Hi everyone,

I have a 5mth old Akita X Mastiff and i'm uncertain as to how much I should be exercising him.  From info on the net and in books it says a pup that big will get enough exercise in the garden.  I take him out twice a day less than a mile both times.  Is this too much or not enough??  I've read on the Burns food website that owners of large/giant breed puppies make the mistake by not exercising them enough as the general belief is it will damage bones/tendons etc.,  they recommend that exercising of large breed pups will build strong bones/tendons etc.,  I would love to take Tank for longer walks but have read conflicting opinions... any ideas please??? :-)

The recommended amount of exercise to give is five minutes walking for every month of a dog's age. So a 5 month old puppy would have a 25 minute walk, at 6 months would have 30 minutes and so on until the dog reaches maturity.

A novice athlete wouldn't go straight out and run a marathon - they would build up their fitness levels slowly and steadily in order to prevent damage to their body. Your pup needs to have a slow build up of exercise in order to slowly build up his muscles, tendons, ligaments etc and thus help to prevent damage.

Hi there Harley, thanks for your advice I will take that on board.  Much appreciated :-)

You are welcome :)

I only know that because it was a question I asked when we got our first puppy a few years ago - we have always previously had older rescues so exercise limits wasn't too much of a consideration. A lot of the general information about owning a dog often mentions that dogs must have regular exercise but rarely mentions that it is different for a puppy and the exercise should be limited.

Hello,
I was in the same boat as you when we got our Doge De Bordeaux. There is so much information out there that we were often left more confused! I was told by many reputable breeders to limit their exercise until fully mature. Dont go on really long walks etc. Swimming is perfect, it gives a good workout without adding stress to developing bones and joints. My DDB is nearly a year old now and we take him out for 20 -25 minutes, he has a mad burst of energy runs around then he gets tired. We dont actually go very far, but he has a good romp. Avoid stairs if possible and jumping off and on things, couches into high cars etc. But there is only so much we can do, and ater all that, the dogs could still have problems in the future...We can just try our best to do what is right.

At a year old I would have expected to have built up to an hour of formal exercise which is about what an average dog would expect as a maintenance/regular walk to keep happy, any more would be for full maturity as and when.

I'm with misswager.

My pup is 8 months old (Mastiff), I was also told by a very reputable breeder to limit the exercise until he was 18 month old (over the bigest growth phase). He has a 15 minute walk per day on lead, for the rest of the day he can play in the house & garden (avoiding jumping on/off things, steps, slippery floors). This walk has been built up gradually and will be built up further, very slowly. Exercise is very important for strengthening bone, muscle and ligament, but due to the rapid growth phases of the giant breed, too much exercise can lead to joint problems and ruptured/pulled ligaments BUT not enough exercise can cause problems too.

Road walking is obviously much harder on the joints than walking on grass. Walking on gravel/sand/up hill is very good for tightening/strengthening ligaments in the feet (toes, carples, hocks).

EDIT, heres a link to the OEMC (old english mastiff club) dos & don't on raising a mastiff pup. http://www.mastiffclub.com/health.htm#3
2nd edit - FAO admin/moderator I am not a member of the club or affiliated with it in any way.

It doesn't say what limiting exercises is, I would have thought the five minutes per month of life was certainly limited enough.  e.g. 3 months 15 minutes 6 months 3 minutes and so on.

I was told to not walk my Mastiff more than 100 yards per day until he is 18 months old. The breeder that told me this has over 30years experience in breeding & showing and he is very repsected within the 'Mastiff world'.

Buster is 8 months old, there is no way he would be happy walking for 40 mins per day, it took me 2 months to get him further than 10 yards from home. But, each dog is different and will have different energy levels, some Mastiffs are much more energetic and are happy to go further. They are very large dogs and due to this and thier body's rapid growth demands, they tire quickly, the best rule to go by is (if the 100yd seems too short), when they show signs of tiring (starting to pant/slow down), then thay are at thier limit (and shouldn't be walked any further).

It is amazing how breeds vary. 

For my breed after about 4 months the 5 minutes per month of life needs to often needs to be twice a day.

