Hi all,
As a dog owner and general animal lover I know this post will upset a lot of people and i'm sorry for that but I need to pick a few more brains of people who may know how to advise me. A local, stupid, ignorant young man who still lives at home with his parents has recently taken on a 2 year old Chow. His parents will not allow the dog in the house so the moron is keeping it in the front of his small escort van! I have reported it to the RSPCA and I sadly have to say as previous experience seem to be disorganised and slow. I have also reported it to the police. The police informed me that they have had several calls about it and the RSPCA Inspector for our area has attended and reported that because the dog has food and water there is nothing they can do. I was under the impression that the revised Animal Welfare Act which came into force in England and Wales in April 2007 gave agencies such as the RSPCA more powers as it contained much stricter rules regarding the welfare of animals. I have looked the section of the Act up which applies tothe poor dog and it appears clear to me that the RSPCA can serve him with a warning notice under 'duty of care'???? I have rung the RSPCA everyday for 4 days now as the dog is still in the van unable to lay down properly because of its size looking extremely sad and we have already had snow with more forecast, all of which the RSPCA are aware of but the people on the phone keep telling me they are unable to update me or tell me any information about it as info has to come from the attending Inspector, but she still hasn't rung me!!! The only reason I know the Inspector has attended is because the police told me! Can anyone reading this think of anyone else I can contact, or know that if I was to really push the RSPCA quoting clauses from the Animal Welfare Act they will do something??? I've contacted the local papers who don't even seemed interested. I've even thought of contacting the Chow Dog Club as they are a specialised breed but at the end of the day what could they do?? I'm just at my wits end with it and its so distressing having to drive past and see him every day. Any advice or suggestions would be greatly appreciated, thank you X

One thing you could do is to put a formal complaint, in writing to the RSPCA, to a more senior level than you have gone so far, and also to make the biggest possible nuisance of yourself by phoning repeatedly to higher and higher levels until you get the CEO if necessary.
You have said that multiple people have made complaints....presumably these are also neighbours, so you could try going around the neighbours and getting together as a group, as there is more strength in numbers. Maybe a petition might make the local papers more interested.
Ring the Chow rescue anyway as they might be able to advise, and could add some seight with the rspca......you could also try finding out where he got the dog. If he got it from a dogs home they might be interested in taking it back. If he got it from a breeder they might be prepared to get involved. If he bought it from anyone else THEY might not be too happy about the dogs living conditions and might be prepared to go around and reclaim the dog.
Personally, if it gets really cold, and nothing has still been done, Id break into the van and take the dog in, saying it was an emergency. I know that people have gotten away with breaking into cars in extreme heat, so it should be the same for cold.
P.S. Many years ago I reported for someone doing the exact same thing with GSDs. THe RSPCA spoke to the person concerned immediately, and it stopped. So that proves that they do not consider it acceptable to keep dogs in cars in the cold.

Just a thought to give it a different angle with the police - does the car have tax disc, bald tyres etc......  If it turns out the car shouldnt be on the road the dog cant be kept in it...

Maxine

Thank you, i'll will check that out. DVLA are very hot on untaxed vehicles round here and are very quick to clamp reported vehicles.

Thank you for your reply. I'm going to give the inspector one last chance to contact me then i'm going to take your advice and write that letter. I have already started making enquiries into which other neighbours have reported it. I'm definately going to contact the Chow rescue and don't worry if it gets silly cold or nothing seems to be being sorted I will definately remove the dog myself, I have already warned the police i will do that if absolutely needed but will try the legal and proper channels first. I run a rabbit and guinnea pig rescue and have had to 'remove' suffering animals before, the welfare of the animal will always come first in my book no matter what the excuse, thanks again X

Chow Chow Rescue

Mrs S Jakeman (Co-ordinator)    01608 658491

Scottish Chow Chow Rescue

Mr Ken McKie   01357529402

Why not contact Chow rescue as they maybe able to help by persuading the owner to perhaps wsee the way they are keeping the dog is not in the dogs best interest :)

without knowing (rather than guessing) all the details and circumstances maybe youre not getting the whole picture? I know when i left college and was staying with a friends parents for 4 weeks, they were worried my hound would eat their chihuahua so didnt want him in the house. he lived in my landrover very happily for a month!!!

I cant believe you admit that.

Dog Warden? 

