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Topic Dog Boards / Behaviour / Neutering
- By jripley [de] Date 13.10.02 14:08 UTC
I have 5 months old black labrador and am considering getting him neutered.

I was just wondering how it is likely to affect him in terms of behaviour and health.

Also at what age is he likely to be fully grown.

Thanks in advance

John
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 13.10.02 16:29 UTC
To put my cards on the table I am against castration unless it is for the health of the dog. Why are you considering doing it? If it is to stop breeding then please consider vasectomy as at least that leaves the dog with an intact hormonal system. Different breeds mature at different ages. But please be sure you have good reason for doing this, once done there is little you can do to reverse it, I have to spend a good deal of money on hormone replacement tablets to help conteract the effects of castration. Not all dogs are effected to the extent that mine is but most will have some side effects. Jackie
- By Kerioak Date 13.10.02 17:03 UTC
Hi Jackie

You always recommended vasectomy instead of castration - what has happened to your dog to make you take this stance and what are the pros and cons of vasectomy over castration in your view?

Christine
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 13.10.02 17:37 UTC
Castration removes part of the dogs hormonal system and although they manage without it, I don't see the point if all you are trying to acheave is that your dog will not procreate. I have a dog that was castrated at 13 months and I have had a lot of trouble with him in his later years most of which are hormonal, some vet will admit that castration was probable the cause other will not hear of it. All I can say is I would never take the risk of putting another dog through what this one has suffered again, unless it was to save his life. In humans if part of the hormonal system is removed or damaged in some way then replacement hormones are given to counteract any adverse effects. It costs me at the moment around £50 a month to keep my dog happy and well, he is approching 13 years now and I hope to keep him going as long as he is still enjoying his life. He also has a reduced imune system but I think this may have been caused more by the medication he has had over the years rather than the lack of testis. Sorry about spelling, cant blame that on castration. Ja:)kie
- By dollface Date 13.10.02 17:17 UTC
If your dog has contained one or both of his testicles you have to have him neutered.
It is a very good idea to have him neutered if you are not breeding him. It cuts down on roaming behavior, and can also reduce aggressive behavior as well. Unneutered males can have health problems like testicular cancer. Males are usually neutered around six months of age.
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 13.10.02 17:51 UTC
I would class retained testicles as possiably life threatening. I have never had a dog show roaming or aggressive behaviour although they can be difficult around the teenage time. The case about avoiding the very rare prostrait cancer has recently been questioned as in research the same number of dogs were found to suffer regardless of whether they were castrated or not, and it is anyway very rare in the dog. Of course, if they don't have testicles then that is one place they can't get cancer but checking them could not be easier. I am suprised if people are worried about male behaviour that they have a dog in the first place, by dog I mean male. Ja:)kie
- By Amy M [gb] Date 13.10.02 21:40 UTC
Castration is said to reduce the level of aggression in male dogs and in the case of the three Labradors that I know who have been castrated it has worked very well. One was a seven year old working dog who turned on another male dog whilst on a shoot. He was horrible, growling at male dogs and eventually getting to the point where he had another dog by the throat. One year and castration later he is a different dog. Today I saw him play with other male dogs while out walking and with no hint of his former aggression. His owner was nearly in tears she was so proud of him. I am not saying it works in every case but it has in the examples I have seen. The other was fine until he hit 18 months then he was growling and posturing at every single male. Again he got to the point where he attacked another male and was castrated as a last resort. I have to say his attitude has improved to the point where he can be around other males and not be at all concerned. All were done on the advice of a vet and behaviourist but I do not agree with castrating a dog just for the sake of it.
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 14.10.02 06:15 UTC
Thing is Amy, it does not always work to change behaviour, if fact I would say you only have a small chance it will work, if you use Tardec first you will get an idea if it will work or not. If Tardec does have the required effect, then yes castration is better than having the dog PTS. An yes vets will suggest castration at the drop of a scalpal, but things are changing and some now realise that providing the owner will home and look after the dog in a correct fashion then perhaps the dog should not be castrated. I have had one vet tell me that he is suprised that no one has yet to take a vet to court for not explaining the side effects to the owner, I asked if he would put it in writing and he would not, I can understand his reluctance. Jackie
- By Sharon McCrea [gb] Date 14.10.02 07:13 UTC
My views (and my vets') exactly! In fact with multiple dogs castration can worsen the situation. I neuter for medical reasons only.
- By Helen [gb] Date 14.10.02 08:07 UTC
I have an entire male and he started being "bolshy" around other dogs. However, he is approaching 2 yeard old and he is fine now. In fact, we had a terrier run out of a farm yard towards us barking furiously yesterday. He just looked at him, and turned round when I did. Two months ago, he would have been very insulted to have a little scrap of a thing barking at him.

Do you think people see normal adolescence as a "problem" behaviour?