Pretty much adlib excersise once over a year of age, though they are pretty laid back and lazy at home.

I couldn't imagine a dog that tired after a 1 yeards, that is often the distance mine will race ahead of me and recall from when off lead.

lol, my sisters Boxer would be bouncing off the walls if she had to stick to 5 mins per month once a day!!!

I think aswell as variations with breeds there is variations within the breeds. My Buster is a 'typical' Mastiff, happy to be lounging around the house all day, apart form a couple of 5 mins loony puppy play, but some Mastiff want to be on the go, in which case I would have thought they would walk further before tiring.

My sister & her boxer live with my dad, my dad always comes with me to the vets for checkups etc, he always asks the vet if there is something wrong with Buster, he just can't get over how 'lazy' he is, especially as he is used to living with a Boxer, he still can't believe the vet when he says "that's a Mastiff for you"

My old dog (14yrs) has very weak, withered back end, we got him from a rescue centre & found out later that basically 1 rear leg is held on with just muscle, as at some point his hip joint & femeral head have been removed as a treatment for HD. He can't walk far in his old age, but we need to keep the balance of walking far enough to keep him mobile, it is very odd seeing a crippled, old, deaf, half blind dog with more energy on a walk than an 8 month puppy.

After growing up with cross-breeds that used to be walked 3 times a day for several miles each walk as adults (and would have happily gone for more), it is quite a shock & hard to get the balance right with a Mastiff. It is so important to get them moving, yet it is such a worry putting extra strain on thier young fast growing bodies. Not suprisingly, the Mastiff has a tendency toward obesity as they are so lazy, obviously obesity need to be avoided as it causes a lot of joint problems in an already huge dog.

Sorry for the long-winded ramble, it's just I am suprised too. Before I got Buster I knew he should have 'restricted' exercise, & I thought within a few months he would be able to walk the 2 mile round school trip - no chance!!! I would be stuck half way there with a 8 stone dog laid on the floor refusing to go any further!!!

How much of this time would you give off lead?

This is all on-lead, my pup is only allowed free running in my garden, he doesn't have a reliable re-call and when he is fully grown will not be off-lead in public even with a reliable re-call, due to the fact many people are intimidated by of dog of his size and would I hate anything bad to happen to him because somebody mistook his exhuberant greetings as agressive (the dangerous dogs act states that a peron only needs to feel threatened by a dogs behvior in order a complaint to be made).
Other people do let thier Mastiff have off-lead time. If I were to give buster off-lead time I would stick to rule of not letting him go past the point of tiring (a bit hit & miss finding out how much is enough though).

The link I gave to the advice on the OEMc site, state the age up to 9 month is the most critical time to restrict exercise (quickest growth period), my pups breeder states 18 months (the biggest part of growth over at this point).

It's a really difficult thing to try to advise on. Nobody knows for sure how much is too much and then it varies with the individual dog :(

I sorry this is really vague, this is my first Mastiff, so I have limited personal experience and all of the advise I have been given re excersie is vauge. I have discussed this with my vet, who also says just to walk Buster as far as he can comfortably manage (on lead).

Golden rule is five minutes per month of age twice a day.  Restrict running up and down stairs and jumping on and off high objects.

The 5 minute rule does not fit a Mastiff - it should not be alowed to get too tired, if at 5 months old it is worn out with a 10 min walk, then it shouldn't be encouraged to go the further 15 mins that the 5 min rule states.

http://www.walnutknobfarms.com/pupcare.html

The the OP, as your pup is Akita x Mastiff I imagine it is even harder getting the balance right. Judging by my friends 10 month old Akita (who just can't get enough walking), they are much more high energy. I would have thought that restricting the excersise as one would with a pure Mastiff would be most suitable for your pup if he is physically more like a Mastiff than an Akita. I would be inclined to take everything you read online (including my advice) with caution and check with the pups breeder.

