Is there any truth in this?  Apparently, this is a hot topic in US, where certain pet food brands have been accused of using pets that have been provided for them by vets!  Owners are up in arms because they had assumed their pets had been cremated, not added to the food chain.  Tested food was found to contain the drug used in pet euthanasia.  Roadkill is also thought to have been used.  I haven't found out about the food in this country.  Does anyone have any info?

Have a look at this thread :- http://www.champdogsforum.co.uk/cgi-bin/board/topic_show.pl?pid=910717;hl=roadkill#pid910717
I havnt read it all, I have just put road kill into the search menu, but it is a thread from april :)
(will now go and read LOL)
Lea :)

Sorry but I wouldn't even bother looking. Think about it from a purely economic viewpoint. How much would it cost to drive around an area hoping to find roadkill? How many hedgehogs would it take to make one bag of complete? The cost of offcuts and carcasses they get from mass produced meat farming and fishing would be far cheaper for them. The idea that they'd drive around looking for the odd dead pet or animal lying in the road is absurd to me.

>I haven't found out about the food in this country.  Does anyone have any info?

have a read of the Petfood Manufacturers Association website. It will answer your questions.

The US is, unfortunately, the source of a lot of scaremongering. If the roadkill part (for instance) was true how come it's left lying at the side of the road for weeks?

That's very logical, Lori.  As to euthanised pets I can't imagine any vet so impoverished to risk flouting the very strict disposal rules of clinical waste here in the UK, which sadly is what our pets become once they have passed away, for the few coppers that a food company may be willing to pay.  I can't imagine the US would be very different.

Well, i expect if the drug has been found in the food, it had to get there somehow, just how good the actual proof is would I suspect, be open to challenge. I expect if it is true, the facts will come out eventually. I would think the danger of buying food with this in it would depend on if the food came from the US to start with.

With whats in some dog food in this country, road kill would at least add some meat, real meat, and no shavings, colours, preservatives etc! I remember a program about a chap living off road kill, but he did remove the skin feathers and bones! :)

> Is there any truth in this?  Apparently, this is a hot topic in US, where certain pet food brands have been accused of using pets that have been provided for them by vets!  Owners are up in arms because they had assumed their pets had been cremated, not added to the food chain.  Tested food was found to contain the drug used in pet euthanasia.  Roadkill is also thought to have been used.  I haven't found out about the food in this country.  Does anyone have any info?

There is absolute truth in it unfortunately. If you are really interested in reading more about it either buy or borrow from the library FOOD PETS DIE FOR by Ann N. Martin. You will really think twice about feeding your dog dry kibble. It's legal in the US to use road kill, diseased animals, euthanised animals as it is cheaper for the Vet to send them off to processing plants than to dispose of them by cremation.

I won't list all the other 'ingredients' that go into making kibble in the US or those of you that are dry feeding would probably not eat your own lunch and definitely not want to look in the dogs bowl.

>it is cheaper for the Vet to send them off to processing plants than to dispose of them by cremation.

Seeing as the owner pays the cremation fee within the euthanasia fee, how does that work? It costs the vet nothing. And how many trucks have you seen clearing up roadkill? If it's so valuable why is it left to rot at the side of the road?

Even if it's true for the US there's no reason to believe it's the same for food manufactured here.

A company in the the UK(still trading but under different ownership)was caught in an undercover TV investigation, putting dead dogs & cats into dog & cat food they produced. They actually never tried to cover it up & the animals skinned & gutted carcasses were hug on hooks & piles of dogs/cats in bin liners were delivered daily from all over the UK to them.

The owners/management were stopped by the local authority after the footage was given to them & the factory was closed down. The same company was responsible for sheep carcaases being used to make cattle food that was was one source of BSE in cattle(this happened when one Margaret Thatcher had the law changed to allow animal protein to be used in the production of cattle fodder-obviously this has now changed)

This company never made dry complete dog food BTW

The owners/management were taken to court & found guilty. The company is still trading but no longer makes pet food & was taken over when it went into receivership after thecourt case. Because of this I will not name the company as the current company has no connection with the previous one.

It is illegal for meat to be used in production of animal feeds in the UK to be anything other than fit for human consumption & this applies to any imported feeds as well. There are very strict rules on the use of drugs etc as treatment of animals destined to be used for human & animal consumption.

Edited to add that part of the fee paid to my vets includes disposal of the body(by mass cremation) when animal is PTS if the owners wish the vets to dispose of the body, however the cost is lower if the owner states they want an individual  cremation & the ashes returned as this cost is then paid directly by the owner to the crematorium. I personally know the Pet Crematorium owners & they cremate all types of pets from mice to horses & even some livestock if requested to

> Because of this I will not name the company as the current company has no connection with the previous one.
>

Why not?  If there was a court case and indeed receivership it is a matter of public record.  I have tried Googling but cannot find it so far.

