We moved to a house on a Greek island three years ago, and acquired two local rescue dogs as puppies: a 3-yr old gryphon/mongrel bitch, spayed, and a 2.5 yr-old setter/mongrel male, uncastrated. Both are reasonably well trained. The male is uncastrated because he is unagressive and does not wander; he will come to his name or a whistle, and walks to heel on command. The female is also obedient, but more jumpy; she barks a lot at strangers, and hates being on a leash. They sleep indoors at night, and generally stay in the grounds of our country house; very rarely, the male will visit friends half a mile or so away, but knows he shouldn't and is scolded when he does. They are definitely house pets, and have been trained for everyone's convenience rather than to a high degree of obedience; however, they are normally amiable and sociable beasts, eager to please, and share the house with cats. They are taken for daily walks off the leash in essentially empty countryside, and on these walks the male in particular runs fast and ranges pretty far, but will come when called.

They both have hunting blood, though they have never been encouraged and were never trained as gun dogs. We are always aware that they could suddenly snap into chase mode, and indeed the only time I have lost control of them completely is when a hare exploded onto a track and they gave chase; they returned to me of their own accord after thirty minutes. We have seen that if we suddenly come up against a sheep or goat, they can be controlled by voice alone, as long as they are not too far from us. Obviously, what we worry about is what might happen if they come across a lone sheep when out of sight (not difficult in broken ground).

It happened today, when I heard the bitch barking excitedly and in volleys, some distance away down a rough slope. I could catch glimpses of them through the scrub, realised they had closed in on something, and that this was bad news. Shouting and whistling failed to budge them. I went crashing down the slope, saw two sheep and a lamb standing on a hummock some hundred yards from the dogs, and guessed that a single sheep had been cornered. When I was some twenty yards from the dogs, they finally reacted to my shouting and backed off. I saw that they had been savaging a ewe, which had bite marks to the head and rump and was down - obviously in such a bad way that I had no option but to destroy her.

The dogs were clearly aware of being at fault. I beat them both on the rump with the flat of my belt to underline the fact and shouted at them really loudly, and made them both heel the two miles or so back to the car.

My question is, what next? Obviously they can't be allowed to do this again, and the problem is that untended sheep or goats in ones or twos can suddenly appear anywhere in this landscape. They would be miserably unhappy if not allowed to go for runs off the lead. I suppose I could always insist they stay close (within voice control range), but I would have to be constantly calling them back, particularly the male, which would be tiresome for all concerned. I can probably get a neighbour to provide a sheep and a paddock for training exercises, if anyone can recommend something effective along those lines. What about an electric collar? I hate the idea, but what if it's the only alternative? It's certain that if they get a reputation as worriers, they will be shot or poisoned. All suggestions are welcome. Apologies for the length of this message.

you should never beat your dogs! the only reason this happened was because you hadnt trained the dogs and they were not only out of control but out of sight as well! in this country the farmer would have shot them. your only choice is to keep them on a lead from now on as training them now they have attacked a sheep will be impossible. imo anyway

I agree, beating your dogs was no way to go - esp. with a belt. I take it you had to take a few moments to take the belt off?
In all probability they would not associate it with what they had done anyway, it takes just a few short seconds for dogs to "not" think of what has just happened. They may have associated  it with you going to them though and may see you as unpredictable.
Most dogs would chase after a loose sheep; I think it was brilliant of you to take on 2 rescue dogs, but perhaps a tad unrealistic to have them loose off lead all the time.

On my visit to the Lake District, I let my dog off where i was totally certain it was safe - as you know, sheep can crop up all over. I love the Lakes but would hate to live there as the owner of a dog with a high chase instinct as you'd have to be always looking out and couldl not relax. I'd personally simply keep the dogs on leads where you can't see ahead and just train a good recall :)

Lindsay
x

Afraid I'm sceptical about the poster! How did they kill the sheep???

I'm sceptical as well - especially after the mention of an ecollar :(

I think we shouldn't post any more till the poster comes back and we're assured of his genuineness.

I didn't say the dogs killed the sheep. I had to. No idea what else you're sceptical of, or what might reassure you.

Good point about the sheep, I agree we should wait :) Oops cross posted with Simplex.
We have had a poster making up stories to promote electric collars so tend to be a bit "careful" so as not to waste our time...
I think some are a bit unsure as you how you killed the sheep, ie what with etc? Not about killing the sheep but how you managed to do it, with no gun etc presumably.

