I've just got home from bringing Thomas (aged 8) home from school. Thistle was in the boot of the car. My 16 year old daughter wanted to let Thistle out of the boot-Thomas knew this, so he went to let her out (being spiteful, he isn't usually) -I told him to stop- he carried on - I told him to stop again, by this time he had half opened the hatchback, but thought better of it , so closed it again and banged Thistle (not very hard) on the head.
I was livid, how did I deal with it? Have a discussion about selfish and mean behaviour and how we should make sure we don't hurt other members of the family? No instead I smacked him round the head-there aren't I an awful mother. Of course I feel terrible now :-(
Jane

Jane ..it happens ...try not to worry too much ..the occasional smack will not scar a child for life.

On the odd time when I have lashed out (bad mother here as well see? ) I have apologised to the child afterwards and explained that *I* had lost my temper rather than reason with them ..and can they see how bad I was to do that ......and how their behaviour provoked it to a degree ;)

Makes them feel better as you have said sorry but makes them feel guilty for behaving like that

And dont worry

:)

Melody - Oldest child is now 27 and she isnt scarred for life from the smacks she used to get on odd times ..youngest child is 9 and now *knows* when he has pushed mum too far

Welcome to my world :D :D :D :D

Don't worry about it - he'll get over it and will have forgotten all about it in the morning.

Fiona
x x x

I hope thistle is ok :)

Thank you Melody and Fiona
I'm sure you're both right. Thomas didn't say anything he just looked at me with his big blue 'hurt' eyes. Of course I have since apologised.
He has now gone to a friend's house to play and I won't see him till I get back from work at 8pm. Thistle's fine. Thanks again
Jane

Thistle,

Touch wood I have not had to lash out very often but I do remember once my daughter keep at it all day and finally I grab her and smacked her butt about 10 times..she was screaming..

She behaved after that and I never smacked her again. I fetl awful. I ask her now if she remembers and she doesn't she is 12 and she must have been around 7 at the time.

It is hard but sometimes enough is enough...

Pam

don't feel bad about it ,It was over and done with quickly ( knee jerk reaction ) I think most of us would react the same way --I would --you're not horrible or a bad mother just a normal mother trying to juggle twenty things at once.better to have dealt with it quickly than to let it fester and brew into something bigger in a few days
liz

Hi Thistle when I was a child it was quite normal to be hit,an everyday thing in fact.
Nowadays its seems that we are not allowed to hit our children not PC as they say,When My oldest son Craig was about 9 we had A GSD called Dina she was a very well trained dog we used to go to dog training with her and she was lovely,one day Craig sporting his new doc martin boots asked could he go in the Yard to "train Dina" anyway I looked out of the window and he was kicking her like mad I calmly went out and sent him to bed,then in a split second I could see my dogs trusting face as he kicked her,I flipped and ran up the stairs and nearly knocked Craigs head off !! I completely lost it.
To be brutally honest I didnt apologise to him nor would I or why should I he was wrong and he was punished.He had another good hiding some years later too and he was 15yrs and nearly six foot tall the neighbour found it hilarious to see me 5ft 4inches dragging him down to street to my exhusbands house and fling him up the path :).(these were really the only times I hit him and yes it hurt me so much after)
But ask my son who he loves to Death and he will say His Mum, ask him who is best friend is and who is always there for him and who he can talk to anytime about anything and he will say My Mum he is 29 and 6ft 2in tall now and always has a cuddle for me when he visits
Dont feel guilty about the smack its life just look at mother animals they put there babies in their place and they are just doing their job being a Mum.

Jane

As others have said - welcome to the real world. I daresay none of us advocate smacking a child but sometimes it is a natural re-action to something. He'll survive - so will Thistle - but she might not have done - could have caught her much worse or even let her out and under another car.

Kids - why do we have them - one I can understand - but two or more!!! We must be mad:D :D :D

Pam n the boys

I've got 4 kids :-( / :-)
Jane

Jane ..I have 5 ranging from 9 to 27 AND 2 Grandchildren ....and who is the biggest baby of the lot I hear you ask?

