Bought up briefly on the culling puppies thread, what are your comments to dogs in rescue being pts. Under what circumstances do you think a dog should be pts? It has been said that it is not cruel to terminate a life, not for the dog who simply passes on, which of course is true because they (maybe...) don't know what we have in mind for them when its done. Everyone says rescue centers (both breed rescue and all the other rescue centers) are full to bursting. It was never much liked when the RSPCA had a policy of pts any dog after 7 days, but is it kinder in some circumstances?

No matter which way you look at it there is never an easy way of coming to terms with dogs being pts but in rescue centres I think that those dogs whose behaviour problems (such as serious aggression) are not going to better are candidates, the rescue centres have limited resources and the resources spent on those dogs could be better spent on say several dogs being helped and finding new homes etc. 

Hiding now whilst everyone has a go at me.....

I might be shot down now, but I think the rescues that DO pts are the more responsible ones. I don't like those that keep dogs that cannot be rehomed for life. The dogs don't get a normal life and they take up space from dogs that COULD be found homes.

I don't know about other RSPCAs but our local one stopped putting dogs to sleep after a set number of days (unless ill, very aggressive etc) many years ago. I seem to remember they told me that was everywhere. Instead they turn dogs away when they get full up. Cats too. I remember one year when they were full, I had 3 cats dumped at my house at different times, and a couple of dogs too. Each person told me they'd tried the RSPCA first. At least if an animal is put to sleep it won't suffer, if they are turned away anything can happen to them... In an ideal world none would need to be put to sleep, but sadly that is unlikely to ever happen.

I started typing a lengthier reply to this, but realised that I'm not sure I could live up to my own principles on it!

I strongly disagree with fund-raising and extensive expenditure on dogs who need vast medical care and will have a limited quality/length of life at the end of it. Have seen various examples of this, but one specific one was I think quite well publicised and I found it very disturbing. I think the money would be better spent helping a larger number of healthy dogs.

Would also agree with not trying to rehabilitate dogs that have major aggression problems, and with culling litters born in rescue to one or two puppies.

However, until I've been in their shoes ...

M.

> I strongly disagree with fund-raising and extensive expenditure on dogs who need vast medical care and will have a limited quality/length of life at the end of it. Have seen various examples of this, but one specific one was I think quite well publicised and I found it very disturbing. I think the money would be better spent helping a larger number of healthy dogs.
>

i ageree with you lily, i feel that it's not fair to put dogs through a life of pain becasue we cannot make the decision to end it (i feel this was about euthanasia for people as well but thats another subject!). a dog cannot understand why it hurts and as beings that are rather more physical than metaphysicaol as humans can be i think its cruel to put them through pain just to keep them here, so if a dogs very ill, yes pts and help as many healthy ones as you can.

ditto aggression, an aggressive dog is not happy. culling rescue litters is a sad subject but yes i can see the value in this (obviously keep one or two for mum though)

appart from that i don;t like the idea of putting a healthy dog to sleep (mentally healthy to) but if they are not getting homed elsewhere it might be the most humane thing.

I think it depends on the quality of life. I did a practical training course at a rescue centre and the dog I worked with had been there for a year already. He was hard work and didn't get out much. There were 3 dogs in the kennel due to overcrowding. He was covered in scabs from the numerous spats he had with his kennel-mates. (he was a lucky one, loads of them lost their life to serious injuries during fights) A year later I did another course and yep, he was still there. Day after day, stressed out in an overcrowded kennel, no companionship, little if any walks, no play, no joy. There was little chance of him ever finding a nice home. (he was too big a risk to take home with my pup) I think it is more cruel to keep a dog in these conditions than to end their suffering in a painless way. I'm one of those who feel there are worse things than death. But then I don't think there is any 'awareness' post death. I really don't envision the spirit of a dog floating around thinking "darn, why did you all do that". Hurting a dog is cruel. Torturing it physically or mentally is cruel. Putting a dog to sleep in a humane way may be a shame, a sad loss of life to those of us still living, but I don't think it's cruel. Often it's a kind and welcome release from a life full of pain whether that's physical or mental. You'd have to think the dog suffered some sort of pain post death to use the word cruel.

