and I am starting to wish I had stayed at home in Sweden, noisy kids all week but no animals and no problems.......sigh. :(

Came home to youngest male dog having decided he wants to take over top spot from the oldest male dog and a lot of serious fighting. Thankfully I THINK (touchwood) we may be able to sort it out, I have had a lot of good advice from my trainer and it appears to be working.

Next problem: the move is once again OFF. Remember the farmer who had to
give his permission for us to access the water pipes under his fields? Or we would not get the mortgage?
The contract finally appeared for us to sign, and he had added a clause
saying we are not to keep any kennelled dogs and not to ever breed any
animals !!! (What on EARTH it would matter to somebody living half a
mile away I don't know.) So he's made it clear he really does not want
us to move there as he KNEW we were hobby breeders.(And he isn't even the seller!) As if that wasn't
enough, the other farmer whose field is involved too is now demanding 3K to sign and we can't afford
any more outlays. So we have to get my mother in law out next week (she is currently renting the property but will be expected to leave the moment we confirm we are backing out)  and
into rented accommodation, and the house hunt has started all over
again............. :rolleyes:

Needless to say there is nothing available in our
price range without neighbours in the right area (=okay for hubby to get
to work from). Well there was one house, no neighbours, right area and price,
but so small we would not all fit in it, and right next to the road to
York with a LOT of VERY noisy traffic -almost impossible even to get to
as the house is virtually on the road. So not a good option, over priced
too.

It has been about 3 years now that we have tried to move!

Oh well. I guess things could be worse! Going to watch the X-factor now then ctch up on some posts. :)

Oh Marianne, that's so awful and frustrating and infuriating for you. :( Surely you've got to have some good luck soon?

I hope so. :)

Oh heck how frustrating on all the house business :(

Hopefully SOMETHING will come along - seems a bad time for property :(

Hope something turns up soon for you Marianne - fingers crossed!

Margot

Oh Marianne I do hope something turns up soon, will keep all fingers and paws crossed for you :)

Hi Marianne

We have this covenant on the deeds of our place - plus one that says that we cannot mend any machinary out in the open ! - I think it is a fairly standard one on property that has been once owned by local authority agricultural agents. We phoned up the land agents and they told us it was aimed at preventing commercial boarding/breeding due to the increased traffic this might cause. We currently have kenneling for 6 dogs here and are aiming to put up another run to house 6 more. We are also planning to breed in the future. The land agents have been out to check out a boundary that we were disputing and saw the kennels etc but have said nothing. My neighbour whose property also has this covenant attatched has over 20 dogs and most of these are kenneled - she also breeds a litter at least once a year- she has lived there for nearly 17 years and has never had any problems.

You can also apply to get the covenent lifted ( although you do have to pay to do this) - the land agents have to prove that your kennels/dogs cause significant material loss to the farm next door - as we only have a tumble down barn and 40 acres of fields next to us there appears no way they could win on  that grounds. We may do this if we decide to sell as these resrictions can be offputting to potential buyers but if I were you I would get in touch with the land agents to clarify exactly what this means - good luck !

Yvonne

Very interesting Yvonne! The difference here is, it isn't the seller of the house or the deeds or anything that says it, but the farmer who has to give us permisison to access our water pipes under his fields.

Now last night there was a deevlopment, the son of the sellers (elderly couple, and the woman isn't expected to live more than a fortnight now) said that as far as he has been told BY the farmer who is an old friend, this business about no kennels and no breeding is not meant to apply to US! It is meant to apply if we SELL the property. It all stems back to the farmer having a serious disagreement with a dog breeder who used to live in the area and he wants to make sure he cannot move back. The seller's son said the farmer has no problem at all with our dogs and what we do. John called our solicitor this morning and he says well the documents do NOT state it should not apply to us, but he will get on to it and see if it is at all possible to get the farmer to add this, as then we will okay it. We don't exactly have any intention of moving again anyway, all being well. So there's a glimmer of hope again and we'll have to sit back again and wait -but the sellers are now VERY keen to complete quickly (as in by Friday) due to the wife's illness, and so maybe, just maybe they are more keen now to sort things once and for all........ although I dare NOT hope too much after everything!