Had a quick look at the link and, as far as I could see ( was only a quick look) the information on the page about puppy care said that you should "control excessive exercise. A puppy may play at his own rate but should not be encouraged to take long walks". The 5 minute rule would still seem to apply to a Mastiff, in fact any breed of dog. I have no knowledge of the breed at all but if I had a 5month old pup, whatever the breed, and it was worn out with a 10 minute walk I would be questioning it's health in general and asking my vet to take a look at him. Not wanting to worry you but I find that situation would have me worried.

Have had a look at the other link higher up the page and that one does suggest that you don't take your pup out until it is 9 months old but does mention the importance of socialisation. Just wondering how you can socialise it if it isn't allowed to walk - they must weigh a huge amount at that age and would have thought not many people would be capabale of carrying one :).

Socialisation is so important for dogs this size as is lead training as you really can't afford to have them pulling once they are fully grown!!! Yes exercise should be limited but you have to get the balance right. I suppose I loosely follow the 5 minute a month rule and all mine have been fine with this. My boy that went down on his pasterns I did more road walking with as this was recommended by numerous people very experienced in the breed to strengthen his pasterns. I have to get mine out and about to socialise them and get them used to different things as with any breed. To be fair when you are showing you can end up walking further than 10 minutes and that is with a 6 month old puppy!!

I agree you need to be careful with mastiffs and other large breeds but like I just said you do need to get the balance right. If I walked mine for 10 minutes a day they wouldn't be happy!!!! And they are very well socialised, they go to the beach and other popular places, are happy going to the vets and equally happy in a town centre. They also are taught recall as if they ever got off the lead by accident it would be a disaster if they didn't know recall.

ETA....this is just my opinion on things, somethings work for some people and not for others.

> if I had a 5month old pup, whatever the breed, and it was worn out with a 10 minute walk I would be questioning it's health in general and asking my vet to take a look at him.

so you can't understand why a rapidly growing, 38 kg puppy would get tired after 10 mins of walking when he has free access to play with another dog all day????

Just to put you're mind at rest, he his healthy according to the vet.

The tiring on such a shockingly small walk may have something to do with the high-energy demands of rapid growth on an allready large pup, coupled with the fact that he has plenty of mental stimulation (largley in the guise of many short training sessions of a wide varity, including recall) and play thoughout the day.

They are 'allowed' to walk, the point I have obviously been failing to get accross is you do not drag them around on a lead when they are nackered just to fit in with the 5 minute rule. Socialising a pup without exhausting it is not that hard - you take it places within the individual pups walking limits, or you drive to places and walk around ie- drive to a car boot, amble around - lots of people & other dogs. Drive to a busy town & sit on a bench - plenty of traffic & people to get used to. Drive to the vets & sit in the waiting room.

Socialisation is not about marathon walking it's about encountering different situations/places/noises/people/animals/traffic, if the only place your pup gets socialisation is wherever it can walk to in the 5 minute rule, I'm sure it's missing vital experiences.

The link that says not to take your pup out until 9 months, is referring to taking it on a walk for the sole purpose of exercise, with a little common-sense it is obvious that the puppy will need to actually walk before this point.

> They are 'allowed' to walk, the point I have obviously been failing to get accross is you do not drag them around on a lead when they are nackered just to fit in with the 5 minute rule. Socialising a pup without exhausting it is not that hard - you take it places within the individual pups walking limits, or you drive to places and walk around ie- drive to a car boot, amble around - lots of people & other dogs. Drive to a busy town & sit on a bench - plenty of traffic & people to get used to. Drive to the vets & sit in the waiting room.

I don't drive so when my pups were too young to walk far I took the bus to town and shopping centres where I could sit with them.

Also re exercise I think it more important to recognise when a pup, especially a spunky never say die one is getting tired.

I have seen many baby pups dragged around in the country Park for hours (usually collies or springers) in the hope that this will wear them pout.

I have often see these same pups with crooked legs and poor movement, gone wide and out at elbow etc, though your pet owner wouldn't recognise they are damaging their pups.

The 5 minute rule is a useful starting point and gives an idea of exercise requirements.

As with my breed the rule by five months really needs to be twice a day or maybe twice a day some days.  Pups go through growth spurts when they seem to need more rest etc.  So you need to learn to read your dog.