I do think it would be far kinder to put a limit on how long dogs were kept in rescue kennels. Certainly if they're not getting the love, attention and exercise they need which would be next to impossible to provide for so many dogs. I also think it would be kinder to let those too broken by us already to continue living in fear. In an ideal world  there would be loads of home with experienced dog trainers that could give these dogs the time and work they need but it isn't an ideal world. If it was we wouldn't need the rescue centres.

> I strongly disagree with fund-raising and extensive expenditure on dogs who need vast medical care and will have a limited quality/length of life at the end of it.

I''m relieved to see someone else feels like this, because I've noticed it is increasingling common - raising thousands of pounds for hip operations (in one specific case I can think of the dog had several operations because the first did not work).  As difficult as this decision must be, these resources could help many dogs.

I would prefer it if rescue centres had "foster schemes" where dogs that had been in rescue for a while could go to a foster home to be taught normal life as opposed to life in a kennel and would stand more chance of a forever home.
Depends on the reason for being PTS i guess

I would add to these the seriously neurotic and traumatised individuals who one charity show in commercials as will never find a home because of past treatment.  Is it fair to keep such dogs alive?

I think most breed rescues try to foster if a dog is likely to be in rescue a while.

I definately don't think it is kind or fair to keep dogs kennelled for years, for some dogs even a few months does them a great deal of harm.

Those dogs for whom a home is extremely unlikely to be found, who have to live in kennels, are not capable of socialising with other dogs or people, are not responding to training... those dogs ARE better off put down.

Ditto those who come into rescues requiring thousands of pounds worth of medical treatment, months of cage rest...

These dogs take up physical space, time and money that could be better used to turn around the dogs with minor, or no problems.

THat is a very harsh and hard hearted view of things, and I can fully appreciate that I would find it extremely difficult to say of a dog I knew personally 'this dog has no chance, have him put down'.

One of my even more extreme thoughts is this: Do we have a bigger rescue problem, because we have got MORE rescues now than we had 30 years ago?

I believe we do, because I think the increase in people willing to take dogs on and kennel them for years on end means more dogs are kennelled than would have been put down, and it also seems to make it more acceptable for people to get a dog on a whim and when it all goes wrong because they put no work in 'send it to rescue'.

Would any of the erm, more mature members of the forum agree with that - being only 28 I wasnt here 30, 40 + years ago, but does that seem to add up?

If the US are anything to go by where a large proportion of discarded dogs are euthanized, and very few by comparison find homes then I think the answer is no, because the people abandoning them like to kid themselves that their discarded Dog will find a home.

Then of course many people in rescue blame breeders for the rescue problem, but to be honest it is irresponsible ownership and irresponsible breeding combined .  Even puppy farmers only breed because they can sell the pups, and don't care if the owners are responsible.

If rescues didn't exist then people would have to face the reality of themselves having to find a home or having it Put to sleep.  Perhaps they would be less easy come easy go about Dog ownership, who knows.

In my opinion, our local rescue centre keeps the dogs way, way too long. A few years ago we had a few ghastly people, churning out GSDxAkitas and GSDxRotts, due to the hideous way they were raised (one akita dam was just 8 months old when she had her first litter :-( ) coupled with the questionable temperements of the parents, a huge amount of these dogs ended up in the rescue centre.. at one point there were 8 gsdxrotts in at the same time, all around the same age, powerful adolescents with attitude. And the sad thing is, some are still there. I think its way too long to have dogs living in kennels.. I'm sure its mainly because the staff have become attached to them? I've seen these dogs homed out and then brought back over and over again and I truly believe its no life for them. They need really specialised dedicated homes and these are few and far between, well they are where I live anyway. So the dogs end up living in tiny kennels for years, literally bouncing off the walls with boredom, its little wonder they struggle to adapt to a home life, where the new owners expect their new doggy to behave 'normally' and get frustrated and take the dog back to the kennels and the whole process starts all over again.

Have to say, if I was working at the kennels, walking and feeding these dogs I'd probably be the first to fight tooth and nail to get them homed and stand between the dog and the vet, ;-) but from an outside view point I don't think its fair on the dogs.

