I have a 8month old flatcoat (Inca) and am so thrilled with her, she is the most loving creature.  We have an older golden and didn't think flats could be any better than him but she really is fantastic.

I am coming up to the time when she must be spayed and am overwhelmed by all the different opinions on spaying flatcoats!

What will happen to her coat/temperament/weight ?etc... I don't want a fat flat!  she gets loads of excercise and we are careful about feeding.  Should she be spayed before 1st season or after, I have read both!!!
Her mother is not spayed and lives on huge estate of horses where there is little chance of an unwanted pregnancy.
I do not want to breed Inca, I am not a breeder and there are enough dogs for rescue in the world as it is.

I want her to be happy and healthy for a long time to come.  I think I should spay her, but when?  She is begining to blow her coat which could mean she is coming up to 1st season.  I am worried about the mammary cancer and uterine infection possibilities.  She had a uterine infection at 4months so she seems that way inclined although it did not reoccur.   Any help out there would be much appreciated. Inca is kennel club registered and comes from a good line of dogs with Ch.'s in her pedigree.  She is so beautiful and I want to keep her that way.  mnay thanks Lesley

Hi Lesley,

Inca sounds as though she's the light of your life :)  Re spaying, I would always recommend letting a bitch have her first season over with at least as the hormones in an entire animal are required for achieving physical (and mental) maturity.  Ideally with larger breeds IMO it is better again to wait until they are 2 years plus, however I appreciate that not everyone is in a position to manage seasons well and that this could cause all sorts of problems for the owner.  If spaying before any season occurs, it is a guess often as to how close the season was about to start and it is safer to spay a bitch between seasons (usually 12 weeks onwards) as the womb is engorged immediately before, during and after seasons so a higher of blood loss.

Re coat changes, I don't have flatcoats (I love them though :) ) but would expect that there is a possibility of an adverse change in coat, however  I would think to a  lesser extent from a problematic POV than with a longer, double coated breed such as my own, or much of the Collie family.

Confusing isn't it, as advice differs, but I should think most experienced owners/breeders will recommend you let her get that first season out of the way :)

Best wishes, Teri

i have spayed two of my fcr,one was 7 the other 6 year old,
not so young has you are thinking of .
i would wait if you can untill she 2,1/2 let her mature as fcr are late mature's.

wispa and brie had very good coat before they were spayed,untill six months after they were spayed the coat blowen.put after a year and a good moult it settal back down like it was before spaying,
but brie good better for spaying now.so did wispa but these were old bitches.
one thing you got to watch is weight gain,
poor brie she on a high protine diet to get the best product out of her food but she only has a cup full of the stand fed cup twice a day but it has maintan her weight over the last two years.she a very fit fcr.

yes get her first season out of the way,
has she come into season yet if she like mine wispa was 8 months bries was 10 months,teyha and blue 16 months,waiting for pagan but i thing she be the same as the last two later the better for me.

i like what you say about her morther is not spayed and lives on hugh estate of horse where there is little chance of an unwanted pregnacy,
this made me laugh after last week i whelped a litter of portguses/+ puppies the bicth live's in the same surrounding as you stated but if a bitch wants to get out and wants to be mated they find a way the same as dog will find a bitch as well,
i know of two bitch that have gone for a little walk on their own to find a nice male with out telling the owners,then 63 day later a big surprise.both not fcr and not mine thank god.

Having had flatcoats since 1981 (yes I am that old) I have both dogs and bitches, both neutered and entire.  Re; weight, that is a management prpoblem I have NEVER had and overweight dog, I watch the figure, if it looks like its starting to get a bit larger than normal I cut back on the food.  Re; the coat, I give Evening P/oil and this help keep the coat as near to what it was as poss.  Re; time.  I would prefer to wait until at least the first season, but each to their own if it means preventing an unwanted preg then go for it. My bitches were older when I had them spayed but I dont find having a bitch in season a problem. Our lives stay the same, whatever.  Go by you gut instincts.

Neutering does not CAUSE obesity, it just reduces the metabolism, you are in charge of the feedbowl so feed accordingly.

These links may help make up your mind about the appropriate age to neuter your particular dog in your particular circumstances

http://www.caninesports.com/SpayNeuter.html

http://www.naiaonline.org/pdfs/LongTermHealthEffectsOfSpayNeuterInDogs.pdf

Neutering may not cause obesity but it does cause a change in body shape as it does in post menopausal women. I would always say if you really have to neuter then do it as late in the dogs live as you possibly can.

None of my neutered dogs male or female have changed their shape!

It's impossible to say what shape they'd be if they were entire, though, isn't it? ;-) It's a fact that neutered (both male and female) animals lay down fat in a different 'pattern' than entire ones.

