Hi

I was wondering if there was anybody would had experienced a problem my sister in law is having with her 10 day old puppies, or anybody who may be able to offer any advice for her or help

Her bitch had 10 healthly puppies 10 days ago, all seemed to be going well until yesterday morning (sunday) she noticed 2 of the had upset tummies, as the day went on it got to the stage where is was just 'squitting' out of them as they slept. Then a 3rd one came down with it, then there seemed to be like blood mixed in with it, so she seperated them from the rest of the litter and phoned her vet, the vet suggested she bring them and mum down to her which she did, the vet thought that it may have been something mum might have eaten that had upset the puppies tummies and she gave ur some saline and told her to keep them away from mum for the next few hours and let it pass through mums system.
By 9pm last night the pups were getting worse so she phoned the vet again and the vet gave her some glucose for the pups and told her to give a mixture of that and the saline to the 3 poorly ones and seperate them fromt he others over night and to review the next day. She had to administer this throughout the night at 15 minute intervals. This morning 2 of the 3 pups started to feed off of mum again but still with upset tummies. But within an hour she noticed that 4 more of the puppies now had upset tummies and to top it off one of the pups from last night would not nurse from mum. She phoned the vet again who said to bring the pups down with mum again, so she took them all down to the vets and they ran a test on the pups and ruled out 'parvo', but also said that she now doesnt think this is something mum has eaten.
The vet kept mum and all the pups there today and administered saline, glucose and antibiotics to both mum and pups, but now the puppies have started to be sick too. She was told to come and collect the pups at teatime and to just keep adminstering the saline, glucose and antibiotics to those who wont nurse and just the antiobiotics to the ones who will. The vet also told her the future is not looking rosey.
I just wondered if there was anybody who had experienced anything like this before and might have some advice or ideas for her, she is so upset bless her and she doesnt know what to do next, she does trust her vet but you never know if somebody somewhere might know something.......
Thank you x

I am sorry to hear about these poor puppies. I am keeping everything crossed that the outcome is good for these babies. There is a topic of FAO on here about fading puppy syndrome. It may be worth having a read of this though I am not implying that this is FPS.
Has the mum been near any stagnant water? I ask as may years ago I knew of a lady whose pups were very poorly with similar symptoms. It transpired that they dam had been running in the owners field, there was an area that was flooded. The bitch was carrying a water borne campylobacter (protazoa) that the pups picked up when they were feeding. From memory they needed intese antibiotic therapy plus a small dose of panacur daily for 2 weeks. My memory is that they all survived this but they were slightly older than these wee ones.
I do hope the outcome for these wee ones is a good one.

How are the puppies today?  Was the bitch given the Canine Herpes Virus vaccination on mating and again just prior to whelping? Have you changed mums food at all recently - what are you giving her?  Has she got the 'runs' too?  Fingers crossed all is well and pups doing ok.

Goldie I am sorry to hear about the puppies.  I read a few months ago about a remedy which helps a lot with the problem of FPS.  I don't even know why this remedy helps to be honest and I don't remember which site it was but I do remember it was a reputed breeder  and that there were many examples of where it had helped.  It is however a case of feeding the bitch a little beef liver.   I suppose this boosts the energy of the bitch which logically then boosts the energy of the pups.  I would try everything possible if I was in this situation so try to suggest trying this one too.

Hi again

Well Im pleased to say puppies have made it through the night..........we are keeping all fingers and toes crossed !!!

