Basically I'm writing because I need some reassurance with my bitch puppy - Poj.

She's a lovely little thing and enjoys life very much.  She's 13 weeks now and shows very few signs of being house trained.  She generally does her poos outside and about half her wees - despite being taken out usually every hour.  I'm fine with it and keep reassuring my husband (not a doggy person) that it won't be long now - it's just I'm starting to lose faith - how long does it normally take a lab?  If someone could tell me then I will be able to wait quite happily until then reasured that I'm doing nothing wrong.  I'm crate training and don't make a fuss when she wees indoors - we have no carpets so it's easy to clean up.

Also she bites ALL the time - when we walk past her she chases after us biting at our ankles.  I've tried yelping with pain, barking and deep loud 'no' but all these make her more excited.  When I'm outdoors I stop walking and she gives up the biting and carries on - this doesn't seem to work indoors.  She's also started jumping up even though we never stroke or fuss her until we choose and after she's sat down.

On the plus side I've trained her to sit, shake a paw and she 'drops it' about half the time when she's picked up something she shouldn't have. 

I just need a bit of reassurance from some fellow lab owners so that I can keep going!

Sounds like a normal puppy to me

Instead of yelping or telling off when she nips, have you tried walking away & out of the room & not showing any reaction ?

I could try that - I'll try anything.  How do I get her off my trousers without 'rewarding' her with the attention that prising her off would need.  I couldn't just walk out as she's attached to my legs - short of removing my trousers and leaving them behind

>short of removing my trousers and leaving them behind

It's too cold for that - wait till summer!

Have you read this article about biting? I'm sure you'll find it helpful. To be honest I never found that yelping did anything other than wind the puppy up more - obviously I don't speak 'dog' very well! What I've found works is to calmly and quietly say "Ah ah, no, gently" when mouthing gets too painful, and stop doing whatever I was doing before. It also helps to be as calm and placid as possible around the pup and to stop games before anyone becomes over-excited.

Housetraining does take time - like children, puppies gain bladder control at different ages, and some get the hang of it sooner than others. Both are normal. :) What are you using to clean up messes with? Anything with bleach will smell similar (to the pup) to urine and will encourage her to use the same spot. A solution of biological washing powder/liquid does a good job, especially if you finish off with a wipe-over with surgical spirit or vinegar to break down any lingering smells.

Hope this helps!

I'm not a lab owner but I do have a 8 mth old springer.

I would say that for a 13 week pup, you are doing a grand job!!!!!
I was reminded when I spoke to a freind who trains police dogs, that they do not expect anything from them until they are 6 mths onwards, not that anyone would leave basic commands this long but the point he was making was that puppies have such short attention spans they let them grow a little first (can you imagine the chaos that would bring to a home LOL)

It sounds to me as though your pup is doing just fine and as you say most of toiletting is done outside then the pup obviously knows the right place to do it.

Maybe try taking her out more frequantly, keep check for signs that she needs to go (sniffing, pacing etc.) - if there is a certain area that she always goes indoors to wee, try to restict access to this area on her own, if she heads there you know its time to let her out.

You can reassure your OH that, by the sounds of it, you have a lovely puppy that is learning fast, she doesn't wee on purpose at this age, it is usually caused by us not letting them out at right time. You will get used to her times for going once a proper routine is established.

Stick to loads and loads of reward when she does do it outside and ignore it when she does it inside.

With the biting, how about trying distraction with toys, or as she knows the sit command try that when it looks like shes about to nip, then give her a treat for not nipping??

Good luck and happy puppying

I'm by no means a training expert, however I've been witness to our friends training thier chocolate lab puppy, and yours sounds very similar to him. Henry was all teeth too - in fact almost all of us have just had nails growing back normally where his little teeth had gone right through (such pain). The only advice I can offer is make sure everyone in the house is consistant with how you show her biting is unacceptable. The reason I say this is that one of Henry's owners was very good but the other used to let  him 'play' nip and not say anything at all. No wonder it took what seems like a lifetime for Henry to learn bite inhibition.

With regards the housetraining - all dogs vary. When my 18 week old puppy had some accidents a few days ago after a period of not doing it in the house at all, I just went back to step one, which was being taken out as if she were an 8 week old puppy. After eating, drinking, playing, sleeping and every hour. I used to spend more time in the garden dementidly saying 'quickly' and 'Good Girl!!' than I did inside, but I'm reaping the rewards now...she's (am I tempting fate??) very very good inside now. It just takes time.