So it would seem that one should be extremely wary of all the imported dog foods -especially those with high protein levels - as they could contain euthanised pets who may have been taking medication.

It could be a toss-up ..... do you want to feed dead pets or roadkill?????????

  

Arthur Boyt from Cornwall can't see anything wrong with roadkill and eats it all the time.  I can see his logic, it's not fed hormones and hasn't been tampered with by humans. Provided the dead meat is fresh and butchered properly it won't cause any harm.  He should know I suppose as he's been eating it for years. This bit made me chuckle "His most unusual meal was a greater horseshoe bat, which he reckons is not dissimilar in taste to grey squirrel" Err, what does squirrel taste like? - I'll be disappointed if someone says chicken.

I can't see roadkill being financially viable as a business in the UK.  From my own observations over the years most roadkill in this country is made up from hedgehogs, badgers and birds.  At least in the States they are likely to have bigger wild animals to run over. 

Roadkill that ends up the verges gets cleared up by the council around here.

I'd prefer roadkill any day!.....

> Even if it's true for the US there's no reason to believe it's the same for food manufactured here.

I never said that it was true for the UK. But it has been proved true for the US. It is a big subject and having done my research as well as owning the book it has been proved and not denied as happening in the US. As I stated it is quite legal.

Just because the owner of the deceased dog pays a cremation fee does not mean that the animal actually gets cremated.

The orginal poster asked for any information on the above. I have just given it as I believe it to be. It is up to you to accept it or do your research and then accept or disprove it. Animal feeding is a subject that is very important to me and I am extremely careful how I feed my dogs, chickens etc. and therefore I have spent a great deal of time on research. Hope this helps.

> Just because the owner of the deceased dog pays a cremation fee does not mean that the animal actually gets cremated.
>

Although classing our deceased pets as clinical waste is, perhaps, rather distasteful to us at least it has ensured that pet crematoria are all licenced and inspected because of this fact.  So I think it highly unlikely they would risk their whole livelyhood for whatever coppers such remains would bring given that there is no shortage of supply from legitimate sources.

>Provided the dead meat is fresh and butchered properly it won't cause any harm.

I agree - fresh roadkill is free, organic meat; I've eaten it myself (pheasant) and the dogs have had rabbit from this source. I was too late to get a deer once - by the time I'd turned round and gone back for it, someone else was loading it into their car! Curses!

>Just because the owner of the deceased dog pays a cremation fee does not mean that the animal actually gets cremated.

That's very true and there are unsavoury characters in many areas of business.  However, if you pay to have an animal cremated and it then follows that the animal isn't I think you would have strong grounds to sue for breach of contract.  Certainly, that's the route I would follow via Trading Standards because I would have been deliberately lied to/deceived and not received the service I had paid for. 

>Just because the owner of the deceased dog pays a cremation fee does not mean that the animal actually gets cremated.

That might be the case in the USA but I very much doubt it happens in the UK

>dogs have had rabbit from this source

Reminds me of Gordon Ramsay's programme recently where he took his son with him to catch rabbits with ferrets and nets.

Yes, thank you Orjack.  I must admit I was amazed when I came across this on the web.  I think it's the fact that people are constantly lied to.  It's like that film Soylent Green (anyone remember that one with Charlton Heston) when people were turned into food for the masses.  When we are paying good money, for what we believe is premium pet food, the ingredients should reflect the price.

Since surfing on this topic, I've come across a legal action from Canada about Royal Canin food containing so much Vitamin D it has caused death and serious liver damage to pets.  Whatever next?

> I've come across a legal action from Canada about Royal Canin food containing so much Vitamin D it has caused death and serious liver damage to pets.

What was the outcome?

Not sure of outcome - but legal matters take ages.  Here is a link to one report dated May last year.

http://www.thestar.com/article/194285

In the early 80's when I worked as a vet nurse this happened in Sweden -and it was definitely true there, then, it was in all the papers and news and it was a huge scandal.The vet I worked for was interviewed about it and I ended up in some of the photos with her. The importers of dry dog foods made in the UK were very quick to point out that it affected no UK made food -it was Swedish foods. It's all a long story, was very long ago, and needless to say caused such an outcry things were changed. But as I do know for a fact this DID happen in Sweden (I think it was 1984, I still have some of the articles somewhere) I'd imagine it is entirely possible it has happened elsewhere as well. :( But I'd very much doubt the UK was involved as they seemed to be on the level already back then.

