Right, I'm not quite sure how to word the question.

Does anybody know what is the UK law in cases like puppy ("the product") being "faulty"?
What I'm looking is for example cases where somebody has bought a puppy that has then died soon after purchasing...
In a case like this what has been the breeders liability?
Or does the law say after the puppy has left the breeders anything could happen and it can not be proven where the illness etc came from?

Anybody have ideas where to look.
I tried googling but just did not know what words to use (being non-native speaker legal terms go over my understanding!)

It is really case law.  If it can reasonably be proved that the dog was already incubating the illness then I expect the owner may well have a case against the breeder, but if the dog simply became ill through no fault of anyone then no. 

Unless of course it was as a result of a condition that the breeder failed to take reasonable steps to prevent such as available health testing etc. 

Sadly good breeders have been found liable because the owners claimed to not have realised that HD was a possibility, even though the breeder had stock tested with good results, so ti seems to be a lottery.

have pm'd you

I agree with everything that Brainless has said, but to be honest if the pup has died only a short time after being purchased unless it has died via cruelty at the hands of the new owner, then personally I would give a complete and full refund this is how breeders should work.

No responsible breeder should ever want to sell a pup that dies for whatever reason shortly after being placed.

If this breeder is showing no interest and is basically saying hard luck, then shame on them! :-(

Don't all good breeders give 6 weeks insurance as the puppy goes to its new home so that the purchase price and any Vets' bills would be covered in an unfortunate situation like this?

;-)  Very true, and a well picked up point, which means really bad breeder not to have offered any insurance at all, if an older pup then the owner should have insured also. this would take care of the immediate financial issues, but.............

as a breeder I would still be showing an interest and knowing me my reputation would come first and I would most probably offer a pup if I were breeding the following year FOC, the devastation from a new owner would be my top priority.

I think that I would be frightened to breed the next year if I'd sold a puppy that had died shortly after it had left me - and I hadn't realised that it was ill. ;) :)

If it was the new owner's negligence that had cause the pup's death, then they wouldn't be getting another from me.  I've had a number or enquiries over the years from people saying that they've had a dog run over and they're looking for another.  I never have one available! ;)

I've had a number or enquiries over the years from people saying that they've had a dog run over and they're looking for another.  I never have one available! 


I'm with you there!!!

It's difficult not knowing what this pup has died from. If due to ill treatment or judgement from the new owner then I would be the one upset.

I think that I would be frightened to breed the next year if I'd sold a puppy that had died shortly after it had left me - and I hadn't realised that it was ill. 


Agreed, I also think I should not be breeding at all if that went un-noticed, which may well be the case here. :-(

But if say it had died after a bad reaction to injections or some other reaction unforseen, or illness that is nothing to do with the bloodline, after spending months of getting to know the owners and them becoming like family and knowing my pup had gone to a really good home, there is no way I could turn my back, we all try our best to find the homes for life for our pups, if these owners have gone through my assessment and were given a pup, then I would want a future pup to go to them too, if they were prepared to wait, if not I would certainly ask a breeder friend to pop them on their list and I would pay for their new pup, that is just me.:rolleyes: Bad press gets around quickly, even if the pups death is absolutely nothing to do with my breeding or the Dam or Sire it would still reflect.

Which makes me think this breeder is Mr or Mrs churn them out and grab the money.

I hope that the poster whether asking for a friend or herself has a satisfactory outcome.

Funny enough I had just such an enquiry from someone who had bought brother and sister from a pet store and then they had the bitch run over at 10 months, and wanted a replacement as the dog missed his sister.

I suggested they didn't want or need another pup but to put time into training this one to be really obedient so that when they did consider getting another in two years or so it would be well trained.

Thank you for your replies!

Hi
Sorry, Dont know about the law
but i bought a pup 3 months old from a breeder
came home it was sick
phoned the breeder who told me either travel sick (journey was 20 mins) or settling in
2 hours later sick again and had a fit
Breeder said it was fine before- when i collected him - he was fine playing with his brother
1/2 hour later another fit and foaming at his mouth
called an emergency vet and took him down there
they x rayed his stomach - all clear
he deteriated so quickly they put him on a life support machine while doing other tests
They diagnosed possible distemper
after 2 weeks they told me that Billy was stable still on life support and if he did pull through he would have neurological problems, and my bill so far was £600
I told  the breeder every step of the way and she told mne that she wouldnt be able to give me anything towards the bill
Billy was so drugged up - not getting any better i asked for him to be pts
the breeder refunded the cost of Billy,  but nothing for vets costs
i could have pursued it futher with legal action but agreed with the vets to pay off the bill monthly
I could'nt belive my bad luck
I bought Billy Sat and booked him into a vet for his puppy jab on Monday and was also going to insure him also on the Monday

Now i have another dog bought from a breeder from the Southern Border Collie club
i paid for his injections before i collected him (2 weeks after his jabs) and was given 6 weeks free insurance from the breeder which i continued when it expired. My new dog had also been hip scored and eye checked which this particular breeder always does with all her dogs

I personally would never get a dog without jabs and health checks and insurance (although it costs) i learnt the hard way

Regards
Helen

Puppies cannot be hip scored only the parents, which is what I am sure you meant, but readers may not :D

Many breeders myself included will not sell a part vaccinated pup, it either goes without or if it stays past 10 weeks gets both.