You certainly have had a hard time Marianne. No one deserves that much grief. I can only think that maybe the fates were protecting you. Sounds like even 1/2 mile away that farmer may have caused trouble for you. I'll wish hard for the perfect home to reveal itself to you ASAP. Maybe even follow up with a bit of fairy dust for good measure.

Do you ever think about going back to Sweden? I think about going home - and I thought about going home every day when I was buying the hosue we're living in now. ;-)

Yes, I must admit I have often thought of going back home -the nature is wonderful and the money we have available would reach MUCH further in the Swedish countryside so we could get a really nice place. However quite apart from all the things I would miss in England, there are too many people involved. My 79 year old disabled mother in law who cannot cope on her own and who certainly don't want to move abroad at her age, and my husband's children, and my own children whose father would never allow me to take them abroad to live -I couldn't live that far away from them as now I see them each and every weekend. Be different if they were older, but they are only 6, 11 and 14.

What a rollercoaster you've been on! I hope everything does work out, and quickly. Fingers crossed :)

Just come across this Marianne - I really hope you manage to get matters resolved :(  Will keep everything crossable well and truly crossed for you ;)

Teri x

Thanks Teri. Right now this instant my main problem is the two male dogs fighting. I am in tears here with major, major problems and injured dogs and I know whatever happens I cannot keep both. But that's not all, far from it, but I can't write the rest of the dog story here. I'm starting to think I've used up all my good luck -I had the best luck ever when I met my husband and got a new life that is a million times better than I had before, and I always used to say to myself if only that bit could get sorted out (ex) I'd never ask for anything else again. I don't want to always seem to be moaning because I have such an awful LOT to be grateful for, but I can't help to be upset all the same at all of this right now.

Does anyone know of a way to get a dog used to being kennelled without hating it and barking and howling? Beds, toys, treats, food and company doesn't seem to help.

Oh Marianne {{{hugs}}} - I know how awful it is when you suddenly get upsets with the dogs - had that at the beginning of the year, so do know what you're going through - vets bills, injured dogs etc.

Hang in there girl, things will get better.......just can't say how long it will take.

Regards

Margot

Hi Marianne

I do hope this awful situation sorts itself out for you.  I was in a very similar situation just over a year ago.  We were buying this farm and two of my girls started fighting.  Then the sale started going horribly wrong.  I had given up and wanted to walk away, but my partner kept me going.  It all worked out in the end.  We are happily living here now.  It was a very painful process and I wouldn't want to go through it again, but we just love it here.  Lots of space for the dogs and no neighbours.  Wonderful. 

My girls still don't get on, but we are managing the situation.  Not ideal, but they are happy.  Could you perhaps use cages, rather than kennelling one of the boys?  This has worked for us.  Musical cages is an interesting game, but they all love their cages, have lovely soft, cosy beds in them and are often in them whether the doors are closed or not. 

Best wishes

Hi Marianne, can you put one of the boys out in the kennel with someone else for company. If you know he's got everything he needs - water, toys etc then in your situation I would put a citrus collar on him to stop him barking. I know they're frowned upon, but with neighbours like yours and a dog he'll fight with in the house it may be an ideal answer. The collar won't hurt him, and in my experience won't upset him one bit but will stop him barking.

I've no words of wisdom, I'm afraid, but I do feel so sorry that you are having all these problems :( Let's just hope that your sale goes through ASAP and that will be a few of your problems solved :)

Thinking of you :)

Daisy

Hi Marianne

For some reason I didn't get the email notification for this :rolleyes:

Re the boys - sounds pretty bad and I can understand your anxiety and frustration.  Is there a big age gap between the two not getting on and are they the same breed?

It may be worth trying to cage rather than kennel them on a turn each basis - but within sight of yourself going about your usual routine (so reducing isolation howling etc).  Have you another easy going pair which could alternate and keep the confined male company?   If, as I suspect, they're not used to being alone then toys, treats etc aren't likely to help nor company if they know that "Mum" is still around somewhere.

Of course this may not be any use in your own domestic circumstances. 
sending support on the cyber waves ;)  Teri x

Just saw this Teri -just written a long explanation below. Rambo is a 16 month old Malinois and he is the one doing the attacking, and Dandy is a 10 ½ year old Golden so very big age gap. The other two boys are Simba 3 yr Golden (entire as well) and Arnie, 4 yr old cross (neutered) and Arnie and Simba don't seem to come into the equation at all. Dandy has a hip score of 96 and so mainly sleeps all day -he's a very large boy and these days very calm, big softie really.