It did happen in the UK but it was in the 1970s. My father's employers used to have dealings with the UK company(they produced animal feedstuffs-another company that was taken over & now no longer exists)

It is ILLEGAL in the U.S. to use road kill or euthanised pets in dog food.  End of story.

Whether it has ever happened in the UK or US is a different matter - it is breaking the law and people do break laws.

A few people in this country have become seriously ill after eating what they presumed was road kill (deer), if a deer is knocked down and injured most police forces have a list of registered FAC1 or FAC2 rifle holders that will come at short notice to dispatch the deer, if none of these are fortcoming it is then left to the veterinarian on call to humanely euthanise the animal. If the animal is left for the council to collect and someone comes along and takes the deer before then it is subsequently eaten fatal consequences have been known to occur. I would not touch road kill with a barge pole.

Might have happened in the part but it seems a bit odd in this day and age of duty of care etc that someone could leave, effectively, poisoned meat lying around without taking every precaution to prevent injury to people at least a notice attached to it for instance.

No Isabel I am afraid, there was a large warning about it in the Shooting Times a couple of months ago, 2 dogs fed venison roadkill and dead the next morning, toxicology stated caused by PB, last year 3 people seriously ill again reported in sporting press due to same. If the deer is dispatched late at night the duty vet may not be able to dispose of carcass and it is left to the local authority to do so, they are informed of location etc and it appears they did not act till the next day. There are warnings every year about this and legally unless the deer is euthanised when injured on land it belongs to the landowner, if  euthanised on the public highway it is then the responsibility of the local council. The vet or indeed the RSPCA if called are under no legal obligation to label the carcass, a mad law but true I am afraid

> Might have happened in the part but it seems a bit odd in this day and age of duty of care etc that someone could leave, effectively, poisoned meat lying around without taking every precaution to prevent injury to people at least a notice attached to it for instance.

Yes, surely somebody would be in trouble for leaving a euthanised (as in lethal injection, not shot) animal on the road side? Not just a danger to people who may take it, but think of all the wildlife (and pets?) that would be eating it, they would all be at risk of being killed too :(

> No Isabel I am afraid, there was a large warning about it in the Shooting Times a couple of months ago, 2 dogs fed venison roadkill and dead the next morning, toxicology stated caused by PB, last year 3 people seriously ill again reported in sporting press due to same. If the deer is dispatched late at night the duty vet may not be able to dispose of carcass and it is left to the local authority to do so, they are informed of location etc and it appears they did not act till the next day. There are warnings every year about this and legally unless the deer is euthanised when injured on land it belongs to the landowner, if  euthanised on the public highway it is then the responsibility of the local council. The vet or indeed the RSPCA if called are under no legal obligation to label the carcass, a mad law but true I am afraid

Poor dogs, I hope the people who got ill recovered Ok. That is frightening :(

Are the shooting press, or indeed anyone, attempting to do anything to change this law, lobbing MPs for a change for instance.
Although I would have thought the laws obliging everyone to observe duty of care to the general public in their work, ie the vet is working, would have covered it.

Yes there has been a government lobby by the Countryside Alliance and also I believe BASC but as it isn't a 'hot' topic no legislation has been passed as yet. Last year a rifleman was called to an injured deer by a farmer whose land he shot over, the deer was humanely dispatched on the highway but as this guy didn't have the right conditions on his firearms certificate he had his license revoked, the law is a right ass at times unfortunately, this guy was doing the correct thing by putting an injured animal out of it's misery quickly and he gets punished. Maybe the press and the RSPCA should do a campaign warning people of the dangers of roadkill.

> Maybe the press and the RSPCA should do a campaign warning people of the dangers of roadkill.

I would rather see a law preventing the abandonment of poisoned meat rather than people being resourseful about any road kill they might find.

Cor blimey, thats awful.
In the spraying industry we have to have certificates to say we are able to spray toxic chemicals, wether tht be on Weeds or Vermin. And is somethingt OTHER than the weed or Vermin dies then we can be fined upto £20,000  for doing the wrong thing.
SURELY there is some litigation to have this with animals as well???????
although, on the other vein, isnt Euthanasia injection just an over dose of anasthetic. So if a deer is given  euthanasia injection and it i despersed straight into the heart (Right leg, vein goes straight into the heart so the prefered way???) and the heart stops, so the veins shut down so the chemical goes into the heart and stays there) So surely the small amount of anasthetic in the blood stream wouldnt do anything else but make the person sleepy????? As long as they dont eat the right leg and heart of the animal???
Sorryt all this is coming from the back of the brain and is probably completely wrong.
Lea :)

Maybe the press and the RSPCA should do a campaign warning people of the dangers of roadkill.

