Out with the labs yesterday met up with my mother in law with her rescued greyhound,no lead on ,within seconds the dog went racing up to a yorkshire terrier that was on a lead  and attacked the poor little mite,I ran to help,the owner of the yorkie was on the ground in complete shock,the greyhound would not stop attacking no matter what,eventually I got hold of the greyhounds collar,the yorkie ran off towards the carpark,OMG I thought it was going to get knocked down,but the dog had run to the ladys husband who was sat in the car,he is disabled,he could see all this going on  but couldnt do a thing,the liitle yorkie was very stressed I new it would have injuries as the greyhound was tugging at its rear end,I ran back to the lady and helped her up,bless her she was heartbroken and covered in mud she is about 70, Igave the lady my address so she could let me know if the dog was ok,she called this morning in tears the yorkie has been at the vets overnight,badly torn underneath,my mother in law will have to foot the bill,I hope she has leart a lesson.

Sheila.

That's made me cry.

I hope the yorkie recovers and the lady too.

How awful for all concerned :( I do hope the Yorkie recovers :(

What an awful event :( I hope the little dog recovers.  Will MIL be keeping her dog muzzled now?

and on a lead!!

arr poor yorkie hope mother in law will muzzel the greyhound around little dogs in the future

Aww thats so sad :-(

You did the responsible thing and gave the lady your details, lets hope your MIL has learnt her lesson, and pays the vet bill for the yorkie.

A friend of mine had a much loved cat shaken to death in her drive and in front of her children by an ex-racing greyhound being walked with no muzzle (not sure about a lead). 

Ex-racing greyhounds are supposed to make fab pets although I dont know anyone with one personally. I'm always slightly wary after a friends dobermann was attacked by two dogs (lurcher and greyhound) one at each end apparantly and the dobe needed lots of stitches. He's a lovely friendly dobe too, just out enjoying a romp. That poor little Yorkie tho.... and the owner. At least someone acted responsibly.

They are a sight hounds designed to be excited by and chase small furries, this is why cats and small dogs are not safe in an open area as the hound does not see them as other dogs but as prey.

As for the dog attack, Lurchers more often ahve terrier or a herding bred in their make up to which combined with the sigh hound instinct can make the dog more keen to herd/tackle, and of course poor dog to dog socilisation and training may have contributed.

All the pure Greyhounds I ahve ever met have had very gentle natures but most ahve a high prey drive for quarry.

This brings home the thread on 'will my dogs ever be good off lead'. In my opinion, having owned borzoi for 20 years sighthounds should only be off lead in secure areas. My local greyhound rescue states on it's website that although rescue greyhounds make wonderful pets they should never be off their leads and should always be muzzled when out. They're used to wearing muzzles when exercising anyway. What a shame for the poor yorkie and owners, but you can't blame the dog, from a puppy it will have been taught to chase and 'rag' furry toys etc. I can't find it now but I read online a great poem about a disease that affects sighthound owners - it's called TRUST. Sighthounds are generally so calm and quiet and love nothing more than leaning against their owners side that we start to believe they are trained, we forget that their instinct is to chase and kill small animals, we start to trust them more and more until one day this happens :(

How long has your MIL had her greyhound for?  Was it an ex-racer?  Ive had rescued greyhounds and whilst they are one the the most lovely creatures on earth there is absolutely no way on earth I would even contemplate taking her out unmuzzled or letting her off the lead.  Its a sad fact that most of these greyhounds have been churned out by an industry who's only aim is to produce a dog that chases small furry things in order to win and there are some people who will give the dog small furry live animal to get them even more excited when they see the mechanical bunny.  That combined with the instinct to chase and kill makes a pretty dodgy combination.  I'm really suprised that the rescue didn't advise your MIL to keep the dog muzzled its really no hardship to do this.  Trouble is that most of the time we really have absolutely no idea what theyve been through previously.  I'm really sorry for that poor lady and her dog, good on you for being brave and helping her it must have been horrific.  Obviously your MIL didn't know what was going to happen but incidents like this do nothing to help the plight of the 14,000 greyhounds that go unaccounted for from the racing industry every year in the UK & ireland alone, its just more bad press for them really :(  These are not your average pet, and while some make perfect pets others need special considerations for what they are.

Oh, God Bless the poor little mite.

