ok thanx for that reply, that was more of a friendlyer helpfuler advise

Why won't you be able to show him?  You can learn to show an adult without too much trouble, though inexpereince may affect the odd placement when you first start.

Well You seem to want the easy route to get people to use your dog simply because he is "new"bloodlines. What is new about them, is he an import ? Born to imports ? Are the Imports from lines that are not already in the country ? If not he doesn't have "new"bloodlines. Bitch owners should be willing travel to use the "best"dog on their bitch to improve the breed. Just because he has different bloodlines to the dogs local to you doesn't mean he is suitable for use on the bitches

Not bothering to show or work your dog means that responsible breeders will not have a chance to assess him

Before using any dog or bitch for breeding they must be health tested using all the tests available, not to do so leaves both the breeder & stud dog open to civil action should an defect appear in the puppies. Also both breeder & stud dog owner should be able to take back any of the puppies their dogs produce at any age as they are jointlly responsible for the puppies being born

Taking this into consideration & what Barbara has said about the males attitude to other males If you cannot do all of these & control the changes in your dog then you should not allow your dog to be used

I have a lovely BC puppy Bred in the purple & showing all the ability he should have to be able to do the job he was bred to do, but he's a CEA carrier(DNA tested) & so if he is ever used at stud the bitch must be CEA clear genetically & TBH not many bitch owners would consider using a CEA carrier if there is a similarly bred DNA clear dog available. So he might never be used no matter how good his hips are or a good a worker he is.

Does this diminish him as my dog ? After all he's new bloodlines to where I live so shouldn't the bitch owners be encouraged to use him ? No to both. He's my pet first & anything comes a distant 2nd

BTW I have had stud dogs before & they were carefully educated as such & none were used before being fully health tested & both shown & worked & I did not need to advertise or encourage anyone to use them.

i got told be his old owner he's not show type as he was breed to hunt not show, she doesnt move like a show dog,  he was imported its not the using him to stud that im conserned about its more i love showing, i used to show my horses and would love to show my dog, i cant show my  bitch coz of an old injury to a hind leg they said she wouldnt move propley. If i can show him it will be great as i love it, its my idea of fun not competing same as my horses

and he's had all his relivent tests and he's fine passed {his old owner has to test his dogs as there working dogs}

I'm sorry, I've come onto this thread late and I can't get to the first page.  It doesn't sound like you have collected the dog yet?  Perhaps he is not the dog for you if you really enjoy showing and he is not of show type?   Can I be nosey and ask what breed he is? 

If he is the breed you have mentioned on the Food board, they are dual purpose breeds, there is no such thing as "show type" or not.  Dual purpose ability is highly prized in that breed and you would be well advised to show him as well as working him, if you want to stud him.

Of course if he is not of show quality and moves badly then good worker or not he shouldn't be used at stud, when bitch owners can choose from dogs that are both attractive and good workers, the whole dog which is what should be the aim.

i got told be his old owner he's not show type as he was breed to hunt not show,
he's a vizsla whos going to be shown


BTW his eye & heart tests only last a year so he has to be retested every year & the others like his Von Willebrands, Hip Dysplasia are a one off test

Like 123 says there are no show/working types in Vizslas are like the GSP/GWP/GLP dual purpose dogs

You are very lucky that some one has let you have a dog they have imported from totally new to the UK bloodlines & the old owners haven't bred from him either I presume ?

I do not, or have ever wanted to breed from any of my dogs. So I wonder, unless you have been asked by several intrested parties, who really, really, really want his pups, why breed at all? Sorry but I'm baffled? Don't you realise that he'll turn from wanting you to wanting to be with every bitch he comes across, in season or not. He'll be marking, chasing girls, become a phedaphile, and drive you crazy with embarressment every time he goes out. I would certainly not want to be bovved with any of that for my dogs and certainly not for the sake of a couple of hundred quid, surely it's never worth it unless that is really what you bought him for? If that is the case, then he won't be a pet, but a working animal? You go ahead if you want to and certainly no-one here can stop you but personally,I think you must be crazy. Enjoy your dog perhaps. Go do some agility, showing or obedience and if you'd like people to think you have a wonderfull animal, show off his other abilities first, if he has any.

I realise that people on this forum want to discourage thoughtless breeding (me too!) but not all dogs become a nightmare after being used at stud.  However, just because you have a dog that you want to use at stud does not mean that everyone will want to use him.  (Sorry if I am repeating what has already been said, but I can't get to Page 1)  My older dog is a champion, with a below average hip score, a lovely temperament and is well bred (both parents champions, 3/4 grandparents champions, all hip scored) but I don't exactly have people beating down my door to use him - not that I am worried about that.  I feel responsible for all the pups sired by my dogs as well as the pups I breed (very occasionally!) and I don't want to be responsible for too many.  Owning a stud dog is a responsibility and you need to have the knowledge of the breed to decide whether bitches are suitable for your dog or not.

There are champions in my breed that have for one reason or another never or rarely been used at stud. 

Apart from maybe not apealing to the owners of available bitches, the opposite may be true, he may be universally admired, but there aren't bitches suitable for him, they may have the same failings, be too closely related, or they may have an even better brother or sire that is proven and is being used in preference.

For practical reasons the owner may not be able to accomodate visiting bitches, he may not want to perform away from Mum, or conversely be unable to perform in front of his owners if discouraged from bitching when younger.

An awful lot goes into the making of a competent stud dog, and some of it is down to fate and good luck, but mostly knowledge and experience of the owner.  A dog will be judged by the offspring people see.

