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Topic Dog Boards / Breeding / What is a reputable breeder? (locked)
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- By Jeangenie [gb] Date 13.03.07 14:56 UTC Edited 13.03.07 15:04 UTC
In your original post, before it was edited, you said that you had mated both your bitches. For a first-time breeder that's very unusual, and not a little worrying, considering the huge over-production of your particular breed.

>I'm not a regular breeder either as I will not be letting mine have another litter.
>I don't agree with people flogging their bitches to death mating them every year as some DO


One ill-considered litter is worse for a breed as a whole than four good ones.
- By Isabel Date 13.03.07 15:01 UTC Edited 13.03.07 15:03 UTC
I don't know any breeders that object to people breeding their first litter, surely no one is illogical enough to fail to see breeds would die out with the current group of breeders :D
On the other hand although you point out flogging to bitches to death mating them every year is an extremely bad thing to do that does not take away from the fact that breeding just one badly thought out and prepared for litter can be just as catastrophically detrimental to those individual puppies and future owners.
You seem to have taken on board the hard work and dedication involved in rearing a litter but I still wonder about the preparation and understanding that might have gone on prior to mating.  You mention following a line but is this a line fully familiar to you?  Has your bitch been confirmed as a good enough example to be used to perpetuate that line either in the show ring or working field?  You also mention a health check but do you mean conducting the health screening recommended by your breed club and attaining adequate results or simply a confirmation of general good health by the vet?  All this would apply to the stud dog too of course.  What are the health tests recommended for your breed and are you a breed club member?
- By Blue Date 13.03.07 15:40 UTC
You did say you had mated your 2 bitches at the same time. This worried me. An inexperienced would never cope IMHO with 2 litters. Very few experienced people do.

I'm not after making money from my dogs and I don't care if they only have one puppy they will be loved and looked after 24-7 as I don't go out to work and have all the time in the world for my dogs.

Why have the litters then. If you are after the " lovely experience" we hear so often I would advice better to go watch a litter be born by someone experienced.

Pet litters from pet bitches have no real positive objective I can think off personally.  
- By Liisa [gb] Date 13.03.07 15:49 UTC
I dont agree with 2 litters at the same time either - this is gready!!!  Sorry.

1 litter is hard enough.  1 litter needs all the socialising it can get.  My litter are currently 4 weeks old and I am worn out.  I certainly couldnt have coped with another litter at the same time.  I would rather dedicatre 100% of my time to one litter knowing I have cared for them to the best of my ability.

You also said you had no interest in breeding or showing in one of your posts - what made you change your mind if you dont show?
- By Brainless [gb] Date 13.03.07 19:21 UTC
Having for a variety of (I believe good) reasons had two litters together from my Champion bitches in December I have to say I would not do it again.  Apart from being exhausted, it simply is not as enjoyable having 14 pups to look after instead of my usual 4 to 7.  I didn't feel I knew each one as well as I might have had there been fewer pups.

My favourite litters have always been the smaller ones.
- By Goldmali Date 13.03.07 15:51 UTC
If you are after the " lovely experience" we hear so often I would advice better to go watch a litter be born by someone experienced.

My very first experience of a litter was fostering 2 orphan pups for the RSPCA. They needed a lot of care before they would be old enough to be re-homed and it was a great way to find out a bit about what rearing pups is like -although with just 2 it was nothing much like my first litter, years later, that had 9. I'm not sure if this is something rescues would consider (but I know cat rescues like CP do), but I'd say it's a great idea for anyone wanting a litter just for the experience -no money involved, no stress of finding the right homes, just all the hard work, and doing a good turn as well.
- By Moonmaiden Date 13.03.07 16:01 UTC
A reputable breeder is one who does not breed from a bitch that is bought solely as a pet, but from the very best bitch they can find, they show or work the bitch depending on the breed, make sure all the health tests are done & because they have bought their bitch from a reputable breeder they will have the help, support & guidance from their bitches breeder