Why, oh why do some people who take on ex- Greyhound racers not understand they are use to chasing hares and small dogs to them are just another hare.

Every ex-Greyhound racer I have met has been on a lead until it could be trusted and re-trained and I have always seemed to meet resposible adoptive owners.

Out of interest did the rescue not explain all this to your Mother-in-law or did she just think it would be ok? I hope that she will not re-home the dog, it is only doing what it was taught.

I'm glad that you were there to help, I think I would have gone home and cried afterwards.:-(

"until it could be trusted and re-trained"  I think thats the problem Lyssa, they can never be trusted, no matter how quiet and well behaved and obedient they seem they will always have the ability to do something like this. Ex racers are wonderful house pets though and won't mind being muzzled and on lead for their walks for the rest of their lives.

Hi yes the Greyhound is a ex racer,she has had her for three months, I think that because the dog is so loving and gentle at home,she never expected this to happen, I dont see my MIL very often however I try to educate her on certain issues with the dog,no Idea what advice she was given,but I will be going out to buy a muzzel for the dog. The Lady with the yorkie will be ringing me later , I will let you all know how things are.

Sheila.x

Hi Sheila, please make sure you buy a proper greyhound muzzle so the dog can breathe, a great site to buy from is Jans greyhound and lurcher gifts   www.jansgifts.co.uk

What a load of RUBBISH!!!

With patience and consistency, they CAN be retrained, some dogs will be better than others but to suggest that ALL sighthounds or lurchers cannot be retrained is ridiculous.

My own retired working lurcher can be safely let off to play with yorkies and shi tzu etc etc. She is smart enough to distinguish rabbit and squirrel (her favourites) from yorkie or whatever!

She is EVEN ok with my own cat, EVEN when he is out of the house, although i wouldnt turn my back on her, but then she ISNT really a 'cat safe' dog, just MY cat.

That said, i can call her off a cat, i can call her out of a chas iwth another dog if the other dog doesnt appear to be enjoying it as well.

These dogs however do have a tendancy to play chase and grab at other dogs, even each other, and they need an owner who understands how that play works and trains their dog.

For a dog born to run though i think its actually rather cruel to state they will be happy on a lead all their lives!

Em

really - it's such a load of rubbish...they CAN be retrained... yet you still wouldn't turn your back on yours??? :D   :D

I didn't mention lurchers actually, generally the reason they add breeds like collie to greyhound is to make it slightly more trainable/tractable.

I stand by my earlier comment that an ex racer will be perfectly happy being walked on it's lead for the rest of it's life - it's what greyhound rescue centres recommend and what the dog is used to. Chances are if you let it off it's lead it will just mope along beside you anyway unless it sees something to chase - a tasty loking yorkie perhaps :(

Hi chaumsong,

I think that the word re-train has been taken out of context or maybe not explained very well, a Greyhound will never looses it's natural nature to hunt and chase prey like many dogs it is too inbreed an instinct.(This can not be re-trained)  However what we humans can do with a lot of ex-racers and I have seen this very successfully, is to train a Greyhound, the commands LEAVE and RECALL.

I meet 5 ex racers regularly, they will walk along side a woman friend of mine who has 5 Yorkies and they will happily pass the time with my dogs.  She also has a 6th whom she is training, who will probalby be on lead for a good year. I also meet a gentleman with 2 who happily can walk off lead.

Not all ex-racers can be re-socialised, it really is down to time, effort a good trainer and the personality of the dog itself,  but it certainly can be done, I see it with my own eyes every day. :-)

Alas a lot of people who take on these rescued dogs do not understand them or have the time or effort to train them this is where the problem lies.

Hi Lyssa, you could be right but personally I would never take that risk with an ex racer. My next door neighbours son has one. He's had her for 5 years and you couldn't find a sweeter, gentler, quieter dog...they have young children who play with the dog and lie and sleep beside her. She used to always be off her lead down the country park, would come when called even if chasing a squirrel and never looked remotely interested in chasing any small dogs. One day last year she was walking along beside her owner and a cat crossed the path in front of them - off she went..dissapeared in a flash, over an hour later she was waiting outside their front door - blood splashes over her face and chest! Her family were devastated, they would never have believed she was capable of this. The cat was never found and no angry owner came forward but it served as a warning to them that they shouldn't trust her. The kids still play with her etc but she is just never off her lead outside their garden - just as the rescue centre told them!

