I know this bored has had a few of these recently but i have just got back from my walk quite upset.
My vizsla is very scared of dogs and so can snap at them. She never mouthed as a pup and so never learned bite inhibition (I know i should have got her mouthing so that i could work on it but just after we got her we discovered my mum had breast cancer and so ziggi got left to the side a bit. I will never forgive myself for not socialising her enough at that point due to the stress in the family. anyway that is history and there is nothing i can do about it). Due not to knowing her bite strength she now wears a muzzle whenever out and not on a lead.
I have two dogs so i walk them together on wimbledon common and usually it is lovely. However today really upset me.
when ever i see a dog, i call ziggi and put her on a lead. i then ask for a sit and calmly talk to her, and give her the command to leave the dog. This is usually good until the dog comes in to her safety zone. Now i understand that dogs will come up to her and it is my job to keep her under control (which i do and whenever sheis on a lead she never hurts anything, but can make a lot of noise).
I am not asking people to stop their dogs coming up but what really hurts is when i get the snide comments of the owners (usually pairs of women pushing buggies (no offence meant as i am sure none of you are like this)
today was the worse and i just feel so pathetic trying to calm my dog down (who is just scared) and trying to stop myself from getting upset about the comments i get.
I just would have thought people would be happy that my dog is muzzled, leaded and undercontrol.
sorry about this rant i am just sick of peoples comments when they know that i can hear.
Sitting hear in tears and really not wanting to let it happen again.
Also i try and appoligise for my dog's behaviour but i get realy anxious (i have social anxiety disorder) and get all my words mixed up and they end up walking off laughing and continuing the horrible comments.
sorry just a bit upset and needed some people who i know are nice, just so i can rant abit.
Thanks and sorry

Please remember that if your dog is on a lead and next to you, it is under control. It is those that have their dogs run up to you who are not under control. Remember you are the one that is acting responsibly, so don't beat yourself up about it.
A friend of mine has a breed who are not good with other strange dogs, she therefore walks her dog on the lead.
She has had people have a go at her dog just because she has asked them to keep their dogs under control, ie, away from hers.
Not that you would want it to happen but if your dog had a go at one off the lead that ran up to yours, it would be the other dog that would be at fault, as yours was on the lead.
People will made blind observations if they see a dog with a muzzle. That it is vicious. If you dog is fine and you only use one because of other dogs actions. I would not use one personally, your dog has a right to defend itself if it is being bothered by others.
Try not to let this experience upset you. Walk out with your dog in the knowledge YOU are one behaving responsibly and are not at fault.
I had it happen once, I had a youngster on a lead as his recall was not yet good enough. Two large dogs came flying up to us. I asked the owners to control their dogs, which they said they were under control. My reply was that if they had control why did the dogs completely ignore the owners calling. A dog with no recall is a dog out of control, friendly or not.
Most dogs if they're space is invaded will act one of two ways, back off or have a go back in various degrees. That is a dogs' way. Just as you would push someone away if they were in your face treading on your toes.
Don't blame yourself. Just a  thought but would it be worth going to a few socialisation/training classes as well. It would benefit the dog and also help you I think. Remember the dog might also be defending you if you are getting upset when it happens.

Ditto to megan57collies. It's YOU being responsible, the other people should NOT let their dogs go up to yours!

What sort of comments are you getting Anna?  You sound a very responsible owner to me so don't let those other people get to you - there are many ignorant people about. :(

enjoy your dog - you've obviously got a great bond with her - and ignore these sad people who have nothing more constructive to do than make ignorant comments.

*Family size box of Kleenex,honourary seat reserved at my Kitchen table,Big slab of Cadburys..erm no..hang it! its an emergency..we'll get the Thorntons out!! ;) and bottle of something nice :D*

OK..ready when you are Sweetpea! *thrusts a waterproof shoulder forward*
   Ditto dont let the blaggards get you down!! easier said than done.. but its sticks and stones Anna. You shouldnt have to feel like this after a walk, you poor thing :( it should be fun and have you coming back feeling energised not demoralised. Is there anyone you can get to walk with you? and do you think perhaps it might help you both to perhaps have a one to one trainer walk with you for a few sessions, iron out a few of Ziggi's niggles and set her on a better path,it can all be straighten out with time and patience (Storm came to us after having been locked in a shed for the first year of his life with no other canine interaction, he was a whirling dervish and now 9 months later, still working on it mind, but calm and placid to a tee! it can be turned around)
   Chin up, your worth much more than to let presumtious people upset you!
{Hugs} x

ditto to what everyone else has said, i wouldnt bother to apologise to these people if i were you, you have nothing to apologise for.

