I OWN A MALE OLD FASHIONED LOOKING STRAIGHT BACK 7 YEAR OLD GSD. I HAD HIM SINCE HE WAS 7.5 WEEKS OLD. HE IS THE FIRST GSD I HAVE OWNED. I WOULD GO AS FAR AS TO SAY THAT THIS IS A DOG THAT NEEDS CAREFUL HANDLING AND UNDERSTANDING. HE HAS BEEN A CHALLENGE TO ME PARTICULARLY DURING HIS ADOLESCENCE. I HAVE ALWAYS OWNED BORDER COLLIE BITCHES BEFORE AND STILL HAVE MY DEAR 16 YEAR OLD TESS. SO AN ADOLESCENT MALE GSD WAS AN EYE OPENER. I DO THINK IF YOU OWN ONE YOU MUST BE AWARE THAT THIS IS A DOG THAT HAS A VERY STRONG INSTINCT TO PROTECT AND IS GENERALLY OF A NERVOUS TEMPERMENT, I HAVE HOWEVER SEEN RELAXED ONES ONE THIS IS NOT WHAT I NORMALLY SEE. I THINK THEY ARE AS A BREED GIVEN A BAD DEAL. FIRSTLY PEOPLE ARE VERY BIASED TOWARDS THEM WHICH I HAVE TO FACE MOST DAYS WITH MY NOW WELL BEHAVED BOY. I HAVE TO FREQUENTLY PUT HIM IN A DOWN POSITION WHEN PEOPLE PASS US BECAUSE THEY ARE EXTREMELY ANXIOUS ABOUT THIS EVEN THOUGH MY BOY IS NOT THE SLIGHTEST BIT INTERESTED IN THEM, BUT I PUT HIM IN A DOWN POSITION WHICH DEFUSES ANY TENSION WHICH A GSD IS GENERALLY VERY SENSITIVE TO. I HAVE ALSO EXPERIENCED ANOTHER BAD DEAL THESE DOGS HAVE TO DEAL WITH AND THIS IS THAT TRAINING CLUBS FREQUENTLY ARE STUCK IN TH 70S WHEN DEALING WITH A GSD. I HAVE WALKED OUT OF A LOCAL GSD CLUB WHEN I REALISED WHY ALL THE DOGS WERE ALL ON EDGE (NOT NICE IN A GSD) BECAUSE THE TRAINING TECHNIQUES WERE SOMEWHAT HARSH TO SAY THE LEAST AND TO MY HORROR THEY STILL BELIEVED IN STRINGING UP! I COULD GO ON ABOUT THE INJUSTICE DONE TO THIS BREED. BUT IN THE RIGHT HANDS THIS IS A MAGNIFICENT DOG, WHO WHEN HE IS SHOWN THE RIGHT BALANCE IS A EXTREMELY LOVING AND LOYAL DOG. BUT I WOULD SAY THIS IS NOT A BREED I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IN INEXPERIENCE HANDS. I ACTUALLY LIE IN GERMANY NOW MY HUSBAND IS A SOLDIER, AND I CAN SEE THAT THE BREED HERE IS STILL HEADING TOWARDS THIS EXTREME SLOPED BACK AND THE TRAINING HERE IS EVEN MORE ARCHAIC.
I DO NOT KNOW WHETHER I WOULD OWN ANOTHER GSD, PURELY BECAUSE I FIND THE BIAS TOWARDS THEM IS HARD TO LIVE WITH AND MAKES AN OWNER SOMEWHAT FEEL ANTISOCIAL WHICH IS A SHAME AS THE BREED NEEDS GOOD SOCIALISATION.

Hi Bec

I am sorry to read that you suffer predjudice with your shepherd, the people I know with them, are always getting people coming up to them and complimenting them on their dogs!
I think the G.S.D is a very popular breed in the UK and not nearly so maligned as say, a rottweiler or a dobermann.
I actually read an article not that long ago which stated that some police forces across here are thinking about using the Belgian Malinois instead of the G.S.D because Shepherds are getting all the hardness and natural suspicion bred out of them!
Nearly all the people I know with longcoated shepherds ( most of them from British lines) complain that their dogs are too soft! And they are, I know a woman who used to breed, she has 13 and they are all soft and friendly dogs.
So maybe its the Germanic types that are highly strung? I don't know.
I wouldnt let other people's opinions affect you Bec, get yourself another Shepherd if thats what you want, after all, you know your dog has a nice nature, its not your fault if other people tar every guarding breed with the same nasty brush!

