Didn't have anything else apart from sliding glass lid but it was still a bargain.

What about your setup, how long have you had it, how many fish, what fish, cleaning regime so on and so forth?  How long was it set up before you added fish and how many did you add over what period of time?

Also, how do you clean the filter - in old tank water or tap water?  Do you test the tank water at all?

Definately aquarist classified, and ebay also, and local papers too.

25l is a TINY tank and I would really struggle to keep that stable - go for the biggest you can house (and VERY big tanks, 5ft + tend to go cheaper as a lot of people havent room for them!), and go for external filters every time, you can get away with putting a much bigger external filter onto a smaller tank as they tend not to create a stupidly fast current (unlike a bigger internal filter in a smaller tank), and so you 'overclock' your tank, keeping it more stable and happier.

My Juwel Vision 260 was 200 and all it needed was a metal replacement top brace, that was off aquarist classifieds.

Ditto Nikitas questions though, in case theres something you are doing wrong...

Also What fish and how many did you have in the tank?  with 25 litres you can't get much in their and only small fish.

How long did you have the tank set up?  Did you fishless cycle or cycle with fish?

I did everything the shop told me to do, and these are guys that have fish as well.
I have ended up with 2 Danios (~one died last week)
The water was fine all the time tested by myself and the aquatic shop!!!!
And they couldnt understand why they have died!!! Have had the tank well over a year now.
The one thing I have been told is the larger tanks are more stable, hence why I am looking to getting a larger tank, I just cant afford the £400 they go for!!!!
Lea :)

>I did everything the shop told me to do

Don't believe everything your told!  :)  Just because they are "experts" doesn't mean they can give good advice :)

PAH stock two quite nice (imo) 60 ltr tanks which arn't over priced, they go on offer aswell now and again which makes them ideal!  Either that or there's afew tropical fish forums which have bring and buy sections!

What did you test the water for?  Do the fish show any signs of illness?  Where is the tank situated?  There are so many reasons a fish might die.

Also Danios can be a little weak compared to other fish and was your tank fully cycled when you added them?

my friend is selling an 80 litre tank, she wants £100 but am sure she may negotiate ;)

you would need to collect though, North Lincs, so not sure if the location is all wrong???

edited to add details of tank (she e-mailed them to me to advertise on work forum)

Juwel Rio 180, with stand, black
180 litre capacity (may be too big looking at your initial post)
dimensions 101cm x 41cm x 50cm

Dearlady Pmd you LOL
Icequeen, I hve spoken to several people who have had tanks as well, and gone into detail with them about what I have done and they said the same LOL
Lea :)

Fair enough!  I came across far too many horror stoires though about what people had been told to do with tanks within my stint of working within PAH!!!!!!  So please forgive me? :)

If you want the details of a friendy fish forum then let me know and I will PM you the addy!  I have found the site very helpfull within my old job, plus I would love a hughe tropical tank when I have the space!!!!

No its fine Ice queen :)
Sorry After over a year I have forgotten most of what I have done!!! LOL
I have been told so many times that the small tank is hard to keep stable!!!
(I now wish I had bought a cat instead!!! (Sam wanted a cat so I bought him a fish tank as thought it would be easier to look after!!!) )
I would love a large tank, and really want a chinese fighter fish and neon tetras once it is established LOL
Lea :)

uh, if you mean siamese fighter aka betta splendens.... you cant keep that with anything really especially not tetras.

Theres pretty much just one reason why tetras are 'community' fish, and that is because they are generally too small to do any harm, but make no mistake they are nippy aggressive little gits and a betta would have no tail in a matter of days :(

Betta's need to be on there own, there are the odd one or two who successfully live with other fish but it generally ends in tears, either the betta bullies the others and gets stressed, sometimes they can kill smaller fish (guppies!) (usually with other long finned fish, the constant flaring and fighting stresses them so they are susceptible to disease), or they, being slower less adept swimmers with loooong flowing fins, get mercilessly nipped and harrassed and bullied.

The end result is the same though, unhappy stressed fish = dead fish.

