Basically I have insurance which covers both my girls.
The problem is my vets require payment up front for any treatment they need regardless of how much it costs.
My question is, is it normal for vets to charge you first then for you to claim the money back from your insurance?
I say this because my pockets are not bottomless pits and I got insurance to pay for things shoud the worst ever happen.
It was my impression that as long as you are covered by insurance you vet will simply claim straight from the insurance company rather than their client.
I really need to know if this is common practise, if not i need to consider changing my vet
Im not trying to sound cheap here but not all of us have spare hundreds or even thousands of pounds should anything ever happen
Any advice would be much appreciated :D

My vets won't accept payment directly from the insurers unless costs are more than £500, and then by approval only.  As a group practice they are well know for their ..er.."...financial astuteness..." :rolleyes:  However, my own vet who manages my local surgery is generally more relaxed about it. 

Because of this I took out a credit card that I only ever use for vet fees.  Fortunately, my insurers pay very quickly.

Yes it is common practice.. read the small print :) some vets do take a claim note as payment and fill it in on your behalf many dont and its pay up front..

I really cant understand why they do this
Im sure its very off putting for mere mortals for pet owners :rolleyes:

I think im just going to have to search around and find a decent vet that understands not everyone is a milionaire with money lying around.

JenP the credit card is a great idea but unfortunatly its not an option for me 

It is my understanding that there are only one or two insurance company's that the vets deal with direct. Insurance is there for you to reclaim payment. Instead of changing vets, change insurance company to one that your vet will deal with direct :)

Problem here is insurance companies either not paying up because the treatment isn't covered or taking months to pay out ! 

Some vets in my area will only deal direct with insurers by prior arrangement

I really cant understand why they do this

They are doing it so that they get their money sooner, can bank it sooner and get the interest on it sooner. My retired vet friend says that they are no longer a profesion but a trade.

My small animal vets always claim directly from the insurance company, we just pay the excess up front.

My equine vets are known for being very very strict about payment, and yet they still claim from insurance companies where people are insured.

Surely the point of insurance is that most people wouldn't be able to afford a huge vet bill?

I would find another good vet.

Im lucky my vet is a bit more relaxed about payment I do tend to pay as I go but when my GSD was ill and was having tests they said wait until it was finished and pay the final bill they also gave me the option of paying them and claiming on the insurance or they would do it direct and i just paid the excess this is what I did.

Another vet I used many years ago when I was having problems with my rabbits were really good and let me set up a direct debit and pay of the bill monthly.

I know my sisters vet wont treat unless they are paid. When she had her last litter the bitch was ill and rushed to the vet and spent the night on a drip. They would not allow my sister to take her out of the surgery until the bill was paid in full even though she had a litter of pups at home. We are talking a heafty bill as it was a out of hours weekend visit.

Wendy

I had a very similar, very upsetting experience.
I had been to the vets before and not paid when I collected the animal so when I went to pick Merlin up at the end of the day, I was not even thinking of payment as we were going to be going back few days later.
I was told I can't have him if I do not pay, they have changed their policy!
I had all my credit cards at home and they would not wait for me to go and get them(20 minutes), so he would have to stay there over the night.
But as a "good deed" from their side, I was informed I would not have to pay for the extra night, like I cared about that!

I was upset as surely the best place for him would have been home but accepted that he will need to stay...

Boy was I upset when at home and calling the surgery no one answered... All night...
I then realized there probably was no staffing there over night so he was left on his own with no care for over 8 hours!
(which I checked the next morning and this was the case and I have later found out does happen quite a lot, animals being left unsupervised)

Vet had told me (in the phone) how to care for him at home, of the need to give liquids every hour or so to keep him hydrated etc...
Suddenly this did not matter and he was just left!

Needless to say I did not sleep that night, I picked up my baby the next morning, PAID and have and never will be back!

Thats terrible!  

Shocking! makes me feel sick to read this!

Sadly unless the Vets you use have a hospital facility with staff on site 24/7 a dog staying in overnight will actually be left alone, so in most cases would be better off at home being watched by the owner until morning.