HUDSON!

:D

Melody

Sorry youv'e had a bad afternoon, don't worry it will soon pass. Your anger was to protect a dumb animal that would have been it deep trouble had it retaliated. Sure your Son will soon forget, he's just found out that adults are not perfect and thats a good lesson to learn, sure he understands he went too far and hurt an innocent dog. Ja:)kie

Jane, you did exactly what my Mum would have done, though if we had been at home the deed would have been done to the legs or bum with a wooden spoon. At 46 I love my mum deeply and after Ian she is my best friend. Go reckon :-).

Ditto: big wooden spoon for me too :rolleyes:
I can only remember it happening once or twice, but when she went on the warpath, I always skittered in front of the oncoming storm. :)
Usually, afterwards, I think she was relieved that I acted "normal" once in a while. :D
toodles

Sara, most definitely well past time you got that sighthound and joined 'the sisterhood' :D :D!

Then I'd definitely have to put in a taller fence around the 6X12 ft back yard :rolleyes: It's currently just under 4 feet tall -- keeps my girls in just fine ;) :D I'm also here only for about another 15 months :)

Hi Thistle
You sound like a good mum and I am very sorry to say that you did make me laugh a bit. Hope you dont mind :D :) It is the sort of thing a lot of us mums might do, me included. A reaction at the time that is all. My daughter is 30 now and still loves me :D
Gina

Gina
I'm glad I made you laugh !!!
Sharon
I'm 46 too and my mum used to hit us with a wooden spoon too. It was a toss up whether you put your hands over your bum cos she'd smack your hands if they were there and your bony hands hurt more than your slightly less bony bum. However I still love my Mum to death and always have done-so a smack never did me any harm
Jane

We have changed so much form our mothers I think. We do beat ourselves up..

Nice to see a total agreement tonight. ( I take cover LOL)

Pam

Aww, I think my mother worries about things that she had done quite a bit. :( I know she realizes that my brother's situation was a disaster no matter what she could have done. Then, even when I was very young, I tried to keep so much of my life secret from her so she wouldn't have the extra burden.

It's only been the last few years that she's been discovering how much I kept quiet. Two weeks ago, she found out it was the wrong child that had to leave for boarding school :( My brother would have loved to stay and I would have loved to attend.

Now my grandmother, that's another story. Both my mother and I love her very much. Despite her lack of empathy or even sympathy. She will never even attempt to comprehend how a divorce affected my 5 year old mother in 1940 and then being shuffled around into different homes for the next 3 years. She is convinced that her role as mother was perfectly accomplished along with her business career.
No she never hit my mother. But my mother, who is a much gentler person than myself, was very seriously emotionally traumatised by the different methods of "control".

OOooooh, better stop now. This is a very raw subject that I've admitted I tend to carry for my mother. She has never allowed herself to feel anger, but I have a bad habit of doing it for her. :( Unfortunately, the relationship with my brother tends to bring back old memories for both of us. And I got a card from him today, so things are a bit near the surface. :rolleyes:
regards all,
toodles

Hi Jane

It is easily done and sometimes they drive us all to dispair !! You are a good mother and don't let anybody say anything to the contrary !

I had a phonecall from Linda the owner of the nursery/kids club yesterday at 3.30pm to ask if I could come and pick Florence (10yrs) up. She and a friend had lied to one of the helpers saying that they had got permission to go to the village green together . Linda had found out and drove very quickly down to get them back. She gave them a very good telling off and then contacted me. I was furious. I have been off sick and was snuggled up on the settee. I got dressed drove to the nursery and went in and in front of around twenty kids plus all the staff, crocked in a loud and angry tone 'Florence get down the stairs and into the car now!' How I managed to keep myself from giving her a clip round the earole I don't know. She knew she had done something that was totally out of order. I made her write a letter of apology to Linda and have also made sure she will be doing chores for the next week at nursery.

