Hi, i have two rescued female Dobermanns called Leah and Danni.

Leah is just over 2years old, she came from a Dobermann breeders who also rescue sometimes. Leah was found in a very bad way, she had been hit, had dogs set on her and was even hit round the head with a metal bar which has left a big dent. She was eventually found in a boarded up shed starving. The people who rescued her fed her a lot of food straight away, which has unfortunately ruined her stomach. It now bleeds constantly and she has diarrhoea permanently. She has been on medication, but it hasn't worked. We have managed to find a food that makes it a bit better though.

The big problem with Leah is aggression. She started off very nervous, and then became very loving towards the family. As time passed, she got more and more confident, and unfortunately very vicious. She doesn't attack the family, but has attacked dogs in the past. We now ensure she doesn't get the chance to attack any other dogs, and have been able to keep her under control.

There are times where she gets wound up by people walking past the house, and if she gets too wound up, goes in a sort of trance. She then has to attack someone. She has gone for my sister once, but stopped just before as if she knew it was wrong. She then goes for our other dog Danni. This has got a lot better recently, and none of them have got hurt badly as i can split them up straight away. i know she could do a lot of damage though, as my thumb got in the way once and i would have lost it if i hadn't have pulled it out of her mouth. She is a big dog, so i can imagine she could cause a lot of damage.

Things have been going well recently, we have had no fights for a good few weeks now and she hasn't had the chance to attack anything. Her and Danni get on so well, and play with eachother most of the time.
We took her for a walk today and all was going well, she didnt even bark or growl at anyone which she usually does. Just as we were getting home, we stopped to speak to a neighbour, and she stood there patiently. We often stop to speak to people and have had no problems. As he went to walk past her and away, she lunged at him and managed to bite his coat. luckily i was able to pull her away straight away, but she could have hurt him or one of his children if it was them i was talking to. I've always known she could be dangerous, but she's never been confident enough to even approach other people.

The big problem is, we now cannot let my 10yr old sisters friends into our house as there is a chance she could bite them. This cannot go on, and i don't know if there is anything else i can do.

I really don't want to have to get her put down, as she is a very loving dog really, she just seems to think everyone is out to get her.
Is there anything else i can try? or does anyone know of anyone who could help, or even take her on? I would love to find someone experienced with aggressive abused dogs, but i have been looking for a while now and haven't found anyone yet.

I really don't want to see her pts but i feel there is nothing else i can do...

Emma x

Bearing in mind her history, combined with a serious head injury, I'd say a vet check would be your first point of call to rule out any physical cause, be in brain damamge or pain.  You then really need to ask your vet to refer you to an experienced behaviourist who can observe your girl 'in action' and advise accordingly.

I'm sorry, I have never been one to give up on dogs and have fought like crazy to re-train badly behaved dogs in the past.  But I am really fearful of this dog you have, I think this is an accident just waiting to happen! Sometimes a dog has been too badly abused to ever turn around again.  In my opinion if you wish to keep this dog, you will have to live a life of never trusting her, always keeping her on a lead, never allowing her to be left alone with people and never, ever let your guard down.  If you have the time and energy to keep up this forever life style, then that is wonderful and this girl may have a happy life with you, but if you are not able to keep this lifestyle up and it would be a strain on anyone, then................  :-(

You must also protect Danni, a dog being attacked will eventually snap back, you do not want two vicious dogs on your hands.

Dobbys are great dogs, I met two today actually, but I personally could not live with a dog, I could not trust. Sorry! :-(

We have been trying for a while now, but are restricted to what we can do and where we can take her because of what other people think, even though i have full control of her. I would like to take her to training classes, but i don't think anyone would let her because of her aggression? If they would then i'd be happy to take her myself.

