Hi guys
Maybe there should be a champfish site lol

I have a tropical community fish tank.  I have noticed in a number of shops how the high amount of different shrimps, crabs, lobster and snails being sold.  Does anyone know if these are good for a community tank and also what they do in the cycle of the tank?

Hi,

I've had algae shrimps ( aka Amano Shrimps/ Caridina) for a year now in my tanks and they do a really good job of keeping them nice and clean.  They do need lots of vegetable matter and places to hide tho so they need to be in a planted tank ;)  and being small they need to be in with small fish otherwise they become a very expensive snack they don't seem to add much of a loading to the tank.  I have half a dozen in each tank but really could do with more.  They don't like living alone, they like lots of other shrimps for company :D

The Crabs and Lobsters (not really Lobsters - they're actually Crayfish! and not all of them are legal in this country ;) )  do have a tendency to eat any fish they can catch so not really a good addition to the tank. 

There's loads of info on the Practical Fish Keeping website for all the different crustaceans found in the shops, just go to home on the following page
Amano Shrimps

other sites you may find useful are

Aquaria Central   and   http://wetwebfotos.com/talk/index.jsp

and also  Aqualink 

These (free) sites will tell you everything you could ever want to know about cycling and running a tank successfully and are brilliant no matter what level of expertise you have :D :D :D

Hope this helps :D :D

Thats cool Dill thanks so much I will go have a look now.

I really want to find a masterpiece fish too to finish off my tank so hopefully will get some ideas lol thanks so much x x x

LOL

You're very welcome :D

I love to see people becoming really successful with their aquariums :)   It's so relaxing when it all goes right and heartbreaking (and expensive) if it doesn't, there are so many people who have bought expensive fishtanks and equipment and then when things go wrong it all goes to waste :(   The worst thing is, that often it's the advice novices have recieved from unscrupulous and ignorant petshops :(  I find myself having to either walk out of these places or having arguments with the staff when I overhear them giving really bad advice about tanks and fish :rolleyes:  eg. "oh yes you can put that pacu (grows to 2 feet+) in a 2ft tank it will stay small because of the size of the tank :rolleyes:   or  " Just put this medication in the water and it'll be ok"  :rolleyes:  all too often medications are needed because of bad tank management or poor quality fish sold by the same shop

Having said all that you'll usually get good advice at Maidenhead Aquatic stores, most of their staff are enthusiasts, not the cheapest of places but they do help novices who ask :)

As you've probably guessed I'm also an aquaria nut :D :D

LOL Dill

Thats where I got my tank from they were great :-)

I''m in love with a new tank at MA :rolleyes:  it's absolutely gorgeous :)  just have to find the cash cos I know it'll look fab with plants and fish and I love the filtration type :D :D

Oooooooooh fishy talk....

Tank number four will be arriving tomorrow (second hand juwel vision 260)...

Anyway, back to shrimps. Depends whats IN your community... currently i have a quarantine tank (current residents one guppy one black spotted spiny eel and one apple snail), an 'oddball' tank - two giant african filter shrimp, two zebra spiny eels and a small shoal of silver tip tetras, and my BIG 'aggressive' community... not very aggressive but... four angels, umpteen different kinds of nippy bolshy tetras and a large gibbiceps plec.

Of those tanks i wouldnt put small shrimps in ANY of them and most of the 'normal feeders' are very small - so small in fact you will rarely see them in a big tank.

So, what is in your community and what size tank do you have?

If you have a 2ft tank or pref bigger, go for shrimp you will be able to see, and these are usually the filter feeders rather than the oens with pincers.

I currently keep giant african filter shrimp, aka vampire shrimp. These are probably one of the biggest true shrimps you can get hold of, growing to a max of 6" as adults. They are also completely harmless to anything bigger than a dead brine shrimp (sea monkey!!) as they eat tiny particles of food they find on the bottom or floating abotu in the water.
They are a greyish blue colour usually, ranging from reddishbrownish right through to a deep dark blue depending on feeding, mood, stress, season, age...

