i've seen them listed as a breed in a couple of places, i just thought they were not kc recognised in the uk. forgive me if i'm wrong on this and please correct me but do the kc not take a while (with i'm sure considerable campaigning by breeders/owners) to recognise a breed? (eg, breeds from other countries that are being imported). does the american kc not fail to recognise the german spitz? i thought that it's only quite recently that the uk kc recognised the tibetan mastiff etc. (again please correct me if i'm wrong). the utonogans are a nice looking dog, i can see why they like it but are they mad? no offence to sledding breed owners, infact deepest respect as are they not a HUGE amount of work? i walked a husky once, never again! they are so strong!

They are not recognised by any National Kennel club.

Tibetan Mastiffs etc have been around in their countries of origin for a long time and are recognised by other Kennel Clubs in countries where they have had a presence for many years.  Northern Inuits/Utonagons (and their various aliases) have only been around for about 20 years in this country....not long at all in the evolution of a breed and far too soon for KC recognition.

I dont think they were expecting there german shepherd to jump a stable door to get to the bitch 

Why?  I wouldn't be at all surprised at a German Shepherd doing that.  I had to pop out for half an hour once.  I left my male GSD indoors, and my GSD bitch in a cage in my barn which was padlocked.  I came home to find my male had broken an upstairs window (I live in a small cottage.....upstairs isn't very high) jumped out....broken my barn door and moved the cage that my bitch was in.  My fault entirely.  He should never have been left with a bitch in season....thankfully he didn't get to her, and luckily he didn't have a mark on him. 
Expect the unexpected......

That is why I don't have a male on the premises.  I do not have the facilities to ensure they can be kept apart. 

The male I own in partnership is safely 100 miles away :D  When the resident bitches (mostly his daughters) are in season there are facilities to prevent accidents.

I am sure these people mean well, but these are excuses, first you do everything possible to prevent accidents, spaying would have been first choice in this instance with a rescue, then proper vigilance if they got caught with an unexpected season, not only could their own male have gained access to the bitch but any other too.  Then when a mating had taken place the bitch could have had an injection or been spayed. 

Fortunately in this instance the breeders are being responsible for the pups, but will this last for the next 13 years, hopefully if they have homed them well it won't be tested, but it is rare for a whole litter to stay in their original home for life. 

I wonder if they have permanently identified the pups to ensure they could be traced back to them if in years to come they end up in rescue?  Buyers loose track of breeders, or are too embarrassed to go back to them to admit they have failed and put dogs in rescue without letting the breeder take their responsibilities.

goodness me, randy randy boy!

OMG:rolleyes:, I wasn't insinuating that they are bad parents at all or that the children will be attacked, i wouldn't do that as i don't even now them, but what i was insinuating is that these dogs are not the sort to take on lightly, they are very head strong dogs and need proper training, once trained to a high standard they may actually make a good dog.

im not sure how many times i have to say it was an accident, but will say it again just to be on the safe side!

it was an accident, she didn't get a male and female and think ooo puppies, she got a male, 2 years later rescued a female from a show..... they mated and now leo is here! and the mum has been done, so no more litters :)

as for the "will they have a forever home" can you guarentee that with ANY pup?? if that was the case then no breeder should breed, regardless of orgin or reason unless they were keeping all the puppies!

Nugga, it did read that way by the "i sense another news story" why else would it be in the news?

I think you need to get of your high horse!! I didn't insinuate that children were going to be killed, i was simply stating that if it hit the headlines which could mean as in biting another dog, growling at something/someone, or out of control for what ever reason, the media seem to get hold of these kind of stories the breed maybe dragged through the dirt. This is a forum for help, so far everyone has tried to help you and you've just come back with negativety and not actually taken any of it on board. Everyone has different opionons and its nice for people to put there's across so you get a better picture of the whole scenario.

What I am saying is there are things that can be done about accidents.  so there is very little need for any accidental mating to result in puppies unless the owners were totally unaware it had happened.

No we cannot guarantee homes will be lifelong that is why no one should breed unless they are prepared to take back and re-home any pup at any age. 

To make even more certain of this many tattoo or microchip them so their pups can be identified even years later.

Mobby,

You are happy with your Leo and where he came from and that is all that matters accient or not.

I think that this debate has been turned around at some point and is totally off the original post!

Well done for trying to dissuade your friends from taking on this puppy but there is only so much you can do without becoming a bully!:rolleyes: