ok, my best friend is desperate and I really dont know what i can say to help, so thought you good sensible folk might have soem general thoughts i can put to her.
Scenario, she has been with her chap for 8 years, living in his house, they have never married. From day1 she has wanted marriage/family....for the 1st 4 years he worked mainly away from home (which she hated) but he always said he was doing it for them and their future, so she accepted it.
Now 8 years down the line he refuses to discuss either marriage or children. She adores him but hes the most stuborn chap imaginable. hes very kind and they own a number of dogs/cats which they are equally potty about and adore.
Shes now at the stage where she feels that she is like a longterm visitor in his house.......he refuses to even consider  a baby because he says they cant afford it...but hes in his late 40's and shes 29 and shes getting desperate. I suggested that she sit him down and tell him all this....that she explains how desperate she feels and that she feels their relationships going no where etc. She did this but he just shrugged and walked away! she doesnt want to leave him or their animals, but she s so unhappy because she feels she will soon have to leave him to look for the "mr right" who will give her a family.
so its a really hard situation and i cant think how i can help her other than to listen to her. Anyone got any bright ideas please??

Leave him as it sounds wouldn't like to bring children up in a relationship like they have and doubt that he will change ;)

I suggest she gives him an ultimatitium and if he comes up with some more lame excuses then get him to move out and then she can plan her future. Tell her don't let him wlak all over her as it looks like he has done it for the last 8 years or so ;)

You are clearly a lovely friend to her. She will need to make the desision her self but letting her talk it through with her will be what she really needs.
I can't offer anymore advise as I don't feel I have enough experience but just felt I needed to tell you how nice it would be to have a friend like you.
Wishing yo and your friend all the best.

Leave him, unfortunately she doesn't want to be in the position of grabbing Mr wrong because time is running out.

No-one can really afford children, and if he doesn't want to be a Father at 40 he never will.

Does he have any other children from a previous relationship?

She needs to talk to him again, and make it completely clear about what she wants.  It sounds a horrible position to be in, as much as she adores him now, she could well end up resenting him if she's desperate for marriage and children and it never happens.  I'd have to leave I think, but I can well imagine how difficult that would be.

It's good that she's got you to talk to :-)

If she is that unhappy then she knows herself what she has to do. She just wants someone to gently push her in the right direction. It sounds like she is asking for someone else to make the decision for her. Been there, done that. I was in a relationship that was going nowhere and gave ultimatum after ultimatum. In the end I left and everything has gone upwards. I can't believe just how unhappy I was in the relationship. Looking back the best thing I did was to walk out.

We had 6 dogs between us and I took 3 with me. I left my elderly spaniel behind as I knew she wouldn't be able to climb the stairs to get to my new home. That was one of the hardest things I've ever done.

no he has no children. As much as anything the dogs/cats are her worry as neither of them could really afford them if they were apart. its terribley sad, shes in tears  to me every week.....but i stayed with them a few days ago and they are just such a lovely couple together, this is the only thing that is causing the problem. I need a magic wand.!! The stupid thing is that about 6 months ago she had a false alarm and told him she thought they were pregnant, and he was genuinly thrilled once hed got over the shock!!!

Well if he was genuinely thrilled maybe she should have an accident, as maybe the actual planning of a family is the problem step for him, and he wants fate to take a hand.

Sorry but I take that back as dishonesty is no way to base a family on.  If he was thrilled maybe she needs to remind him of that fact, and that she wants a family.

.....but i stayed with them a few days ago and they are just such a lovely couple together, this is the only thing

Why on earth is she even thinking of leaving him then. :-(

Watching my own friends, I've seen how difficult it is to fnd someone that you can even get along with longterm, if this couple have lots in common and do get on well and are happy why leave to look for Mr Right, (babymaker) she may very well meet a load of ......... out there, we know there are plenty of those.

Men worry about finances, marriage to many is done purely for the female,  many men are happy knowing they are with someone, to be living together to them means they are a couple.

Sorry Brainless I know you had a prick of conscience about accidently getting pregnant, but in this case I would do it, why........... because this is a longterm commitment, they seem to have an otherwise good reltionship, he was happy in the end at a previous accident so is not going to walk out or finish the relationship,  so he will come to accept. Many of us worry about affording children, but we all do it and manage, men sometimes think too much!

As to the marriage thing, perhaps getting pregnant would push him to legalise things for the sake of a child re: upon his death, wills etc.

In relationships far to many people concentrate on the next stage, instead of sitting back and thinking but we are actually happy, marriage, fatherhood, it's all about the right person, someone you can laugh and share troubles with, someone who feels like your soulmate, if this is how she feels about him then she need not look anywhere else, she just needs to bring those things to him in an accidental and none pressured way. He doesn't want to plan these things, they are just going to have to naturally happen.

I know I'm being a bad girl suggesting it, but sometimes people don't know what they want until it is there. I think this couple will be fine.

I hope that they make it. :-)

Interestingly friends of mine have just had their second baby. 