They also don't breed from a bitch(or bitches)because the person who grooms the bitches thinks they are good enough. The reputable breeder of a coated breed should be able to groom their dogs themselves, otherwise how are they going to advise the puppy buyers of how to care for the puppies' coats ?
- By Val [gb] Date 13.03.07 16:36 UTC
But I must inform you that I am not an idiot that just want to let her dog have a litter and I'm not a regular breeder either as I will not be letting mine have another litter.
So do you think that ignorance is bliss and it's OK to do it once so long as you don't do it again?  Do you think that makes a breeder reputable?:confused:

I'm not after making money from my dogs and I don't care if they only have one puppy they will be loved and looked after 24-7 as I don't go out to work and have all the time in the world for my dogs.

Time doesn't equate to knowledge.  Do you think that having time means reputable?:confused:

I have a spare room which me and the bitch will be moving into probably a week before she is due and I wouldn't leave her at all. Any signs of problems during in the birth and I won't mess about I will take her straight to the vet's (our vet's is 24hr).
How will you know what is normal and what is a problem?  Do you think that it always happens naturally?:confused:

I am already prepared with whelping box etc
Does that mean reputable? :confused:

I have followed the line with breeding and my dog has had health check and booster and wormed before mating.
What line?  Does having a booster and worming mean reputable?:confused:

I know some of you breeders don't like newcomers breeding a litter well I'm sorry if it offends any of you but you at one time had a first litter.
I don't know of any reputable breeder who doesn't encourage new people who are interested in their chosen breed.  We are all only temporary guardians of our breeds.  But I also don't know of any reputable breeder or stud dog owner, who would encourage a pet owner who can't even trim their own dogs to produce puppies from their pet bitches.

You have bought 2 pet quality bitches from a person who doesn't show their dogs either.  A reputable breeder rarely sells 2 pups to the same home.  You cannot possibly give your new owners the back up of knowledge that they deserve when they buy a puppy.  You don't even know how to trim your own dogs. :(  If you keep telling yourself that you are a reputable breeder then you may convince yourself but you'll not convince any reputable breeder. :(
- By Goldmali Date 13.03.07 17:40 UTC
I don't know of any reputable breeder who doesn't encourage new people who are interested in their chosen breed.  We are all only temporary guardians of our breeds.

Hear hear! That's it, the right person with the right attitude will always be encouraged and very much welcomed into the breed!
- By Fillis Date 13.03.07 16:40 UTC
I really didnt think vets would give a booster to an in-whelp bitch?
- By Isabel Date 13.03.07 16:48 UTC

>and booster and wormed before mating.


:)
- By Jeangenie [gb] Date 13.03.07 17:02 UTC
Good information about reputable breeding.
- By Goldmali Date 13.03.07 17:45 UTC
This is another great one It's actually my trainer who has put this page together and the experience of costs and damaged houses etc are mine.
- By Brainless [gb] Date 13.03.07 19:15 UTC Edited 13.03.07 19:27 UTC
Certainly in my breed we are crying out for new custodians for the breed as the current dedicated breeders many of whom have devoted their lives to their breed get older and the day approaches for them to have to stop.

Many come into a breed for a Short time (the average is just five years) breed a litter or two and leave.  That is not what is needed but those with dedication and a long term aim.

You state yourself that is not your aim, so what are you offering the breed and the pups new owners with just one litter?  You will not be able to mentor those new owners should they become interested in getting more deeply involved, as you won't have the knowledge they will need.  so a puppy from you will in fact be a dead end for a potential breed enthusiast.

Most breeders (as opposed to people who just produce puppies) do not over breed their bitches.  None of mine have had more than 18 puppies or 3 litters.  Apart from anything else there simply isn't time if you are successfully working or showing them :D.
Topic Dog Boards / Breeding / What is a reputable breeder? (locked)
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