My vets usually require payment up front.  But with Soli needing x-rays very soon, the receptionist gave me an appointment with the head vet of the practice, I've explained that there is no possible way I can do it and he's fine about claiming direct from the insurers, so long as I pay the excess.  Which I can just about manage.

My old vets (in Kent) claimed direct without question, but the other lot I've dealt with up here (Lincs) were the same as my regulars, up-front payment first.  Pain in the rear, frankly, considering I'm earning a part-time wage and have a house and pets to pay for.

Unfortunately yes, which for many people rather negates the whole point of Insurance as they will have to find the money from somewhere in the meantime.

Generally, I pay my Vet up front, but when Lizzie had 2 big ops earlier this year, the 1st one was £900 which I paid the Specialist up front and claimed back, the 2nd was £2200 and this, the Specialist claimed for directly for me .........I also have to pay the Hydrotherapist up front for 12 sessions (£180) 4 at a time, before he will give me a receipt to claim it all back......

It depends on the insurance company - some are better payers than others, so the vet will be more willing to take the risk of a non-payout.

My two are insured by different companies and my vet ( who is extremely good ) claims directly :) All I do is sign the form and then they do the rest :)

the vets that I use make it clear they will not claim directly from any insurance company.
It completely defeats the object of having insurance!
They never used to do this so i can only imagine they have a few people not pay for treatment, which I do understand because at the end of the day its a business, there to make money.
I will be looking into finding someone else, I simply cant take the risk should anything ever happen

We are with PetPlan and our vets are more than happy to bill them direct, however I don't know if they do so for all insurance companies.

If you are a long term client many vets will also allow payment over a few months, it really depends on your relationship with your vet. ;-)

I don't disagree with you though Huskygirl, I also think that insurance companies should be billed direct and pay quickly there are many, many, people in the same boat who simply cannot afford to pay even a bill of £200 up front, very large bills I think most vets would not expect many people to be able to pay upfront in those cases they would wait for the insurance claim.

Trouble is if you are a new client at any vet, and especially if you should only have one animal registered with them, they are less likely to be helpful for fear of loosing out themselves. :-(

You may need to ask a good friend or relative to help you out until the insurance is paid up.

No matter who I insure my dogs with the vet lets me pay whatever I tell them is my excess and then wait for me to bring them in a claims form so they can claim back the rest.

But the clams form has options to pay me or the vet so it must be normal for people to pay the vet and then have to claim back the funds.   I'd guess if you told the vet you couldn't afford to do it that way though they would be reasonable. They can't refuse to treat a sick animal.

Whilst I understand that a vet is a business, they also have a moral obligation to care for the animal, and I am pretty sure that they are legally obliged to do so if not doing so would cause suffering or endanger the animals life. I know that farriers, for example (different, I know, but somethign I am sure of!) are legally bound to trim/shoe a horse if not doing so would cause suffering.

My vets (my friend is a receptionist there) do offer to take payment by installments if people can't afford treatment. Also, whenever I have an appointment, I always leave without paying, as my Fiance phones and pays with his debit card the same day. They never mind this.

i recently had an embarrasing incident to do with vets and insurance! my crested puppy fractured her leg paid my vet £500 for banaging, x rays and treatment. Unfortanlty it didnt heal and i was sent to see a specialist he put a plate in the leg. I asked them could they bill the insurance direct and was told no was given a quote of £1000 to be paid when i collected her. Increased my overdraft to £1000 and went to collect my dog. When i got there the bill was £1400. I explained i only had £1000 could they invoice me was told no. The rude receptionist asked me if i had a credit card or knew anyone with a credit card. I had to ring my husband to come from work an hour away and pay some on his card and the rest on mine. I felt really embarrased had to sit in the waiting room for an hour before they brought my dog out. As if i wasnt upset enough. Now she needs to go back for x rays and check up there is that cost to add on too!

Sorry big email but wanted to agree its no good! off to order a credit card.

joby thats appaling ! like people wander around with that kind of money spare, they should have made sure you knew the cost before you arrived. madness. what other business charges you that kind of amount in one go?

My vets used to deal direct with the insurers but they now want payment up front.  They probably had to wait too long until the claims were settled.  However, they were very sympathetic when I had to get my cat put down and they just sent me a bill in the post with a 30 day settlement.