Helen
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 14.10.02 09:28 UTC
Helen, YES I DO, a little more research into dog behaviour and a little less rushing for a quick fix would be better, at least IMHO. Ja:)kie
- By mari [ie] Date 14.10.02 10:56 UTC
I cant say enough how much I agree with Jackie H .
Nature is not meant to be so interferred with and in the plan of things nearly always works it self out .
Teenagers can be dreadful asses but turn into nice adults.
Mari
- By Madamemeddler [de] Date 14.10.02 12:34 UTC
I have a neutered red cocker male.He showed aggressive tendencies from weeks old.After he nipped a friend of my son's..we had him neutered aged 18 months on our vet's advice. He is now almost 5.On the whole he is a calmer dog with flashes of temper.I also have an entire orange roan male aged 4. He has a perfect temperament and is healthy so I see no need to neuter him. I can see though that 2 males who are close in age could have the potential to fight if the dominant/submissive behaviour was changed more.Our red dog is still very much the dominant dog...and the other very submissive.If they had been of a similar temperament in the first place we could have had more problems.The multi dog home has a different set of potential problems compared to the 1 dog home.
- By Jane Gordon [gb] Date 15.10.02 16:19 UTC
As you seem well informed on this what would your advice be for me. I have a bitch and her 14 week old male puppy, I don't want to have her 'fixed' but was intending to have Dillon castrated to prevent any unwanted matings with him and his mum! What are the alternatives?

Jane
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 15.10.02 19:10 UTC
Have a vasectomy. Or have him or her kenneled if you can not seperate them your self. Jackie
- By LongDog [gb] Date 14.10.02 15:56 UTC
A reatained or absent testicle is not life threatening in all cases. I had a whippet with a retained testicle who lived to the ripe old age of 15 and he was never 'tampered' with in any way.
I do not believe in castration or spaying unless on medical grounds. I have had dogs all my life and everyone has remained intact!!
- By dollface Date 14.10.02 17:27 UTC
Just a question here. How do you sell your pups if they only go for pets. When with some breeders in their contract (pet only) must be fixed. If people buy these dogs for pets how does the breeder know they aren't out there fixing up other dogs and with canine disese's (Brucellosis, herpes) can't that be spread? Is it good for females to go through heats if you are not breeding them, and can it harm them in the future?
I know someone who bought a puppy who had a retained testy and he ended up passing on because of it (only six months old) they told her it was becuase of it(tumor), how would you know if it is life threatening or not? I always heard that they should be casterated by puberty. Is it a big chance of it becoming life threatening? I had a pup that contained one and I had him fixed, the other one came down then went back up. Could I have left him intact? I was told to fix him. He also had a rectal prolapse (not heriditary asked the vet, and did a lot of reading on it to,could of been reason for testy) we did a purse string on him and was told not sure how long he would live. He is still alive and doing well, on fibre twice a day to help him poop.
- By LongDog [gb] Date 14.10.02 18:23 UTC
Hi dollface
In response to your question:
Is it good for females to go through heats if you are not breeding them, and can it harm them in the future?

We have six bitches at the moment the oldest are 10, none have been 'fixed' and all have regular seasons. Even the bitches we dont intend to breed from will not be spayed unless for medical purposes. They are all extemely healthy and happy.
Look at it this way would you give a woman who didnt want to have children a hysterectomy so she didnt have her monthlys? or would you castrate you son at puberty to prevent him fathering any unwanted children? I dont think so.
When our puppies go to pet homes it is the new owners (who are thoroughly vetted) choice as to wether to have them fixed or not but if they asked our advice it would be "if it ain't broke don't fix it"
- By Lara Date 16.10.02 05:24 UTC
Well my oldest GSD wasn't broke so I didn't fix it! - now in his latter years when things are prone to go wrong one of his testicles has developed a problem. A simple op in a younger dog - but now when his back end etc.. is failing and he's elderly - I'm left with the agony of it all. I personally don't feel he would pull through the operation as frail as he is and I could really kick myself for not castrating him earlier.
I only wish I could turn back the clock :(
- By Jackie H [gb] Date 16.10.02 07:27 UTC
Lara, none of us can see into the future, but if you had had him castrated, as I did, he may not have made it as far as he has. It is usualy easy to find a small pea size lump both in the testicuals and in the mamary strip whilst grooming and it is normaly very easy to deal with. I am sorry the situation is complecated by other problems with your boy but as long as you can keep him comfortable he should be OK, after all, we all have to go with something and if he is old and still enjoying life then you should feel you have done the best for him. Only wish I could put the clock back as my boy has been suffering for at least the last eight years and that is only since it became noticable.

If it is just his age and the operation you are worried about, I would ask your vet who will check him and if asked give an honist oppinion as to whether or not it would be wise to operate, I don't think the actual op is any more of a problem now, than it would have been when he was younger. Wishing you all the best, oldies are such a joy and such a worry. Jackie
- By Lara Date 16.10.02 09:41 UTC
Hi Jackie

I wouldn't be unduly worried if it was a pea sized lump. One of them is considerably swollen although doesn't seem to offer any discomfort. I am aware of benign v malignant, but having recently lost a dog to cancer it's very easy to fear the worst or at least prepare yourself for it.
My vet is always consulted in matters like this and we have discussed it at length and both agree that it is six and two threes as to which will get him first if it is cancerous. He doesn't know what he would do and neither do I.
You and I just seem to be in the same boat of regrets only at other ends of the scale. I don't doubt that you won't ever castrate again - and unless something like what has happened to you happens to me then I have no doubt that I will not keep a dog entire again unless I intend to breed which is highly unlikely as it's not my thing, but I will agree to differ with your opinion that the op will be no more of a problem now. An op in an old frail dog carries a considerably higher risk than a younger stronger dog - and yes I love the character of oldies! :)
Topic Dog Boards / Behaviour / Neutering

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