WE HAVE A PUP AND THE T THE MUM HAS BIT THE CORD TO FAR I HAVE NO BLOOD STOP WHAT CAN I DO

Do you have forceps?  This is why they are very improtant in a whelping kit.  IF not, is there any way you can tie it off with thread?  If not, apply pressure with a cotton wool pad and ring vets - only lway will be to stitch.  Good luck

Is there any cord left at all?  If so pinch the end with you fingers for a couple of minutes.  Or call vets for advice.
Hope everything goes OK.

no cord i also think he has a cleft palate final count 9  puppies 3 girls 6 NEVER AGAIN

i ment to say 3girls 6 boys

Scans are notoriously inaccurate for numbers.  Oh dear, so many males too.  If the pup has cleft palate PTS would be best.

> no cord i also think he has a cleft palate

Just caught up with your posts. I do hope all went well for this little pup. Congratulations on all of them - you've got your work cut out :)
P.S. hope you've had some sleep now :) :)

Gosh 9 eek.... sounds like your girl did very well then. :)  I hope you and your girl are OK.  HUGS!!

are males harder to home?

Generally, yes; so if one has got a cleft palate then it's sad, but better to lose a dog than a bitch. Hope mother and babies are doing well now.

Yes, if he has a cleft palate best to pts, get the vet to check to be sure. Poor chap, but congrats on the rest!

although the other pups arent showing cleft palate they will be carrying the gene for it. so they shouldnt be bred from and the parents shouldnt be used again unless you can find out which parent is the carrier for this, this is why re searching your bitch's line and the stud dogs is so important

hi there thought i would update you all he is fine now back in with the rest of the litter and feeding well so no cleft palate i dont thnk .When we thought she had finished she hadnt final count are you ready................... 13 LIVE pups 1 was born dead sadly so she had 14pups in total that is triple average for my breed mother and babies doing well we have 4 bitches 9 dogs only 3 were born in sacks and  3 were born with their cords already severed the one we lost had been dead a while but i still tryed to revive her to no avail i am just thrilled to have 13 healthy pups
ALSO i have a unused bottle of dopram if anyone would like it also a tube of puppy stim with 12 mls left in a aspirator unused as all the pups had no breathing problems i dpnt mind posting them it seems a shame to waste them mite aswell save someone else a few pounds

I am going to be unpopular with some people here, and it is not meant to be hard hearted but an option to prevent potential future heartbreak. 

This was a litter thrust upon you. 

They are not going to be eligible for KC registration.  The kind of potential owners they will attract may be the kind who are less knowledgeable or don't care about being sure of pedigree, health background of the parents grandparents etc.  You are likely to get lots of enquiries from the kind of person who shouldn't own any animal, especially for the males.

I would be very worried about trying to home so many pups, do you really feel they should all be reared, given that there is a huge over population, especially of unregistered pups and crosses of this breed.

Rearing such a large litter may also be very hard on the bitch and you both physically and financially.  By the time they are 6 weeks old you will be going through two sacks of Puppy food a week, not to mention everything else.

If you can't find good homes for them all by the time they are a few months old you could end up with them fighting, especially as you don't know the temperament of the dogs behind them.

That is all I will say on the matter.

ashleig thats brilliant, well done to you and your girly. i don't think anyone will disagree is i say we're all really impressed with how great you've done in mad circumstance. you'll have a knackering few weeks ahead of you, and god a lot of homes to find, you'll do great though!

it is a worry isn't it? but given how responsible ashleighs been with them so far i think they have the best possible chance given the circumstance. we can but hope!

I just pray it works out.

hi thanks for your honest opinion brainless i had the same worry but i will do my best and i am adamant that no unsuitable people will get one of my pups even if i have to keep them for a bit longer so far they are all doing well

Good luck

>even if i have to keep them for a bit longer

That 'little bit longer' could be many months, if you're picky (as you should be) about who you home them to. Have you the facilities to raise 5 or 6 male puppies till they're 6 months of age, with all that's involved?

ashleigh are you planning on keeping a dog or a bitch pup?

yes we are keeping a dog

one less dog to home then. also likely to fit in well with your bitches.