So not only has a dog got to prodcuce good pups, so the choice of bitches he is allowed to service will have a great bearing here (not many dogs can make a silk purse out of a sows ear), but those pups need to get into the hands of exhibitors and working owners so that their attributes can be appreciated by others, who will want to know who the sire and dam is.

i dont want to use him as a breeding michine at all, yes people have asked me mostly for pups from my bitch but i cant and im not breeding from her, im just enqiring to make sure i know everything if u dont ask you dont know, and as i said id LIKE TO show him but if i cant im happy to walk him treack him dog camps ect thats why i want to know whats best, horses and dogs are different on showning and i dont see why you all dont get were im coming from, i dont know if they do fun shows for dogs as they do for horses, please see where im coming from

and thats wot the old owner told me he aint show quallity

Hi, I'm pleased that you just want to enjoy your dog.  There are "fun" dog shows, they are called companion shows, they are usually advertised in pet shops, the local paper, the vet's etc.  You just turn up and enter on the day.  Dogs that have done a certain level of winning at championship shows cannot enter.  They are fun, I sometimes take my youngsters for the experience, or my little Aussie as she enjoys them too. 
Do you belong to a breed club?  They sometimes have fun days?
I'm sure all the other posts have given you food for thought about wanting to use your dog as a stud dog.  If he is not of show quality, then - in my opinion, he is unlikely to be of breeding quality.  Do you know why the owner says he is not of show quality?  Breeding from a dog or bitch is not something to be entered into lightly, as I am sure you realise.  Have fun with your boy.

If he's not show quality then he's unlikely (unless he does extremely well in field trials or working on shoots) to be suitable for using at stud. Only the best should be bred from. It sounds as though his role in life is to be your loved pet and companion - enjoy him for that! :)

oh yes i will dont you worrie ill keep a look out for those shows, but he used to hunt, he does it well but im not into that, my bitch doesnt hunt shes show type but i cant show her too as shes got a scar on her hip, so the working on shoots wont prob happen as i wouldnt be able to do it i think but field trails ect are a fumbs up

Hi - why would a scar stop her being shown?  I show my RRs which do occasionally have "hunting" scars, and it has never made a difference.  Occasionally, I am asked how they did that, but that's all.

oh really??
i was told that she wasnt aloud now! hey i think im gettin lied to too much

Hope you don't mean by me!!!

What's the scar from? How big is it?

oh no did mean you lot its people seeing her sayin she cant now ect, and its about 6-8cm long

Can't see why that would be a problem.

ok should i ask the kc first?

I wouldn't have thought so, if the scar is the result of a wound rather than an operation.  However, I would contact the KC to ask them, to be on the safe side.  You wouldn't want to have a nice win, then be disqualified!!

ok kool thanx alot :D dont think ill be winning tho havent got a clue when it comes to dog showing ill be staring some training classed to help but still i be that person people laugh at :d i think i get to embarresed easly spes in shows

Just out of interest, why have you chosen a working dog if you have no interest in working it?  Why would a scar mean that this dog couldn't work?  If it has been trained to work why haven't the current owners passed it on to a working home?

no my bitch has a scar, and my dog was breed for working he worked it, then trained him to be a sniffer dog at his kennels. He broke a toe and had it removed witch is in one of my posts, and he said that it hasnt afected his work its just he said that the veiws and the pubilc. i dont see a problem i didnt even see it till he showed me.
its not i dont have interesed in it its the fact i dont think i could do it

Having had a toe amputated wouldn't stop him being shown.

It also wouldn't stop him working.

well he said thats y he cant work, :rolleyes: the way u all sayin it makin me think somethings wrong

Pardon our cynicism but it does all sound strange. 

Danielle the minute i saw the title of your post i knew what the outcome of the thread was going to be. I belong to a few websites,most of the members of these are serious,dedicated breeders who really know their stuff.You would have got very similar responses to these on those sites aswell.I dont think the views of champdogs members are unusual at all.The reason i say this is because you may be thinking,these people are out to get me,or are stuck up breeders(sorry folks)  who only approve of show people breeding,and you may be thinking of finding another website to try and find the answers you want...... You can join a hundred sites,but if they are filled with knowledgable breeders who truly care about bettering their breed you will get the same answers there too.

Now,there are plenty of fluffy  websites out there who would have most likely given you the answers you wanted,but would you really have trusted these peoples knowledge?Would you have felt comfortable trusting their opinions? They would think its a good idea to breed their next door neighbours dog with theirs because the pups would turn out cute and be rare to boot.Health tests,what health tests! Their vet said their dog is good to breed,thats all they need to know. I think you are lucky to have found this site and got the honest and straightforward answers you got from a bunch of real experienced people IMO.

It sounds as though the people who've been advising you about working and showing may not be as knowledgeable as they claim.

I've stayed out of this thread until now, Danielle, and my advice to you is:

1.    LEARN ABOUT THE BREED you have - read about it, join the breed society, go to shows and look at dogs that are winning (and losing).  Go to working trials.

2.    LEARN ABOUT BREEDING.  You are asking us basic questions, so obviously you need to know a lot more about the whole process - get a copy of The Book of the Bitch and read that.

3.    START SHOWING your dogs - it doesn't matter if they don't win - you will still take the best dog home - and you, yourself, will know how to show.

4.    START WORKING your dogs - for the same reasons.

If all of this will take too much time out of your life, then think long and hard about whether you ought to be thinking about making your dog a stud dog - that too, will take time.

Margot