Hey all,

I have a dog and a bitch and some people know. They've had a litter and I kept a pup.

This is also a bitch now 8 months old. There's been just one other incident like this, but the past TWO mornings, as I get out the food bag, all hell breaks loose !

A real nasty fight breaks out between the bitches. Now I know I need to seperate them at feeding times now, but I do leave them in the back garden in the pen together when out.

Will this 'bad feeling' continue and boil over whilst I'm out, even tho there's no food there? Or do dogs not work like this?

Also - is it possible they're STARVING and I'm not feeding them enough , hence they fight?

(Although they don't seem as tho they're hungry until morning. I feed them one large bowl of dry with tuna or sardines etc mixed)

I think sexual maturity is the far more likely cause.  I would never leave them alone unsupervised.  This is a breed that could easily do tremendous damage to each other.

I have always heard it said that Akita's in common with soem other dog dominant breeds should never be left alone unattended, especially with their own sex. 

As the younger is reaching sexual maturity you are likely to have more problems down the line unless you split them up when you are not there.

I wouldn't leave them unsupervised at all - IME it's unusual for an 8 month pup to take on or even retaliate with a fully mature adult, likewise, if the relationship between them is good, I wouldn't expect an adult to exercise any more discipline over a pup than a lot of noise and when all else fails a snap.

It may be they are getting insufficient food - however only you can determine that by feeling them, i.e. are their ribs and pin bones sufficiently, but not excessively, covered?

You mention feeding one large bowl - do you mean each, or between them    Certainly I would not expect dogs to share a food bowl as while it is not unheard of for them to be OK with one another, it is certainly unusual ;)

In view of the sheer size and strength of your breed I would certainly have them separate at all times when there is no-one around to ensure that they are safe in each others company.

HTH, Teri :) 

:D

No no ... one large bowl each !!! haha

As I say there's been only one incident before, but it's the past 2 mornings in a row now .... EACH TIME, it's been food orientated .... otherwise they're excellent together ... I'd go so far as say like a real mother and daughter ....

Relieved about the food bowls ;)

>I'd go so far as say like a real mother and daughter

hmmmm, depends on how well all the mums and their daughters get on that you've ever met   Not always plain sailing in humans or dogs ;)

My bitch and her daughter have never exchanged more than a few dirty looks and maybe two grumbles - all from mum - in over two years.  I've got friends in a substantially smaller and naturally meeker breed than yours where the mother and daughter would shred one another given half a chance.

Personally I think it ill advised to leave them together unattended but of course the decision is yours - anyone else can only advise.

regards, Teri 

People I speak to who breed the same breed tend to think that Bitches are ok together (not around food, of course .. but mine always have been, which is why I'm surprised) anyway, they tell me it's the males you cannot keep together ...

Testing the theory may prove heartbreaking.

I'm not sure why you asked for opinions in the first place if you want to continue as you are

I have several friends with your breed and have known many examples of Akitas "up close and personal" for around 15-18 years.  It's not a breed which is forgiving of another dog or bitch which has challenged it - you must know that much for sure :rolleyes:

I know this for sure outside , it's just never happened really 'inside' , this is the first I've known of any internal challenge. I suppose we treat them too much like babies and forget what they actually are :rolleyes:

Hi again,

bitches in any breed are notoriously more dangerous when fighting with one another than males - males are usually all mouth and trousers and any spats swift and soon forgotten.  Bitches can harbour life long grudges and when a fight breaks out it is generally much more meaningful and likely to be bloody than with males.  Add to this the distinct traits of your own breed and I think it's fair to say that if you have a problem brewing it would be safer to take precautions as of now rather than let it brew and fester with them.  It's not worth coming home to a seriously injured (or worse) dog/s as a test of how well they may get on together.

regards, Teri

Dogs fight for breeding rights
Bitches fight for breathing rights.

But I, I, I, I was trying to say that :D  must learn to do short & sweet :P

It all makes sense ... !

What would you advise for INSIDE the house, whilst I'm in etc ... there's nothing funny indoors so is it ok to just 'keep my eye on them'

??

Also ... as above where somebody said it's unusual for an 8 month old pup to 'challenge for position' what does this indicate?

You have to guage how the dogs are with one another at all times.  If you think there are issues beginning to develop over anything, attention, food, toys, water bowl, squeezing through doorways together then you have to be sure and keep on top of it :)  This may or may not mean that you have to keep the girls separate - even indoors - only you can determine what is best based on what you observe and know of the individual dogs' characters.

It was me who mentioned it being unusual to have an adult and 8 month pup challenging one another - personally I think it's a problem in the making but it's not something so easily diagnosed over the internet.  All I can suggest is that you proceed with caution between these two bitches as you may well have serious problems ahead if you are having relatively minor ones already.

regards, Teri   

Problems with Akita bitches are usually in older bitches..but I have only a fancy for these dogs and not experienced enough to advise!
I can recommend Chris&Tina Thomas of the Nosferatu (sp?) Kennel (Im quite sure they Judge Akita's too) I hope I've spelt that right put Nosferatu Akitas in search their web site should come..theyre verrrrrry helpful/approachable!
HTH :)
(I have their add somewhere but have just changed ISP and havent yet had time to change all my address's etc over, but if you cant find it shout out and I'll find it here somewhere!)