You do realise that by the time the Mum comes in season when the pups are four to five months old that a male pup will be able to mate and impregnate his Mum?

I would have her spayed as soon as her milk dries up when the pups are about 12 weeks old.

Well done :), and hopefully they will all find loving suitable homes :)

Oh dear, I'm going to make myself really upopular here.

I think you've done a fantastic job taking on this bitch and seeing her through this whelping, BUT, IMHO, it is as irresponsible to rear all these puppies as it was to mate her in the first place.

No matter how determined you are to do the right thing by them - and I'm sure you are - finding the right homes for such a large number will take a long time, and you will have spent vast sums of money rearing them, vaccinating, etc. before they are safely with their new owners. Are you really 110% sure, that when you are stuck with several four or five month old puppies, who are wrecking your house, fighting, barking and causing problems with the neighbours, that you won't let your standards slip just a tiny little bit? If just one of these precious little bundles ends up in the wrong home and continues the cycle of irresponsible owner/unwanted pregnancy/more crossbred pups to be found homes for, then all the good work you have done will be wasted.

It would be far better, in my view to ask the vet to put some of the pups to sleep. This would be far kinder on the bitch who will not then be so exhausted trying to cope with such a large litter, and will mean that you really can ensure that those that are left go to responsible owners.

My head agrees that some might be best pts - but how would you ever choose if they are all healthy at this stage. :-(

All things being equal healthwise, start off by choosing the smallest males.

good luck Ashleigh, I am sure you will do what is best for you and your pups. 

In all of the time I have been on this board, very recently is the first time I have heard of people advocating pts pups because there are too many or they are the wrong colour etc.  Personally I would find people who would help me hand rear the pups if it was too much for mum to do but each to their own.  For me an animal is part of the family and not a commodity and no more would I kill an animal for convenience than I would a child.

i agree lincolnimp, its hard enough finding suitable homes for this breed when you have say five let alone 13 better to be sorry now than later on when you have no control over what happens to these pups

i to would much rather hand rear some than pts a perfectly healthy puppy and everything cheekychow has said is exactly what i was going to say i really appreciate people being honest and am not going to jump on anyone for what they have said like some others would but i just dont think i could do it and mum is coping extremely well at the moment and all seem to be getting enough milk although i am ready if they need abit of extra help and i have seen a few posts on here where bitches have had litters of 13/14 and although some of them are large breeds and are not as common as my breed they dont seem to have the worry of homing them

ashleig08, what area are you in? 
There's gotta be some help out there.
Let me know where you are, and I'll see if anyone can help?

although the other pups arent showing cleft palate they will be carrying the gene for it. so they shouldnt be bred from and the parents shouldnt be used again unless you can find out which parent is the carrier for this, this is why re searching your bitch's line and the stud dogs is so important

Hayley ALL pups will NOT carry the gene.

Nothing to do with supporting or not supporting this litter , I just hate seening incorrect things in posts that others may read and believe.

ashleigh08, I think people's main concern is for the future of these pups once they leave you, not so much as the bitch rearing them. I personally think part of being a responsible breeder is having the courage to put healthy pups to sleep if that may be best for them. There are worse fates than that for a pup. Much worse.

Having reared a litter of 9 myself, my first litter, I can honestly say the work it involved to properly socialise and rear them, and despite the fact I was heartbroken, whne the last pup left I breathed a sigh of relief. All pups had ben booked prior to birth, although I ended up having the one we now have back to rehome, as I had to turn some people doen in the end, but that meant I didn't have the added worry of not knowing when they would be leaving.

It is admirable that you are prepared to rear them, and so you should be, but it isn't about whether you're prepared to pu int he time and effort, it is about what is best for the pups and I personally would be trying to find the extra strength I needed to have some PTS at this point, which would take far more from methan rearing them myself.

my partner has owned and bred this breed for longer than ive been alive, maybe you are right maybe not all will, but you would never know unless you bred from every single pup born would you?

What is the mode of inheritance for cleft palate? Dominant or recessive, or polygenetic? Or is it linked with nutritional deficiency during pregnancy? If the latter, then there's no inheritability at all.

Edit: this link suggests that there are several possible causes, not all of which are genetic.