Kids hey who would have them !!

Is Thistle fully recovered for her Op yet ? If so do you fancy meeting up soon to go for a walk ?

Lucy

Dear Lucy
I hope you've forgiven Florence now. They can be little devils can't they, but they don't realise the possible dangers that we worry about. What a coincidence I've got a friend with a chocolate lab called Florence ( I know it's your daughter, not your dog that's called Florence!!!)
Thistle is now bursting with health, so it would be great to get together and show your girls the river.(Thistle and I are just off down there now :-) ) I'll email you.
Jane

I think Moose and Min think they are Florence and Florence thinks she is called Moose and Min half the time as I always get mixed up !! It is when I tell all of them to stop pestering me and to go and lie down on their beds !! I have two Labs and a ten year old daughter sloping off to their respective beds !! :D

Will wait to hear from you ! Have a lovely walk !!

Lucy

Hi Jane .
I remember when mine were little and I had smacked one of them for what ever reason.
I never planned a punishment . It was usually just like you had a reaction to one of them being very naughty.
When I went to tuck them in I would look at the little face and literally cry .I would then lie awake for hours feeling so guilty.
However , if allowed to get off with too much we wouldent be doing them any favours either.
Mari

Mari you are so right there. Mine have had the odd smack or 3, but I always felt guilty afterwards, but we wouldn't be doing favours if they got away with too much. I still give the odd pat on the bum for bad behaviour and it is a pat, though they usually are expecting more. It is definately a normal reaction, so why do we beat ourselves up over it. Hubs has had to restarin me on occassions. However I find I am mellowing in my old age. On saturday night I was the worst mum in the world (to 13 yr old son), I was hated, he wanted to go and find his dad as it would be better living there, etc, etc, etc. So after hitting the wine (instead of said child) and going to bed I explained the next day that it would mean changing school, only taking what stuff his dad had bought him, no more paper round and pocket money, no holiday to greece next year and suddenly I'm cool.
Why do we do this????
Fi xxx

The thing is we are the pawns fi :D
I must have done something right as my family give me the grandkids any time I want and even if I dont want
If they trust their precious children with me then they must think im ok a mam
Mari

Goodness Jane, no way are you a bad mother!
I bet you most of us who post here were smacked at some time as children, I certainly was, and it didn't do us any harm!
And I expect most of us who are fellow *mums* will have smacked their kids too.
I think that a lot of the probs faced in society today are caused by the anti-smacking brigade's kids!
Nicky

Hi Everyone,

Just a general observation of the site in the last few weeks, (I tend to read and not post very often). I observed with interest the debates on scruffing pups and dogs, noting how upset a lot of people seemed to get and how defensive the original scruffers were (cant remember who they are, and not trying to get at anyone)!!, but now the debate is about smacking kids and everybody is giving their support and saying 'no, you're not a bad mum, it won't hurt them, no lasting damage', etc.

Is this a bad case of double standards or what?????????????

Why is it ok to 'scruff' your kids and not your dog. I don't understand.

Just for the casebook, I have no problems with either, if the recipient deserves the punishment. Mental punishment is much worse and more damaging to kids and dogs IMO.

This said, I rarely have to reprimand my dog, the kids only occasionally. Its other peoples kids that I would like to get my hands on!!!!!!!!!!! Especially the ones that belong to the anti-smacking brigade, they are usually the worst behaved of all IMO. :D

Sarah and Zak

Sarah

I am a member of the anti smacking brigade and a dreaded single mum to boot, ta very much and my two daughters are well mannered, polite, considerate etc etc people have always commented on how well behaved they have been all their lives.

They understand a look that tells them 'don't go there' even at 19 and 16, we laugh about it coz they don't go there but have never been smacked in their lives. My eldest still says 'why do I do as I'm told, what are you going to do about it if I don't I'm a grown woman now?' I've never gone into their rooms uninvited since they were about 8, so they've cleaned their own rooms since then (or not as is the case during the teenage years!). I have no idea how much money they have in their bank accounts but am always there when they need a helping hand sorting out their problems.