Bitches will challenge each other, and if your 8 month does not wish to back down you will have very seroious trouble ahead, two strong bitches like this can really do some damage to each other.

What you must remember is that anything may set them off, at the moment it is assertiveness over food, it may be something as innocent as a feather floating between them and they both want it (I'm being serious) or the leads coming out and a tussel to get the lead on first, when bitches challenge it is truly over nothing important, which is why I agree it is not safe to leave them alone, you never know what could set them off. They may get on like a house on fire 90% of the time, but that 10% when they turn they can kill each other.

Things may calm down the pup may not challenge her mother with maturity, but you must be prepared for this also not happening, and them being seperated at all times or one re-homed. With such a strong breed it would be hard to keep two if they both wanted to be Alpha female. :-(

I agree with the above posts, also would mention that if you are very lucky it may just be a bit of resource guarding over the food coming out. This isn't necessarily due to hormones, although if it does occur along with other problems then it is likely to be part of the dogs assessing each other and getting hormonal more.

I noticed you said it is as the food bag comes out - I'd keep a very close eye  on all dogs all the time to be safe, but what you could try just to manage and perhaps help you gauge what is happening is to get the dogs under total control whilst the actual food bag is being got out - put them in a different room if necessary, (but not with the 2 bitches together as they could start fighting as adrenalin could have already started as they know food bag is being got out)  and then put the food in their bowls and put their bowls around separately to give them space to eat in peace.

Be very aware and if you sense more trouble, I'd contact someone to come in and assess the problem who can give guidance :)

Hi, I dont know a lot about this breed, but my son has a friend who breeds these dogs, has had them for yrs...I know he will talk your socks off  about his breed if you let him........not sure if I can put up his web site on here, but will PM you with it , you could give him a call and ask his advice if you like.......he may be able to help!

This is just my experience,my two dogs brother and sister,can,t be fed close together as it is the bitch,who starts to snarl and growl,I feed them so they can,t actually see each other,only one tussle very early on when I had them, after that I have never taken the risk,but this problem,with them has never gone away,supervised with bones as well,BUT they can,t bear to be apart,and cry thier eyes out if they are, on the odd occasion seperated.

So please don,t be fooled by the usual 'nice'behaviour they show together,I am no expert,but I guess its down to survial with feeding.
Ash.

I own 2 shiba inu bitches (and 3 elkhound entire males).The 2 bitches were fine together until the younger one reached about 12 months and then they had a few little scraps ...we seperated them and then kept a close eye on them...not enough! Another fight broke out without warning and before we could seperate them one had a chunk missing from her face ....£200 vets bill!!!
We now have to seperate them with either one in a crate or keep them in different rooms with at least 2 barriers between them to prevent accidents.They will even try to drag each other THROUGH a stair gate!
This is all from a smaller Inu breed weighing only 8 Kg.We have both(Me and OH) been bitten seperating them and it always takes 2 people to get them apart.
If your 2 decide to go at each other it can be instant...no growls or raised hackles and if you haven't got help you have no hope of seperating them....IMO you need to keep them apart,esp when alone.2 akitas could inflict serious damage on each other..and anyone who gets in the way.
Archer

Hi there

It is so sad to have dogs and have to keep them apart.  IMO if I had dogs that couldn't get on then I would rehome one of them because, to me, its no life having to live like that (for the owners and the dogs!) and they would be happier apart.  It also strikes me that the OP has little experience and having 3 dogs of that size, with the damage that could be caused, is surely an accident waiting to happen.

This is quite scary reading and my advice would be to rehome the puppy now before further problems arise.

Annie

I have a friend who bred akitas for years, and she never ever has kept two bitches in the same room - they will challenge each other, even if they are mother & daughter.  

They can be kept in pairs - ie male & female (obviously, if they are pets, spayed & neutered) fairly happily tho!

Margot

Hi - I've got a bitch akita and bitch lab and they get on like a house on fire.  There was a brief "Stop pestering me" moment from my akita once the lab reached about 8 months, but now they are both great together.  kennelled together, eat together, sleep together etc.  (Akita is now 4 and lab is 3.5)  It may just be that the lab is not a dog dominant breed so they get on

Oh and neither has been done

Hi,
It is quite natural, two women one man, it will. dogs are no diffrent. Take the dog away and the bitches will get on fine. Put the dog back they will fight untill one submits. Take one bitch away any and they will get on fine.
This will not stop untill they are to old to bother. Food is not the issue. I personally would not hold food to ransam. I feel this increases the dogs to be greedy.
It does not mater if its his daughter that doesn't come into the accusation its a bitch!!

Unfortunately bitches don't need a dog to fight over...any excuse will do in some cases....:rolleyes:
Archer