In all the years our GSD rescue has been in existence , there has only one dog that has been a long term resident & it wasn't due to illness or poor temperament, he just could never settle in a home, our rescue lady even brought him into her own home, but he simply liked being in a kennel-he was walked & exercised & trained by the kennel maid, he was a lovely old boy, who simply like being in a kennel & run. He lived to over 12 & was PTS when he time came.

Over the years there have been two dogs put down through temperament problems(both ex guard dogs !!)& a few who had been dumped with serious illnesses(2 with cancer that had reoccurred after previous veterinary treatment & when the rescue's vet did tests they were given sleep before life had no quality for them)

One dog who was fine with people but had severe dog to dog aggressive problems, lived out his life as her house dog

When I lived in Kent I worked for our local rescue. Of course we saw many dogs come through us and our policy was unless there was an illness that was detrimental to quality of life or a personality/temperament disorder that could not be rehabilitated then every dog stood a chance.

At 3/6 week intervals the individual was re-evaluated on character and health.

Taking into account my personal experiences, I would have to say that if a dog has not been re-homed after 1 year - IMHO that is a long time in the life of a dog - then a decision has to made. Whether that be moving the dog onto yet another rescue home - as a last chance or advertising the dog in the local press to be fostered etc. But ultimately, and it really pains me to say this - if all efforts have failed to find the dog a 'forever' home for whatever reason, then the kindest thing is to PTS for the dogs sake :(

A case that still sticks in my mind is a GSD that was completely lovable once you had spent the time getting to know her but was totally loopy and the Vets that came in from Maidstone to evaluate her said 'you cannot pass this dog onto a family as she is a liability'. This we had assumed from spending time with her - ultra intelligent - ultra nervous - ultra unpredictable - we described her as the 'mad professor' - didn't help though when I had to hold her whilst she was PTS :(

Ultimately, some dogs thrive in a kennel environment and go on to make fantastic pets and some don't shine at all but still go on to make good pets - some unfortunately have been through the system too many times to ever be re-rehabilitated. But on balance the rescue centre that I volunteered for treated each as an individual case and evaluated each on their own merits

Sick dogs with a poor prognosis and aggressive dogs who are unsafe to home should be PTS IMHO. I also disagree with vast sums being spent on dogs that have severe medical problems. What makes me despair is those who import stray dogs from abroad. I too feel dreadfully sorry for some of these poor animals but there are so many in rescue here that these folk need to have a bit of common sense about it. When we were in Tenerife a few years ago there were lots of stray cats around the apartment complex, all very beautiful and appealing but I never for a minute seriously contemplated bringing any home, what I did was suggest to the management of the resort that they have the poor things neutered to cut down on the numbers. I don't know if they did or not but if enough people commented then perhaps they would try. The only exception I would make is for the groups of soldiers who occasionally bring home strays from war zones as I do believe that they form a genuine bond with these animals, which I don't think is the case on a two week holiday. The money spent on travel and quarantine would be better given to a local rescue who I am sure would have many suitable animals that these folk could have.

>The money spent on travel and quarantine would be better given to a local rescue who I am sure would have many suitable animals that these folk could have.

Agree totally. The few thousand pounds spent on one animal could benefit so many more if spent wisely in the country the animal came from.

The very old cloudy-eyed, grey faced oldies... the ones with the scared and care-worn expressions, should be the first candidates for a peaceful release from this world if homes cannot be found quickly. I think it very cruel to keep them in scarey, noisy kennels and if they aren't homed within a reasonably short time, it's surely our duty to give them peace. It's a bit like locking your granny up in Wormwood scubs.

I really don't know about having rescue dogs PTS. My 14 year old dog is from a shelter, we got him when he was 4 years old, he had been there for 2 months. If there was a blanket rule for them to be PTS after x amount of time, chances are that he would've been PTS, he also would have failed a food-aggression test, but after us dealing with that issue he has been a wonderful dog.

I can see why shelters feel they need to have dogs PTS, they are overstretched with a constant supply of animals to take in, it's awful, I couldn't make a decision as to which dogs could live and which had to be PTS.

We need some sort of licencing so it's not so easy for just anybody to get a dog. Far to many people rush out & get a puppy 'cause it's cute, with no comprehension of all the hard work that lays ahead if they are ever going to turn that pup into a well behaved dog and when they encounter a problem or typical puppy behaviour (chewing, digging or anything that arises from not being trained properly in the first place etc.) they get-rid :(

Licensing is a nightmare.