Environmental Health??

Pinkl;illies. I presume after a month Sams dog was back in the 'fold'
Now A month shut in a landrover to me is better than 5 years stuck in rescue kennels!!!!
Gemma, my RIP dog had to be shut in a crate for a week, only let out when I went round to her and played with her when my husband wasnt there and only for a 1/2 hour at a time maybe once a day as I also had a 5 month old and too scared to go as thought he would be there and not at work. I dont know what happened with her when he was there!!!
The Reason. I left him and had to stay at mums where I couldnt take her. And I did not have the money to eat let alone put her in kennels, so I had to leave her at my husbands house.
1 week later I went and got her and she lived happily for over 8 years as mainly part of my family and a VERY MUCH loved family pet  before she was PTS in December.
IF I had handed her to a rescue centre she would have either lived her life out in kennels or been PTS at the age of 2 due to her temprement.
Sometimes, a situation that looks cruel for a few weeks, can turn out to be the best thing for a dog in the long run. Like Gemma and like Sams dog.
Lea :) :)

I am sure there are no laws against it Lea, and its not necessarily cruel, but I would equate it to being crated for very long periods. I am not sure where i stated that the dog should be placed in rescue??????? Personally I would attempt to find a temporary foster home, or would not go to stay with people who could not also accept the dog. As I live alone I am totally aware that emergencies occur, and have therefore not left things to chance, having prearranged emergency care for my pets with family and friends, with several "subs" in the event that someone is unavailable. I am however sure that Sam is likely to have been a lot more attentive than the owner of this chow.....Purely my personal choice....and I must say that considering the view often expressed on this board about crating, I am somewhat surprised that so many have expressed a view that long periods in a  car are acceptable Its not the being outside that I have issues with, its being locked away out of earshot for long periods with no real opportunity to toilet ( i am referring to the chow here, NOT sams dog)

I should qualify the dog shoudl not be shut up for long periods, be that crate kennel or vehicle.

You said that you were shocked that Sam admitted to leaving her dog in a landrover for 4 weeks. I was just showing that certain circumstances a few weeks of what people would call cruelty would lead to a life time of happiness Like I belive Sams dog and Gemma. Unfoirtunatly I was 21 at the time and was not online so the only other option, other than crating Gemma 24/7 for 7 dayts was to give her up. I knew nothing else!!!
As for the Chow shut in the van. I hope they are in a similar situation to me and will be able to give the Chow a good life soon. I had the RSPCA out to me, explained the situation(luckily I was there when they arrived, a complete fluke) and they were fine with it.
So it might be (hopefully) that there is a good reason the dog is shut in there and it will only be short term. Until you talk to the inspector you will not know!!! If she doesnt give you a good reponse, I hope you are abnle to find someone to listen :)
(PS the
Chow reminds me of the dog in keeping up appearences!!!!!!)
Lea :) :)

Working within the RSPCA's criteria, remember some dogs aren't bothered by being outside, infact a lot of breeds like outdoors better than the indoors, as long as they have shelter, the RSPCA do not say it needs to be heated shelter, just shelter and a Chow has ample coat to keep warm. 

The fact that the Chow can't lay down properly is my real cause of concern as the van must not be big enough, if this is a true fact that is a worry and maybe something you can use to protest.

The dog has food and water and hopefully is being walked plenty, so I don't actually know what law within the RSPCA or any animal cruelty he can be breaking, hopefully the dog has a bed in the van too, so I don't think you have a case.

Dogs go camping with us, and plenty of people sleep in vans never mind dogs, so as long as the dog is well cared for, not much to do I don't think.

Well it woudln't be any different than being kenneled, as long as it tis walked, had bedding and it wasn't hot.  Most dogs can and do cope with cold fine with bedding.  How amy peopel travelling to or attending  shows will have the dogs in the vehicle overnight?

I also know someone who had an air conditioned van (run on solar power) kitted out for their dogs and when he went to work the dogs were in the van as he was worried that they would knock his disabled wife over.  This way he could walk them in his lunch hour and tea breaks.  Not ideal, but better than being crated in the house all day.  Why have the dogs in this situation?  Well his wife became disable and he was due to retire.