It is mainly I know due to the way the breeder keeps and breeds his/ her dogs. I did go to a breeder to see a litter of puppies and was appalled at the conditions the dogs were kept in. In the lounge alone there were two bitches and their large litters kept on filthy newpaper with no soft bedding at all. Outside (small concrete garden) their were rows and rows of cages with up to 3/4 dogs in a cage one dog would find hard to stand up in. When I checked their lines they seemed to be interbreeding their stock, and I was surprised to find they did have KC registered papers???? I reported them but I still see their add in the paper with a cute GSD pup on it. My Shephereds were bred for their temperament and also their intelligence and willingness towards people.
In the UK they did become very popular all of a sudden, and I think now as they are so common, people don't want them anymore, hence the many thousands of rescues each year. People these days who want a GSD have to check everything about a breeder, the pup may be cute, but can grow up with temperament problems, not to mention hips (as I found out).

Hi there I'm Bec and Beccy is Beccy! I own 5 Parson Russell Terriers and a Boxer! Just so you don't confuse the 2 of us!!
Bec

HI BEAR,
I HAVE WONDERD WHETHER THE LONG HAIRED WOULD LOOK LESS THREATENING,
AND I HAVE HEARD THAT ROTTIE OWNERS HAVE PROBLEMS.
MY HUSBAND IS A SOLDIER AND I HAVE REGULAR CONTACT WITH THE ARMY DOG HANDLERS IN THIS PART OF GERMANY. AND YOU ARE RIGHT THE NEAREST ONE HAS JUST TOOK DELIVERY OF SEVERAL MALINOIS, WHICH ARE PRESENTLY IN OMAN. THE DOGS ARE PARTIALLY TRAINED IN DEFENCE WHEN THEY BUY THEM. IT IS INTERESTING THERE IS DEFINATELY A CHANGE GOING ON BECAUSE PREVIOUSLY THE GSD THE ARMY HAD WERE 'RECYCLE' DOGS SO TO SPEAK, WHICH THEY DID NOT PAY FOR OR HAD ANY TRAINING IN PARTICULAR . ANY WAY THE REASON I WAS GIVEN FOR THE CHANGE TO MALINOIS WAS THE GSDS WERE LOOSING THE EDGE, WHEN ASKED TO BE MORE SPECIFIC I WAS GIVEN TWO PROBLEMS WITH THE GSDS ONE BEING THAT THEY WERE BECOMING SOFTER, OR SECONDLY THERE IS AN INCREASING HIGHLY STRUNG TYPE AROUND.
AS FAR AS PREJUDICE TOWARDS MY BOY PREHAPS I AM SENSITIVE TO IT BECAUSE I KNOW HE IS A BIG WUZ AND HE IS ALL BLUFF, AND MAY BE I CANNOT UNDERSTAND WHY ANYONE COULD NOT BE PROUD OF HIM AS I AM.

I have to say I love GSD's, but much prefer the non-exaggerated ones. I hate the sloping backs, poor things look all wrong.

I wonder if I can go back to the mention of the Essex force a few years ago - i am not quite sure what JOhn meant, but a few years ago, wasn't it the Essex force who killed a dog in training? By forcing his handler to string him up and then kickng him for growling at him?

If this is indeed how the Essex force were traiiining their dogs, (god forbid) and if this is how the "trainers " were training the handlers , then no wonder the dogs were nasty.

I remember police dog Acer died from a ruptured liver and his handler was very upset, as he had been forced by blackmail to kick the dog (ie if he didn't do as he was told then he would be kicked out from dog handling).

This then led to the rescue societies immediateley with drawing their dogs, as they were extrememly concerned and rightly so. After much debate they re vamped their methods and became a bit nicer to the dogs, and now i believe that some rescue societies are once more sending their dogs to the police etc.

As for the Malinois, if an old fashioned trainer tries to treat them badly, they will have to watch out as they have an active defence reflex (like the GSD) with the agility of a much smaller dog.

HOwerver they are also extremely soppy with the right owner/handler.:)))

I do so hope that training methods continue to improve, there is a well known lady involved with GSD's who is far too rough with them and i have had owners ringing me in tears telling me how their dog has been upset is now nervous/aggressive and hates training.

My main gripe with the forces is that in some cases the dogs have to adapt to different handlers, that is sad for breeds as loving and affectionate as GSD's and Belgians, although their lives are perhaps more interesting because they are working. It's a good life I should think for a dog who has a good handler and is "secure" in his position!