Smaller than that are asian filter shrimp, aka bamboo shrimp or wood shrimp. These guys usually appear in fish shops as a mottled browny tan colour with a pale stripe down the middle of the back. In best health in your tank, they should change to a reddy orange shade with a very definate cream stripe. These guys grow to around 3", again completely harmless to anything in your tank as they feed in exactly the same way as their bigger african cousins.

If you pick your community carefully, these guys, certainly the bigger africans (latin name atya gabonensis) will not get eaten, though you must make sure they are getting enough food....

They acn be bullied though, and my first atya was finished off by my gibbiceps plec, he didnt eat him, but they dont stand rough treatment very well.

Other things to take into account, asides from bullying fish, are water parameters... these guys need a much less acidic water than most amazonian tropical fish (thats yer angels, tetras etc), and quite hard water...again unlike angels, tetras, plecs, etc.... This isnt a huge issue, if you make the water harder for the shrimp, the fish can acclimatise. But if it is too acidic and soft you'll find the shrimp struggle when moulting and can have problems and deformities.

These guys ARE hardier than their smaller shrimpy cousins as far as water conditions go and better suited to livng with fish than the amano shrimps, red cherries, ghosts etc, and much less likely to be eaten. They wont do anythign for any algae issues though but they are great at clearing up uneaten food off the bottom.

Em

Not going to let my amano shrimp read this :)  they're in very soft acid water (blackwater tanks) with delicate tetras and they're thriving :D  they even provide some food for the fish :D :D  as they release eggs regularly :D

I do tend to keep what will live in my local water tho, rather than trying to alter water parameters - life's easier that way :)

Have to say its not such a huge deal for smaller shrimp.... they dont grow as big so they dont shed as often.

With a BIG shrimp.... acid water can really knacker em up!

Em

thanks evferyone for your help xxx Woke up this morning after putting in some new neons two days ago and all my fish are on the top gasping for air so going quickly to the pet shop to see if they can give me some type of advice or something to put in to help them as i am really worried about them

If they are gasping then they usually need more oxygen ....have you plenty of plants and an air system in the tank? :)

What Melodysk said, and how long has the tank been set up?  Gasping can also mean there's too much ammonia in the tank, usually when too many fish have been added at once, or when the filter hasn't had time to adjust to the fish that are already in there.

It's probably an oxygen thing tho - some fish need more than others.  I have to have a HUGE airpump on my tank - I keep lemonfin barbs and they need a lot of air!

thanks for the advice.  Had the tank a while now but just done a test and my nitrate levels where through the roof so did a half water change and they seem to be looking a lot better and healthy...for the minute anyway.

How can you work out how many gallans a tank holds with out emptying it.  I have a four foot by one foot tank? is there any mathimatical equation i can do?

Fish tank Volume Caluclator

;)

You need 3 measurements though not just the 2 you gave :)

rough guess is about 180l ish.... my 4ft by 12 by 15 is about 200l.

Do you not have any live plants?? They do help keep the nitrate down ...

Is tank over stocked at all or is it under filtered (i always over filter my tanks, the 200l tank is filtered by an external filter which is meant for a 300l tank).

Em

What theemx said,

Plus,  when doing a water change and cleaning the filter do you wash out the fliter material in tank water?  Some manufacturers neglect to give this advice in the maintenance info, but it's vital for keeping your filter bacteria alive ;)

Have you tested your water supply?  some water supplies can have nitrates already which means you have to be careful with water changes.

I grow fast growing, weedy type plants and cut them regularly to help with nitrate removal ;)  Hygrophila is particularly good as it doesn't require high light levels or co2

Ooh yes....

when  you clean your filter... do the water change first, then rinse the filter media in the bucket of manky fish water. (Then take the manky fish water and throw it on your veg patch/flowerbeds/compost heap)....

If you have to replace some filter media (not very often!!!), replace HALF of it, cut any sponges in half.... replacing all of it, same as washing media under hot tap water (or even cold tap water) means you have no 'good' bacteria left so  your tank will be running on just mechanical filtration until the filter is mature again - that would easily cause an ammonia (and everything else) spike.

Em