Not out of the house in a field with a cat who thinks a dog is a play thing, no!

I know very few dogs who wouldnt chase a strange cat outside and mine are no different, and only one of them is a retired working lurcher!

I know plenty of ex racers who HAVE been retrained, and im angry that people are being told they must ALWAYS be kept on a lead AND muzzled forever. Thats not true and its not fair on the dog either.

Em

>I know very few dogs who wouldnt chase a strange cat outside and mine are no different, and only one of them is a retired working lurcher!

I think the difference, though, is sighthounds can catch them!
I know if I had one of these dogs I would not take the risk, things can happen in a twinkling and I could not live with myself if someone elses loved companion suffered for it.

Its not fair on the poor small dog that gets attacked either :( the reason why people are always being told to keep their greyhounds on the lead and muzzled is the whole point of the OP, some greyhounds just can't be trusted to be let off in a public place.  The only place i will let mine run is on the beach and even then it will be when my OH waves a bit of ham in front of her face, i'll hold on to her and he'll run a distance away and call her in, this happens ONLY if there is noone around apart from that shes walked on the lead.  Ive also got a Pharaoh Hound who's  and Ive had him from a 7 week old pup who can be let to free run as long as its away from a road because he can be trusted not to kill anybody's beloved pet. 

Of course its not, i dont believe i suggested it was, nor did i suggest that all greyhounds can and should be let off the lead straighta way.

Thats just stupid! They CAN however be retrained with some effort, and i get really annoyed at the people who have these dogs on a short lead, muzzled up to the eyeballs NOT because there is a problem but because they CBA!

Fwiw, id only use a muzzle at the long line stage of recall training. An on lead dog is under control (on a short lead) and personally i htink its unfair to muzzle them as well, it can and does affect a dogs behaviour and its also DAMN hard to use food rewards or squeaky toy rewards on a dog wearing a muzzle.

I would also warn people thinking they can let a sighthound off lead wearing a muzzle if it doesnt have a recall, wearing a muzzle does NOT prevent a determined untrained hound from causing injury to another animal, sadly a great many people think it does! Sometimes its ok with none sighthounds, but sighthounds tend to bash with their heads trying to grab, and if its a yorkie or something similar, serious damage can be done!

Em

I do indeed keep my GH on a short lead and she is muzzled at all times when we go out, not because I CBA to train her, far from it we've worked very hard with her.  Not everyone who we meet when we are out has control over their dogs, especially little dogs.  If we didn't muzzle her I'd  say she would have probably killed a few small dogs that happen to have less than perfect recall skills running up to us which would mean a huge set back for us, not to mention a major pain to have to deal with distraught owners and screaming kids whilst out on the daily stroll.   
                   
It means she gets a chance to meet and sniff other dogs on the walk in a controlled situation without fear that in a moment of GH madness she will forget what she is doing and clamp her jaws around another dog.  The muzzle has been a very useful training tool it may be the case with other dogs who aren't used to wearing muzzles to cause behaviour problems but as GHs are already used to wearing them from their racing days, I don't think its a problem.  Depending on how she continues to progress which is very good considering the type of dog she was when we got her, she may or may not have to be muzzled for life.

Damm good point about the letting them off with a muzzle, it would be equally horrific to have a small furry pumelled into the ground which I've no doubt could easily happen

I wasnt meaning people who ARE training their dogs....i mean the people i meet who have taken on dogs from the nearest racing place near me (droylesden) who say 'oh he CANT be trained, we never let him off or take the muzzle off' when ive asked if they are training him, usually because they see me with mine and say 'oh, how come she is off lead with no muzzle on' (most people who dont know think she IS a greyhound, in fact she is 3/4 saluki), and i explain that she has been trained and i have learned her body language so i can tell her NO in the split seconds between 'ive seen something' and 'im gonna chase it'.

Great many greyhounds (and lurcher GRR, they are NOT always the same)end up with owners who seem to think these dogs are 'no effort required' dogs, and CBA to train them, think they CANNOT be trained, and evne if they did most couldnt cope iwth the concept of a dog walk that requires them to pay attention to the dog, rather than wandering about aimlessly going 'hello clouds, hello sun' etc.