I think part of the problem is that it is very hard to get a GOOD dog, its very hard to find a reputable breeder, then its pretty tough to wait x months or years.. generally one has to travel a long way, usually several times.

Explaining to people WHY they ought do all those things, rather than buy a dog from the puppy farmer down the road, or the one who delivers... thats pretty tough.

Licence dog owning and you make it harder still to get a good well bred dog..and not that much harder to get a bad one.

It is easy to look at a rescue dog we may own and think 'well its a good job x rescue doesnt pts, or I wouldnt have my dog'..

But i look at mine and ask myself honestly, would I want ANY of them to be sat in rescue even for just say 3 months - given that a dog cannot possibly grasp the concept of future, nor hope... no, i wouldnt. (In fact, should I die, obviously Kel will go back to Dearlady and if there were any of my dogs shed take on I would be more than happy and there are two or three other people on my list of 'if i die i want you to have x dog'.. but if those people CANT take on my dogs.. I would want them pts at home, not sent to a rescue that kennels.)

I have stipulateed in my will that if my family are unwillign or unable to keep the dogs that any over 10 years old are put to sleep.  Any others are to be homed within 6 months and their expenses paid for from my estate.  If not homed by then they should also be PTS.

if i'm right which one your talking about they do have specific centers for dogs who can't/ probably won't be rehomed. for example there is one for elderly dogs where folk can visit and sponser but they don;t put the dog through the rehoming process, just keep them happy till they go

> It is easy to look at a rescue dog we may own and think 'well its a good job x rescue doesnt pts, or I wouldnt have my dog'..
>

It's also easy for somebody who hasn't got a rescue dog to say have them PTS.

I don't look at it from my perspective, if my dog had been PTS in rescue, he would only have known the horrible life he had before he was put in the shelter, he would never have known a good life with people who loved him and provided everything for him. Now when he dies, he will die as a happy, contented dog, not as wreck in a shelter.

> But i look at mine and ask myself honestly, would I want ANY of them to be sat in rescue even for just say 3 months,

I would rather my dogs were in a shelter waiting for a good home, than dead.

>I think part of the problem is that it is very hard to get a GOOD dog, its very hard to find a reputable breeder

dog's do not end up in shelters because they are 'bad' dogs, they are there because of bad owners, a good owner will not dump thier dog in rescue if it gets health problems (even the most reputable breeder can't guarantee health), a good owner will have any behviour problems sorted out (most behaviour problems are down to poor training).
My rescue dog was a hanfull, he would still playbite at 4 years old, he would pull ont he lead like a tank, he was food aggresive and other little issues. Within a year it was all sorted out, the dog was the same dog - it was the owners that were different.

If only 'bad' dogs from bad breeders ebded up in shelters, why do reputable breeders put so much effort into finding a 'good' owner?

> If only 'bad' dogs from bad breeders ebded up in shelters, why do reputable breeders put so much effort into finding a 'good' owner?

You've answered your own question, the vast majority of dogs in rescue have got breeders who  didn't put so much effort into findign a 'good' owner.

> It's also easy for somebody who hasn't got a rescue dog to say have them PTS.
>

no it's really not. i don't think anyone on this forum takes the life of a dog that lightly to make any such decision easy. i think it's something that needs to be considered though.

i can see the value of having dogs pts in certian circumstance and i have had a rescue dog before. i don;t believe where the dog has come from is any measure of the value of its life and i don't think other people with pedigrees do either

> have stipulateed in my will...

gah! just realised i have to think about that sort of thing now! growing up sucks!

I was 26 when I wrote it, but being a lone Mum makes you think of these things, as of course I had to say who would look after the kids.

Will have to change it soon as kids now 17 and 21, so that bit won't apply, my youngest brother is one executor and Dad another do might have to rethink..

>> If only 'bad' dogs from bad breeders ebded up in shelters, why do reputable breeders put so much effort into finding a 'good' owner?
> You've answered your own question, the vast majority of dogs in rescue have got breeders who  didn't put so much effort into findign a 'good' owner.