Hi again Marianne,

I have no experience with Pano at all - all I know is that it is very painful and can be overcome in time :(

At Rambo's age, with the biting incident and professional belief that it was pain related, I don't think that necessarily all hope is lost ;)  It may be that the agression shown towards your elderly boy is bullying - plain and simple.  Some young adolescent dogs will pick on a weaker one within the pack rather than push their luck with a more equal contender.  Fortunately this behaviour often passes when maturity is reached and as Rambo is only 16 months now and this has been going on for a while then it's possible that much of it is hormone and age related.   I'm under no illusions that a BSD, probably in particular a Malinois, getting feisty takes grit, determination and 100% attention which I'm sure under normal circumstances you could cope with.  Unfortunately with all the added worry of your move it's probably seeming like an insurmountable problem right now - try not to focus too much on it and stick with preventative measures until such times as your domestic arrangements allow you to put more in.

Have to nip out now - so will catch up later.

Teri x  

Thanks Teri. :) If we can just get sorted with the move I am sure we can sort things out -I ALWAYS wanted Dandy to live indoors all the time anyway, with the younger dogs outside a lot more, so he could have more comforts such as a soft bed -some of the young dogs eat bedding so can't have that! So we were always planning to change things slightly.

In 6 months time everything could be different, we just have to cope now. Hopefully Rambo will recover from the Pano -it seems to be people's experience that they do. (We are meant to have another x-ray done soon to check progress.) I don't like to say it, but Dandy is very much on borrowed time. His hips will give up one day and personally (before anyone else wants to tell me differently, this is NOT a statement on the breed but of MY dogs -I've had 9 Goldens) -I have never had a Golden live for longer than 11 years yet.

And yes, it very much seems to me a case of picking on the weak dog. Once upon a time Dandy could have stood up to anyone. In size alone he is 13 kgs more than Rambo!

Oh heck Marianne,
Have just read this!  Keep your chin up.  You weren't meant to get this one!
  Good luck with the "boys" too, as you know, I've been through this one too, though not quite as serious as yours sounds.

Big hugs,

Sarah.

So sorry to hear about all you've been through after getting back from Sweden.
To me it sounds as if there is still hope of getting the new house. Will keep everything crossed for you, know how much you wanted to get away from your present neighbours.
I'd try Ridgielover's suggestion, a cage to prevent them from getting to each other, without any of them feeling abandoned.
Good luck with everything.
Karen

Hi Marianne

Big hug from all at Gron-De-Mon - what a nightmare you are going through at the moment. I really hope that the situation with your move is sorted quickly as this would certainly help with the dog fighting situation.

The way that I got my boys used to being kenneled is as follows ;

every time I put them in I gave them a command " be good" and a small chew stick.
at first I left them there for no more than 15 minutes then released them (and took the chews away if unfinished)
I repeated this up to 6 times daily gradually increasing the amount of time I left them there and always staying within earshot so that I could repeat the command if they barked.
I also fed the boys all their meals in 'their' kennels.

Now if both Trevor and I are away they stay in their kennels with no fuss. When we are here we leave the kennel doors open and all the dogs can mooch around together in the dog room/yard but 9 times out of 10 the boys can be found snoozing in ther kennels through choice. Everybody comes through to the living room at the end of the day to have hugs on the sofa and at night they either sleep in the dog room or kennel - again I leave the doors open so that they can choose. The boys are ALWAYS fed in their kennels and definitely view them as their own space.

However the initial training perod was quite noisy and given your charming neighbours I think would be very stressful for you to carry out.

To be honest Marianne - if the move doesn't happen I would think about rehoming your youngest boy the fighting could well escalate and you really need to remove him from the situation before a serious injury occurs.

Malinois are  fantastic but I do believe them to be MUCH harder work than either the Groens or Tervs - and when they fall out things can be very tough.