It's usually a good rule of thumb to cut a neutered animal's diet by about a third after the surgery.

Depends on what age you do it, so as you say, is it "natural" or is it Maybelline (sorry I do a lot of lateral thinking)! :D

Thanks to tohme and to all who kindly replied to my question.
Just to say that I am very careful how much and what I feed my dogs and really think people with fat dogs should be educated, by force if necessary!.  Some breeds do have a tendency towards  post op' weight gain and some not so much.  We live in a town but travel to the nearby country side for long walks every day at least twice. My husband does very long walks at the weekends and of course  the dogs play together too.  a slight reduction in food will have a big effect with all the excercise so if the metabo so if the metabolism slows then thats what we will do.

My Golden is a rescue and originally, way back comes from a wretched puppy farm(mill)  We got him at 10months with bad feeding and no exercise bless him, he has the worst hip joints you could possibly imagine!  therefore we have to keep his weight way down to help him and so are used to keeping an eye on things and adjusting his food.  I don't see a problem with watching Inca's waistline.  I want to do the best for both my dogs and again I thank you for all your comments. I think I will discuss it with my vet and do it after her first season and hope she doesn't have any little accidents! 

Keeping a bitch in season is no great problem as long as you don't live with entire males or have one next door, whom might more easily try to get in.  Otherwise ti is just be vigilant of her when in season (even in your own garden) and keep her on lead and away from entire males for up to four weeks.

It might be worth looking at the second link and the links to neutering and bone Cancer as the FCR is more Cancer prone.  Mammary tumours are not as big a problem as is often suggested else all of us that breed would have bitches with mammary tumours.  Yes the occasional adult bitch does have them and half of these are not benign, but by watching your bitch carefully and removing any lumps in a timely fashion it is no big deal.

Of 7 (6 of which are/were 5 Years or over) bitches that have been entire for at least a couple of seasons I have only had one that had a mammary lump, which was carcinoma, was removed, as was the regrowth some years later along with the gland that time.  She lived a fit 13 1/2 years.

As for consulting your Vet, you do need to bear in mind that some Vets are so pro neutering that they seem unwilling to accept that it is not always a positive thing to do.

I would print off that latter article which gives the Pros and cons as he may be unaware of the research..

Well!! I have gone thru the menopause and I still have my shape.....because I watch what I eat and get good excersice...

  > Well!! I have gone thru the menopause and I still have my shape.....because I watch what I eat and get good excersice...

You are very fortunate; going against the normal can sometimes be convenient. :-)

It is not a matter of what you eat and it is not a matter of how fat or thin you are or exercise.

It is a change in body shape that is known to take place in the body of those who's sex hormone is changed or lacking and is one of the reasons why HRT is prescribed for people who are deprived for their hormone producing glands earlier than designed by nature.  The medication is to help the body to remain in the condition and shape expected of someone of the age of the patent, not, of course, to produce normal child bearing or production.

It is after all the sex hormone that makes females look like females and males like males but I guess there will always be an exception to the rule.

mmm! thankfully NHS do not routinly hand out HRT like sweets anymore. bye the way I chose not to replace my hormones and I still look vvvery female.  Lifestyle does play a part. you just have to stand in the supermarket and look at the trollys.

> mmm! thankfully NHS do not routinly hand out HRT like sweets anymore. bye the way I chose not to replace my hormones and I still look vvvery female.  Lifestyle does play a part. you just have to stand in the supermarket and look at the trollys.

Not arguing with you only stating the facts. You are fortunate to feel as you do and be as you are. I do not mean taking HRT for normal menopause I was talking of it being prescribed for unfortunate people who have to loose their ovaries or testis by their early thirties, medication is then given to avoid the unavoidable side effects.

I had a complete hysterectomy(ovaries the lot) at 42 and was put on HRT until 48.  Sadly coming from a long line of fat women on both sides of the family I put on a lot of weight and have had to struggle with my weight.  I am 51 now and again am on the road to wieght loss... It has to do with your food upbringing and your genetics and your bad/good eating habits.  I was never overweight until my 30's after first child but then had funny metabolism which is very low and of course bad eating habits etc.

Dogs I am sure can be the same so good genes and eating habits from the start must bode well.

In reply to the vet thing I trust my vet as he was loath to spay Inca when she had the uterine problem at 4 months.  she was on anti b's for quite a while and was monitored very carefully as he refused to do it before 6months unless emergency and even then would have been most reluctant.  He only spays after fisrt season I have learned and not until a month or two after.  I am still undecided as to when to spay but am reading all I can.

I agree with the other two flatcoat owners on here. Let your bitch mature if you can before spaying her. Weight is a food and exercise management thing you can control. Spay mid way between seasons as well as it is better done then.

Polly Foxpath FLatcoated Retrievers.