Of course discipline is a lot easier now as it's a case of you're over 18 so a woman and on an eqaul peggin so it ain't child abuse anymore just 2 women being very undignified lol!

Having recently really 'lost it' with my 15 (next month) daughter, I can't wait for it not to be child abuse. she is 5' 8" to my 5' 3" but I am a lot, lot heavier, lol!

Do what my mum always used to do - threaten to sit on her :D :D D: D: :D

Fiona
x x x

Fiona I think I'll try that with mine next time
Fi xxxxx

That is what I end up doing when she tries to storm out of the house in a temper after dark!

Schip ...you said it yourself ...DAUGHTERS :)

Try having a couple of sons and you will see the difference ;) I have 3 boys and 2 girls ..ages from 27 to 9 and I have had far more problems with my sons than with my daughters.

I would never say never and , therfore couldnt (and wouldnt) call myself anti smacking. I do not smack for punishment. The only time I have smacked is when *I* have flipped , and I have apologised to the children afterwards as it wasnt that they were being so terrible I *had* to smack them ..it was that I am human and my patience is not finite.

I truly believe that children need to learn that they cannot push and push when someone else is not feeling up to par.

My children are polite and well mannered too ....not wee cowering beasties ;) They help with the housework and cooking and keep their rooms clean and tidy. I have received many comments on how well behaved they are ...

I am happy for you to be a member of the anti smacking brigade ...and I hope you will be happy that I am not :D

Melody :D

I don't think smacking is the best way to deal with kids, but goodness me doesn't it make you feel better :-) , momentarily anyway.
Brainless you need to stand on a chair to give your daughter a clip round the earhole!!
Sarah and Zak
Good point about not scruffing the dogs. Maybe I should post this on the 'behaviour' board, but anyway I have this problem with Thistle- she is generally brilliant and well behaved and doing well at obedience. However she has this occasional bad habit of jumping up and sort of scratching and biting my clothes (very vigorously). She does it when she's bored. I've been told to ignore it as it is attention seeking, but it's hard to ignore as it's reaaly annoying and it hurts me and damages my clothes. Last time she did it I got hold of her scruff and shook her (very gently) and said 'no' firmly. She looked a bit surprised and stopped immediately!!

Hi there,

You sound like you have got the motherhood thing just about sorted:)

My kids are also well behaved and not quivering wrecks (not that you insinuated that they were:D) and thankfully I rarely have to reprimand them, but they do have that knowledge that they cannot get away with everything, and that there could be trouble ahead. La la la etc.

These days a threat of a smack is all that is required, oh that makes me sound as if I spend all day threatening them:(

Anyway as for the dreaded single mother thing (your words not mine) I think you should be proud that you have brought up such well adjusted kids that obviously respect you. Who needs a man to muck things up when you can cope well on your own.

Sarah

Melody I've done the boy thing too as I've been foster carer and childminder, mostly for disabled kids ie autistic etc, for 15 years prior to my Meneires disease. Always found them a little easier than the girls until they hit about 14 then it changed but by then they were well sorted lol.

I was smacked as a child to the point of abuse and scar's so always vowed that I'd never teach my own children that sort of fear and have to my surprise stuck to it. The last time my father hit me was only 2 years ago this month in front of my eldest daughter in my own home, he frightend her to death but blamed it on me, she now understands why I don't follow that sort of pattern with them.

When my children went to secondary school we went for the evening introduction talk and the head announced that all children born between April and October would not be as bright as those born outside of these mths and any child unfortunate enough to be from a single parent family and born between those mths was destined to fail in life according to research that was just out at the time! I'm pleased to say that although both my children were born between those mths and from a single parent family and a dyslexic suffere for one, they are doing well, one is at Uni just about to start her 2nd year and the other with dyslexia did well enough in her GCSE's to go to college to do A levels and is hoping to go to Uni too. So now it's a standing Joke in our house 'oh my god mother we're part of the dreaded single parent family brigade how could you?'