It was a rhetorical question in repsonse to

>I think part of the problem is that it is very hard to get a GOOD dog,

I was trying to point out the fact that it is the owners that are responsible for putting thier dogs in rescue, not the breeders. OK BYB/puppy farmers don't care what happens to thier dogs, but a good owner who mistakenly gets such a dog will not dump it into rescue due to poor breeding.
The vast majority of people are not aware of the difference between reputable breeders and BYB, not all of these people are irresponsible owners.

Mastifflover i do hope by your comment about those not owning rescue dogs thinking its easy to say 'have them pts'.was not aimed at me! Four out of my five dogs are unwanted rescues!

I apologise for not being clearer about my comment that its hard to find a 'good' dog - by that i mean a dog bred responsibly by a reputable breeder who takes every effort to find responsible well educated owners. Not that the dog itself is inherently good or bad.

I do stand by what i originally meant with that comment though - it is FAR easier to find and buy a badly bred dog from a puppy farm, a puppy superstore, out of Loot or the local newspaper than it is to buy a really well bred dog from a really good breeder.

Of course the owner of the dog has a huge responsibility, i definately agree with this and go further to say that a huge part of the unwanted dog problem we have is CAUSED by the demand from irresponsible owners for dogs that can be bought right here, right now, with a credit card, taken home same day or delivered. Without those people we would not HAVE puppy farms and puppy supermarkets!

Just thought I would add to this topic.. As I have grown older I have become more cynical to to life of the animal than keeping them alive for the sake of it.
I brought a kitten for my son who I had to pts at only 15 months old due to ill health- now I could of gone the road of high medical bills but I didn't want that animal to suffer.
To put any animal down is a sad thing but it is necessary to realise that sometimes it is "a good death" as the word euthanasia means.
It really all lies with people who decide to get a dog not the pup or the person who breed the puppies in the first place.
With this throw away society its makes me cross that people kick out an older dog because they've gotten themselves a new pup.
I know a woman locally who gets a new puppy every year only to get rid when not even a year old then to get another. I think she should be made to take that young dog to the vet herself to be destroyed as she might then finally realise what she is doing is wrong.

I think a dog who's owner has died should as well be pts as there have been cases of dogs committing suicide from grief.
Any medical problems they should be allowed the dignity to die, I think there is nothing worse than seeing a massive GSD with a cart on its back legs to help it get around when there are so many 100% healthy dogs needing homes.   My own Father with a vet telling him that his dog would be fine with medication kept his doberman x alive for over a year with diabetes only to be told by me enough is enough the poor girl who was like a puppy mentally for 8 years of her life died a broken depressed dog she was pts at 9 way to late in her condition I thought.
We all spoke about culling puppies I think this is very different as it hasn't given those animals a chance in life an iota, I think everything should be at least given some chance. Some poor dogs as someone mentioned before go to a home only to be returned time and time again to a rescue centre, very cruel I feel for the dog involved.
The actor Arnold Schwarzenegger being the governor of california came under fire when he was going to allow shelters to pts stray dogs after 30 days, not sure if it became law?  More of a shame that he could not band pet store's from selling cute puppies in the first place. As we should in this country.

> I think a dog who's owner has died should as well be pts as there have been cases of dogs committing suicide from grief.

I don't think so Can you give examples ? Dogs can pine if they lose a companion & are left alone(or kennelled if they haven't been kennelled before)

What you are saying is that if I died you would kill my dogs-who are all perfectly healthy-aged-7, 6, 3,1 & 5 months as well of course as killing my kittens who are not yet 1 year old ! I think not. Should I have had my Dad's Cavalier PTS last February when my Dad died ? Kaycee had another year of quality life, before I had to have him PTS as the SM had reared it's ugly head-not grief. He was very close to my Dad, where my dad was Kaycee was, but when my dad died he simply  he transferred that allegiance to myself.

Sorry but killing healthy dogs just because their owner has died is one idea I cannot condone

I think a dog who's owner has died should as well be pts as there have been cases of dogs committing suicide from grief.
In fairness to the poster, I think, or I certainly read it that way, that she meant the dog would pine its self to death. Which can happen, some never settle when their owner has died, but it does depend on the circumstances. if family/close friends can take on the dog for the remainder of its life, and you are convinced that will happen, then fair enough. But, if you don't have anyone you can trust to do this, what do you do....sending a dog out to kennels that has only ever been in a loving home, never kenneled, would not be in the best interests of that dog, especially an old one that has spent its life one way and may never be homed again because of its age. Its a hard choice to make, but if there is no one you actually can trust, then the final caring thing you can do is ensure your dog/s don't get passed from piller to post after your death.

