so since Tio moved in i've had him on a barf diet which he seems to be enjoying (for the most part, doesn't like trout or kidneys). Given that he'd not been out for proper walks for a while he was a little on the tubby side, not much but since he has had surgery on one cruciate and the specialist says the other one has an 80% likelyhood of needing surgery as well i wanted to shift some pudge off him.

no bother, its fallen away but unfortunately we've gone a bit far and now he's getting to thin. i' feeding more than he;ll actually eat, supplimenting his meat (liver, tripe, beef and pork mince, lamb mince, turkey drumsticks, chicken drumsticks, rabbit, pilchards...) and veg with porridge, potato or rice, he gets loads of treats when he's left in the house (hidden in his kong and tire toy so he needs to find them lol) like cheese, black pudding, hot dogs, boiled eggs (also raw in his dinner but i like giving him cooked ones to play with) etc.

we've not massively upped his excersize, he's getting a moderate walk every second day and a session of footy in the garden each day in between (building up his stamina) which he loves so its not that i'm burning everything off of him.

any suggestions to stop him wasting away? someone mentioned some kind of fattening balls before?
 

anyone any suggestions? please?

You are thinking of satin balls but to be honest if he is losing weight you might need to take a look at what you are feeding him, especially as he was ok before you switched him to BARF.  I had the opposite with my boys, I had to take them off BARF because they piled they weight on.

Can't you just up the amount you're feeding or will he just not eat anymore quantity wise? When I was feeding all raw my Dobe was on 4% of his bodyweight (think the average is about 2 or 3%). He's always needed more than the recommended amounts on complete foods also - even when on rest for his torn cruciate ligament he was still having a lot so I think he just has a fast metabolism. Temperament can also play a part - dogs that are naturally a bit anxious or stressy will burn more calories than relaxed, calm dogs.

Lamb breast is good for putting on weight, and also full fat cheddar cheese cut up into small cubes for training. Tripe is also good, but see you're already doing that. Think you might just need to try and up the amounts rather than add anything else..?

Like Claire my English Setter piled on the pounds on BARF - the Gordons tend to run there's off but not my fatboy Charlie so he has reduced portions

What % of his body weight are you feeding as meals?  Are you feeding enough quantity - perhaps you should up the percentage.

Astarte - you may just need to up the amount of food you are feeding. Both my dogs are raw fed and the GR gets between 2-3% of his body weight but my small terrierX gets around 5% of his body weight and is still very lean. The percentages recommended are a starting point and you then adjust them to suit your dog. My smaller dog has more tripe than my larger dog and this helps him to maintain his weight. Although he is very lean my vet said he looks perfect but Cooper is not always bothered about eating and can lose weight very quickly if he only eats part of his two meals a day.

It also depends on the amount of bone they are getting. BARF recommended 50-70% raw meaty bones but I personally think this is way to high for my dogs and they get around 15-25% rmb which suits them much better. Bones weigh quite heavy in comparison to the amount of meat on them so you may just need to up the muscle meat a bit and reduce the bones - just MHO.

I was just thinking the same thing Harley, up the actual meat quantity. I certainly don't feed anything like 60% meaty bones; thinking about it I feed about the same amount as you.

yes! those are the things! well i've listed what i'm feeding above, any suggestions?

he won't finish what he's eating at the moment, so upping quantity isn;t an option. he is an anxious dog but i'm feeding quantity wise more than was reccommended by a barf feeding leonberger owner (so same size to bigger than my lad)

doesn;t seem to like lamb very much either, he eats less of it than say chicken, tripe etc but he gets loads of cheese, black pudding etc. even given him a bit of creamed rice as a treat.

he isn't on mostly bones (i was actually concerned that might be why he's slim, ta for clarifying they are less fatty), he's on more muscle meat.

will try upping his meat more, but genuinely he doesn't eat everything i give him anyway! if he eats a whole bowl i offer him more which he will sometimes eat, sometimes not...

anyone got a recipe for satin balls? they might help a bit.

Perhaps you could try giving him less food at one go but putting an extra meal in so he is still getting same quantity but spread over more meals. Have never fed satin balls so afraid I can't help you there.

My terrier wasn't very keen of offal to begin with so I whizzed it up in the food processor with mince and now he will eat it in chunks. Might be worth mixing lamb in with something else he does like? I know some people add oil to their dog's food so this could be something else to research ( don't do it myself so not sure what the pros and cons are but again might be worth looking at).

I myself don't feed any grains at all and have never fed rice etc - it could be that he is filling up on "filler" food and so unable to eat the meat?

i've cut right down on the filler foods, will cut it out for the next couple of meals though, and tried hiding the lamb with other stuff (like toddlers and veg lol), still doesn't eat it, even with tripe! how can he possibly smell it in tripe?? some impressive nose! he's a trouble maker!

he gets fed in the morning when we are both in, then he gets fed in the evening when we both get home and bf gives him lots fo treats in between, as well as those left when he's alone.

trying mixing in some kibble with his meat as well incase that heps but it worries me as i've heard a couple of folk mention bloat occuring when feeding a mixxed kibble/raw diet- am i being paranoid here?

Here you go astarte, I've found and posted this before for someone else but have had no need to use it myself so not sure how good it is. I'm sure there are other recipes out there too :)
The thread is ....wits end with non eating dog!

