Hi All. I need a behaviourist in the north birmingham area. I have tried two and I may as well have flushed the money down the toilet. i have three dogs and live alone. ~I would love to go to dog training class but how would I do it with the three.
GSD x Weim. spayed bitch. 7 yrs in april. Biter with some other dogs, not all. and biter to indisciminate people, not all.
Rhodesian. entire bitch. 2 yrs in May. Will lunge and bite small kids. has to be muzzled. barks and appears terrified of all people shes never met. People she knows, licks to death.
JRT x ?. Rescued from police stn oct 05. maybe 3ish. spayed bitch. tendency to run off and ignore the recall. Only thing that will bring her back is the sound of my car engine, or lorry engine! Probably the reason she wasnt claimed by her origional owners, they got fed up of chasing her!
These are the most worrying problems. Not all of the problems i have. Getting rid of one or two is not an option. I adore them all. Entirely selfishly some would say.
im almost sure that at least the two big dogs have some form of nervous anxiety. But how do I get it across that they need to look to me, and not take matters into their own paws. individually they are different dogs.
Best Regards.

Good you have come here but why such a mix of difficult dogs

Hi LJS
~It was never planned. you know...
I had a rhody for 12 years. JAde. There was a litter of GSD X Weims and the last bitch was a runt so ~i said Id have her and she would keep jade company. Enter Vixon. Big mistake. But done so gotta live with it. Then Jade, rhody, had liver issues at 12.5 and I had to make the decision. I was Broken when I had Jade pts. so boyfriend bought me another one. Kimba is lovely. But I think she is slightly mental. no joke. And As I was in Police stn showin documents for an accident I had the day before, some bloke came in with a sm brown dog. There was an argument and bloke said he was going to loose dog onto road. Enter me. Notified all vets, had her scanned, put her on petsearch, Claimed her as mine after a month. had her spayed and chipped. and shes intigrated into the pack.
So theres the story in breif.
Had any ideas?

Did your vet refer you to these behaviourists, or were they advertised somewhere? The best ones are vet-referral only, so if you haven't been through your vet I'd suggest that's the route you take first of all. As for training classes, I'm sure you can rotate the dogs, either leaving two in the car during the class and swapping them over every 20 minutes or so, so they all get some training each session, or take one the first week, another one the second and the last one the third week, and repeat the sequence.

Hi Jeangenie
Yeah both vet referals. They see me comin!
would trainers go for three different dogs in session then?
~I assumed it was out of the question.

What makes you feel that you have to take all three dogs together to training class?
Couldnt you take them seperately? I used to take mine on alternate weeks. Its good to take them seperately, gives you time to concentrate on the individual dog, and to bond with it. It also prevents the other dogs interfering with training. It certainly sounds as though your dogs are in dire need of training before someone or some dog gets hurt, so find a reputable class that will accept problem dogs. 
Remember, it doesnt really matter if each dog only gets one class every third  week...the class isnt there to train the dog, its to train YOU how to deal with basic training and problems. at the class you will learn stuff but YOU do the training at home.

I agree with JG. I have 8 dogs (and have had 10) and although I no longer work some of them at classes due to old age etc, I regularly go to training with 4-5 different dogs. I'm lucky to have a husband who will hold a dog whilst I work another and I go in different classes, but when I went on my own and had to use the bus I just alternated between the dogs from week to week.

To be honest, it sounds as if your first 2 dogs may not be easy to accept in to a training class, esp. the one who is as you say so afraid of people she doesn't know as things have to be done gradually - if you "flood" such a dog she may never get over it.

What sort of things did the behaviourists suggest, and how long did you try them for? :)

It can take time to turn behaviour around, esp. with fearful dogs.

Lindsay
x

I used to go to a class with a rescue dog who had been abused and suffered from fear related aggression. If you find the right class you will get lots out of it BUT remember other people in the classes may make stupid comments about your dog, rise above it and don't leave unless the trainer can't help you.
With my dog we would go for 5 minutes of the class and stand at the main door. In time this increased to 5 minutes sat in the hall. We only ever made it a metre down the entry corridor at a time but that is all my dog could manage. After about 6 weeks we were spending 10 minutes sat at the edge of the class and the trainer would see us after class with the dog off lead and he would try to make friends with him. My dog was more aggressive if on a lead as he had been tied up to be beaten!!!
After about 4 mths we were part of the class and my dog loved the trainer to bits. My dog was soon top of the class he loved it there and was after about 8 months working off lead in that class. The other people there that had made comments about him and said just put him to sleep were the first to congratulate us both. It is hard but you can do it.
My dog hated the world and from what he had been though you could not expect any different, he was never a normal dog, he was full of fun, happy, loving to those he knew but he was always suspicious of strangers although never ever went for them after training and time. If you made a friend of my dog he was a friend for life and many people would say it was a most rewarding relationship as it was an honour to be accepted in Whiskey's world. At one point he went to day care in a big farm house with 10 other dogs 5 days a week and the owner was worried but 4 mths later he said to me one day, I have never had such a rewarding dog here. I was the proudest mum on earth.
I lost Whiskey in October aged 13 years, we'd been together 11 yrs and I can honestly say I miss him like mad and I'm so very glad he was mine. I am proud of what we achieved together, it can be done, with lots and lots and lots of hard work and time and love. Don't give up, work hard and remember to love the dogs for who they are.
Good luck to you and your dogs and remember do it in their time not yours you can't rush this process.