I think the decision all depends on the individual circumstances of the owner.

Of course thinking of all your animals for instance 5 dogs + kitten to find homes for if family took them on and they thrived that would be great.. certainly the younger 3. Sadly some people haven't got that in there lives. Family might start to argue and may not or could not care for the older 2 or visa versa with the younger lot.  My father pasted away and his dog went and is living with my sister. I can see when they brought her down to put some flowers where my Dads ashes are [there right near where is house is] her face her eyes light up and she started bouncing along she was so happy to be home . Her disposition has changed you can tell she misses Dad terribly but she was 8 when my Dad pasted and there was only him and her. You can tell the love of her life as gone you can see it in her eyes. If my sister had not of had Becks then I would of. Even some dogs that have been re homed where there owners are still alive can never fully get over there previous home with living in the same area thats why a lot of rescue dogs are placed in different shelters so they can make that break.

I did read that a bearded collie ended up living in an apartment and throw its self off the balcony after a few weeks of its owner dying and a friend taking it into there home.

I know myself that if I pasted a way my older dog snoop would pine but the younger one tinkerbell would not and would easily be re-homed into any family as my cats the older being extremely close, I personally think cats are far more independent anyway where as dogs form very extreme bonds with there owner.  When I went away and left my dog with my mum I went by coach to Norfolk she didn't eat for 5 days or more my mum was worried to death. 

> don't think so Can you give examples ?

greyfriars bobby, starved himself didn't he? or died of exposure or something. also one of the Brontes dog died the same day she did.

Actually my dogs & cats are all covered in my will, they get all the money I will leave(mainly the house)& two of the dogs are in partnership(the oldest two)& the younger ones all come from breeders who will take their puppies back at any age(& I do mean any age). The kittens will go to the Cat Protection League with a lump sum so that furture care is assured

Sorry but dogs do not commit suicide, any dog that was used to living in a house or bungalow would have no savvy re being in a flat & so jumping over the balconey, would be the same as one of mine jumping over a wall.

>greyfriars bobby, starved himself didn't he? or died of exposure or something

Actually he survived for many years, living on his master's grave, being fed by the local inhabitants.

I'm sorry but  I know of a friends  staff Mutley who killed himself..
It was his owner and him for 13 years. Mutley really should of been pts a while before due to him having chronic arthritis- could hardly walk but his owner being his first dog just could not make that decision. He was in his car travelling from Wales and the owner stopped into a lay by as a needed to wee. Mutley who couldn't even get out of the car very easily some how did and he waited for a car and jumped in front of that car. I was at my friends when he turned up with Mutley in the back seat dead. He buried him the next day at a favourite place they used to go fishing at. He was adamant that his dog had ended it as He couldn't cope with the pain any more. 

Dogs are blessed with an inability to see the future - they live in the present, and certainly don't have the reasoning capability that's being ascribed to them here.

ah ok.

still shows that they continue to mourn, same with the akita that used to wait for his masters train each day. i think in a situation like that it might be best to pts cause they seem so unhappy.

of course if the dog moves on (as most do) then great, enjoy the rest of your life. it;s the same as people who lose spuses etc and can;t get past it though, seems crueller to make them stay. i've a friend who;s randad died one morning, his gran then went that afternoon. my friend was in a way quite pleased because he knew she'd have been miserable without him.

> greyfriars bobby, starved himself didn't he? or died of exposure or something

ER no he didn't he lived for 14 years after his owner died & was fed regularly. He used to lunch by the 1 o'clock gun.

> also one of the Brontes dog died the same day she did.

Do you mean her mastiff cross, Keeper ? He lived most of his life outside & was the family's guard dog, he was her favourite though.

see now here is the prob! different accounts of things! i read that her mastiff died the day she did and would not let anyone else near it through it's life.

Well she let it in the house once & it went on the beds & she gave a beating !!!!

They wrote that they made up their stories whilst their old guard dog, slept at their feet !!

hmmm... less of a lovely story then... though i suppose the dog was seen rather diffferently than now.