The first they say was a happy accident. 

They had decided not to have children, and after nearly 20 years together their Birth control failed.  They realised that they wanted the baby, and he is now three and they have just had a little girl.

In some ways being able to plan our families means we can't get past all the doubts.

Seems to me that your friend has low self esteem!   She needs the confidence to walk away, this guy has got it all, a live in lover with no committment

You need to boost her confidence and she needs to walk away from this situation.

The woman always has to be the most loved in a relationship for it to be successful.
 

It depends whether her desperation for children is greater than her love for her partner. If she did decide to call it a day and move on there is still no guarantee that she would have children. She may not meet the right person to commit to having children with or she may simply not be able to have children - a fair few women can't :(

If she left and the above scenarios occurred would she regret leaving the man she has loved and shared her life with for such a long time - she not only would still be childless but also would no longer have him in her life.

If we all waited till we could afford babies then the human race would die out!

I do think sometimes that planning takes the fun and joy out of it all...that said i am a terrible planner and don't like suprises!:rolleyes:

Its a tricky situation the pull of wanting children is strong but she could leave and never meet "mr right" with whom to have children with!

Gosh there seems to be some anti men on here!! :d

From what you say they have a fantastic relationship and are really well suited.  I would be worrying that maybe he has some other worries maybe work related or financially related and that he may need some help.

It just seems that there's more to this and it looks as though they really need to sit down and talk, maybe with someone who is impartial?

My sister recently broke up with her boyfriend of 8 years,the big sticking point in their relationship was babies! She already had 2 kids from previous marriage aged 16 and 13.He desperately wanted a baby or two of his own,but there was no way she was going to start all over again with littleun's,cant say i blame her one bit!

He loved her more than anything,but just couldnt get over the baby issue and felt that he would resent her Later on,after it was too late for him to have kids.He was under the illusion that he would leave her and soon hook up with someone that would want to have babies straight away,unfortunately now he has realised this is not the case.They are both in their early forties,and most women have already had their kids by this age and wouldnt want to start over again with a new family.

Anyway the point is he bitterly regrets leaving and wants her back but she wont have him as she knows the baby thing will rear it's head again soon.

It just seems that there's more to this and it looks as though they really need to sit down and talk, maybe with someone who is impartial

Couldnt agree more. There must be more to it and maybe he is afraid to say for fear of losing her. Men are not the best, on the whole, at expressing their feelings, and she may not be telling the whole story herself, no one knows for sure what goes on in someone elses relationship. I don't believe in getting pregnant on purpose is right, or fair, to him or the baby. Both need to want a baby to cope with the lifetime commitment. If she feels she can't live without a child, she needs to make the decision as to if losing him and maybe not finding a new partner is worth it, and they both need outside help to talk their feelings through. Finding someone who genuinly loves you is hard enough, throwing it all away without some extra help seems such a shame. i would advise Relate, give them a chance.

I think there is more to it than this too.  Someone not a million miles from me was 'happily married' to all and sundry, but the wife did not want children, the husband did but decided to keep his wife he would let the matter rest and had resigned himself to being married to the love of his life and remain childless. 

Then an about turn with the wife, she met and fell madly in love with someone she worked with and although really upset for hurting her husband she left, became pregnant immediatley and is living very happily with their 3 year old and the love of her life.  It is a happy ending for the estranged husband too as he is now remarried and his new wife is pregnant :)

I believe not wanting a baby is more to do with not wanting it with the person this guy is with.  Sometimes it just doesn't work out like that, I suppose it's natural selection?

>It depends whether her desperation for children is greater than her love for her partner.

I think this is the big question she needs to answer. There is no compromise to be had, only she can make this huge decision, you can only be there to support her Sam.

I certainly would not suggest she got pregnant and hoped he came round to the idea.  That is totally deceitful and any relationship has to be built on honesty and trust.

a major part of the problem is that he would never talk to her about his feelings...or to anyonelse......a lovely bloke and we adore him, but is typical of his nationality and is a very basic "bloke" who has no place for being emotional or talking about problems....they are just for weak women!!
The only time he ever shows emotion is with his hunting dogs.....then he weeps buckets just remembering those that have died over the years!  its been good to hear other peoples take on the whole thing and certainly it hadnt crossed my mind that she may never meet "mr right" (she s a gorgeous, sweet, very intelligent and very funny  girl) or that maybe she couldnt even become pregnant. Food for thought and will gently pass on these thoughts to her in our conversation tonight.

Ahhhhhhhh,,,,but that 'special' bond, that 'thing' has little to do with looks size or shape :) She may search forever to find the love of her life, and regret losing what she now has....which is why i thought they could work it out another way. What do you think his reaction would be if he thought he would really lose her? Would that be greater than his fear (or whatever it is) of having a child, or is it that maybe he is not as committed to er as it looks? This is such a tough one for all concerned, I really feel for both of them and you Sam, as you are obviously fond of both of them.