Dogcrazy... Thank you.
There are an awful lot of similarities between Whiskey and Vixon and Kimba. Ayla, the one from the police stn is never a problem with anything thats alive... just the recal and not always. She comes back 80% of the time.
But you are right, I will be criticised. And my skin is thick enough to withstand that! If it helps the dogs and I to have nice times without the risks it will be worth it.
In answer to what the behaviour people said...
Keep dogs seperate. (cant do that, they love each other)
Walk dogs seperate. ( havent got all day)
Have high value rewards in pocket. (pocket stinks of sausage)
Dont let Vix any where near strangers, in case of bark and lunge. Cross road if someone aproaches. (She never gets the option to prove shes got better)
Take Kim to busy places. (Good idea, where?)
Call Ayla, give high value reward. (When I got sausage in pocket they will not leave my side!!)
Bearing in mind that they only display this behaviour when theres more than 1 of them. If they are alone with me they are different dogs. Kimba was held on a lead by someone she had never seen before on new yrs day. I had to drive to Hull to collect a horse in lorry. She had mommy all to herself and was a happy dog. As I was loading the new horse the old owner offered to hold the dog. I just handed the lead over and didnt think. Kim just sat there, being stroked!
So what do we make of that lot?? o and there was loads more that the proffesionals told me but it made so little sense I cannot remember it. Basicaly these are wolves in the house. and I need to learn how they think. I have with the horses. Whats going wrong.
Regards Carolann

The behaviourists have suggested some very good things there. If you stick to those suggestions your dogs will get better with TIME and EFFORT. I have been working with my vizslas problems for over a year and a half and she is not completely better but atleast i enjoy my walks with her now. If you follow their instruction completely your dogs will get better but you may have to take alot of your time. Do any pairings of dogs do better?

you said when kimba was alone with you in the lorry she was a happy dog. dont you want that all the time for all of the dogs?

my mum and i have kept multiple dogs, some of them having behavioural problems, and when it came to a head, we had to make a decision to rehome, so they could be the only dog- and with the couple this has happened to- we have seen them flourish into happier dogs.

wish you all the luck x

The behaviourists have given very good advice. Walking the dogs separately is definitley the first thing to do, to stop them feeding each other's neuroses, and getting them to concentrate more on you. It needn't necessarily take you any longer - walking each dog for 20 minutes rather than all together for an hour when the 20 minutes each individual gets is one-to-one will be just as good, certainly until they behave better. Then you can start experimenting with various pairings to see how that works. The fact that Kim is more relaxed when she's with you on her own shows that this will work, because the others aren't winding her up! Busy places to take Kim would be the shopping centre on a Saturday; your local market; the railway station at rush hour ... the list goes on. When it comes down to it many dogs are actually happier being 'only dogs' rather than one of a pack, so you might have to consider rehoming one (or two if necessary) of them to give them the lifestyle they want.

But don't expect a 'quick fix' - be prepared to spend several months working on them before you see good results. Good luck!

Hi all
In response.
There is a busy place localy. Its outside a school. I guess I could walk past it a few times. As for the pairing. I hadnt thought... But yes Vix and Ayla will be good together.
I havnt done them any favours by walking them around the farm, with just the farm dog for doggie company. They rarely go on a lead as i take them from the car to the fields and as I check fences, gates etc. and they have an hour morning and night off lead in this situation. So, to sum up.. ~I live alone, I walk them with the same person and dog every day, around the same route where they see no one. And then Im suprised when I put them on a lead to take them to a local park where they cant be let off (too many kids and dogs) and they dont behave as I would want. Pretty typical  eh?
But at least I do have some understanding of the situation. And I am also trying to learn. I have been trying to find a class. We have one club 4 miles away and its booked up for ages. Back to the drawing board for that one then.
Thanks for everyones input. Any other thoughts gratefuly received
Carolann

No real advice, but just to say I have all 3 of my dogs enrolled at my club, I take a different one each week. The trainers also rotate, so I try to match the dog to what the trainer likes to do, ie Good Citizen, agility or obedience. :-)

hi,
I have to be very careful with my dogs too,they give me a hard time,but only as they had a hard time.
They were rescue,half starved beaten ect,but for quite a while I walked them seperate,it really works,yes,they still cry their eyes out if split up,even for only an hour,so be tuff.