This is exactly why a friends dobe bitch is taken out road walking after dark muzzled and on a head collar.

She was well socialised as a pup, and problems started from her first season where she started reacting negatively to other dogs.  she was shown but as she got older she just got more and more stressed and fearful when out of the house.

She was spayed as it certainly seemed to be worse the more seasons she had, but by this time the behaviour was too ingrained.

Her aggression is entirely fear aggression, but she would bark and lunge at unexpected objects and people too in due course, and trying desensitising was just soo difficult with peoples reactions. 

If she had been a yapping Yorkie no-one would have turned a hair.  They were worried about the perception of them having a dangerous dog, and someone complaining, so evening on lead walks are her only excersise away from home each day.

If you met her at home she is the sweetest dog imagineable, she greets everyone warmly stranger or friend, but when out of the house it is almost as if she doesn't recognise you.  I would say she is agoraphobic.

She knows my dogs well since a baby puppy having stayed with them here during her first season, and from 5am walks together when her owner was working, yet if we pass her owner when out walking she would try to go for them, though seems to realise who we are if I speak to her, but by then mine might be on the defensive so we walk on without stopping too long.

What I am saying is that unfortunately you will just have to get a tough skin to other peoples reactions if you are absolutely sure that your dog cannot become a danger, or else avoid people as much as possible as my friends have reluctantly chosen to do, as getting upset will go down the lead to the dog, and an unstressed owner will be better for her.

I have found that it is often the people with out of control dogs that get the most agressive and horrible when you ask them to control the dog. I had a collie come running up and jumping all over Floyd when he was still really little, the woman was calling to no avail, and when I asked her to control the dog she got hold of it, and then let it go again straight at Floyd. When I told her, no, really under control, he is only a little pup and doesn't need to be jumpped on whilst attached to me via a lead, she went beserk swearing, calling me all sorts of names etc. I was really down at the time and nearly cried on the spot! I think these people know they are at fault and so get defensive when it is pointed out. I just walked away, with her shouting after me, I was shaking but I didn't want to stand around and listen to it. I think the other posters are right, if you know you have done your best, for both your dog and theirs as it happens in this case, then you should hold your head up high, you do not need to explain or enter a confrontation, just walk away and leave them to their horrid thoughts :rolleyes: Hope you're feeling better now, it really leaves you shaken when people are so outrageous in their attitude towards you. {{hugs}}

Good grief, don't apologize to them! My response would be to yell over that my dog was scared of other dogs and if they were any kind of decent human beings they would have some compassion for a frightened animal. (I used to be painfully shy but thankfully now I'm over 40 and bolshy as a very bolshy thing!)

You shouldn't let it upset you. Only a petty person would react that way to someone who was obviously trying their best - and succeeding in keeping their own and other dogs safe. They're not worth the poop in your scooper! ;-)

>They're not worth the poop in your scooper!<

:D :D :D LOL! (must remember that one!)

when ever i see a dog, i call ziggi and put her on a lead. i then ask for a sit and calmly talk to her, and give her the command to leave the dog. This is usually good until the dog comes in to her safety zone. Now i understand that dogs will come up to her and it is my job to keep her under control (which i do and whenever sheis on a lead she never hurts anything, but can make a lot of noise).
I am not asking people to stop their dogs coming up but what really hurts is when i get the snide comments of the owners (usually pairs of women pushing buggies (no offence meant as i am sure none of you are like this)
today was the worse and i just feel so pathetic trying to calm my dog down (who is just scared) and trying to stop myself from getting upset about the comments i get.
I just would have thought people would be happy that my dog is muzzled, leaded and undercontrol.

Hi there, sounds as if other owners are being unfair and judgemental! Probably as your dog has a muzzle on, they may think she is aggressive.