A very common sense approach until such laws are made to cover roadkill...if they ever are made that is!

Perhaps Defra should take some responsibility for this??

Perhaps Defra should take some responsibility for this?

I think you are right.

>The idea that they'd drive around looking for the odd dead pet or animal lying in the road is absurd to me.

But they do :-D It was on that show called "The dirtiest jobs".And there are people who's 9 to 5 job is solely picking up roadkill which are then sent to rendering plants.

>So it would seem that one should be extremely wary of all the imported dog foods

Whether it be imported or local pet food,i don't use anything that doesn't use certified Human Grade Ingredients.
Pet foods,in the US, who do use HGI have to pass a very strict screening process.Any food that doesn't have this written on the package is fed at the owners "own risk" i guess.

As for getting my pets cremated,i have been lucky enough to be able to have buried my passed pets,as i just cant trust the vets,or whoever it is that deals with these things.How do i know i'm getting MY pets ashes back?? If a vet can make money out of selling deceased pets,and get them picked up,eg taken off their hands,then i'm sure there would more than one who would deal this way :(

> Whether it be imported or local pet food,i don't use anything that doesn't use certified Human Grade Ingredients.
>

I don't really know what goes on in Australia, I shall leave you to sort that out ;-) but here in the UK this already applies to all our foods.

> As for getting my pets cremated,i have been lucky enough to be able to have buried my passed pets,as i just cant trust the vets,or whoever it is that deals with these things.How do i know i'm getting MY pets ashes back?? If a vet can make money out of selling deceased pets,and get them picked up,eg taken off their hands,then i'm sure there would more than one who would deal this way :-(

I know that my pets are individually cremated & returned to me, I know the people who run the crematorium & they are dedicated to making the lost of a pet, whether it is a cat/dog/horse etc easier by their services(the cost hasn't increased for years). They actually set up the crematorium when regulations were brought it to make it illegal to bury horses on their land & they lost a very much loved elderly horse. They deal with the worse scenario for owners with diginty & personal service. All the bodies are collected the same day & cremated the same day. The only mass cremations they carry out are if the owner doesn't want their pets ashes back or the animal has been killed in an RTA & has no known owner or PTS as a unowned pet. Their ashes are scattered in woodland on their farm(arable)

> But they do  It was on that show called "The dirtiest jobs".And there are people who's 9 to 5 job is solely picking up roadkill which are then sent to rendering plants.

What country was this in? I'm sorry but I'm struggling with this concept, not because I think humans are far to noble or ethical to indulge in such activities but because it makes such little economic sense. It costs me about £100 to fill my tank with diesel. How many bodies would I have to pick up to pay for that?  Plus I'm lucky (unlucky?) to see one dead animal or bird alongside the road in two weeks of driving so the rendering plant would have to pay me about £200 for a rabbit carcass. And I live in an area that has loads of rabbits in the fields. Maybe in countries where gas/petrol is cheap and road kill is large and numerous it could be viable but I'd hate to make a living at it here in the UK.

Lori, I saw this It was on that show called "The dirtiest jobs".And there are people who's 9 to 5 job is solely picking up roadkill which are then sent to rendering plants. on the Tv, a while ago now though, and yes people were picking up road kill in this country. Couldn't understand why to be honest, and can't remember where it was sold/given on to, but do remeber the collection of it because I thought it bazare!

This series perhaps?  It turns out they are using it for compost which does not seem like a high income product either so perhaps the expenditure on all this is for environmental health or safety issues.  I know large objects are always removed from on or around our motorways perhaps this is similarly busy and high speed roads.

That's the only one I could find Isabel; on the Discovery channel and in the US.

Well, I only have the regular chanels, bbc 123 ITV1 2 3, 4,c4 and 5, and i have no idea which one I watched it on. Could have sworn it was UK.....***shrugs shoulders and smiles***** but I could have been wrong about it being uk, there you go! :) :)

The internet doesn't yield everything. I'm sure you would have noticed if they were doodles! :) It's probably just not listed online anywhere.

Anaesthetic drugs don't quite work like that Lea....
Yes, any peripheral vein will take the drug to the right side of the heart. It is then circulated round the lungs to be oxygenated and returned to the left side of the heart to be pumped out into the systemic circulation. The anaethetics then act on the brain to induce  anaesthesia in therapeutic levels, or euthanasia in overdosage. Also, death would not ocurr the instant the drugs reached the brain, there would be a few seconds of heartbeat, thus distributing the drugs throughout the whole system.
This is a very disturbing thing to be happening, in any country.
Liz