I have occasionally taken a five or 6 month pup out for too long and then not taken them out at all the next day, or for a shorter walk. 

My present breed as pups will sit down and give a clue they have had enough (under abourt five or 6 months), but my first dog of a herding breed woudl ahve walked until she wore her legs off if I ahd been stupid enough to take her out for hours.

Woooo - I wasn't being funny or critical just concerned :)

Of course I wouldn't drag a pup around and never suggested I or anyone else would or should. The 5 minute rule is about the maximum amount of exercise a youngster should have and not a minimum set period - perhaps I didn't make that clear. I myself wouldn't personally let my own puppies have free access to play with another dog all day because my pups have tended to play with great gusto and can overdo it at times thus negating the limiting of exercise I try to adhere to but that is just my opinion.

I did not say that socialising a pup meant it had to be dragged around until it was exhausted and can't see where you got that idea from. Yes I totally agree it is great to drive them somewhere and then sit watching the world go by as it extends their socialisation and encompasses a huge amount of situations and experiences and makes for a well balanced dog - not everyone has a car though so only works if owner has a car.

Perhaps we just have different views on what the words "worn out" mean - I have a large breed but my dog didn't get worn out on his walks at 5 months old but then my dog is not your dog and all dogs are different :)

I will keep my concerns to myself in future as would not wish to offend again even though that was never my intention in the first place.

Blimey if i stuck to that 5min rule my house would look like its had a whirlwind through it!!

Pups are VERY self limiting i of course can't account for cross breeds where there are totally different variations in excercise i suspect its going to be hard to strike a balance..

I have took all my youngsters on a beach escapade with the elders and they usually do 2mins full on warfare then 15mins sniffing every blade of grass possible!! then a further 2mins on their second wind followed by the 15mins (total 4 mins being a pratt and 30mins gentle walk at their pace) mooching... Now thats free running which is what i agree with, its forced on lead walks i do not agree with... Mine have got and do get 30-40mins every day on the beach regardless of age the youngest invariably potter about most of the time...theres just nothing forced about it...

Then i save a quick 5mins around the village for purely lead training...

"Perhaps we just have different views on what the words "worn out" mean - I have a large breed but my dog didn't get worn out on his walks at 5 months old but then my dog is not your dog and all dogs are different "

This was the point I was trying to make but don't think I made myself very clear like normal!! All dogs are different but felt it was important to point out that even dogs of the same breed are very different. The same as with the feeding everybody has different opinions and does things in different ways. If it works for you and your dog then that is fantastic. I've had quite a few mastiffs and got 4 at the moment and up until now what I do works for all of us. If at some point it didn't I would rethink. I don't think anybody was trying to cause offence, we all just have different ideas and do things different ways!

Paula - it wasn't your post I was replying to :) I was replying to Mastifflover who mistook my concern for criticism :)

No I know, sorry just quoted your post because you put it so much better than me as that was what I was trying to say and thought it maybe hadn't come across how I wanted it to!!!!

For the OP.

http://www.i-tails.com/great-dane-mastiff-puppy-care.html

http://www.dekever.com.au/AllDomainWebs/bretonmastiffs/general%20Mastiff%20Information.htm   (scroll down past 5th row of pics for exercise info).

If you can't tell when your pup is tiring, it will slow down/sit/laydown and may pant.

Harley

Sorry - I did take it the wrong way - I appologise for my harsh relpy :(

I'm a little touchy when it comes to my 'babies' - I would give up my own limbs to ensure they are healthy, happy & well behaved :) i took your concern as an implication I am ignoring an underlying health issue, it's too easy to mis-interpret the written word, if I wasn't such a touchy battleaxe i would have asked exactly what you meant before I got my knickers in a twist. :(

I do get annoyed with 'blanket rules' regarding the health of our dogs. As many of you have said, depending on the individual dog (regardless of breed), you give them the exercise they need. I said in an earlier post my sister Boxer would go insane sticking to the 5 min rule, even doubling it wouldn't be enough. The Mastiff do tire much quicker than most other dogs, they are carrying a lot of weight around, and again the point at which they tire (start slowing down not having a heart attack :) ) will vary for each individual depending on genetics, enery level, bone size and weight (there is a vast variation of size within the mastiff breed & the pups also grow at greatly different rates).