CG

joby that sound awful!!
And to top it off the receptionist was rude to you!!

Its lucky though that you had the money to pay for everything, if that was me there would have been no way in hell I could have afforded all that.
and thats exactly what I am worried about, i dont have money lying around, I dont have an overdraft nor could I get one, I dont have credit cards and I dont know anyone that could lend me a large amount of money without a garantee of when they could have it back

My vet has changed the way that they deal with insurance claims. They used to bill direct but, due to the length of time some companies take to pay out, will now charge £16.50 to the client if they wish the claim to be paid to the vet by the insurers. If I pay the bill and then claim it back from my insurers they complete the insurance claim form free of charge.

They do not give credit under any circumstances at all - all bills have to be paid before you leave the surgery.

When Maddie was really poorly, and she had to stay there, I ran out of the vets crying. Never thought to stop and pay. The receptionist phoned me when I got home to remind me I hadn't paid. I was very upset and annoyed by this but I had only been there a couple of times before and only for vaccinations etc. I went in the next day to collect my girl and pay. Now they are more 'sympathetic' and as I have never not paid straight away since, when she had to have nearly £2000's worth of treatment, they gave me time to borrow and continued with treatment anyway. I got it all back within two weeks of a claim :)

On another note. When Maddie suffered bloat on holiday in Devon, I had to pay £350 up front before they would operate :( they said they had been left with dogs before when payment was high, people never collecting their dogs!! As it was the very start of our holidays I just dipped into the holiday fund

I agree it totally defeats the object of getting your pets insured. Our vets deal firect with direct line and petplan but won't for any other insurance company. My old vets (in the uk) were fantastic and nothing was too much trouble and they always "talked" to our old dog, our new vets just treat you like a money machine and try to flog us more and more products every time we are there!

I have only just taken insurance out for 2 of mine so dont know what my vets would do with that.
But when I had to take Beano in at 9pm on a friday night as I thought he had a blockage they gave him an injection and some rimadyl and I expected to have to pay then and there. But they invoiced me the next week :)
I used to have an account with them where I paid at the end of the month but they stopped that about 8 years ago.
The other weeks I had picked up and paid for Gemmas medication, but got a bill 2 weeks later for it. Rang them and it had been put on the wrong system LOL
Last month Gemma needed a blood test, and I wasnt 100% sure I had enough money in my account. And jokingly said if my card got refused they wouldnt hunt me down.
The receptionaist and vet both said, nah your a regular we know you will pay :) :)
So there are still some god vets around :D :D
Lea :) :)

My vets claim the insurance companies direct. All you have to pay up front is the excess :) Maybe you should call around and see if there is another local vets that will offer this?

as long as its agreed up front with my vet they are ok with any arrangement. paying a bit each month will incur a £4.95 charge.

i moved from a vet who wouldnt claim direct. a big bill can cripple most people and an unsypathetic vet is the last thing you want with an ill pet.

small bills i pay straight away but anything over £100 then its direct.

nice man my vet

We have a very unsympathetic vet!

The Royal Dick Veterinary College (I spend too much time there ) require you to complete a form, and you MUST give credit/debit card card details... they automatically bill the credit card company 14 days after treatment.

I think a lot of referral centres, if not all, are very strict about payment.

The Royal Vetinary College claimed directly from my insurance which was much appreciated because the bill ran into several thousand pounds.

My (new ish) vets are lovely, and will sort the claim out with my dogs insurers direct..

However previous vets were BL**********DY awful.

Would not deal direct with insurance.

The worst experiences though were with my elderly (and uninsured as i got her too old to make insuring her worthwhile or even that easy to do at all)..Saluki x.

We had a horrible incident with a foster dog and the upshot was Abby had large tears over her neck, shoulders and throat, one of these was a triangle shaped tear from behind her ear to down over her shoulder...blood, as you can imagine, everywhere.

Ring my vets, am directed to their out of hours practice which is always open (so not a call vet out and meet them there job)..

Get there with two bleeding hounds and am then informed that they wont treat until i pay up a min. £50..