This recipe is one for putting weight on an animal quickly, and some use it for putting a couple extra pounds on a show animal prior to the big day, or an animal that may have been ill and needs a weight gain program. It has also been reported that this recipe will help with some forms of hair loss, such as when your dog(s) blow their coat, to keep the coat healthy and shiny. This recipe is intended to be fed raw.

10lb hamburger meat
1 jar wheat germ
1 lg box of oatmeal (uncooked)
1 1/4 Cup vegetable oil
10 eggs
10 sm pkgs unflavored gelatin
1 1/4 Cup unflavored molasses
A pinch of salt
1 lg box Total cereal (2lb's)
(You may also add a pinch of garlic powder to add flavor)

Mix all ingredients together well, much like a meatloaf....put into separate freezer bags and freeze, thawing out as needed. It puts weight on in a very short time, not to mention the gloss in their coat. You can use it every day when they have a show to do and it does not produce diarrhoea. It can be fed alone or with kibble.

Total cereal is cornflakes

thanks, thats grand. sounds really appetising huh?

If you search the thread, Astarte, some of them changed the ingredients slightly cos they couldnt get them. Might be worth a try asking them how they got on with it when they come on here :)

Could he be missing your parents and their other dogs Astarte ?( I may be completely wrong here or thinking of someone else but didn't you get him from your parents not long ago?) Maybe if there are no other dogs 'competing' for food he doesn't feel the need to finish everything?

yes thats us! :) its an idea, Keeper did have a tendancy to go scrounging, but he'd let her have some at home (she ruled with a paw of gentle chastisement :)). he's still eating most of what i give him, just not all, and it gets taken up after a bit if he doesn't eat it

i don't want to have to put him back on kibble as he's calmed down so much on barf, i think he must have been really sensitive to anything added. he also seems to enjoy it more for the most part.

Higher fat content foods, rather than more food quantity.. and added oil (if that doesnt have dire(rear) results?)..

I add porridge oats to the HairyFairy's dinners which seems to be putting the weight on her nicely without piling it on too much (she is young, brainless and has inherited the bouncing traits of a Tigger i think so does her level best to burn off any extra calories and cant have ANYTHING even remotely like rocket-fuel or im peeling her off the ceiling).

i've had him on porridge as well, sigh!

what sort of foods are highest in fats for him? i presume beef mince and tripe? leaving skin on his chicken and turkey?

bought him 2 kilos of hearts today so hes a happy boy :)

Tripe is pretty low in fat. If you want to add fats you can put a spoon of something like olive oil in his food. If her were my dog I'd go with Harley's suggestion and feed him three times a day to get his weight up if he's that skinny. Hard to believe he can't eat enough. My friends Newf weighs a svelte 76 Kg now and he only eats 800g of meat a day. My little golden youngster could easily pack 500-600g away in one go. She usually eats 800g herself. You'd think a big boy like him could stuff it down! :) I'll have to introduce him to my father and his amazing accordian stomach. ;-)

ok, will do. its only sometimes he doesn;t eat the full portion and i think its becasue i wasn;t leaving enough time between feeds. he'd get fed at night (approx 11.30- when i get in from work) and then get fed again at about 9 am and it was generally the morning meal he wouldn;t finish so i'm making the meals now and getting my partner to give it to him at about mid day.

the way our shifts fall 3 meals a day is a bit impractical, so instead today i left a few more treats for him. The frozen blocks of rabbit from prize choice go a bit pate like when defrosed so spread some on bread and some of his toys and left him an egg to play with.

he had a huge bowl of heart and tripe with duck eggs today and scoffed the lot so hopefully its that simple. will start putting oil in it and possibly suet. chicken legs and thighs, rabbit and heart tonight for the boyo. my team at work claim he's better fed than the lot of them.

I'm sure you'll find a routine that works for him.

The rabbit does go slushy. They don't get them often but my two love rabbit hash made with warm boiled potatoes. :)

oh, might need to try that with him

What about the occasional tin of sardines in sunflower or Olive oil? Some grated cheese? A mcflurry? (I'll have that if the dog doesn't want it!)

eta: what about goats milk?

Been having this problem with Sunny, well sort of.  He isnt fed RAW, or BARF, but on a holistic food.  Anyways, this dog came to my aunt at 4.5 lbs ish.  (an adult is supposed to be 8-10 lbs - and he was almost 2 years old)  Anyways, with talking with some breeders, they suggested either macaroni, or hamburger meat.  Since then, he is up to just over 7lbs, and is looking much better. (Now only to add some muscle to him)

I know, difference in size - I mean we are talking min pin, not mastiff, but it may help. 

The idea about splitting meals is also a very good one! 

goats milks a good idea. he doesn't like sardines but eats pilchards and eats lots of cheese.

seriously a mcflurry?

he is scoffing his whole meals now that i've spaced them out a bit more, and has started eating more. he'll often come and whine for more after meals so i'm just giving him as much as he'll eat really and he's put a bit on. dad was round yesterday and is really pleased with how he looks, apparently he thinks his rather mastiffy muzzle has shortened down a bit and got more wrinkle

That's great news Astarte, well done for being so persistent. Now to find a nice balanced maintenance diet.

thanks, hopefully we can keep it up!