Em

Sheila,

Congratulations on doing the responsible thing here.  I can only hope your MIL will hold up her end of the bargain.

thank god you were there!

my nellie got chased by two lurchers when she was a tiny pup.she was petrified. she still remebers,hates greyhound & lurcher types now.

ALL people must be educated on what their dogs were bred for. id not take my dogs for a run in a field full of sheep:rolleyes:

in my town in australia the council enforces that all dangerous dogs be muzzled and on that list of dogs is a grey hound. Grey hounds a supposed to wear a cage muzzle and if caught without one the fine is HUGE.

I agree Chumsong whilst some GHs can be retrained and be let off the lead with reasonable safety there are a LOT that have such high prey drive that even with all the training in the world they are still a risk to other peoples dogs and other small animals.  It is not cruel to keep a dog on the lead, maybe its not the perfect solution, but  then maybe it'll be another cat/grans Yorkshire terrier that gets savaged by my greyhound.  There is nothing wrong with taking a GH in taking it out  muzzled for nice long walks and being kept on the lead. All most of them have known from a pup is kennel, van, track. 

They don't know about running freely through the woods therefore have no idea about what they're missing.  As long as there is a secure garden to stretch their legs in, which is normally checked on application to the rescue, there is absolutely no need to take unnecessary risks by letting them off the lead in public.  Like I say the solution is not perfect, but then again neither is the industry that churns 'em out.

I can see all the problems relating to rescued greyhounds and understand them well.  To say they never ran anyway so they won't miss it is completely missing the point.  They DID run - albeit on a track or on training gallops - you can't train a greyhound to run on a track without it running beforehand.  People should at least find a secure enclosure to let them run.  IMO a running hound not being able to run IS cruel.

Debs

I don't mean never let them off in a secure area, the point is it is not safe with a lot of GHs to be let off in a public area where there are other dogs that could be in danger of being attacked. 

Well done you did the right thing. I hope the westi is ok.

I own a rescue ex racing greyhound.  I can let her off certain places, I let her off on the beach the only thing she chases there are the sea birds, she seems to be be able to tell the difference between rabbit and a dog no problem, but i would still not let her off in an open field area as if she sees a rabbit I know I would not be able to get her back, i am lucky i own my own land which i can let her off for a run,  she also plays with a lot of my friends smaller dogs. I was advised by my rescue to not let her off the lead in open spaces but only in an well fenced area. but they never told me to muzzle her.  I think it not a case of all greyhound are the same and will chase and attck small dogs, some will some wont, its like any breed on any dog, some are dog friendly other are not. of course it is bred into the greyhound to chase, but I know mine will chase anything that moves at times even a leaf blowing round the garden?

I also own a working lurcher, I do not let him off as I know he is ok with my dogs but I would not like to chance it,  he recall is rubbish, we have tried everything when my o/h takes him out coursing, but once he has caught a rabbit he runs away and hides it, he is still young, hopefully he will improve with time and more training.

Sheli

Well with me seeing this horrific attack,I would never trust a ex racer GH again if not on a lead and wearing a muzzle,my Labs appeard to be a bit scared of MIL GH,maybe they sensed somthing.Babara,has not let me know yet how little Poppy is,so fingers and paws crossed.Sat near the phone and praying for good news.

Sheila.

As an owner of a Pomeranian who was actually picked up and wragged by a lurcher once when doing obedience, I realised that as it's the dogs job to go for hares etc. that it wasn't his fault.  I couldn't blame the woman as it was a "controlled" dog, but maybe the dog trainers should have thought better of letter a small furry dog do a recall in-between a lurcher and other dogs.

Hope the Yorkies OK.  But I hope that you're MIL has some sense to deal with her dog properly.

UPDATE ON YORKIE.
Barbara called this evening little poppy is out of the vets,had a lot of stiches in her tummy and she is very badly bruised on her bottom and suffering from truma.God bless her,I hope there will be no long term effects on her she is only two,so relieved that she has pulled through,thanks for all your replies.

Sheila.x

Thats good news Sheila. Well done for everything you've done - things could have been so much worse had your MIL been alone. Dogs recover amazingly quickly don't they - hopefully it won't be too long before the poor wee mite id running around again.