It's about this time we turn into 1 child abuse sufferr and 2 women being undignified on the bathroom floor lol.

Schip ..I was smacked and beaten as a child . I had to go to school once with blue lines of bruises across the back of my legs as my dad had taken a bamboo cane to me. I used to wait for my father to come home and examine me to see if I had picked spots ..if I had then I got a beating.

There is NO comparison between systematic abuse and a smack now and again.

Otherwise , you may as well say everyone who has a drink now and again is an alcholic ..it just isnt right (Thank Goodness)

None of that will ever change my view that the occasional smack is not child abuse :) It is all a matter of perspective IMHO

Melody

Yesterday, in class listening to two 17 year old boys bragging/complaining how tough their parents were... I was desperately trying to hide my inner sense of humour. :) They were talking about how (in their lives) they egged their parents on to "punish". They were also discussing how their 'future' sons would get smacked around to "know" their places and keep them in line :rolleyes:

I asked them if their parents hit them now or when they were younger. Nope, but it sounded good to make them tough sounding :rolleyes: Grounding and parental discussions just doesn't have the same impact on the "tough life" spiel ;) The 'boys' knew themselves and realized how bombproof/immortal they thought they were :D In fact, one was in the middle of four boys --- nothing that his parents did to him would ever equal the treatment the brothers did to one another all the way from when he was a toddler :rolleyes:
like convincing a 5 year old to jump off the roof holding a large garbage bag "worked just as good" as a parachute :rolleyes:

I just dont' think that kids are as "fragile" minded as the current mode of thinking likes to portray them :) I do realize that boys are very different from girls + the different temperaments of individuals also play a huge factor :)

Jane don't worry a little smack will not hurt, and you will not credit this but both
my boy's got a smack this week and I ment it as well. And both have young children

Pat xx

I think smacking your kids is just the same as training and different breeds to be honest:) What works for one doesn't necessarily work for another. I do think boys are a lot harder than girls in general but saying that it's the sly comments that you get from my Daughter that does me more- Kane is quite upfron and whatever he's doing he does it infron of your face:o To be honest I haven't really read through this thread properly so I can't comment on most of it but I thought I'd share my latest story of my Son with you! Kane (5 a fortnight ago) broke a boys glasses at school yesterday:o He didn't mean to and it was a complete accident- they were play fighting and just got a bit too rough- hence the boy ended up with broken glasses. I haven't smacked Kane for this since I feel he had enough punishment from the teacher who made him sit on a chair at the other side of the classroom at storytime instead of sitting on the carpet with everyone else. He was gutted- he only started school a fortnight ago and I can imagine how he must have felt sat alone:( My Dad thinks I should have made him het his pyjamas on when he came in and go straight to bed but honestly he really did feel guilty enough. Obviously I've offered to pay for them and will do. That's what I mean about them being different- Kane has a coincious (Sp?) where Shannon doesn't seem to and if she could cover her tracks she would. When I came in I just said in a Stern voice 'What's been going on then'! He started to cry and said he was sorry and didn't mean it- and he wishes he could *mend* his glasses. Like I say- kids are all different- if it was Shannon she would have made a cock and bull story up about how it wasn't really her fault and tried her best to get out of it:)

Stacey x x x

Accidents happen no point in going on about it I would say he feels bad and no good would come from any more punishment. My friend has 3 boys all grown up and the nicest lads you could meet she slapped on occassion talked on others but always listened to all sides before she did anything. Eldest got drunk and walking home with pals decided for some reason to kick down bollard on traffic island just as police car came past. All got lifted she reacted by telling him how disappointed she was and telling everyone about it he was so mortified he has never been in trouble again.
Anne

Sounds just like my son and daughter. I find her far harder as she doesn't feel she has done wrong, where as he is naughty, but does!