No mum has been fine, there hasnt been a change of food, she has been feeding mum on all her normal stuuf plus cottage cheese and some goats milk but that hasnt changed since pups have been born, she did say she gave her some pasta the other night with a carbonara sauce on it and at first the vet thought it might be that but now the vet is saying its not, so who knows !!
She did have the bitch swabed at the start of  her season and an infection of some sort was found so she put her on a course of antibiotics, also about 4 weeks into the pregnancy she had a discharge which wasnt a normal colour and i think if i remember rightly had a bloody tinge to it, we wondered if she was aborting the pups but she put her on another course of antibiotics just incase, we couldnt believe it when she had 10.
But i have looked on the internet and there wasnt but information about pups with upset tummies but i did find something about some bacteria and ecoli and it being passed to the pups during birth and the mother cleaning them, and yes she does swim in a local stream that always make the dogs stink when they come out of it, so maybe that is a possibility......
The results from the vets is going to take another 2 days or so x

I was given a recipe for a porridge type food for mum which I gave to my bitch and she loved it - I'm not too sure about cottage cheese etc.  Please PM me if you would like recipe.

I was wondering about this situation as I may be wrong but Fading puppies tend not to suffer sickness etc unless someone tells other wise:-)

Sometimes nobody gets to the bottom of a sickness bug , the pups are just so fragile at this age.

If the puppies remain on anti biotics ensure the vet gives something for their little tummies as antibiotics alone in little pups can cause them to he loose and often constipated.

You can get a thing called k-biotics or similar for them to take with it. it settles the tummy.

I have found in the past it is good to take Mum off for a day and feed the pups some "Lectade" which contains everything they need to keep going for 24 hrs. Then introduce Mum back gradually over the next 24 hrs. Give her a good wash first and make sure she is dry before putting her back and keep her out of standing water...well any water at the moment..most of it is not standing just now!! Feed them as much Lectade as they will take as it is good for dehydration too. They loose fluid very very fast with D&V and need to replace it constantly. I had a litter once..admittedly a little older at 3 wks and they had terribly D&V but I just kept the water bowl full of Lectade and they drank buckets off it and within 24 hrs were pretty much back to normal. The Vet thought it could have been somethin in the puddles that abounded at the time even though I washed Mum down after her walks. Some things are just not seeable...but it pays to be very vigilant after walks and a real good wash down is needed.

Merlot, this is the type of bacteria that I was posting about earlier. It is horrible and the poor pups that have it stink to high heaven with their v&d. I know it becomes prevelant in flooded areas, stagnant water etc. Agree I wouldn't take the dam out at all apart from in the garden to do her business and give her a wipe down after that too. As the pups are so delicate I wouldn't be allowing anyone to visit or touch them and also don't worm them until all the v&d is clear. letade is brilliant and both adults and pups adore it. Good luck with the wee ones.

Cleanliness in the whelp box is also vital I use parvo-viroside ( kills everything) making sure it is completely dry before putting puppies back in, I also fill a bucket with P-V and throw it on the front step and drive plus I keep a mat continually wet so that no-one can walk in bugs , I also swill the dog area in the garden  with it so that she doesnt walk bugs back into the puppies. I make everyone entering  the the puppy room use a hand gel and I clean the door handles down with a cloth that has been soaked in the parvo-virocide.
May seem a little extreme but puppies safety are my main priority.

Hi again

I just wanted to say thank you to you all for your posts and advice it has been great, I have passed all the information to her and she has taken all of it onboard,

But something I did want to say is she has not been out since the pups were born apart from in her own garden, but I did wonder whether the infection she had when she was swabbed at the beginning of her season could perhaps have been caused by stagnant water ?? I know it was treated with antiobiotics and another course midway through the pregnancy, but i did read something on an australian website last night about bacteria in the vagina and it can harbour ecoli etc and I wondered whether this could be a factor, it said about the pups contracting it through birth and then from the mother cleaning herself and then the pups and them catching it via the umbilical cord ??? I may not be making much sense as such but it was gone midnight when i read it and i think i had a bit of information overload by that point !!!!! 
Much of the websites i read last night did mention FPS but not the upset tummies as symptoms as such, those symptoms kept coming up as a sign as parvo, but as we know this has been ruled out. I will also say that while the puppies were at the vets for the day yesterday she spent many hours disinfecting and cleaning everywhere and washing bedding etc etc.