We may have different views on what 'worn out' is, but I think more importantly we have different dogs (dis-regarding breed) :)

I don't drive - i am lucky to have a dad that is willing to be mine & my pups taxi when the OH is at work. :)

Paula,
I knew what you meant. I know you were saying excersie is a very individual thing even within a breed.

I just happen to have the lowest-drive mastiff on the planet!!!! I would love to take him on longer walks, it would do him the world of good re strengthening his muscles etc & keeping him slender :).  I've tried to get accross in my posts that the short walks Buster has, are his personal limits & I would advise on sticking to not walking a pup past it being tired, which seems to be what everybody else would suggest. :)

The Mastiff do tire much quicker than most other dogs, they are carrying a lot of weight around, and again the point at which they tire (start slowing down not having a heart attack  ) will vary for each individual depending on genetics, enery level, bone size and weight (there is a vast variation of size within the mastiff breed & the pups also grow at greatly different rates).

1st one on me and i have danes which are a MUCH larger breed height wise and are very much slower maturing and i've never known them to tire easily at all of course they don't have the density of mastiffs early on but the principle is the same.. Heart attack? thats such a preconception in these breeds and it doesnt happen as much is stated.........People think wrongly much more body to carry around than the heart can cope with.... thats such a wrong statement i have known mastiffs and danes to reach a ripe age dependant on lines in many cases...

I must agree that having Large breed dogs in the past,nearly everything mastifflover is saying,from food in other threads,to exercise etc is completely new to me...
Mastifflover i notice you like posting links,but what about the ones i posted on another thread which contradicts your views on nutrition/protein/exercise etc Are you interested in differing views or only links that back up what you believe? :)

Ktee,
I believe in feeding MY DOG less than 23% protein, I believe in walking MY DOG no longer than tires him.

I will happily offer this advice and the reasons I believe in it. I do not expect anybody to take that advice if they don't want it and I don't expect everyone to agree.

It would be rather pointless me posting links that didn't back up my beliefs.

I have read the links you have posted to contradict me & the links I posted, and still have the same beliefs. I would not feed 42% protein as you do & I will not exercise my Mastiff  based on your experience with Rotweillers & Bullmastiffs (or any other Mastiff for that matter, every dog has individual requirements).

Are you interested in other view points or just the links you post?  As I love links so much heres another :)

http://www.i-tails.com/great-dane-mastiff-nutrition-feed.html

Mygirl
I said 'hear attack' as a figure of speach, meaning not exersie to the point of exhaustion (extreme fatige = heavy panting), in much the same way 'knickers in a twist' was a figure of speach - my knickers are not twisted.

I said a mastiff will tire quicker than MOST other dogs, I did not mention your Great Danes.

Out of interest does a Great Dane pup have the stamina/energy of a Boxer pup or a Border Collie pup, or do they tire quicker?

Sorry - I did take it the wrong way - I appologise for my harsh relpy

I'm a little touchy when it comes to my 'babies'

No problem mastifflover :) We are all only trying to do our best for our dogs :)

>I'm a little touchy when it comes to my 'babies'.We are all only trying to do our best for our dogs

Ditto that.
I just wanted to put across that i have researched canine nutrition for many,many,many years and so many things that were written in stone years ago have now been thoroughly debunked.Such as the protein myth etc etc

I just happen to have the lowest-drive mastiff on the planet!!!! I would love to take him on longer walks, it would do him the world of good re strengthening his muscles etc & keeping him slender .

Just wondered without wanting to cause world war 3 have you ever tried to gradually build his exercise up so that he can be exercised more as I do believe it may help his muscles. Like I say this isn't a critiscm just a question? Like you say there are many different 'types' within mastiffs, I don't and haven't had in the past just one type but like someone else mentioned mine tend to all be eercised together and the puppys do as little or as much as they want and the same with the adults!! Like I say not trying to have a go but everybody has different ideas and sometimes it is good to try different things.