Can I just say, it may be helpful if your Ziggi is not asked to sit if there is a likelihood of other dogs coming up as it may increase her anxiety - knowing she should keep her sit, but being afraid and wanting to move away. If dogs are further away it is OK. I'd have her under control but not ask for sit if dogs come close, I'd release her from the sit :) Just a thought you may want to consider :)

Angela Stockdale teaches the "hide" which can help dogs to cope.

It may be worth looking into behavioural or training help as dogs can often be helped to overcome fears like this with desensitising and counterconditioning, although it would take some work and has to be done at the dog's pace :)

Sorry for your awful walk, don't let them get to you. Also would it help to rehearse what to say, and then just walk off calmly? Being prepared may be calming in itself.

Lindsay
x

thankyou for all your lovely comments they have really helped me cheer up.
I have been to see a behaviourist but the problem i have is the fact that she is perfectly fine with dogs unless
A) she comes face to face with them. or
B) they touch her
So it is very hard to desensitise her to them as she can be brilliant with them and then 1cm closer she with suddenly snap.

I don't make her sit if a dog comes too close i ask her to heel with me away. The thing is these people see me put her on the lead and then walk in a circle around them, i am sure they see the muzzle as well and yet they don't think to call their dogs away.

I am also worried about her not getting enough excersise if i always walk her on a lead and road.
I also have the problem of my parents. neither of them are dog focussed and just want to walk and not work on ziggi's problems.
so i can do loads of work in the week and then at the week end it will all go out the window (ziggi is my dads dog and so he likes to walk her - i can't tell him not to as he has aspergers syndrome and he will just take offence and make life really hard :( )

Any tips on how to get her over this. These are the techniques i use already:
treat and praise all the time she is good around dogs.
asking for different behaviours around dogs to take her mind off things.
heel work past them.

the problem is she has such a fine line to where she is good with dogs and when she is not.
I have tried shortening the distance between her and another controled dog but 4 months down the line we couldn't get past her safety zone. edited to say : this is under 5m away

Once she gets to know a dog she is absolutely fine and will be great friends. she also love entire males :) shes such a flirt with them even tho she is spayed.

I must say that she is actually dog aggressive hence  the muzzle ( she is also terrified of children) and i would not feel safe without it unless she was on a head collar.
help, i reallyyy don't know what to do :(

Poor you! Vizsla's are terrific dogs, you seem to me to be doing everything right, I'm surprised about her also being afraid of children this breed of dog are usually great with kids and other dogs.

Wimbledon Common is a great place to continue with her socialising skills, continue the way that you are, people's comments are always going to be hurtful, but try to rise above them. It is important for her to meet and greet and hopefully overcome her fears. Continue with what you are doing there. But....................

Please don't restict her off lead time, she is a high energy dog, I would not use this common for her off lead time, it has too many dogs, children, joggers etc. with her socialising probs not a great place for her. If you drive can you get her out to the country somewhere for her walks please try, get a friend to go with you somewhere very open spaced with not many dogs around to get a good run every day, she needs a good 120 minutes a day.

Look on your map for woodlands and conservative area's and more secluded fields. I believe a dog should always be allowed to run free and would personally search high and low for a place to take her. It would also relieve the pressure for you of meeting people and other dogs a dog walk should always be enjoyable for yourself and your dog. :-)

I would hate to stop her off lead time. She would actually go crazy. She gets at least 2hrs walking every day (usually 1.5hrs off lead and half an hour on).

We have always been suprized at her worry about children but in general she is a very nervous but loving dog. She is much better at being around children since some children have moved into our street and i baby sit for them.

I completely understand your point about trying to find a quiet place to walk with few dogs but...
... i get really scared walking on my own and all my friends are at uni and i am on my gap year so there is not really any one to go with.
i have only just been able to walk up on wimbledon common. I also have a problem with my other dog who has noise phobia so i can't go to my local park which has all of ziggis "friends" who she is brilliant with.
i don't understand what i have done wrong for both my dogs to have problems. I am always being told that i am really good with dogs and that i completly understand the way they behave. Hence running puppy classes at my vets. I have even done some one to one training sessions and everyone elses dogs have really come on after i have helped them. I just don't understand why my dogs are so messed up.