Pups are still hanging on in there though at the mo, but they look like newborn pups rather than 11 day old ones, bless them xx

I hope they pull through a very worrying time for the owner.

I had a similar experience a few years ago - it was def related to the dams milk, suspect toxic milk. Dams 2nd litter, first litter no probs. Vet took samples from pups who were just scooting the most vile smelling poop, I took them home. Vet reckoned I'd be lucky if 50% survived. Pups were taken from her, handreared for 48 hours, fluids subQ. Started to look much better away from dams milk. Luckily for me firstly I have hand reared a litter before (from birth to weaning) so had an idea what was needed and secondly the dams daughter had a litter just a few days older so added them to her smallish litter. They came on leaps and bounds. Nothing particular showed up in the poop samples which took a week to come back anyway. All survived after 2 days in my intensive care boxes, the down side was of course the dam was terrible distressed and had to be sedated and given galastop to dry up her milk but it was obvious that there was something very wrong with her milk..

Hi There Goldie glad to hear the pups are battling on Please get them on Nutri Drops ASAP -

Petmeds Helpline Tel 0800 0430848
http://www.petmeds.co.uk/Nutri-Drops
Nutri-Drops
This is an immediately available source of glucose, B vitamins, amino acids, Vitamins A, D & E, and trace minerals. This process causes an intermolecular phenomenon to occur between each of the ingredients and the energy base. This allows the energy base to become an effective mainline carrier of the essential nutrients directly to the bloodstream of the animal. Pet Nutri-Drops is a superior combination of balanced glucose, vitamins, minerals and amino acids.  These nutrients support life and are needed quickly to restore a crippled or non-functioning immune system.   
Food and supplements normally require 8-14 hours for digestion.  Nutri-Drops is the first and only supplement that does not require digestion.  It shunts directly to the bloodstream in minutes, quickly restoring the immune system while other sources of nutrition are still in the digestion process.
Measurable in the bloodstream in minutes
50% uptake in 30 minutes
Nutri-Drops is indicated in any condition where additional energy and nutrients are needed to support normal metabolic function and normal Immune System activity
Also available from Canine Chemists http://www.hyperdrug.co.uk/prodinfo.asp?number=9020777
Tel; 01833 641112

A MUST for anyone with Pups no one should contemplate a litter without this in your Whelping first aid kit
and please keep us all posted on the Pups & Dam's progress

Hi all

firstly I would like to say a big thank you for all good wishes and your advice, it has been fantasic x

Now for an update, mummy and pups are doing well, all pups are still alive and are all on a course of antibiotics, they are now back feeding from mum and are starting to gain weight again which is fantastic, it was a long few days of hand rearing and giving medication and glucose etc etc but all are feeding, they still have loose bowel movements but no where near what it was and there is no blood loss now etc, we are still keeping fingers and toes crossed but they are moving around the whelping box again, seemed to have gained their energy back and hungry and wanting food again

We dont know if we are out of the woods yet but hoping and praying we have turned a corner and starting the road to recovery

Thank you all again, everyone of you, all of the advice has been amazing !!! 

xxx

Thats great news!!!!!  Its so worrying when very young pups are not well and you are struggling to feed every couple of hours day and night.

Good that they are now, once again, feeding off mum, they should come on leaps and bounds now. Give them all a big cuddle from me.

Mine are all away to their new homes and I am missing them so much.

Hello I have had the same thing with my puppys they are only 3 weeks old now but I have had very close contact with a breeder who advised me to give the pups a small bit of organic natural yoghurt just off the end of your finger before each feed and this helps to settle tummys this worked wonders!! plus the blood in the poo is usually because the pups are loose they make there selfs sore and sometimes it makes them bleed.
I no longer have faith in many vets as when this happened to mine they tried telling me to give up on my pups ,
Hopefully they will make a full recovery

You must be so pleased there is such improvement. You'll struggle to part with the puppies when theyre ready to go to new homes. Really pleased for you.x

How are the little ones doing now?  Hope they are still doing ok.