However if you get a new tank, you can keep a betta on its own in the existing tank, with plenty of plants and bogwood and possibly a few shrimp (double check that im not sure if bettas might eat shrimp).. nb. algae eating 'dwarf' shrimp, not the long armed kind or the 'lobster' type...those eat fish!

LOL thankyou theemx
I will bair that in mind :)
Think I have a few names for picking brains when I get my new tank LMAO
Lea :) :)

Your 25 liter tank would be perfect for a Betta :-D

http://forum.ukbetta.co.uk/index.php

plenty of info on Bettas and their care here :)

Before you go buying any more fish tho, make sure that your water doesn't contain CHLORAMINE.  It's more difficult to neutralise than Chlorine and needs a water conditioner which will neutralise it.  Many of them do these days tho ;)

Also, what decor did you have in the tank?  Some things leach chemicals into the water which aren't picked up on the normal water tests

Did the shop test everything - including nitrate?  Long shot maybe but it can be a killer if it creeps up high enough.  I've had trouble with it numerous times, from losing half a tank of small tropicals (30 gallon tank too) to earlier this year, when I lost around 10 adult catfish and barbs (some of which were very rare).  The nitrate stressed the fish to the point of sickness, and they were killed by an absolutely vicious strain of finrot.

Like I say, long shot, but worth consideration - in such a small tank it could build up very quickly.

It was tested for everything. Nitrate levels were fine :)
I just think it is too small a tank LOL
I dont know about Chloromine, but the shop tested it with a professional kit, and everything was fine :)
I may well have sorted a tank, subject to photo and confirmation then will have to get that tank set up and transfer the 2 Danios into that tank and start stocking LOL
Then will look at the siamese (yes you were right not chinese LOL) fighter fish in the small tank )
Lea :)

Thought it was nitrite that was a problem for fish not nitrate(which causes algal(sp?) blooms)?
Angela

I really doubt it was the size of tank unless it wasn't maintained properly :)

My son's tank is 20 litres - the Arcadia Arc Pod tank.  It's beautiful and easily maintained for a child, the only bugbear is that it needs topping up every day or so as it's open-topped.   He's had it a year now and the 5 glo-lights and female betta are looking good.  It has a few plants in it too.

I also have a 25 litre tank which hasn't been a problem too.   But I have been keeping fish for about 25 years or more and have kept up with all the latest techniques, there's always something new to learn.

What was in the tank besides fish?   What was the substrate?  any decor?  any plants?  what is your (straight from the tap) tapwater pH after leaving it stand for a day (it can change as gases are released) and what was the pH of the tankwater? what fish did you have and how many?    All of these will help to pinpoint the problem.

As I have said I cannot remember all that I did, but I dont think the filter worked properly as the wheel that should go round doesnt, so think that might have something to do with it. I spoke to alot of people who have kept fish for donkeys years and told them exactly what I was and wasnt doing, even showing them and they couldnt work out why it didnt work. So explaining on here isnt going to help now LOL
It doesnt matter now anyway as I will be getting a larger tank, and if I ever want a smaller one I will rethink!!!
Thanks for the interest though :)
Lea :)

> Thought it was nitrite that was a problem for fish not nitrate(which causes algal(sp?) blooms)?
> Angela

Nitrite is far more toxic and will kill much sooner than nitrate, but because nitrate isn't broken down it can build up (and often tap water has higher than desirable levels) - and at high enough levels, will stress fish to the point of sickness, as I've experienced.  It does have to get very high to have that effect though.

i have 3 tanks at the mo, a 90 litre cold tank, a 60 litre tropical ( with my siamese boy on his lonsome to see if his colour picks up) and a 240 litre newly aquired tank ( from dvnbiker on here!)  i have mollies, platys, long finned zebra danio, red tailed shark, neon tetras, harlequins blonde loaches, a golden nugget plec and a violet plec, 2 clown loaches also! in my cold tank i have 3 comet goldfish ( rescues) 3 minnows and a hillstream loach ( the cold guys were destined for the bin, and were in a miniscule unsuitable tank)

loving the tropicals, they are great fun!