That must be a huge relief, I know you were very worried, dogs are so resilient I'm sure she is on the road to recovery now :)

I think it is worth noting that this dog is a rescue that has been in its home for mere months...This isn't necessarily a sight hound problem but an owner problem.  I appreciate and take on board all that has been said about chase instincts in sighthounds - however I have seen some awful 'goings on' in my local park by numerous different breeds caused by STUPID owners!  This dog should never have been placed in that situation in the first place - and especially not given its history of being an ex-racer...It was doing what has been acceptible behaviour for its life do date!!  How many people can say there dog wouldn't chase and/or attack a cat if it suddenly crossed their path.  Does everyone on this board walk their dogs of lead wherever they go - Probably not, because dogs generally cannot be trusted in all situations 100% of the time.  I have two sighthounds.  One is a new addition. a rescue, who has been physically beaten most of his life.  When he first arrived (and still to this day) I learnt much about his nature and personality whilst slowly introducing him to new animals, people and places.  He has been off lead with other dogs in a secure area.  My bitch is two.  She is soon to take her gold award, she does abedience, stops at a distance, has a chase recall to name a few of her qualities :D  She is let off in busy parks on the summer, she loves playing with other dogs and likes to chase and be chased - she can be a bully when she spots a weakness/submissiveness in some dogs but I know this and dont allow her to bully.  I dont put her in a situation that I know she cant deal with.  She has been going to classes and socialisation walks since she was 11 weeks old.  I deal with my dogs the way way dogs should be dealt with whatever the breed.
In winter I am confined to local lead walks due to my working hours.  My dogs have been attacked by a springer spaniel, two mini schnauzers and this morning two yorkshire terriers whilst they have been on lead.  This morning the yorkies came from no-where and the owner was nowhere to be seen.  I stood with an afghan hound either side of me while two yorkies jumped at their faces snapping their teeth at them.  Then the owner appeared, she was texting on her mobile phone and laughed while her little darlings were going for my dogs (it wasn't as calm as it sounds!) as I opened my mouth to have a 'word' my bitch told the yorkies in no uncertain terms to back off (and it was very well done if I do say so myself - she did all that was necessary given the situation, without biting) and the yorkies started squeeling.  I dont have to tell you guys the sort of look I got and the mumblings under the breath :rolleyes:
My point is COMMON SENSE.....Whatever the breed.
Sarah

my greyhound was attacked by a small white fluffy thing,and a lab which went for her throat.my girl was on her lead.funny when its a greyhound it becomes a major discussion,yet with any other dog it seems to be ok.any dog can chase cats.we dont all witch hunt other breeds though do we????

This sort of thing really annoys me. I've had my ex racing Greyhound for ten years now. I've never had to muzzle her and she is well behaved around other dogs. She lives with three cats and my pet rabbits. The cats BULLY her, they steal her food! Yes I know there are greys that can't be trusted but to brand them all as dangerous dogs really angers me. The amount of times my dog has been attacked by other breeds is crazy. Had a lab go for her throat whilst the idiotic owner was just wandering along, completely unaware of what his dog was doing, even though I was shouting at him to call his dog off! Small dogs are some of the worst, biting at her legs and nipping her all over, she just stands there looking terrified. I'm very sorry about what happened with the Yorkie, and I hope its ok. But to start going around claiming that all greys need to be gagged,bound and kept on a short lead is terrible. The fact is ANY breed can go bad. Like Isissarah said, don't turn this into a witch hunt! *rant over*

Why drag up a 4 year old thread? It doesn't matter what breed it is or isn't, it's a very simple (and obvious!) fact that if a large dog attacks a small one, major damage can be done, but if a small one attacks a large one, it's not going to be able to kill. Therefore it's far more shocking when irresponsible owners don't control large dogs around little ones.

Good point Marianne, however this is a new member.
Jeff.

Why drag up a 4 year old thread

Oh, I got excited for a minute I saw Isabel and thought she had returned. :-(

> to start going around claiming that all greys need to be gagged,bound and kept on a short lead is terrible. The fact is ANY breed can go bad.

