I take the puppy class at our local training club.  I currently have 3 puppies who I think are very thin.  I have spoken to each owner individually about the amount of food they give, type of food and how often they feed etc, but they don't want to listen.  One puppy was brought away from breeder on just 2 meals a day!  Any ideas on how to get these people to take a bit of advice?

How about making up some of your own fact sheets on puppies.
Most people know what theyre doing, others will read and read up or ask advice, but these people may not know or done any researching.
If they take something home to read, it may well hit home a bit.
Also put a section in on worming, go around the whole class and ask when their puppies were last wormed etc.
Other than that, not sure what else you can do.
good luck Ells x

Would it be possible to ask your local friendly vet or dog warden to make a 'visit' one night for a talk on nutrition?

I agree that making your own fact sheets might be an idea, but who reads things they get at classes? So many people will just bin them without looking at them, and these people sound like they may be the type. :-(

If you could speak to other puppy owners who are at your classes and ask for them to help out by asking the new owners how much they feed their pups, and then commenting on the fact that pups need fed more often, and more food, you might get further with them. The last thing you want is to alienate these people. They obviously don't know better, even though they think they do ;-)

When we completed our training course the trainer had some samples of food and treats for us to take home. Wasn't for any reason other than a little treat for the dogs.
You could do something like that, get the treats out "as a present for all pups/owners for doing so well" and get talking about who feeds what/how often etc. try ot make it as informal as possible.
Doing a fact sheet is a great idea but if these are the kind of people that haven't done any research then they're probably the kind of people to throw a factsheet in the bin. A discussion could be seen as friendlier and more helpful and would put your mind at rest that they definately listened.

We discussed at our last meeting about having a fact sheet and a couple of us are working on it.  We have already mentioned worming to the class - will do again this week just in case they didn't understand first time!  I also like the idea of giving out food samples - I'll approach my vet and see if he will help me out - I'll also try my own supplier.
Thanks everyone for the ideas.

Don't forget a lot of working type dogs are finer than many of the show type, so it's not always that a dog is thin. 

Also I have a male who never puts on weight but is fed really well.  He actually is over the breeds weight limit, but he looks really skinny and is only 1inch over the height limit.

I have been on the other end of this - I weighed my pup and gave the appropriate amount of food on the packet - thought I was doing the right thing.  She had to go into kennels for a few days and they fed her up and told me off!  I hadn't realised what weight she should have been.  This roly poly animal greeted me when I picked her up and I felt SO bad about it.  My husband still teases me about starving my dog.  I just hope I didn't do any long term damage -

I don't see many  underweight dogs but I see a few overweight ones.  Sometimes people's perceptions of what a healthy weight is differs - certainly with people what would have been considered a bit fat is now considered normal.

So much depends on breed as well. Just been to the vet today with my male Malinois and the vet asked if he was  correct show weight, I said yes, he got a RBOB last weekend in fact. The vet thought he seemed so thin! And vets usually like dogs thinner than judges.

I have also seen so many dogs that Vets have said are an acceptable weight and I would call fat.  Fat or at least rather well covered seems to be the norm so a nice lean dog seems to many to be too thin.

dont worry ceejay, I did exactly that with Fagan my first Irish, I fed him on burns and thought he was a good weight - his breeder wasnt impressed when she saw him !!!

The puppies in question are about 5 months old now and their ribs and backbones are very clearly felt.  I appreciate all breeds differ, but most puppies of that age should have a little 'puppy fat' around them surely.

Not neccessarily, I have a 12 week old Irish Setter puppy, that is lean. He's fed four hearty meals of James Wellbeloved Lamb and Rice Puppy diet a day, his poos are firm, he's been wormed, he's growing well, and I can easily feel his ribs and backbone. I can't see them, but I can feel them. No puppy fat on him whatsoever.

Dawn R.

I agree with you you shoudlb e able to easily feel but not see these features, unless the breed is heavy coated of course.

One particular puppy has very obvious signs - you can easily see ribs & backbone and rear end is also very boney!  For young puppies 2 of them are quite lethargic too.

I have also seen so many dogs that Vets have said are an acceptable weight and I would call fat.  Fat or at least rather well covered seems to be the norm so a nice lean dog seems to many to be too thin.

I absolutely agree. I saw one of my pups yesterday. She left me at 12 weeks, weighing 12KGS, (ish) and just right in my opinion. Easily felt her ribs,. but not see them, adn she had a bit of a waist. They took her for her second vacc on the way home (using the same vet as me) and the vet told them she was fat. When I saw her yesterday, she was abou the same condition wise, but obviously bigger now, and the same vet had just told them she was too thin! poor people, they just couldnt' win! She still looked fine in my eyes.

Most people think my girl is too thin, although she is not, she is working fit. Plenty of energy and well muscled. It is just a symptom of seeing the many overweight pet dogs there are out there, especially in my breed, it seems.

To the OP. Are you SURE the pups are too thin, most people keep their puppies too fat, and that is what we get used to comparing to. As long as you can't see their ribs or backbones, they are probably OK. Why do they need 'puppy fat'? If they lay down fat cells now, it doesn't bode well for later life.