I had a lot of fishy friends in SD and one used to have his own business. The mortality rate for the small tropicals used to be about 95%. His tip to me was to invest a little more and buy bigger fish. If they make it past the small fry stage they have a better chance of surviving. This was 20 years ago but I imagine still holds true if they still farm most pet fish.

Big tanks are good :)

Fish are addictive. A neighbor gave me a goldfish in a tiny bowl as a present and I ended up with a 100 gallon tank :)

Jack Dempseys can leap out of tanks easily and can walk across the room on their fins :) Unfortunately they can't leap back in :(

Really hardy goldfish can survive both toilet dips and heated water :)

any other pearls of wisdom? ;-) LOL

Well I am now the owner of a Juwel 180 tank thanks to a Dear Lady with several big Deer hounds one that liked to take my son for a ride on his back ;) LMAO
I havnt taken the tank out of the car yet as need another pair of muscles, but going to set it up tomorrow.
I have bought 2 big bags of gravel and going to set it up tomorrow.
Been told to put a bit of fish food in it to get the filters working, and then leave it for a week :) (yes I am using tap safe!!)
And thats interesting about the fry Lori!!! I did loose alot in first few weeks of getting them :o Will keep that in mind when I start stocking the new tank :)
Anyone have any other advice?????
Lea :) :)

I used to keep tropicals...fairly successfully as it happens although that was more down to good luck than good judgement, I think.  I had wanted a rabbit but my parents thought a 4ft fish tank would be more suitable (??)  My absolue favourite was a red tailed shark who I had from he was tiny and he lived for about 6 years.

I also inherited 3 red bellied piranha from my bother who stupidly bought them on a whim.  Learned the hard way about feeding them FIRST before putting fingers in tank...had a few nasty nips from them and my Mum nearly lost a finger tip.  I eventually rehomed them to a specialist as they began to get too big for their tank and the 2 bigger ones were attacking the smaller one.

Rather than adding food (which IMO is near pointless) Consider fishless cycling.  information can be found on the following link.  http://www.tropicalfish.site5.com/tfc/showthread.php?t=60022

Ice_queen, where do you live????
As that is all gobbledeegook to me, so think you should come here for a holiday to set my tank up :D LOL
Food and slobbery kisses(from the DOGS before anyone says different!!) provided!!!!!
Lea :D

Saw on Facebook you were looking forward to setting it up tomorrow Lea!!! Good luck!!:-D

Is all alien to me but I love tropical fish.:-)

Thanks Paula.
Well I have set it up. Had to get the hose fro the back garden as was taking way too long with the watering can LMAO
I have filled with Water and tap safe, there is one plant in it and filters!!!!
Sorry Ice queen I dont get those instructions at all. I need simple is things to do, and would be terrified of putting ammonia in as am sure I would go completely wrong.
I got told at one point in the past to squeeze a filter out of another fish tank to get the new filters going???
Lea :)

Yes using old media from a mature tank is another great way.  Some Fish shops will sell you them or use a friends old one :) Works on the same princible of when changing tanks you add the old filter and new filter in the new tank :)  Therefore the bacteria in the media is mature so the tank will be mature and you won't find problems with the amonia/nitrite/nitrate cycle unless you end up with a mini-cycle!

The amonia is just adding amonnia (same as fish waste) into the tank and testing untill you get the right level and for it then to disaappear on it's own as bacteria will grow in the filter that way! :)  It's not that hadr but it can take a while.

If your just going to leave it then you will be doing a "fish cycle" which means only adding a couple of fish every week untill fully stocked!

I have the little tank, so wondered if I squeezed the filters out into the new tank and left it for a week before adding my 2 danios????
I do only want to get a few fish at a time, as cant afford to add loads in one go.
Lea :)

In that case add the media from the old filter into the new filter and just move the danio's across but do daily water tests to check everything seems ok...