There is little point in having pure-bred dogs if we pay no mind to thier characteristics. Greyhounds have the instinct to chase & catch small furry things - ergo, one must keep that in mind, Mastiffs have an instinct to guard, so one must keep that in mind, ie. it would be fool hardy of me to leave my Mastiff unsupervised while strangers (ie. workmen) are in the house. It has NOTHING to do with demonising any breed, it's about understanding, respecting and managing thier characteristics. Should be common sense really, but sadly it seems it's not :(

it doesn't matter if its a purebred dog or a mongrel.any dog can attack.as for the fact its a 4 year old thread,as far as im aware it is a free country and people have the right to reply??,my dog was attacked by a labrador which like greyhound lover experienced too,went for her throat.Thankgod she had her greyhound collar on which has deep teeth marks that show just how determind the lab was.that could have had a very different ending.I,however am not saying that all labs should be on a short lead and muzzled at all times.or small dogs which tend to be the worst for running up bouncing around my girls face snapping and growling.the owners seem to find it cute,or funny their little darling taking on a big dog.its not,its bloody annoying.my girl has NEVER retaliated.i've had to walk her home with blood dripping from her nose where a small dog has bitten her.thats ok then because it couldn't have killed her?Shouldn't little dog owners be just as responsible as large dog owners?staffies are small,my friends greyhounds stomach was ripped open by one.that couldn't have killed???wrong!!!!!Im sorry,I know many of you may disagree but this thread does appear a witch hunt.

> it doesn't matter if its a purebred dog or a mongrel.any dog can attack

Very true, but that is besides the point.
An ex-racing greyhound, a breed with an instinct to chase small animals, plus the fact that it has been a racing greyhound (which proves that instinct is there and has been hightened through training etc.) is highly likely to chase a small animal if it sees one (including small dogs). This should be taken into acount when walking the dog or introducing it to other small animals/pets.
There is no witch hunt atall.
On top of the breed traits there is the training to consider.
Would anybody expect a protection trained dog to sit & ignore the attacker if it's owner was attacked? I think not, in just the same way a dog trained to chase a 'hare' around a course (ex-racing greyhound), should be expected to be interested in chasing, and possibly chatching, small animals.

You mention staffies - a breed bred for fighting, so with them extra care should be taken around other dogs.

You may have trouble keeling a Newfoundland out of the water (I've read of them 'recusing' children from lakes that were only playing!).

The list goes on.All breeds have characteristics or (or the likelyhood of displaying the breed characteristics), that do need to be taken into acocunt in one way or another. If those breed traits have been proven/heightend through trainng, then there is even more cause to be aware of the possibility of those behavours showing.

A yorkie being attacked by any dog is not a very nice thing to happen, a yorkie being attacked by a dog that has spent it's early life living for the buzz of chasing a small fury thing around is an avoidable (through it's predictabilty) event :(

what is besides the point???the fact that other breeds can and do attack?? again it has been ignored that people with other breeds of dogs should take responsibility for their dogs too. im sure labs are very nice dogs even though I would never own one  after the attack,doesn't change the fact that two people have had dogs attacked by them just on this thread.I walk my girl on her lead,but I will not muzzle her and leave her in a position of being unable to defend herself if the need arose.a number of people have said how annoying small yappy dogs are for jumping around  their dogs.if their dog is likely to run upto a strange larger dog,should the owners not keep them on a lead too???i find it really annoying when other dog owners let their dog/dogs have a go at my girl who is doing nothing but enjoying her walk on her lead quite happily and the owners just say'oh my dog doesn't like greyhounds'damn well keep it away then!!!

The point is that all dog owners should be aware of what their breed was originally designed for, and recognise that those instincts will be stronger than in other breeds. Collies have an enhanced propensity to herd, beagles have an enhanced propensity to follow a scent, labradors have an enhanced propensity to carry items and greyhounds have an enhanced propensity to chase.

Slightly off topic as nothing to do with greyhounds but the other thing that really annoys me is people letting their dog bound up to others. My oldest boy is good but there are certain situations I wouldn't trust him in and if I ever see anybody approaching when I'm out with any of mine they are called back to me and put on the lead. So why then do other people think they have the right to allow theirs to bound up to mine, I cannot guarantee if something bounds into Winstons face he won't bite, and as he is so huge you can guarantee that he would be the one in the wrong with the other owner and be vicious! My GSP youngster has a couple of times been knocked over when on the beach other dogs have flown up to him and just totally bowled him over. If he was a more nervous dog this would have had a major effect, luckily he has been affected by it. What do these owners think gives them the right to allow their dogs to bound up to a well behaved dog on a lead?