Its 11pm on a sunday right at the end of the month, i don't have £50.. I am registered to this practice, one out of the two dogs is losing a LOT of blood, its quite clearly an emergency and the dog is going to require follow up treatment at my local surgery.. im hardly likely to do a runner.

No joy. I had to borrow from someone in the waiting room and try out three different cards to find all of it..

They take her in and then the next bombshell.. ive got 18 hours to find £200.. or not only will they keep her, but they will charge £20 a night to do so until i find the money...

Now, very fortunately i have some exceedingly good friends who sorted me out.. the bill the following morning was actually over £300 which whilst i dont think was particularly excessive... was considerably higher than quoted (and she had at that point been very thoroughly examined).

I dread to think how they would treat someone who WASNT registered with them...

Then on one of the many trips back to sort out Abbys injuries, remove stitches etc (she was like a patchwork dog).. i requested that a small triangular bit of skin be snipped off so it lay flat, as it was sticking out on her neck and being a thin skinned hound she was catching it..

Yes.. but theyd have to have her in all day for it. I argued that it was a five minute job, jab, snip, staple, done..

Abby is a very very neurotic old hound and staying in at the vets even for one day (even just a VISIT to the vets..) stresses her out so her heart rate rockets and she loses several KG, wees herself, poos herself... the list goes on, she aint a happy hound.

So i finally got them to allow me to be there with her and booked a triple length consult at the end of the mornings consults.. first time the cancelled at the last minute. Ok, maybe an emergency came in.. second time they cancelled on me when i was IN the surgery.. no emergency came in that time.

Third time they kept me waiting (and i could see both vets from where i was, neither was doing more than drinking coffee or reading magazines) for nearly two hours (i even overheard one of them saying 'oh shes still waiting she hasnt given up then, spose we'll have to...)!!!!... and then, sighing pointedly and tutting, brought out a form for me to sign about a bajillion pages long about them being completely not liable if anythign went wrong due to me being present..

And after all that and them banging on and on and on abou thow they just cant do these things with owners present... the op took 3 minutes, Abby stood still and didnt panic, all perfectly simple.

After that i voted with my wallet and went elsewhere... i can of course appreciate that often clients may ask to do things in a way that isnt suitable or safe, i wasnt asking for that. I do also appreciate that people do run off and leave vets without paying them.. even so, i felt their behaviour was bang out of order.

Oh, interestingly for those who posted on this thread saying their vets want payment or they will withold the animal... this is what the RCVS says about it..

"Holding an animal against unpaid fees

17.  Although veterinary surgeons do have a right in law to hold an animal until outstanding fees are paid, the RCVS believes that it is not in the interests of the animal so to do, and can lead to the practice incurring additional costs which may not be recoverable. This right should therefore only be exercised in extreme cases and after discussion with the RCVS.

"

Certainly, my case, as a known client to the practice with many animals registered, and im sure the other couple of people who have mentioned this same thing on here, are NOT 'extreme' cases..

Fortunately my new vets are horrified at the very idea of doing such a thing (and ditto to refusal to treat an emergency case for a registered client until money is produced).

When Jozi had rampaging Mastitis come upon on Boxing Day in just a couple of hours despite the usual hot flannels etc, I was warned by the out of hours surgery that is a vet hospital with staff there 24/7 that it would be £200 or more just to come through the door and I should bring it with me.

My own Vet of course following up said oh sort that out at the end.

AAAGH!!!!!!!!

My insurance company Pet Palls, I arrange my insurance through VIP  to make sure I always have the right cover, just decided not to pay out!

My dog was suspected to have eaten something and was showing the symptoms to indicate this was a problem and so was investigated for a soft blockage and taken in for ex rays. Noting showed up but she later passed a big clump of dog hair which might have been causing the problem and after that she was perfectly fine again. 

They say she had this medical condition before I insured with them back in March and they decided to exclude her for all digestive system problems.  She had eaten things as a pup and I had taken her in to have get checked out just to be on the safe side but she was never ill for more than a day or two in her life!  I hadn't realised that was a medical condition and I have taken her before as preventative action to be safe rather than sorry and only one time was a small claim made because the visits to the vet did not reach the level of my excess. .   They say because of her past history  she is excluded from all digestive system and any related problems.



