Yesterday was one day so bad it's hard to believe.I'll cut it short. First my favourite cat Vanilla was dropped off at the vets to have some teeth out. Then we saw the other vet with one of the Malinois who is in constant pain and  I suspect OCD. He'll be x-rayed next week but the vet was very pessimistic (our vet is a bone specialist), did not feel it was OCD and in fact prepared us we may never find what it is or even if we did not a cure, and we may have to let him go as he cannot be in pain for ever. He's 19 months old! Reeling from that shock the other vet called as we were on our way home and said he'd found a tumour in Vanilla's mouth and wanted to do a biopsy! Then in the evening  the Golden had another REALLY bad "episode" -I've mentioned this before. Yesterday it was worse than ever, for half an hour he could not walk at all, and it did seem more like an epileptic fit this time but still not quite -he was so aware. I filmed him, to show to the vet, if anybody here would like to see it I have put it on a private spot online and will give URL by PM -I'd be interested to hear if anybody has seen something like it.

We're dreafully worried we're going to lose two dogs very soon and that's two of the three YOUNGEST. :( Looking at them this morning they both seem so healthy but they're not. And we've had such healthy dogs for so many years now with the vet not seeing them at all. With the exception of the Cavalier with MVD (and the odd injury) we've not had a dog actually ill since 1999.

Oh Marianne! :( And I thought I was having a bad day but mine is a walk in the park compared to yours :(

You must be going out of your mind with worry.  I do hope things are not as bleak as they seem now.

{{{{HUGS}}}} to you, Vanilla and the pups xx

how awful for you, I hope things arent as bad as they seem.

Received:

Goldmali has a Golden Retriever that is exhibiting symptoms which are similar to Episodic Falling in Cavaliers. We have seen a similar syndrome in a French Bull, a Cocker Spaniel, and a Fox Terrier.  Even humans get hypertonicity disorder. 

If she would like to contact me, my website is  http://www.episodicfalling.com/ and my email is on the contact page. 

Thanks for helping us out.  I would love to hear from her.  We are trying to learn all we can about the prevalence of the disorder and it's treatment. 

Dorothie Hellman

Oh cheers admin for passing this on! Will contact them.

I am so sorry marianne. You are having an awful day arn't you. sending you all my biggest wishes to you and your animals. Give them all a big but gentle hug from me.
Thinking of you at this hard time.
All the best
Anna

Marianne - what a day - you poor thing - try try and keep positive - easier said than done I know.

I have an epiletic dog but she has quite classic seizures - brought on by stressful situations it would appear - touches wood has been fit free for nearly a year now.  So not sure how but if you think it will help I will look at the film you have taken.

Hugs to you all there.

Cheers Rachel have PM'd you.

Marianne - sorry took so long have replied to your pm.

It's fine Rachel!! I have a few PM's to reply to now but I'm pleased to say I have that rare night off -step son dog sitting, so I am off to dog training now which is a break I can really do with. :D So I'll get back to everyone tomorrow. Now where did I put those hot dogs?

Marianne I can't say anything, you have had the worst luck for so long. I know how much your dogs and cats mean to you. I hope everything works out. Sending enormous hugs your way.

Hi Marianne - Sorry to hear of all your problems. This may be a complete shot in the dark, but a few years ago my youngest goldie had a number of 'funny turns', losing the use of his legs for a few seconds, nothing as serious as yours seems to be experiencing, but nonetheless very worrying. At the time he had been having some evening primrose oil tablets (slightly itchy coat) and the minute I stopped those the 'funny turns' stopped. Is he on any sort of supplement/medication? I later noticed on the EPO pot that they should not be given to known epileptics (these where human tablets).

Interesting Pedlee. No Simba isn't on anything extra at all -in fact since this started we have started feeding him raw just in case it would help and he gets a mixer added with no preservatives or anything added and no supplements.  He's not had any flea treatment (ever in his life) and worming was back in July.

Thanks everyone. It never rains but it pours in this house this year it seems! Let's hope it it this house that has brought ALL the bad luck and if we get to move soon (still no date) everything else will improve too......

Positive thoughts winging your way. It never rains but it pours - hopefully better weather is in sight.

