just out of interest ,would anyone use a dog/bitch

that had had cruciate ruptures?

or had cancer?

if it was otherwise a absolutley cracking example.

discuss!

Cruciate ruptures  - no, because it's possible there's a physical deformity causing the problem - 'normal' construction should be able to cope with 'normal' activity without serious collapse. This physical deformity could have an hereditary element.

Cancer - no. They're regularly discovering genes linked with cancer, so again there could be an hereditary problem for a dog young enough to use at stud who had the condition.

I agree with JG on the reasons NOT to use a dog with cruciate problems. I also agree about the potential for cancer to have a hereditary element, however, in addition, a dog with cancer, or for that matter any chronic illness, has more than enough on it's plate being ill and /or on long term medication or other treatment. Mating a bitch would have no benefits to the health of a sick dog.

I have here a beautiful 4 year old American Cocker bitch that has been diagnosed with Hypothyroidism. She has Soloxine every day and is now back in fabulous health and fitness, but have retired her from the showring. She doesn't need to do anything else with her life, that live it.

Dawn R.

i had a dog that had a ruptured cruciate that was repaired by a specialist both legs were x rayed at the same time and there were no signs that the other leg was going to cause problems in the future on the subject of breeding this dog the SPECIALIST said there was no reason not to as no dog in her pedigree or history had problems before i do know her history and it was a fall that had caused the problem before you all moan at me she has not been bred from

Sorry,  but that doesn't negate the arguement that it is a genetic or inherited problem! I have had large working and Giant breeds for over 22 years and NEVER had a problem with cruciates and I have to say I agree that a dog that is excercised with caution in it's first year or two, then allowed to excercise freely, and I walk mine 4 miles a day at a brisk pace, should be able to cope with all and everything! Sometimes I can't believe the amount of problems some people have with cruciates...especailly the US. On some of the breed boards I visit they seem to have problem after problem, they must be doing something wrong? Either the excercise or the Breeeding??? Personaly I would never breed a dog with a history of cruciate rupture, just my opinion of course, for what it's worth! All the best, Dawn

Well, I saw my dog rupture her cruciate after she caught her leg in wire mesh as she jumped over a fence and I would like to see any dog come through that unscathed!   She had 12 pups, none of which have done similar and as my vet says, the more free hard exercise you give your dog the more prone it is to injury.  My dog died last year aged almost 14 & half and never had a problem with her joint after her operation, not even slight lameness.

Likewise any one competing in a physically demanding sport is more prone to injury.  Was Paul Gascoigne excluded from having kids when he did his knee in because that was exactly the same thing as a ruptured cruciate in dogs?

As for cancer it would depend on what and where.  I have friends with a Flatcoat who had to have a toe amputated due to cancer a couple of years ago, he's now 10 and was given the all clear ages ago.   Likewise friends with a Munster who had to have his tail amputated due to cancer 4 years ago.   Last month he celebrated his 13th birthday!   

It is too easy to generalise without looking at each case individually. 

I have to confess that despite my springer having a torn cruciate, he has fathered a litter.  He's a working springer and during the working season does more than his bit.  I was not concerned that this was a heridatary problem although I can see that in many breeds it could be.  Neither parents on either side, had a problem with cruciates so I haven't given this too much thought until now.

I agree with ChristineW that there are many activities that make a dog prone to such an injury as well as a genetic bias.

>Was Paul Gascoigne excluded from having kids when he did his knee in

If only it was that easy! ;) :D :D