I suppose the breeder did discharge their obligations by refunding you the cost of the puppy, though I would have felt morally bound to pay cowards vet treatment, at least to the diagnosis stage.

The initial Puppy Insurance should not cost you anything as it is given free to breeders to encourage new owners to take up insurance and with the the most common cover starts from the moment you pick the pup up, but the breeder signs that the pup has shown no sign of ill health.

Obviously if it was incubating something that would be pre existing.

When she mentioned hip scores I assumed Helen had bought an older dog! :o

Thats an awful sad story. :( Poor little puppy. Your breeder was right in first thinking it could be travel, but what happened after, and so soon after coming home, was dreadful. Did the vet ever fin out what was wrong with him? You did the kindest thing at the end of the day. ((HUGS))

Your new puppy sounds lovely, just one thing....you do mean the parents were hip scored? Coz a puppy is to young, hip scoring is done from 1 yr old. I wish you every happiness with this new pup, you cartainly deserve it :) Your post goes to show the value of finding a puppy from a reputable breeder.

I can't believe the breeder did not give at the very least the money back.

Five years ago I had a litter.  All seemed fine and off they went to their new homes.  Unfortunately soon after two of them started showing worrying signs and sadly both had to be put down at around 18 months of age.  This was all due to some BLEEP breaking into my home when their mother was 5 weeks pregnant, the mother scaling a 7 foot garage and then falling off it.  Apparently 5 weeks into pregnancy is when the neurological side of things is coming into being and so the pups suffered neurological damage before birth.

Strangely the owners of one dog died one soon before her death and one soon after her death, but the other one I offered the money back.  Fortunately for me his vets told him that it was due to the above and he said that he loved her so much that he wanted another pup off me.  This boy is now three, from the same mother and fit and well and his owners totaly and utterly adore him.

At the very least I would want my money back

The poster says the breeder gave the purchase price back, but nothing towards vet expenses.

When I had my puppies last year they were all vet checked, innoculated and microchipped plus insured

How old were they when they left? Mine go between 7 and 9 weeks so there isn't time for the second vaccination. They're more than ready for the new experiences of homing by then. To keep them longer together would be detrimental to their development.

They were 12 weeks old and they are all well developed and fine.  After long discussions with my vet and the new owners this is what we decided to do

Is there a problem with letting part vaccinated puppies go to their new homes? I thought it just helped give them some immunity even though I tell the new owners not to let the pup out until the full course has been completed.Gail :) :) :)

Yes as more often than not the new owners Vet will start the vaccinations again from scratch as they are likely to use a different manufacturers vaccines.

With the growing evidence against over vaccination it simply isn't something I would risk.

Also as my pups spend their time with access to Mum right until they leave I always worry about maternal antibodies interfering with too early a vaccine rendering it inactive and the puppy unprotected until t gets it's boosters.

Vaccine can also be shed into the environment (putting at risk unvaccinated pups as most vaccines are modified live ones) so all the pups would have to be done together, so picking and choosing which pups new owners vets may use the same vaccine is impractical.

Brainless you beat me to it, was just going to add we used to part vaccinate our puppies but no longer do so as the problems caused, my vet uses the older vaccine which means pups can't go out til they are 14 weeks Vaccs at 8 & 12 weeks, most of the puppy owners vets used 8 & 10 weeks. Not worth the risk

Hi Gail, I used to part vaccinate my pups until one owner called me in a right state because their vet had refused to accept the vaccination and started all over again I felt that I had wasted my time effort and money on trying to do the best for the pup only for the vet to pump the puppy full of more stuff that it didn't need :( Like the others on here I now only give vaccinations to any pup staying longer than 10 weeks.

I know of someone who bought a puppy who died within days, not offered a refund, she took the breeder to court and the judge was very sympathetic but said because the breeder wasn't registered there wasn't much she could do
The breeder also made a statement in court to say she had had all her bitches spayed and wouldn't be breeding again, but has since had 3 litters

What's being registered got to do with it, yes maybe they didn't view the breeder as running a business so couldn't rule that they should replace etc, but certainly the sale of goods act applies surely?

I don't know Barbara didn't understand it myself, but the puppy owner done her best to stop this woman from breeding again, she didn't care about the money but wanted to try and make a difference