I can remember from our training classes that we were given paper handouts to revise for the next week when we would be questioned on it! :)

Kinda like school (Except the dog got a treat when we answered a question correctly!!) but we damned well read what was given so we didnt look silly the next week and Mizt never missed a treat :-D

It helped for it all to sink in as well having a fun quiz the next week and some handouts to take home, maybe you can do that?
You will find people are more eager to make their dog have the most treats and not look silly, so they may get fattened up inadvertdantly and the people will learn something as well!! lol

I too would say it is probably healthier for a pup to be lean than over weight, under nourished (or possibly full of worms?) is obviously different case!
In my opinion many people do keep their puppies slightly too plumb and then there are those who just forget the fact the amount of food should go up as the puppy grows!
Especially if they do not weight the puppy it is easy to be blinded to how much the puppy is growing...

These people do not probably know what is the correct thing to do, considering advise from the breeder was feed 2 times a day so some kind of help and advise and coaching is obviously needed...

My giant breed was extremely skinny until recently.  If it weren't for the heavy coat, I'm sure someone would have reported me for neglect! She has only started to keep weight on over the last few at almost 3 years old.

What an interesting thread.

My puppy  (BC X Poodle) is quite fluffy and you can't see her ribs at all, in fact my OH says she is chubby - and she does admittedly look roundish.  But I can feel her ribs very easily...

Does she have a waist, as you should be able to see that last rib when you part the coat.  Feeling the ribs is when you lightly run your finger tips along the ribcage, not when you dig about for them :D

You can see my boxers ribs when he runs but only the last two when he stands.  They are easily felt with a light touch
When we went puppy training there were some pups that look thin but then others were like little balls.  The thinner ones tended to fill out but the fatter ones stayed fat.

If you're running the KC puppy foundation then a talk on 'the responsibilities of dog ownership' is called for. A reminder of the neccesity for grooming, worming and health care would be an integral part of the the talk with a leaflet. It's probably all you can do - after all it's their dog and to push them may get their backs up.

On the subject of vets giving a talk on feeding (aimed at solving the puppy thinness) this may  back-fire as a great many of their profession blame most dog problems on overfeeding... a bit like Doctors do with people.

Just until before Joy was put down, she was really skinny.  A Working ESS at 27 lbs.  We did EVERYTHING to try and put weight on her.  She just wouldnt put weight on.  All of a sudden, she started to again, and when she passed she was 34lbs.  Not ideal of course, but better than she was.

My one MP bitch, she looks really heavy.  I would have said 8 or 9 pounds, but when she was weighed at the vets last week, she is actually lighter than my other fine boned min pin.  The one is 6.8 lbs and the one I thought was fat was 6.5 lbs. 

And it does depend on breeds, I notice a lot of sight hounds look very thin.  Also a lot of dogs with deep chests look really thin until they are fully mature.

The handouts are a good idea, and maybe get the vet to do a checkover of all pups in the class.  On a night when you talk about nutrition and well being.

Good luck!

Was that to me, Brainless?  She seems to have a waist (lucky bitch LOL) - as I said, it's hard to see any ribs due to her being a complete fluffball. I can feel her ribs easily, just by lightly running my fingertips over her side.

Thank you everyone for your opinions.  I have contacted my feed supplier and they have kindly given me some samples to give out as well as leaflets on feeding.
I do prefer to keep my own adult dogs on the lean side as I think it's far better for them, but saying that I do not worry too much about their weight until they are about a year old.  I would never let a puppy get fat but I do like them to have a bit of flesh on them whilst they are growing so quickly.  My own personal opinion is that the feeding regime for a young dog should be reviewed almost weekly and adjusted as required.  Many new puppy owners are only given information on feeding for the first few days, they do not realise that the amount has to be increased reguarly.  I agree that it can sometimes be difficult to keep up with growth spurts, but my original post relates to novice owners, which the majority who post of CD aren't.

Many new puppy owners are only given information on feeding for the first few days, they do not realise that the amount has to be increased reguarly.

Or given information on feeding and don't bother to read it. I am considering giving my puppy owners their puppy packs 2-3 weeks before they take theitr pup home, and only allowing them to take it if they can pass an 'exam' on the contents of the packs!  :-)

On a more serious note, I despair, and thankgoodness they mostly feel they can ring and ask me things.

Although many new puppy owners ring quite often before they take their puppies home, I don't think they do anywhere near as much when they're busy with their new additions.  I also think feeding is probably something they wouldn't phone about - upset tums, chewing, training - yes.
Good idea about giving puppy packs prior to actually having puppy - but even then, would they bother to read it?  Plus, its about remembering all you have read and implementing it as and when required.

Our breeder told us to just give our ETT puppy as much as he wants, 3 times a day initially, but take up anything that was left after 20 minutes.  Now a year old, he has grown into a giant amongst ETT's, but is still pretty lithe and could never be called fat.

I think a lot depends on breed.  I would tend to agree with my won breed up to about five months of age when then growth is at it's fastest, but after that a lot of my breed can easily get fat, and people really need to keep checking the pup isn't too heavy, if it is then keep to the same level of food or a fraction less until it has grown and is a good weight.  With outs usually by about 9 months the food needs to start being reduced, but individuals vary.

I think with any pups that eat heartily you do need to watch weight carefully.

You do occasionally get picky individuals in my breed (I have had one almost anorexic and two that were not too fussed about food during adolescence), especially adolescent males, but the majority in pet ownership are allowed to get too fat, and my cry is nearly always cut their food down.

My youngster is on 60% more food than her grand mother of same height and obviously more substance.