Just sending positive thoughts, Marianne .....keep your pecker up!

Margot x

Can't offer any words of wisdom, but am sending positive thoughts for good results for all concerned. I know how worried I would be with one of my lot in such a situation, can't imagine how awful it is having to worry about 3 of them.

Marrianne, how bad can a day get?? :( :(  Sending {{{HUGS}}} and positive thoughts for you all.

Re. your Golden, I remember something similar being discussed about a Border Terrier some time ago on CD, your videoing it reminded me.  The key feature was of epileptic type symptoms but totally aware at the same time - no loss of consciousness.  It's not much to go on but perhaps a search of cd would throw something up?  Also Google (I'll get looking)

Gosh,

Just typed in "epileptic aware dog" and this came up

http://cavalierepisodicfalling.com/symptoms.html  there are videos on there as well

off to look for other stuff

I have just PM'd M with this :)

This is what Moose has :)

Also found this

http://www.borderterrier-cecs.com/cecs_handout.htm

Clinical signs etc down the page

and this

Canine Epileptoid Cramping Syndrome

very informative

Hope this helps
Dill

Sorry nothing in the way of help to add, but just to say that it must be a very worrying time for you and I really hope things improve soon.

I knew of episodic falling in cavaliers but what I can''t find when Googling is does it ever occur in OTHER breeds? Because viewing those videos, the severe one is VERY similar indeed.......

The fits Moose has are very similar indeed which are always triggered by excitment or if she is over heated after strenous excercise :)

She has been checked out for any other signs of epilepsy and all tests have proved negative :)

Her fits normally last for at the most 30 seconds and she is very clingy and comes for reassurance after them.

Ah well Simba has been resting each time one started,asleep in the kitchen, and although the first one lasted only a few seconds, this last one continued for a good half hour. :(

Nothing to add I'm afraid but just wanted to wish you some better times soon, you've certainly had more than your fair share of the other kind this year.

Marianne, I have no advice but just wanted to send some support, I'm so sorry everything ghastly is happening just now re. your animals :( {{{hug}}}

Lindsay
x

Nothing helpful to add, I'm afraid :( , just sympathy, crossed fingers, and hugs for you all.

Well that is 3 bad things today so with the other positive thoughts it should be good stuff from now on.

My heart goes out to you and your pets.

It is so hard to see these things happening to your loved ones and having to wait and see what the specialists say. 

The videos show symptoms similar to Episodic Ataxia or Periodic Paralysis in humans, which really means episodes of clumsiness or paralysis that are transient and passing, as I have seen them anyway.  On of the site also mentions Arnold Chiari dogs, again something known in humans and to me personally.  I can tell you that EA and PP are brought on by the neural pathways of the body not allowing nerve impulses to pass properly to the muscles, a science known as chanelopethy.  It is a relatively new science in humans let alone canines.  It is brought about by poor processing of potassium or sodium by the body and the exact science would take months to explain.  A lot of research is being done into the genetics of the condition. 

I read on one of the sites that if the episode is not stopped the pet may die.  Again, my only experience with humans, family members and myself, is that if the breathing muscles or heart are affected, and this is very, very rare, this might be the case.  It can be managed by avoiding stress, excitement and illness where possible.  In my case Acetazolomide is the answer but in the case of a dog I don't know. 

I hope you find answers soon we all send you our thoughts at this time.

Arnild Chiari= Syringomyelia which again is common in Cavaliers and I must admit that thought did struck me -now I'd have had 2 possible answers if Simba had been my cavalier and not my Golden, weird...... Does rather point to something neurologial though.Everything worth looking into, can't wait to see what the vet thinks of the video. But yes, it does worry me greatly that one day he will not recover from one of these as each one has been much worse than the last. We live half an hour from the nearest vet, and that's if there's no traffic and of course if there is somebody around to drive as I don't drive... 6 days in between the last two, now today it's been 2 days since this one, fingers crossed it does NOT happen soon again.....

Any news Marianne on Simba ?