Lindsay
x

I meant how did the POSTER kill the sheep?? They're not the easiest animals to knock on the head and I would have thought it was foolhardy and likely to cause more pain to the sheep if they're not euthanised properly! If I'm wrong I'll apologise!! Which Island are you on as I have a property on one of the Greek Islands and spend a lot of time out there...I don't see ANY people walking round with guns at all!!

When the poster can explain how s/he was able to kill the sheep with bare hands - or belt ???  I might feel less scepital(sp??)
Until then, I reserve judgement.
Mmmm....;)

Margot

Hi Newfiedreams, was that for me? :)
I realised that was what you meant...:)

Lindsay
x

Without going into details. The sheep had a badly torn rump and a broken leg, other smaller puncture wounds, was bleeding from the face and muzzle, was in shock and couldn't stand up. It was at the bottom of a ravine from which it couldn't be carried out, was clearly in pain and certain to die, of exposure if not loss of blood and shock. I killed it, quickly, by breaking its neck with a rock. Of course, I could just have left it lying there, instead of getting blood on my hands. I am trying to trace the owner - not easy, as these animals are left to their own devices for days on end.

Breaking it's neck with a rock????:rolleyes:

not sure how you could break a sheeps neck with a rock? hit it on the head with a rock would probably kill it but dont necks need wringing or is that only chickens?

Hmmm, bollos!!!!:rolleyes:

Anyone that knows me knows what that means!!! LOL I smells a rat!!

Lindsay, that was for the Poster, that said...the dogs didn't kill the sheep, obviously didn't get that I meant the poster...I knows you got it Hun, you is bright!!!

I think an electric collar is an excellent solution.

Once you put it on, make sure you give yourself a "zap" every time your dog is out of sight and/or fails to recall.

This may serve as a useful reminder of how important it is to train for forseeable eventualities.

If you are worried about the marks, I am sure you can convince people that they are the result of nights of unbridled passion with someone who believes you are the centre of their universe........ unlike your dogs.

Tohme has the solution!

Margot

superb solution :D

:-D  :-P xx

:P  I got it!

Lindsay
x

Edited:  in reply to Newfiedreams

*still trying to work out how many people needed, and how long it would take, to break a sheep's neck with a rock*

JG FAR TOO MANY!!! LOL

Tohme, do you really think someone that would use an E collar would find 'someone' for nights of unbridled passion???? (Unless it's another sheep of course???!!! LOL Ohh EWE!! always telling jokes!! I suppose a Goat is a step tooooo far?????

Back to Freddie & the Dreamers and talk of wellies 2 sizes too big "Ewe were meant for me"

Margot

And it's all gone quiet over there........

Maybe s/he's gone to rescue another sheep in another ravine ;)

A revine?? Thats a lucky sheep by my standards en....lol
Welshie x

I suppose 'RESCUE' is a new word for it!!!!!!! LMAO

My hubby took my sisters dog for a walk and found a sheep on it's back, stuck. He managed to roll the sheep back over, the only injury being to his face when the sheep kicked him in it hard. He came home looking like he had been beaten up!!

What about an electric collar? I hate the idea,

Yes I used to hate theidea but I found out it was onlky the idea I hated. No way could I get anything like reliable recall with my dog and I went to training religiously for over 19 months, the result I simply dnot let him off his long line for the last 6 months of that. Then I saw someone with a box on a collar, I aksed them what it was and it was an e-collar, they had had the same roblem I was haveing, cut a long disscusion short I got one.
Forget anything you have heard about shock and all those nasty things, its nothing more tha a prod on the arm, within about 4 uses my dog learned for te first time to come back to me when I called him, first on the longline, which he never did for food, and then I let him off, I think I used it once or twice since then. I say get one they are the miracle of freedom for your dog as well as keeping sheep safe. I have PMd the make and a couple of models to get.

You've gone to the trouble of registering just today to post this? :rolleyes:  Being kept on a long lead is not cruelty, electrocution is.  Having had a "prod in the arm" with something similar myself I can assure you it is pretty horrible and must be terrifying when you are not capable of understanding why it is being done. :(

Yes I have gone to the trouble to reply to the persons question.

No way could I get anything like reliable recall with my dog and I went to training religiously for over 19 months, the result I simply dnot let him off his long line for the last 6 months of that.

So basically what you are saying is you failed to train your dog .

>within about 4 uses my dog learned for te first time to come back to me when I called him, first on the longline, which he never did for food,

He must have been very scared and hurt to respond like that. :(

"What about an electric collar"?
Unreliable recall with a dog
Means too little training!

Margot ;)

Trip trap trippity trap, I think this is the original poster back in a new guise...

I think 123 hit the nail on the head of that nasty ickle troll!!! LOL