Or just add the filter from old tank in!  No harm having two filters running :)

How long would you leave it after adding the old media in before transfering the Danios??
(oh and cat straight away as the water needs to heat up LOL)
Lea :)

I would add danios and media at same time, once tank water has heated up!  (Or if you can wait boil the kettle and add some hot water untill tempreture reaches what you want!!! ;)

What even though I have only filled the tank up today??
Lea :)

yup, adding mature media will be fine.  There's no differance between leaving it a week or not when nothings in there.  If you add mature media you need to add fish to keep it alive or add ammonia to act as fish waste. :)

You've probably done it by now.... but if not (or for anyone else)..

Take the sponge out of the filter from the old tank. Put it in the filter for the new tank (or stick the entire filter in the new tank along side the new filter).

It is the filter media/bacteria in the media that support your fish, since this is only two danios its fine to put that into a new tank.

You couldnt take a filter that had been supporting 2 danios, and expect it to support 25 cardinal tetras... theres not enough bacteria there.

There is a product called SafeStart, which allegedly allows you to stock a new tank immediately - im yet to be convinced but its surely worth a try.

Errrrrr

I have a 25 litre one but, even though I have done everythig correctly I loose most fish

While this is the way I've started most of my tanks and it works amazingly well, I wouldn't put the filter from this tank within a mile of the new tank until it's known why most of the fish die!!!!  otherwise you could simply be transferring the problem!

Try to get some filter media from a friend with a healthy tank and thriving fish, that way you'll be up and running quicker and won't be introducing anything nasty ;)

One major factor in fish getting sick and dying can be water pH.  For best chance of success, make sure you know the pH of your water before choosing the fish for the tank and choose fish that naturally live in that pH .  If the fish and water are compatible then they should be able to avoid many diseases because their immune systems will be stronger ;)

Edited to add - By the way, when looking at water pH and choosing fish, remember that each number on the scale is 100 X the number before it   so pH 6 is 100 X more acidic than pH 7 (sort of like the difference between water and lemon juice - to us ;) )  and pH 8 is 100 X more alkali than pH 7 !

> There is a product called SafeStart, which allegedly allows you to stock a new tank immediately - im yet to be convinced but its surely worth a try.

I use something similar in my pond filter (filter boost I think it's called). Whenever we do a major filter clean we use the additive to kick-start the bio filter, it's great stuff :)
Basically it's a bottle of the bacteria colony the filter needs :)

Safe start, or any other "bacteria" formular in a bottle doesn't work!  The bacteria is artifcial so therefore will not work the same as building it yourself.

The only safe way to stock a tank in one go is to fishless cycle using amonia and a test kit!

I also got told the safe start was a waste of money by a knowledgeably guy in Pets at home (vey nice looking Dep manager)!!!!
Well I have put the stuff from the other filter in, and some plants,
Will put the Danios in on Sunday,  week after I set it up, and go from there LOL
Lea :)

Your filter bacteia will die by sunday!  It isn't being "fed"....

Can you not feed it by adding a few flakes of food every day?

Not really.  The fish cycle is Amonia,---> nitrite,----> nitrate

Fish food will just build up as it's not being eaten and throw the nitrate (I think) levels really high.

(Think it's nitrate and not Nitrite)

Flakes are meant to work well as they rot and create ammonia:-

Where would we get ammonia from? Flakes is a good answer
It turns out that rotting food creates ammonia. So, you can add flakes to the tank, as though there were fish there. Don't add too many - just a pinch a day, say 4 large flakes for a 10 gallon tank. As the flakes decompose, they will create Ammonia. Since food has other stuff in it (such as Phosphates) which can be harmful in big concentrations, remember to do water changes before you put any fish in. The decomposing flakes will also leave debris, which you should suck out (with an aquarium vacuum) as best as you can before you put fish in. Also, the exact concentration of Ammonia is not directly controllable with flakes. It depends on their type, amount and speed of decay. There will be a time lapse before Ammonia begins to build-up, and some erratic behavior to Ammonia levels even after it does, which will cause cycling to take longer than you want. But this is a legitimate way to cycle your tank.

http://www.loveoffish.com/fishlesscycling.html