She is a great dog, and when she does attack, Danni will fight back to keep her in her place. Luckily i have always been in when they fight, because i am the only one who is willing to get into the middle of them to split them up.#
if i lived on my own i would happily have her, but as i live with my parents and my little sister it could end up being dangerous. From now on she will always be muzzled when out, even though she hates it. I just cant risk it

Hi,

You know the phrase we always like to use for our dogs is 'Man's Best Friend' in my mind that means your dog is your right arm, someone you can trust, who will protect you if needed but also welcome your friends and family, someone who you can rely on 100%.  I feel totally safe with my dogs, in and out of the house, I feel safe in the knowledge that they would never, ever bite another human or dog. They are very obediant and they are my best friends. My grandchildren can play with them without a tremour of doubt in my mind.

You have taken in this dog who has had a terrible start to her life, but is she suitable to be a pet??? Some dogs just aren't.  Perhaps another option to having her PTS is to see whether any security services would be interested in training her up, she could be with a proffessional dog handler and used as a guard dog.  This she may excel in and have a long happy life. For me she is too much of a risk to be a pet.

You could always get another Dobby to go with the one you have, as I know they do like company. I always seem to see them in pairs.

A lot of us like to think we can save a dog and turn it around, but sometimes it just isn't meant to be.

"Luckily i have always been in when they fight, "

They need to be seperated if they are alone, I even do that with my two or there would be trouble big time.

They are never usually alone as my mum doesn't work. I am the only one who will really split them up, so that is what i meant when i said 'luckily i have been in when they fight'

Unfortunately i don't think Leah would do well as a guard dog, as she cannot see very well when it's dark, and will always be nervous. What i want the most is for her to be alive and well, even if she is not here with me.

Were still unsure of having her PTS, but something is going to have to be done to ensure she doesn't attack again.

Emma x

So sorry to hear about Leah's horrible backgrund :-(  Since I sense in your posts that you want different persons opinions, I will give you mine, as one of many others.
My breed also have strong instincts to guard and protect. They are less intense than Dobes, though. In my experience, from my own breed, a dog behaving like your girl, is a very unhappy individual. :-(  
An unhappy, insecure dog, will sense the way it's never trusted, which in itself will increase it's insecurity. Rehoming her, after she has finally ended up with you and your love for her, seems too cruel to be an option, to me. In the best of worlds, yes, she might find a new home where she fits in better, but I frankly don't think the chance for that to happen is very big. To be rehomed again, might just be too much for her to cope with. Should something really bad happen, and someone really gets hurt, nothing would be gained,only lost, for everyone involved.  IMO you seem to have done everything you possibly can to make her forget her past, and start over with you. But maybe that's not possible? If you can rule out any medical reasons for her behaviour, then I think her soul might just be too scarred from her past, to ever heal again. And then the right thing to do, IMHO, would be to let her go. To let her run free on the other side of Rainbow Bridge, where she will have no bad memorys left, only the good ones you have given her.
Whatever you decide to do, I'm sure you will do what's best for your dog, and I will be thinking of you and her, hoping everything will work out to the best.
Karen

I totally agree with what RRfriend has posted. What ever you decide will be the right thing for all of you. Feel very sad for you as you are obviously feeling desparate, I would be the same. Have you got a good vet? Perhaps they could recommend some one to work with on these issues, you've probably gone down that road. Maybe some of the more experienced members on this forum will pick up this and give you some advice, or names to be referred to ........  I also agree even if you could move her on to another good home the stress and setbacks to her would probably be too much. I talk from experience on that, but luckily iin my case aggression was never an issue. Both my present pups have arrived with several problems, how ever they seem nothing to what you've had  to deal with. Wishing  you all well, DD.

I thought one of the Dobe rescues takes them and if they think they are unsuitable for re-homing they keep them for life, not sure which rescue it is, one of the old ones I know that much.

This poor dog needs to be given peace and we there carers are the  only ones that can do it
you say you love her then do the only thing that will give her peace of mind......