>i read that her mastiff died the day she did and would not let anyone else near it through it's life.

According to this description Keeper (having suffered what we'd call serious cruelty in their early relationship) survives Emily for about three years, and 'provided support and comfort' to Charlotte and Mr Bronte, the two last survivors of the family.

thats very interesting

>Any medical problems they should be allowed the dignity to die, I think there is nothing worse than seeing a massive GSD with a cart on its back legs to help it get around when there are so many 100% healthy dogs needing homes.

Each to their own and the same applies to any GSD's owners or any other owners who decide to cart their dog; it's their business.  I would never condemn anyone who decides to go down that road.  I don't know anything about their dog, about them, the reason it needs a cart, the dynamics of the household etc, etc to form any opinion and in order to not like seeing something, I need to have an opinion.   Many dogs do live perfectly happy lives in a cart to get around and if an owner is prepared to dedicate their life to assisting that dog, then good for them.

I still don't see what carting dogs or dogs with medical problems has got to do with healthy dogs needing homes as it doesn't necessarily follow that an owner will get another dog, from rescue, from a breeder or at all when theirs passes on.

I don't like carts, but thats my opinion and I wouldn't expect anyone else to agree. But what I don't like is keeping a dog going well past its time. When its soiling the house and it self, yet the owners say 'oh, can't be helped' when the poor animal is lifted to go out, then drops down, when they have to keep bathing the rear end and the dog is getting sore...I could never put an animal through that.

I don't like or dislike them to be honest.  In some cases with DM they can be useful in the early stages if some owners want to go that way but sooner or later the condition progresses and PTS is the only way to go.  Each owner will have their own perspective as to when is the right time.  It's quality of life at the end of the day and if an owner can give that 24 hours a day full on commitment and dedication, then fine.  I wouldn't cart mine simply because my circumstances, dog's temperament and so many other things just wouldn't allow it in order to maintain that quality of life IMO. 

However, I still don't see what dogs with medical probs or dogs in carts is going to help healthy dogs in rescue unless we assume that those with said dogs are going to replace their dog with one from rescue which is not necessarily the case.

There are many success stories in rescue; dogs ending up in loving long term homes.  It's not all doom and gloom.  They should be commended for the work they do in what is often very difficult circumstances.

There are many success stories in rescue; dogs ending up in loving long term homes.  It's not all doom and gloom.  They should be commended for the work they do in what is often very difficult circumstances.

Couldnt agree more. It must be quite heartrending at times. Its not a place, however, I would want mine to go, if family/friends can't help I wouldn't want to put them through that, or the chance of being moved on as time goes by. They could be lucky enough to find a forever home....but then again not.

I do think the sick and sorry, the poor oldies that miss their comfy chair and their joints seizing up who no one wants, the dubious temp ones, the ones that they say can't ever be rehomed, they should be given peace from the stress of over crowded kennel life. This could make room for another dog that is healthy and well and can be found a home.

This isn't a subject that I feel comfortable commenting on to be honest because I think there is a lot more to it than deciding who should live and who should die. They should all be given a chance IMO.  These are charities and rely on donations; a lot of the medical treatment given by vets will either be at a discounted rate or free of charge in some cases.  It wouldn't sit comfortably with me as a donator that dogs are simply PTS because they present a challenge. 

It's supposed to be dog rescue, and I cannot imagine that a reputation of dogs put to sleep after so many days if they haven't got a home, or refused med treatment in favour of PTS would sit comfortably with the donating public.  That isn't the image they portray; isn't it the more challenging cases they publicise to get the funds rolling in?  Other establishments give free assistance; our local hydro centre swam post operative dogs for free of charge as part of their rehab. 

They are all not necessarily overcrowded either and will only take in so many.  Not all dogs find kennel life stressful; some practically thrive on it.  Some dogs in homes are confined to kennel life too so I suppose what I'm trying to say is it's not clear cut and there are too many variables to consider when trying to form an opinion as to what dogs should be PTS and why. 

One of mine is a rescue, a bit of a trauma case and it took around 5 years to get her sorted.  But I enjoyed the challenge and I would do it all over again.  The rewards of seeing a dog transformed are phenomenal.