Hi - we're just 4 weeks ahead of you with our puppy so I thought I might be able to give you a bit of reassurance.  Lucy is a springer cross and we think she might have lab in her.  We got her at 11 weeks old and at 13 weeks she was at much the same stage as your puppy.  She is now 17 weeks and provided we pay attention she manages to go outside 95% of the time.  We haven't had any poo accidents indoors now for 3 or 4 weeks (it's easier to catch those as they get into a routine and you know roughly when they'll need to go).  She still occasionally pees inside (it happened this morning) but generally it's because we have got lazy and are now expecting her to tell us when she wants to go out and sometimes she leaves it so late she can't wait until we get to the door....our fault!  It sounds as if you are doing a great job and are pretty much on course to have an accident free dog before too long.  At her age she won't have much bladder control, so don't expect too much...imagine if you had carpet everywhere!

Am impressed by the shaking paw.....that is the one thing Lucy has failed to achieve so far!  Mind you, she can do lots of other stuff so I'll forgive her.

Can't help on the biting front I'm afraid - luckily Lucy has never done this.  I suspect it's because we have an older dog and she seems to have learned from her from day one not to bite other than softly in play.  From what I've read, you'll find this will pass - just takes patience!

Good luck - I look forward to hearing how you get on

Thank you all for your comments.  I mop our floors after accidents with hot water mixed with biologcial washing powder - for the reasons you mention.  She doesn't seem to have any particular places she goes in - just wherever she happens to be when she needs a wee.

The reassurance from you all has been lovely.  I think I started worrying because I read some (smug) poster on here who said their lab was trained by 11 weeks and ever since then I've been thinking I must be doing something wrong.

I start puppy training classes next week so hopefully that will help too. 

Shake a paw was an easy tricky to do with Poj - I started by holding a treat in my right hand so she knew there was a treat involved.  Then I tapped her paw enthusiasticallt while saying 'shake a paw' with my left hand until she lifted it - then she got a treat.  It didn't take her long to cotton on that lifting a paw got a treat.  I'd love some other simple tricks to try with her as she loves her training time (about five/ten minutes a day)  We've done sit, shake a paw, fetch and drop it.  I tried 'roll over' but it seemed to tricky to master it all - any good web-sites/books that offer step-by-step instructions on training dogs to do little tricks?

Thanks - I'm off to try and get Lucy to shake a paw now!

We've been going to puppy training classes for 3 weeks (great fun) and so far she can do sit, stay, beg, off, down and come (90% of the time).  She also knows to touch your hand with her nose when you hold it out (not sure why we learned that, but no doubt it will become clear soon!)  We're working on heel and she will also circle our legs and sit by our side and will run round objects when told to (in anticipation of starting agility in May).  Like you we're finding rollover a bit tricky, (although our older dog got it really quickly) and the other thing we don't have with the puppy yet is fetch....I had kind of assumed dogs did this automatically, but it seems not!

One thing we have discovered is that puppies have an amazing capacity to learn.  Initially we were just aiming to get the basics and thought we'd have to wait until she was older to get the more advanced stuff, but she just absorbs it so quickly at this age, it's amazing.  Mind you, we met a woman with a 6 month old puppy the other day who she said knew 40 commands...we're not quite there yet!

I don't know of any particularly good books for learning neat tricks...but basically any movement that your dog does naturally, she can be trained to do on command.  Clicker training is brilliant as you can reinforce the movement you want at the exact moment they do it - have you tried this?

Nice to hear how successful your puppy training classes have been - I only hope mine are as good.  I've been looking forward to it for ages and can't wait to go.  I haven't tried clicker training, I've been thinking that it would be just as easy for me to say 'good girl' and give her a treat, I know I'd lose the clicker or not always have it with me - however if the classes use them then I'll go with it.

I did read somewhere about the touching things with their noses being useful - I can't remember why - do tell when it becomes apparent!  I can't believe how much you've covered in three weeks!

We were sceptical about the clicker training, but it really does make things easier as you can click at the exact moment they do the right thing...it's rare that you can give them a treat at exactly the right moment.  We use a combination of both approaches but both our dogs have taken to the clickers really well, and because it is such a distinctive noise it seems to have a more immediate impact than speech. 