I rescue so many poor abused dogs and i try every thing to bring them back to normal?
But some times you cant win the dog has gone too  far and this poor one has brain damage by the sounds of it, and to give it to some one else will just send it really mad, there is only one thing you can do and do it for the dog please.......
.

this poor one has brain damage by the sounds of it,

Please post in a responsible manner and stop such dangerous incompetant tripe. First put forward your medical qualifications and then state how any neuro surgeon can diagnose brain damage over the net - the poster should ignore such non rational posts.
Many people who post on these sites are vulnerable and you should not take advantage of someone in an an emotionaly vulnerable state, for whatever underlying motives you have.

I'd suggest a vet check up first alongside behaviourist support. A behaviourist friend of mine has a Dobe that was hypothyroid and this can sometimes cause aggression - it would be wise to read up on this on the net and get a thorough check, explaining to the vet her history.

This will then rule out any medical problems, (which are often hidden) and then you can assume the problem is genuinely behavioural :)
It may be there is nothing to be done, but I do feel strongly in this kind of situation, the owner needs professional help to assess the dog.

See www.apbc.org.uk or www.ukrcb.co.uk for help.
Also www.dog-partnership.co.uk

I know of a lady who had a very aggressive doberman, who had been abused in a terrible way; she was able to help it; if you feel it would help to talk to her PM me and i will attempt to get her contact details.

I believe Doberman rescues (the ones in the south anyway) dont tend to take on aggressive problem dogs.

Lindsay
x

The link I have PMd takes you to one of the Dobe rescues, I think it is one of the older rescues.

Dobe rescue takes on any Dobe and they can handle agression by routine, it was not uncommon in Dobes at one time and the older rescues and handlers understand them very well.

From what Lindsay says this seems not to be the case with the newer rescues and I dont know which is which these days. I suggest you contact the one at the link I have just PMd, I think thats one of the old ones,they understand the breed and agressive dogs inside out, aggressive Dobes were quite common at one time.

>Unfortunately i don't think Leah would do well as a guard dog<

Thank you for being responsible. I'm always disturbed by how many people think that an aggressive, psychologically unstable dog will make a good guard dog. It's clear that you want what's in Leah's best interests, but please think twice about passing a problem dog on. It's not your fault she's like she is, but she is now your responsibility.   

Definitely rule out anything medical first. She could have anything from thyroid abnormalities to being in pain from her old head injury pressing on her brain. She can't tell you if she has a stinking headache that day and is feeling grumpy with the world in general. Also try a well recommended behaviourist and contact Dobe rescue as maybe somebody there with lots of experience may be able to assess her? Not sure on that one, but you could really do with as many 'professional' opinions as possible so you can decide what is best for Leah. But ultimately, you live with her and you've got some heart searching to do. You need to do what your conscience tells you to do is the best thing for the dog's wellbeing. And if that's the decision to euthanize her, at least you have given her a chance to be happy and much love in the time she's been with you that she may otherwise have never had. Sadly, death is far from the worst thing that can happen to a dog as you probably know from Leah's previous treatment before she came to you.

Any dogs that is used as a security dog MUST be predictable, this dog is not, therefore it would be entirely unsuitable as a guard dog in any case apart from the fact that this dog would not be able to handle the added pressure this role would bring.

Sorry but you obviously do NOT have full control of your dog from your posts, if you did then your dog would not have been in the position to lunge and catch the person you were talking to.

You are walking around with a lethal weapon.  Personally I would seriously consider whether to continue.  Dog ownership should be pleasurable and there are thousands of dogs out there that make suitable companions and those that have problems should either be with people who can deal with it, manage it or have it euthanised.

If, after having a full vet check over no medical reasons can be discovered for her behaviour, I would either pursue an experienced, accredited behaviourist (APBC or UKRCB member) for an evaluation.

If you are in a position as an owner and live in a suitable environment so that you can pursue behaviourial modification (should that prove relevant) that is one option to you or you can choose to contact breed rescue who will further advise you.

At the end of the day you need to carry out a full risk assessment to determine how likely her behaviour is to escalate, the frequency and the severity of the outcome. 

Some dogs might even be happier when put down, as their lives are so stressful that this is the first peace they may know...........