Hi mastifflover and everyone... thanks for all your advice :-)

At the moment I walk Tank for about 25minutes, with him being a mastiff cross akita i'm finding it difficult to establish exactly how much is ok for him as i'm very cautious about causing problems with too much exercise and too little!!  He has lazy days and energetic days so I tend to just go off what kind of day he's having. After reading mastifflovers posts i'm going to cut down his walking time a little maybe ten minutes or so and see how he is with that.  I would say he is physically more like a mastiff but he does seem very active and agile for a mastiff but I guess that's the akita in him...

Thank you again everyone for all your help :-)

Sophie

I would think around 25 minutes would be ok at 5 months old. That is consistent with the 5 mins a month rule and if you are struggling to find a happy medium cutting him down to 10 minutes might not be enough. JMO.

I agree with Paula,25 minutes sounds fine.I too think there is such a thing as too little exercise....

And i have to admit i have never followed the 5 minute per age rule,i have never had dogs that have been satisfied with such little exercise.

Hiya Paula yes he seems to be doing fine with 25minutes I was just a bit concerned after reading 'Mastifflovers' posts I was over exercising him! But like I said he seems fine with that so I should stick to it and just keep my eye on him if he is getting tired!  Thanks for your advice :-)

I have been building up my pups walks, very gradually as I have been advised to do. I am in no rush to push this any further, as he does get exercise besided the walks.

I never advised the OP tho walk her dog for only 10 mins!!!  - I advised not to walk him past the point of being tired.

When I take my sisters boxer out, we go at a brisk pace, in 10 minutes we have covered over a mile - in 15 min with Buster  we get approx 200yds - less distance than the boxer, but it takes longer.

This is the reason a time limit is a little stupid IMO - paces vary along with individual needs. I will still advise the OP to walk her dog as far as he can go before he tires - ie, if he is not coming back from his current walks knackerd, I see no reason to change them, whether they fit the 5 min rule or not.

EDIT: I have not advised you to cut his walking down, I have said that the 10 mins at 5 months was what MY PUP was doing, I said all pups are different - they each have thier own limits. I advised you not to walk him past being tired to fit in with the 5 minute rule - walk him to fit his personal capabilities.

I can't understand why everybody thinks that is so wrong, I would have thought it's easier not to over-exert any pup if you stick to NOT TIRING them, rather than a time limit. I know you have said Brainless that you have had pups that would happily walk for hours - but within the large walk they must have showed signs of tiring, ie. if off lead frequent stopping, if on lead slowing pace/panting.

Hi I think the five minute rule or guideline is for those people who are inexperienced with dogs and because pups are mischievous etc assume they need lots of exercise and are tempted to over walk young pups.

I know that the majority of pet owners who come to our training classes are more likely to be doing too much exercise well over the five minutes per month of life as they do not know what is appropriate or realise the rapid rate that pups grow compared to a human or other larger animals.   In the same vein most adult dogs are under exercised, few getting at least an hour.

Pups of the active breeds will often not show obvious signs of tiredness, so it is easy to over walk baby springers, Labs, Staffs, Collies and terriers.

The 5 minute rule is a starting point/guide, and sensible adjustments need to made up or down.  I would imagine following the 5 minute rule you are unlikely to do harm even your breed, and if the dog itself didn't want to do as much the owner should realise that it is too much. 

The rule really is far more appropriate to the people who through ignorance over tax their pups.

can  you tell me if too much protein in the diet can cause kidney problems?

Low protein levels have often been advised to ease the workload for kidneys that are already damaged.  A normal level of protein is in fact needed to grow and maintain the body.  The quality and bio availability of the protein is key.

With kidney failure the protein levels are reduced, but the quality needs to be the very best, and really it is a balancing act to keep the dog alive.

The following link explains this more:

http://www.thepetcenter.com/gen/kf.html

"DIETARY CONSIDERATIONS
Contrary to popular myth, diets rich in protein ("high protein diets") do not cause kidney damage.  Research done decades ago indicated that rodents were adversely affected by diets high in protein and misguided researchers extrapolated that data to apply to the canine.  Read more under TREATMENT below or go to an article about protein in pet diets."