I'm keeping everything crossed for you - if your move goes ahead then hopefully your dog problems too will be easier to manage.

take care

Yvonne

Thanks Yvonne and everyone else. I am considering everything and I am running all my thoughts past the trainer I use for her views. For now, I have sent Dandy the Golden off to stay with my mother in law. I just could not cope being on my own with hubby at work. It was impossible to do even small things like getting dogs in and out for toilet visits, and last night I had another bad fight with yet more injuries. The dogs were all miserable.  The only one acting like nothing was going on was the pup, thankfully -she's as happy as ever.  Dandy got to the stage that he would start shaking the moment he saw Rambo, and it was out of fear.  Rambo got so wary of me being upset and having to try to separate him and Dandy when fighting that when I'd fed him on his own outside and just walked out to pick his bowl up, he took one look at me and fled to the bottom of the garden. NOT a nice feeling, your previously so loving dog wanting to get as far away from you as possible. :(

So for now, Dandy has to stay with MIL. I was in tears sending him off this morning. Of course, I don't know what will happen as if we cannot buy the bungalow she is in, then she has to move out and into a rented one with a "no pets" rule. THEN things will get really difficult.

Thanks for all the tips on kennelling Yvonne. Sounds like I best start when we have moved. If we get this bungalow it is smaller than this house so we'd need some of the dogs to be kept outside, or in rotation, to give everyone more space. With Rambo's current problems there is no way I can re-home him. I have not mentioned this on here before as it was ongoing (well still is I guess), with possible legal action, and extremely upsetting and this is a very public forum, but I always intended to mention something in breed notes eventually anyway as I am sure rumours are flying in the breed. So:

Some time ago Rambo bit a friend of mine. I won't go into details because it will take too long. We did all we could to investigate WHY as it was so out of character, and so we have seen a vet/behaviourist, been referred etc, and I have a signed letter stating their findings etc, and in a nutshell the behaviourist believes Rambo bit because of his extreme pain with the panosteitis -much more pain than we had known about. It was a reflex action due to hurting. I was not nearby. The official advice is that we must now NEVER hand him over to anyone else even for a moment, as with us around he is fine (eg. he will let anybody touch him, such as a judge, even though on his right side he DOES hurt when touched) and given a choice he will always back off rather than confront. (When the incident occured he was no ABLE to back off as he was cornered.) But obviously realistically with this history we could never find him another home as it would be irresponsible. This is why I have been asking questions about Pano and people's experience with recovery from it -hoping that he WILL recover. If he doesn't, there is only one option left.

Poor Rambo has everything against him right now really -the pano, worst teenage stage (16 mths), John & I are very stressed due to the house problems, and a bitch is due in season so it's quite possible he's sensing that. I am hoping HOPING that in say 6 months time he will be back to normal again. Until then all we can do is to keep doing our best for him. And Dandy, who has done  nothing wrong at all yet had to be separated from everyone. :( Good job MIL spoils him (but she has been told TOYS not treats! Can't have a dog with HD get fat) -in a way it was lucky this happened just 2 weeks after her dog died........

Sarah how did you manage yours?

Just wanted to say Marianne that I do hope things get sorted out soooner rather than later. I'm sure too that Rambo and indeed any of your gang will be picking up on stress - you can't help it as you have the neighbour problems, house problems and everything else. I once knew 2 gorgeous dogs, they were brothers and got on really well except when the owners were stressed, then they fought like blazes (but only at this time, never at any other).

Hugs,
Lindsay
x

interesting! Well it's like people as well I guess -John and I normally NEVER argue but lately we do, and we both know and acknowledge it is due to the stress and nothing else. (So we blame the awkward farmer rather than each other. :D )

Hi Marianne,
As you know, Dylan and Buster are next to each other in the pack order (typical :rolleyes: ).  They get on brilliantly most of the time but we do get the occasional "brotherly" squable, which never leads to any bloodshed, it tends to be all noise and no action.  I never leave them alone together, just in case.  Buster's left in the living room with the girls and Dylan is crated.  It could be as Lindsey has suggested, down to picking up stress from yourselves or it could be that your Rambo boy is becoming a "man" and is after a higher position.  I'm not a behaviour expert and can only tell you what I do with my own lot, but I tend to make sure the higher up one (you have to decide who is higher up in the pack at this time) gets attention, food etc first.  With my lot, I feed, treat, pet in pack order and this seems to work for me.

Best of luck and take the bits of advice that will suit you,
Hugs,
Sarah.