Unfortunate, but true.

I do feel for you and have been in your place so I know. We had to have our rescued Dobe girl PTS this year after trying and trying so hard to save her. She had not been treated badly, just not socialised which is as bad IMO. She was the most loving and gentle girl at home and a joy to know and love. She was greatly admired for her beauty but almost unapproachable to strangers and constantly struggled with her demons that she saw around every corner and in every situation, she was always frightened.  Finally after a long hard haul, of behavourist, vets, Dobe rescues that were full and could not help and offers of rehome from possible puppy farmers in Wales, on her last day she managed to bite a Dobe savvy friend for no other reason than the friend was walking towards me!
It was the hardest thing to do and I will always blame myself and think that I could of done more for her, but at the same time I try to remind myself that I tried 110% and that I'm the only one that believes I should of tried more, and that gets me through. She's safe now, not frightened and the child, or elderly lady that she could of bitten are safe too. My memories of her and I together, of the fun days and the good days are like gold dust to me and every Dobe that I own and love from now on will be a Dobe after Daisy.
We have a new baby now and super socialised, out at 9 weeks old meeting and greeting every day,she loves everyone and plays in the park with lots of different dogs. She is only 6 months old now but what a difference, she's fearless and brave and more importantly, she's happy.
Only you can decide what to do for the best, but you will know. Good luck.

Daisys story is posted.

Sorry i haven't replied for a while

Just thought i'd let you know that Leah was put to sleep this morning. She was no longer safe to be around, and was clearly suffering with her stomach problems. We will miss her, but i know it was the best thing to do.

Emma

My thoughts are with you - you did your best for her but I think having her pts was the kindest thing you could do especially if she was not enjoying and living life.  At least you tried.
x

So Sorry Emma you have made the right if hardest decison

Run Free at The Bridge Leah

I'm so sorry Emma - I'm sure it was a difficult decision done with a heavy heart but the right one nevertheless.

Bless you, Teri x

I'm very sorry Emma -you did the only thing you could. Hugs.

Sorry for your loss Emma. I always believe the kindest thing you will ever do for your dog is the hardest thing to do for it.
You put the dog first and showed it the greatest kindest and love.
I hope you take comfort that the short time she was with you, she at least knew that she was loved, which from your original posting, previously she had not.

Heartbreaking story, not sure what else could have been done as it seems you'd tried everything. No more suffering for that poor soul, bless. You must be so upset and i feel for you very much. Take care x

So sorry for your loss Emma.  Leah was obviously suffering and you've done the kindest thing you could and put her out of her misery.  My thoughts are with you at this difficult time. Josie xxx

Emma,
So sorry to hear of your heartbreak. Do not beat yourself up. You tried everything humanly possible to help Leah. Sadly it was not, nor could ever be enough to rescue her, or bring her in from that dark place. As for today and tomorrow try to remember that in a world filled with danger and cruelty, in her heart she knew that only you trully loved her. This is your forever gift to her, a gift that she'll take with her to the bridge untill you can hug her again.

Bless you Emma for having the strength to release this girl who was obviously struggling to come to terms with all the demands we humans place on our dogs.  You did all you possibly could for her.

Oh Emma, so very very sorry to hear your news, as I know how hard it must be for you,and how you will miss her dreadfully.

At least you can take comfort knowing she is now free of her Demons and able to run free....

Warmest Wishes to you and a big ((Husky Hug))
xxx

sorry to here you had to make this decision, thankfully she had love from you till the end,she was lucky to have been with you, so sorry

You had to make a very hard decision, I'm so sorry :(

Lindsay
x

Sorry it came to this.  It took courage to make the decision you did.

Sorry to hear about this sad outcome.  You have been through a tough time.

Take care.

So sorry for your loss, Emma. She had such a difficult life, the time spent with you must have been very valuable for her. To recieve your love and kindness must have helped her a lot. Her soul was just too hurt to ever heal properly. You have given her the greatest gift of all, the gift of letting go.
All the best,
Karen