Mine did really well for a long time, but now I think I will have to start doing the odd walk seperately again,we have a few issues,but one to one is very good,all eyes will be on you,and thats what you want.
Sadly,people tend to want to fuss my two,and I have to say no,they hate strangers,and it wont change,so sometimes you just have to live with it,(always feel terrible when kids want to fuss them and I say no)better safe than sorry.
If you explain to people whats wrong with them,most will be understanding,just be careful not to make every excuse in the book for them as you love them so much,(my mistake often)
Oh yeah,lots of patience,it pays in the end,hope this helps a bit,
Ashx

Keep up the good work Nestle - a lot of people would have given up on these dogs before now.  I too have had and do have problems with my dogs.  Lola is a rescue Rhodesian Ridgeback, no history at all and is fear aggressive.  Lunges at dogs and men when on the lead.  We keep her on a long lead, daren't let her off in public.  We took her training and the trainer was fantastic.  He spoke to the rest of the group and explained about Lolas problem.  We just sat in a corner for the session and although Lola lunged at some dogs when they went past she did calm down.  We took her for several weeks and she was much improved.  She still has her moments but it is ongoing and she is improving.  Casper (Weimaraner), another rescue has to be on his lead all the time now due to his very high prey drive.  Just one sniff of a cat or rabbit and we don't exist, he is completely lost in his own little world.  The only good one is Freya (Weimaraner) who we have had from a pup although her recall isn't 100%...........  The joys of dog ownership!

Hi Louisechris1

Someone after my own heart, there are so many poor dogs in rescue that need homes. They deserve a chance, all my GSD'S have been rescues. Only my last one Zak has been hard work. He is nearly 4 now & the hard work is paying off. He was kept as a puppy in a pen with 2 staffies for company, not much other contact & certainly not much food either. I have to watch him with other dogs, he actually wants to play, but greets dogs in a very aggressive manner. he likes to jump on them & growl, then he will play! Obviously he isn't allowed to do this. We do 'dog agility' & he loves it. On Sunday we came 14th out of a class of 69!! He has a lovely rossette. I can't see myself ever giving a home to anything else now, there are far too many dogs being bred, brought on a whim & then discarded when the novelty wears off. Lets face it even the most well bred dogs sometimes give there owners problems. Over the years the rescue centres have become full with pedigree dogs not mongrels. Keep up the good (hard) work!

Hi Ash Beardy, and Louisechris.
im on the case for the classes now. im gona try the suggestion of taking 1 at a time so the house doesnt get wrecked while im gone.LOL
Theres only one real rescue, Ayla and shes the least of the problems!
Well Done Zak. for his ribbon. that was a large class. I wonder if any of mine will ever win any ribbons.
And as i said before, I cant be rehoming any of my dogs. Would be like selling my children. Of whom a have none anyway!
No when I make a commitment its for life. Good or bad.
Im interested in Lolas case as Kimba is similar. But it is a breed trait to be suspicious of strangers. i think our two have taken it a little far!!
I am very gratefull for everyones input on this as I have learnt a bit. I didnt know I could take all three, allbeit a different times.
~Im told of a trainer that does one to  one near here. So he might handle for me as well. be a bit quicker and showing me what to do. might be easier for me to see what Im looking for too.
As I write Im buried under my lovely doggies. ahh wonderfull.
There is a quote  ' No matter how few possesions you have, owning a dog makes you rich' Louis Sabin.
Absolutely....
C X

I have 4 full time dogs, other 2 live with my parents.  One goes to obedience, another to agility, another water work nd another gundog training.

Hi Nestle

I think you would find it difficult to take more than one dog to ANY training class at the same time and the suggestion of alternating from week to week is good.  BUT, as a trainer myself I would suggest that you do not take dogs to group training classes when you already know that your dogs have issues with people and other dogs.

If your dogs are overly aroused, upset, nervous, stimulated - call it what you will - by the presence of people and dogs they are not in the correct 'mind set' to learn anything.  You need to work on these issues first in environments that contain only the lowest level of stimulous you can find and work up from there eg one calm dog, one non-threatening person.

If you haven't the time or commitment to walk your dogs separately, train them separately or work on their 'behaviourial issues' separately then I think you will find it hard to achieve any measure of improvement and success.