Marianne, I cant say any words to help or advice, I just hope that you get the problems with the new house sorted very quickly and things settle down for you.
Lea :)

Hi Marianne

Milor - our 3 year old Groen boy - had Pano as a youngster - he's absoloutely fine now - it started out in the long bones of his right fore leg and then moved on to the left - he was on Metacam and lots of rest - much to his frustration !. It lasted about 8 months but went quite suddenly and he is now as sound as a bell. Strangely although he had quite a pronounced limp on the affected side he appeared not to be in any pain throughout the time he had it - literally throwing himself at folk for cuddles - but then he's always been a bit of a bimbo !.

From what you've told us I think that your bitch coming into season could well be the trigger for Rambo's 'pushiness' - it sounds as if you've found a good compromise for the moment with Dandy staying with your MIL - really hope that things work out well.

Yvonne

PS - pay no mind to rumours - they are usually started ( and spread) by people with small minds and big mouths !.

VERY encouraging thanks! Was his legs affected visibly in any way? I.e. Rambo looks like Charlie Chaplin, that was the first sign. We didn't notice the pain either, not until the behaviourist had us bend and squeeze the legs etc (I noticed then how tense he got at the right side, and after bending right front he limped badly), and when they went over him and he jumped a mile when they touched his right side -he doesn't do that for us. It's like he's braver with mum and dad close by. :)

UPDATE!! The farmer who put the clause in the contract saying no dogs to be kennelled or bred phoned yesterday and said he has NO problem with US keeping and breeding whatever we like, it is just to apply if we ever sell the house, and he has instructed his solictor to change it so that it clearly says we are allowed. So it looks like the move is back on once AGAIN!! (How many times is this it has been cancelled and then back on again I wonder.) Another problem though, the sellers were an older couple and the wife has now suddenly died. Our solicitor believes they were joint owners. I hope it won't mean further delays as I know she was meant to sign papers etc.

Hope it all works out - good and bad news all in one go!  I'll keep my fingers crossed for you,
Maxine

Another problem though, the sellers were an older couple and the wife has now suddenly died. Our solicitor believes they were joint owners. I hope it won't mean further delays as I know she was meant to sign papers etc.

Shouldn't cause too much problem as there is no inheritance tax for spouses & unless she left her share to someone else the hubby should be ok to sign the paper work

Paws tightly crossed here for you

If the wife hasn't made a will doesn't that slow up the process?  I know a friend who had to wait a few months before she and her siblings could sell their dad's house because he hadn't made a will and it had to go to probate. No sure what that means but she explained it as his estate had to pass through the hands of the State before it came to them whereas if he'd made a will it would have been more straight forward and quicker.   Mind you, this was quite a few years ago so things might have changed since then.

Whatever, I hope things turn out well, you've certainly waited long enough

I would have thought the biggest risk is if the husband decides he cant move and doesnt want to leave the memories........  Hopefully he will want to honour her memory by carrying out their plans,

If there is no will the property goes straight to the next of kin which is the husband in this case, no probate/letters of administration are needed

You can't have probate if their is no will you have to go down the letter of administration in cases of intestacy

Thanks ALL. Just got word from the solictor as well that it should NOT be a problem. :) :) The husband moved out already well over a year ago to live with his son (well both did), the house was empty for a while and currently my MIL is renting it. (WE can't move in with all the animals until we own it!)

Sounds good so far...

Thats great news Marianne.
Keeping everything crossed for you
Lea :)

Paws & fingers & toes all crossed here for you

crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws crossing fingers crossing paws

:-D :-D :-D

WOOO! talk about a roller coaster ride Marianne :D - lets hope that you'll sono be safely installed in your new country home

Yvonne

Now we just need to find a reliable buidler for the garage conversion -what's te betting that's going to be really stressful too LOL!!

Hi Marianne,

Great News!  Please God your troubles are behind you now - it's certainly been a challenging transaction to say the least.

best of luck - things are on the up :) :) :)

good luck,looks like things are finally looking up for you then :)

oooo I know two of those, only they're too far away from you sadly

Best of luck!!  Will keep everything crossed for you.

Sarah.

lol@ Lori!!!
Oh Marianne, Im sooo glad to hear things are looking brighter for you,I cant imagine how youve coped with all the stress and things that have been thrown at you this year! Im so pleased youve finally got some good news..long awaited and well deserved!
Continued good luck xx (and I better go untangle Lori and her GR :D)