>I was told to not walk my Mastiff more than 100 yards per day until he is 18 months old. The breeder that told me this has over 30years experience in breeding & showing and he is very repsected within the 'Mastiff world'.

If he follows his own advice he could never show a Puppy or Junior dog at Crufts - it's further than that from the entrances to the benches, let alone from the car parks to the building itself!

In fact there were 16+ mastiffs in the puppy and junior classes at this year's Crufts, so obviously a lot of people don't agree with such extremely limited exercise for their youngsters.

I don't know anything about showing, but I didn't think it was done to exercise the dogs?

The advise was regarding daily walks for the purpose of exercise, on top of gentle milling around that is done for socialisation. I wouldn't have thought the walking involved with showing was strenuous enough to be counted as formal exercise.

I'd imagine that most of the pups end up walking more than the 5 minute rule would allow (6 month old = 30 minutes). So if we need to take the walking involved in showing as the optimum 'exercise' limits, my pups breeder is talking rubbish & the 5 minute rule is rubbish too.

Walking to and moving in the show ring would be more than 100yards. So either they don't show there young dogs before a certain age or they don't stick to their own recommendations is I think what JG was suggesting.

>So if we need to take the walking involved in showing as the optimum 'exercise' limits, my pups breeder is talking rubbish & the 5 minute rule is rubbish too.

Not the 'optimum'; too little really and well within the acceptable amount. It's all exercise! It takes the same amount of energy to do the few hundred yards from the carparks at the NEC to the Halls as it would do to do a few hundred yards down the road. That'd take about 15 minutes - well within the 5-minute rule; and yet you were told no more than 100 yards? That's about 5 minutes - is that sufficient for a dog up to 18 months? At a show the dogs get far less than their usual amount of exercise, and yet it's still a lot more than your breeder's recommendation.

Satincollie's right; either your breeder doesn't show young dogs or doesn't follow his own rules. Certainly there are very many mastiff breeders with successful young dogs that get substantially more than 100 yards exercise daily but stick within the 5-minute rule.

As I said, my breeder would not class the pace involved with showing as 'exersise', in much the same way a fitness coach would not class mooching 'round the shops as 'excersise'.

Each breeder has thier own recomendations & advice based on the experience & suitbability regarding thier particular 'type'. The advice the breeder gives is used by himself. It really makes no difference if you believe this or not.

The original purpose of this thread was to advise the OP on the exercise her pup gets, that advice has been given & clarified by several other posters. This thread has now turned in to an attempt to discredit the advice my breeder has given me, it seems a little pointless after the thread has concluded, but we are all entitled to our own opinions.

What would you and your breeder class as 'exercise'?

Walking at enough of a pace to elevate the heart rate :)

Well I certainly would hope that trotting a dog around the ring would elevate the heart rate, and formal  lead exercise would maybe  elevate mine but still be fairly sedate pace for a dog.

I really have to move some to get my dogs into a trot (the speed breeds are shown and movement evaluated at) when road walking, which is why I like to go out late at night when I will not have to stop and start for other pedestrians but can do a real stomp.

Pups can be shown from 6 months when the five minute guideline would be 30 minutes for a walk.

I would think even at the NEC the walk to the halls is 15 minutes each way, and then the once or twice round the ring is going to be only a minute or two.  The rest of the time the dogs will be resting.

I'm very confused here. :-o In one post you say your dog has a 15 minute walk per day on lead, then in your next post you say I was told to not walk my Mastiff more than 100 yards per day until he is 18 months old.. Now I'm sure it doesn't take 15 minutes to go 100 yards and back, and it certainly wouldn't elevate the heart rate!

The 5-minute rule applies to putting a lead on the dog and taking it out for some fresh air, sometimes on-lead and sometimes off. A normal dog walk. So we'd expect an 8-month pup to have a walk of no longer than 40 minutes. More than that would be 'over-exercising' - two walks of 20 minutes for such a giant breed would be better.