What has how long you have owned a breed got to do with genetics?  Sorry Hayley I am lost with this one . No disrespect. 

JG has posted some of the modes but in most breeds it appears to be polygentic with some recessive. On average 25% would be affected carrier to carrier with recessive. Polygenetic opens a whole new ball game.   I am not saying whether some should or shouldn't breed from parents in the situation just mearly pointing out that genetic faulty genes doesn't affect all siblings NOR does it mean the whole litter needs to be written off.  Throwing the baby out with the bath water on certain things and excluding lines often sees an increase of another genetic fault. The gene pool needs to be kept as wide as possible in same breeds.

better to lose none

Absolutely, as long as you have guaranteed permanent homes lined up for them. However, facing hard reality, there's not exactly a shortage of staffy crosses in the country, is there?

You are right concerning the number but it is horrendous to see any puppy or any other animal die.

Not when you work in a vet surgery. Sad yes, but not horrendous. There are worse things that can happen.

Agree absolutely with Jeangenie. It's very sad to think of newborn pups being PTS - but sadder still to think of all the unwanted, abused Staffy crosses that end up in rescues.

Would you consider signing the pups over to a rescue when they're old enough so they can be found homes that way? Rescues are swamped in Staffies and Staffy crosses unfortunately but there are some good ones out there who could help you to find homes for the litter. They carry out homechecks and have contracts and would follow up to ensure that the pups were all neutered at the relevant age so they're not used for breeding themselves (as I'm sure you'll agree they absolutely shouldn't be) and the rescue will also offer back up so that if any new puppy owners can't cope they will take the pups back and rehome them which will also take some of the pressure off you? In the circumstances a donation of some sort from yourself to the rescue would probably be appropriate but in this circumstance I think it could be well worth it.

> Rescues are swamped in Staffies and Staffy crosses unfortunately

So why add to the number?

Do you know I am beginning to feel very sorry for Ashleig08 and hope she is not still reading this thread. I know that the whole thing has probably been less than sensible and responsible but the deed is done and I think we forget that emotions are involved here.

No matter what we think about the production of this litter Ashleig must love both her bitch and the pups, to keep pushing having them PTS to someone who is not an experienced breeder and has just produced a litter that even she must be aware should not have happened is not helpful, it will end with her not asking for help when it is needed.

As it happens I agree, but think enough has been said and Ashleig should be allowed to enjoy her litter knowing that help will be available when it is needed.

my advice to Ashleigh08 is to start straight away to get homes lined up for the pups.  I own and show the same breed as you and I know how hard it is to find good homes for KC

registered pups with excellent lines.  In saying that it is hard not impossible, just don't let your standards drop when choosing owners and you will be fine.

>Would you consider signing the pups over to a rescue when they're old enough so they can be found homes that way?

When a friend had an 'accidental' (aka careless) litter last year, the rescue centres told her there was a 5-month waiting list before they could be taken. Rescue can't be thought of as a 'Get Out Of Jail Free' card I'm afraid.

Definitely start advertising now - don't wait till they're nearly old enough to go.

Ashleigh

I admire your determination of how you want to do the very best for the bitch and the pups.  I really hope that you can find suitable homes before too long for these precious babies.  You will probably find the best time to start concentrating on the home finding when the pups are 7 days old as although there is still much to be done it does become a little easier before the next hurdle of worming and weaning commence.  Once they hit three weeks you will have little time for this with that number of puppies to care for.  I'm sure that with everything you have done so far to help this poor girl that you will not let your standards drop.  If  you have the slightest niggle or doubt on any prospective owners then do not let them have a pup.

I know that many people would not be keen to see this story in a paper but perhaps your local paper may be willing to run a story on this - of course you will have hundreds of unsuitable offers of homes but there will surely be many genuine ones coming through.  Your local rescue centre may then be willing to help you sift through them if they also get some suitable homes offered for other unwanted dogs.

Should rescue centres be there to pick up the pieces and take on pups from ill thought out litters- especially at times when almost all are struggling and full to the brim as it is-
Doesnt that just encourage those that breed willy nilly to keep on doing so?
Just a thought.................

Agree, this is not a problem for the rescue centres and I hope it never becomes one.