Lucy
xx

Thanks for asking. :) Well TOUCHWOOD Simba has now been without any collapses for the past 22 days -hardly dare say it. HOWEVER we know this is just a temporary respite. The vet viewed the video of him and told me my dog is dying -it isn't epilepsy,  but most likely something like a brain tumour. Yes we can do an MRI scan (cost: £1400 + VAT at the AHT!!!) but it would not be able to show us anything we likely could DO anything about. (I also read up on brain surgery on dogs and cats, and if you remove a brain tumour it still only gives them less than one extra year to live.)

After the last collapse, Simba was like a zombie for 9 days. It wasn't until he finally recovered that we really understood just how bad he had been. He didn't play, he didn't walk unless he had to, he didn't even lift his head when food was prepared. He ate but very slowly. It was like a light had been switched off inside him and he was alive but not THERE. Then after the 9 days we came down in the morning and our usual dog was back, and he's been here ever since then. He runs, he plays, he jumps, he eats fast, he gets excited, he's like a puppy. It's incredible to see.

We have now put him on epilepsy medication, two lots of pills twice a day, as it may or may not help a bit -the vet said it would be 4-6 weeks before we can really know if it's made any difference. It's very unlikely he can be well again and have a long life as clearly something very serious is wrong, but let's hope we can keep him happy for as long as possible.

Of course, if he collapses like this once a month say, then I think that's just about okay -if he takes just over a week to recover and so has just under 3 weeks out of 4 when he is normal, then he's got a decent life. If it happens more frequently, or if he starts to take even longer to recover, then no he doesn't have a life.

So right now it's a waiting game and we just take each day as it comes and are gratetful for every morning when he jumps up and greets us and is happy.

Oh dear not good news but three is still some hope :)

As you say so long as he is enjoying life that is what is most important.

Will keep all fingers and paws crossed that he carrys on in good health :)

Lucy
xx

That's not so good. :( Poor Simba. Try not to let your fear of the bad times overwhelm the joy of the good times, because Simba won't; he's blessed with the animal's ability to live for today without fear for tomorrow.

Yes I'm doing quite well managing to really enjoy his good days, and it feels like I've been give a respite --I have a chance to spoil him a bit, do the things with him that he enjoys etc, and he CAN do them when he is on his good days.

Oh hell Marianne!!
Will keep everything crossed for you and yours.
Big hugs,
Sarah.

Thanks Lucy and Sarah. :)

It must have been an awful time for you all Marianne when he was so poorly and not himself.  Here's hoping it's a long, long time before he has another episode.  At least if he's happy in himself and enjoying relative normality in between you can be happy too.

Wishing you all the best,
Teri :)

I too was wondering how he was. Here's wishing his good times long continue to outnumber his bad times.

{{{Hugs}}}}}
Oh Marianne, if CD gave out 'Purple Hearts' you'dve defiantely earned yours!!
Its galling..bad things shouldnt happen to good people :(
sending positive thoughts x x

Thanks all. Right now I try to just enjoy him being well and not think too much. (It's too awful to think of.) I decided not to tell my children as they would only worry -and who knows? My Rufus the Cavalier would not see Christmas 2002 the vet said and here he still is.

So sorry to hear that the outlook isn't so favourable but fingers crossed that his good days continue to outnumber the bad for a long while yet :)

Fingers crossed too that 2007 is brighter for you all as 2006 seems to have been a particularly tough one :(

Jules xx

I do understand what you are going through, Marianne - all we can do with our dogs that have something hanging over them is just to appreciate each day with them - not easy, I know.

As Jules says, you have had such a rotten year - lets hope that next year brings better luck with it.

{{hugs}}} for you and for Simba - he is a little lion-heart, isn't he!

Margot

Thanks Jules. 2007 HAS to be better, can hardly be worse. We might even get to move....... (Yes the move is delayed AGAIN! I'm thinking of contacting the Guinness book of world records when we hit the first anniversary!)

I'm so very very sorry Marianne - but you are being wonderful and positive and I think you are right not to tell the children - as you said who knows?  continue to enjoy him every day as you are.

I hope Simba has many many happy times for many years to come and that the tablets do help him to avoid any more episodes.

I'm so sorry to hear this and just want to wish you all well. Keeping fingers crossed for Simba and hope the medication goes some way to help.

Sorry to hear this, hope he's like your cavvie & his good days are many

So sorry to hear this Marrianne, hope his good days continue and he's mostly well.