Is that normal procedure?   It seems like that means she isn't insured for most conditions  cos being sick is frequently one of the first indications that something is wrong? I changed my insurance policy last spring when I got a pay rise to upgraded the cover they get so my insurance pay almost £40 a month for two dogs. But it seems I actually pay twice the cost but get less cover!    so I cancelled it if the cover isn't worth anything. My other dog once had a claim for an accident  before he was insured with this company so they might decide later he isn't covered for accidents. too.

Insurance now they charge so lot but offer back so little! It should give peace of mind! But apparently not.

My vet at least say they will fight it and  I can pay back the £300 in installments. 

Anyone know any good insurance companies?

Having to pay up first is the norm really... I am lucky in that my vet accept payment directly from the insurance and he also lets me pay uninsured larger vet bills as and when...

I also never pay for emergency appointments on the day, so I know I don't have to worry about finding the money when I am already worried about my animal!

I am very lucky with my vets.

Vera

dont use my insurance company am in a similar position, just posted on your other thread!
good luck,
am defintly thinking along the lines of putting the money in a saving account. Ive never claimed on my first dogs insurance and she is nearly three so in theory ive paid £900 for piece of mind! my second dog ive only paid two months premiums and they arnt going to pay out so i expect any further conquences of her broken leg ie arthritis, infectione etc they will link to the broken leg and wont pay out on that either!

It is so frustrating!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hello HG

In answer to your original question: yes, I think it is common practice for vets to want payment from the client - for the reasons given above: insurers may not pay out possibly leaving the practice with the debt, insurers may only pay out partly, there is the question of the excess, insurers may quibble and take a long time to pay and yet the vet will still have to pay all their suppliers on time.

To give you your best chance of a good outcome with the vet I would suggest that you

1.  Establish a good record with them by paying promptly for routine treatments and whenever else you can afford it.

2.  In the event of some huge expense giving you a problem, speak to someone about it immediately, explain your difficulty and ask if they would be prepared to wait until the insurance claim is settled.

3.  If they have a problem with this (and my vet would not if the client had previously been a good payer) offer to pay a small amount immediately and then say what you can afford to pay each week and stick to any agreement that you make regarding instalments, until such time as the claim is settled.

4.  Obviously change vet if you are with someone as unreasonable as the stories given above, but be careful about changing otherwise - you might just lose the trust and good will that you have built up with your current practice and end up in a worse position.

And at the end of the day, I think vets are more likely to use a debt collector than hold animals to ransom and they would not waste time and money sending a case to the debt collector if they know an insurance settlement is on the way.

Here's hoping it never happens.  :-)

Hi Lillith

Just to clarify the OP is not HG (Liv) as she has been offline for a couple of months. She has asked me just to let you know to make sure there is no confusion as she can view at work but not post :)

She has said she will be back on line soon :)

Lucy
xx

my vet recommend pet plan,who i am currently with but am thinking of changing to tesco or argos when his 6 wks free plan is up.altho the vets recommend pet plan they still expect full payment before animal is taken,even tho it states on the notice that pat plan generally pay up in a week.i just dont understand this,its madness.i really dont know what id do if i was put in this situation.

i had a rabbit before i got my dog,and one of the dayas i got home and he hadnt eaten for a couple days...when i picked him up he was limp,and i put him on the floor to have a run around and he just wouldnt move,he was very very lively normally.i was absolutely devastated,and so i took him to the vet with my friend absolutely balling my eyes out and when they said he had to be put down,i stayed with him and i was hysterical.he was only 2.in my rush id forgot to pick my bag up and sp when i went to the counter i asked them to send a bill (my friend said theyd done this for her before).they said i couldnt do it,their policy had changed,but theyd give me til the end of the day to pay,which i did n(and picked him up to bury at the same time,because they added a ridiculous amount for them to cremate him).they were really nice about it but it was for only a small amount of money tho,so i dont know whatd happen if it was more.

i understand theyre worried bout not getting their money,but its annoying for us honest people who would pay up.its the 1s that dont,and mess the vets around that ruin it for us all.

Cheers, Lucy, I should have noticed that it was girl not gal.  :-)