Our Dobe bitch hates stopping at my mothers house and happily spends the night in the car. We don't hear a whisper from her and she is very warm and comfy as this is in the summer months. And by the way, both the dogs love camping

I know its not the same But, the only way I keep Beano quite when he is not with another dog is to leave him in the car. I go out running with Ebba, and leave him with my kids. And he HOWLS!!!!! I go out running with Ebba and leave him in the car on club nights and he sleeps!!!!
Will be only for up to 4 hours at a time as I get to running marathons (hopefully if I carry on!!) But its the only way I can leave him nbot distressed!!
Lea :)

pinKillies....why?? i see no reAson that my hound shouldnt have slept in the landrover for a month....he certainly didnt either!! we were on a very isolated beach property and he had several long beach walks every day plus he came to work with me as well. I can think of many dogs living in houses who get kept a lot worse!!

Why is everybody making a big deal of my "surprised" icon?
sam, am entitled to an opinion, and you have conveniently ignored my SPECIFIC comment that I did not feel that YOU were being cruel to the dog. I have said that i dont feel it is ideal, and am entitled to that view, and have ALREADY said why, so i do not need to say it again, but I will................

I am not a fan of long periods crated, and consider long periods in a car out of earshot to be something desirable. In your particular case  I am aware that you walked the dogs etc, but I would personally not want to do it.
With regards to the Chow there appears to be no evidence that it its being taken to work, walked, or socialising at all. I dont apologise for finding that unacceptable

Also you have to remember that this poor Chow can't lay down properly due to its size, this isn't a transit sized van but a small escort van and he has no access to the back just the front cab area, basically the two front seats. he's too big for the foot wells and can't lay accross the seats because the hand break.

Thank you very much for all that info, i'll definately contact them.

Hi guys, I've spent a while lurking on this site and reading all the great advice but this has really upset me. I own 2 beautiful chow chow boys and so I know this poor dog is suffering. It's a great idea to call the chow chow rescue as they probably have contacts with RSPCA.

Some people may think that this breed is grumpy or aggressive but in my experience they are just protective and also sensitive. My 2 have never shown any aggresion but are excellent watch dogs.  It would be soul destroying for a chow to be rehomed at the best of times as they only give themselves to 1 person or family group, to be rehomed and then not be included in the family group could result in this dog trusting no-one and this is when they become aggressive.

Please don't give up on this dog, he really needs you.

Lunamoona, I promise you I will not give up on this dog. I have looked into and learned a lot about this breed since discovering him and it echos what you said. I know how upsetting it is to hear any sad news regarding animals and how passionate you can feel towards a particular breed. I'll keep you updated X

It's great to know that people are willing to go the extra mile for animals who cannot help themselves. 

I'm sure many of us have been in the position of having our circumstances change and of having to make temporary, less than ideal accommodation for our pets but this is not the the case here.  This person does not have their own home and has got a dog (who will already be traumatised), obviously against the wishes of his parents who have every right to not want a strange dog in their house! How stupid and selfish.

Good luck, I'll look out for your updates

The way this particular dog is being kept is unacceptable, as our general comments about vehicles took things off topic a bit.  I hope the authorities or Welfare Agencies ensure a better outcome, though of course it is likely to lead to more disruption for the dog.  I suspect the owner thought if he kept on his parents would cave in.

Have you heard anything else from the inspectors yet???
Lea :)

Is the chow still living in these conditions.
Any update.
Dog

Smash the window? Remove the dog.
A bit dramatic, but by the looks of it, no other legit ways of helping the poor fella.