I don't want to raise your expectations too much on the puppy classes.  Ours have been great fun and very useful but we haven't covered all the stuff I mentioned in the classes yet.  We've been taking our older dog to some private obedience lessons as well (which have been brilliant) and we've been trying it out what we've learned there on the puppy - generally she has picked it up quicker than the older dog!  Once you've been to your first puppy class and know what kind of approach you're going to be using I'd encourage you to use it to try out a variety of things with the puppy......don't just wait for what they teach you in the classes.  You'll be so proud when she is the star of the class!

When I find out about the nose touching thing I'll let you know!

PS  Your cakes look fantastic!

Just remember a well run puppy class has a programme of things for you and your puppy to learn, and it's set out to make it easier for you and your puppy if it's done in that order - trying to acheive one thing before the grounding has been set can be confusing for your puppy at best and at worst start to break down your relationship. Puppy class should be for the benefit of your puppy, not to become 'teachers pet'.

Hi, What are you rewarding her with when she toilets outside?  Praise isn't enough - you need to be providing a very high value treat.  When she goes outside - she gets a tasty treat.  Inside - nothing happens.  That will make it much easier for her to see the difference between inside and outside and she will learn much quicker.  You need to give the treat to her within 1 second of her toileting: http://www.clickersolutions.com/articles/2001/housetrain.htm

The biting is perfectly normal puppy behaviour and she should grow out of it (and lose her puppy teeth).  Here is a link which explains how to deal with it: http://www.jersey.net/~mountaindog/berner1/bitestop.htm

Are you taking her to training classes?  I would definitely recommend you do.  Have a look at www.puppyschool.co.uk and www.apdt.co.uk

Actually, you're right - I haven't been giving her a food treat for going to the toilet outside, just praise.  I'll treat from now on and see if this makes a difference.  Thank you for the tip.

We start puppy classes on Monday - I can't wait!

Hi Emma!
I'm having near enough the same probs with my 12wk old retriever dog. He's trained to sit and hold his paw up also, but again, happily wees in the house! Difference is, we have carpets throughout the house apart from the kitchen :rolleyes: I know myself how frustrating it is, but keep at it! You will be rewarded with a happy and well mannered dog

My puupy is now 17 weeks old and we went throught he stage that you are going through, but then all of a sudden everything seemed to click and she got the hang of the whole toilet training idea. I'm sure that if you kept an incident diary and then looked back to it in two weeks tme, you will see that your dog is getting better and suddenly hey presto you're there!

As a fellow lab owner I would like to say you are doing great!

" She's 13 weeks now and shows very few signs of being house trained.  She generally does her poos outside and about half her wees "

Now your two sentences contradict one another - she is showing enormous signs of getting there with housetraining if you are nine tenths of the way there with poos and half way there with wees! Think of it that way round....

" - despite being taken out usually every hour."

Now as a breeder I am a great believer in adoring my dogs and puppies but not letting them take over your entire life! Whilst avoiding accidents is desireable of course, you do not need to be taking a 13 week old out every hour. Only before every feed, after every feed (and she should be on 3 meals a day now....) whe she wakes up and before you go to bed. The of course she is naturally outside when you take her out to play with her or do some simple training. Every hour starts to make this dog the focus of everything in the house and - more importantly - if she IS relieving herself most hours, she will not develop the bladder strength to 'hold it in'. She needs to start being slightly 'stretched'.

" how long does it normally take a lab? "

I never consider them entirely trustworthy until around 9 months old. At 6 months they are past the needing to worry too much stage but I have a 21 week old here who usually has 1 accident of some sort per day inside still. Yet he is caged for 7 hours at night clean as a whistle!

"  I'm crate training and don't make a fuss when she wees indoors - we have no carpets so it's easy to clean up."

Crate training will take you forward in leaps and bounds. How is that going? By 13 weeks I like to have them in from 11pm till 3am and then take them into the garden for a wee and usually a poo and then straight back in from 3am till 7am. Are you there yet?

" and she 'drops it' about half the time when she's picked up something she shouldn't have. :

Grin.... totally the opposite of everything I desperately drum into my labs - as a working gundog home, everything is to be 'held' and never ever dropped until i take it....regardless of it being something in training or a priceless ornament stolen from the dinning room ;-)  ;-) Just horses for courses!

Di