I love ziggi to bits and i just want to do the best for her.

i would never let my dog approach a muzzled dog as its totally unfair on the muzzled leashed dog to be in such a vulnerable situation but perhaps many people think, "Oh its got a muzzle, thats ok, cant hurt mine then, no problem", its dreadful if they do think that way but quite likely im afraid.

Anna you do sound as if you are doing really well and from what you say it doesn't sound as if Ziggi is too bad, unless i'm not understanding. I mean, she has her dog friends and will be friendly with a dog if she gets to know them, and will flirt with male dogs too :P

What is the worst thing that has happened, has she ever bitten or caused any injury, or are you scared in case she might due to not knowing about her bite inhibition? I'm guessing she's not ever caused an injury :)

However I quite understand your anxiety.

Lindsay
x

unfortunately, yes she has caused injury - to a weimaraner. Ever since she has, she wears a muzzle.
It was not a big injurey but it was still a bite :(.
This is what i can't understand. she can be brilliant with dogs and then with others she is bad if they come near.

If I saw a muzzled dog I would give it as much respect and distance as I could, lead my lot immeidtaly and check with the owner if it showed any inclination to be friendly.

DON@T put yourself down - you are fabulous in your concerns and wishes to do well. But you can't be there 24/7 I think? has anything else happened? to make ziggy nervous I mean.

Sadly there are people out there who bully others all the time and this is a form of bullying. You keep going kiddo.

Karen

"is there anything else that could have made ziggi nervous"

my other dog is a very fiesty terrier and her way of playing with ziggi is very bolshy and over the top. Ziggi gets very nervous when she bombards her so I always call Pesto away as soon as possible. Unfortunately we think that this may have helped cause ziggi to be nervous when she was younger.
Not sure tho.

There are some things that could have helped cause her nervousness but i will never know and i will never beable to change it, unfortunately.

Anna

You sound as if you are doing the very best you can for your girl, Vizslas are very sensitive dogs, and I wonder if she may be picking up on your anxiety? Being so caring its understandable for you to feel so protective towards her, and she may well be protecting you back! The weim biting incident, well weims are a pushy breed, the class clown, and love to play but can be a bit rough, did this weim maybe scare her, which caused her to bite? Not blaming either breed here, just posing the question. Some Vizslas can be known to be quite shy or timid, so dont go blaming yourself for all her problems.

I just wonder if it may be an idea to talk to an old hand in Vizsla rescue, NOT to rehome her dont panic, but to maybe give you some breed advice, and even find someone who lives near you who has this breed that perhaps could meet up with you and walk with you? You can find rescue details in the breed section on CD.

As to the women with buggies...take not a damned bit of notice of them, or their unkind and uncalled for comments! The thing is, they are making nasty comments in pairs and with a toddler in the buggy. this gives them the support of their friend (safety in numbers) and the protection of the toddler-as in who is going to take on mum with the possibility of upsetting the child. Big cowards, and not worth you even giving them the time of day.

Good luck :)

Ah OK, fair enough; you are being responsible muzzling her and doing everything right as far as i can see...:)

Lindsay
x

Just an update on ziggi. I thought about everything you lot said, although i still haven't plucked up the courage to go somewhere new and quiet. Anyways I brought a halti training lead and i wear it around my sholder. if i see a dog i put her on it and use treats to distract her. It means none of my tension goes into the lead and she is much better like that. If she gets a bit upset i do hold the lead to keep more control but that has only needed to happen once.

Just like to say thankyou to everyone for all your support and help. I have stopped apoligising for ziggi if she is a bit upset as it is their dogs that are not under control. I haven't been able to ask them to take their dogs away yet but still working up to it.
Thanks again and sorry for my little rant.

Anna

Apologies not necessary Anna :).  Glad to hear you are feeling better and are finding the halti lead helpful.

You don't have to be sorry about anything, as I think you're a very responsible dog owner and I wish there were more people like you! ;) I too think that halti is a very good idea. My auntie is using it on her Staffy who pulls constantly and she has noticed the improvement already....... good luck to you!

Well done Anna.

>I haven't been able to ask them to take their dogs away yet but still working up to it.<

Just picture them standing in their underpants and you'll be able to say anything! (provided you're not giggling too much ;-) )