Hi All
Sorry it's been a long time but sadly that is due to nothing to update with. Basically Surrey Police and the RSPCA just keep passing the buck with each other with both of them adamant that its the other one that can do something if anything. I have been constantly ringing both of them. I have quoted the Revised Animal Welfare Act April 2007, (duty of care) to both of them, the RSPCA told me that there isn't a court in the land which would be willing to prosecute as there are far worse cruelty cases. The Police admitted they thay didn't know enough about the new act and will contact me when they've looked into it.
Unfortunately this is by far not the first time I have had to deal with the RSPCA and I have to say that i'm extremely unimpressed with them yet again as with all the other times i've dealt with them. The RSPCA are not allowed to update you about a particular case and only the Inspector allocated the case can tell you anything. You have to leave the Inspector a message to contact you if you want any info at all no matter how small, so I have left 14, yes 14, messages for the Inspector who still has not replied to any! I have only found out that the RSPCA have attended once and have said there's nothing they can do as the Chow has food and water because the Police have told me! The Police for once have been quite helpful with information and have advised me that the RSPCA are 'known' not to be the most organised, quick and competent of organisations. I cannot argue with this as my experience with them now and in the past match that discription. It appears we need Rolf and a camera & crew!
I have also contacted Chow Chow Rescue who have my number and will contact me if they can think of anything but there's nothing they can do or suggest.
I've spoken to my council, Spelthorne Borough Council, who don't even have a dog warden! I thought it was a legal requirement to have one but when I looked into it there's a loop hole some authorities use by allocating an Environmental Health Officer to deal with dog issues and by doing that they're legally covered!
I've spoken to a friend of a friend who knows somebody quite high up in the RSPCA who will try to push things forward.
I've even tried to find an organisation/activist group but obviously they don't advertise!
I find it amazing that in 2008 this wonderful country, supposedly a nation of animal lovers have not got the powers to protect and stop known acts of cruelty to animals which we are 'labelled' to love so much. Dealing with this dog I have discovered that allegedly the 40 horses that were found recently in that appalling state were being reported to the police and RSPCA for just under three years!!! If true (which wouldn't surprise me) is frightening.
I will post any news as/if I get it and as before any ideas or suggestions just let me know you never know what could help, thank you X

Have you managed to get hold of the Environmental Health Officer that is supposed to cover dog warden duties.  Surely this might come under the clean neighbourhoods rules, if not welfare?  Clutching at straws here.

I wonder if we all left messages with the Inspector they may get their act together and go and sort it out ;-)

Oh how awful :-(
Know what you mean about the RSPCA, ive reported someone before but (without boring you with details) they said the circumstances were fine because the animal had access to food and water. I mean, the fact it was being used as a punchbag, NEVER exercised and lived outside in all winds and weathers was obviously not an issue to RSPCA.
How can they accept a Chow living in a van is OK?!!!
Im afraid if it were me i would be inclined to step in myself and take matters into my own hands.
You've gone down the legal route and done things by the book but its's getting you no where. Would you or someone you know be prepared to do this? Where do you live? I'd happily give you a hand :-)

Maybe contact your MP ask him/her to write to Police, Council and RSPCA asking why the law is not being upheld. Good luck!

Please be careful before taking action yourself - apart from the obvious danger you put yourself in you could be open to charges of criminal damage - perhaps a newspaper of some sort might like to feature the story.

Maybe one of the tabloids read by the masses.... you just call the news desk and see if they are interested....

Maxine

I know this post will upset a lot of people and i'm sorry for that but I need to pick a few more brains of people who may know how to advise me. A local, stupid, ignorant young man who still lives at home with his parents has recently taken on a 2 year old Chow. His parents will not allow the dog in the house so the moron is keeping it in the front of his small escort van!
well I'm not upset...I'm in too much shock to be upset! I read all you posts and I just can't believe what I'm reading!

Upset about what people are saying or the poor dogs situation ?

heck... my post is inclear?

sorry....okay... TRANSLATION.:I mean it is too shocking to be upset!

I wasn't making a majorly worth responding to in any way type of comment....  just stating my  shock.

Sorry Maxine, forgot to state that I've tried that one, thanks anyway.

Any update on the situation ?

Hi

have you managed to progress this ?

Such a horrid situation for the dog.  Absolutely horrid.

It amazes me that animal welfare agencies are not stepping in and doing whats right for the dog.  There is a difference between leaving a dog in a van overnight while at a campsite, compared to a couple months in a van where it cant even lay down properly.

Call the papers, write letters into papers and council members. 

This is such a shocking story, and TBH I thought the UK dealth with animal legislation laws better than Canada. 

But honestly, I wouldnt try to take possession of the dog at this point.  Unfortunately, you are doing all you can.  Hopefully what you are doing, will be enough to help get this dog out of this situation.

I'm with Freds Mum! I wonder how easy it would be for the dog to escape from the van, if say it was unlocked somehow??

Sometimes you do just have to take the law into your own hands. I've done it before now and would do it again, and I bet loads of people on this board could admit to the same! Anyway, when you're faced with the authorities who could help but won't, or who are totally impotent, what else can you do?

K

it will soon be too sunny to keep a dog in a vehicle safely :(