My old guide dog retired after 9 years of service and being 11 years old. I still have her bless her and recently qualified with my new dog. He's a 20 month old yellow lab cross retriever. From leaving the kennel environment he was on 450g of Eukanuba Large Breed Maintenance. Since coming home I have learnt this is way too much for him and he should be on about 250g instead. This I thought may the cause of my problem but it has helped.

The problem is this, he has a pen in the garden on slabs where he is told "get busy". Now he does a poo and a wee in the morning. Now in kennels they let them out at 7:30am where he used to do a poo and then another poo at 8:30am before the trainers come to collect them. If he doesn't do a second poo he will spend within 10 minutes of walking.

Now that I'm home my work hours do not match his kennel routine and so he will do only 1 poo before I go to work. I can take him out several times before we leave for work and he will only do one poo. He will then hold on all day, even though I give him plenty of opportunities to spend throughout the day.

When we get home he will do a wee and then after being fed he will again do a poo and another wee. Now when I go out in the evening he does another poo then. Again he has plenty of opportunity before going for a walk. I make no suggestion that he is infact going for a walk. How can I get him out of this routine. It looks like he needs to poo 3 times a day but I can't get him to do it. I've managed to get him to poo morning and after feeding but he still needs to do a 3rd. Now if we don't go out he won't go for another poo.

I'm not too bothered at the moment but I'm more worried as the nights draw in because this is when I loose my vision and I won't be able to see the poo to pick it up which I am doing now. This will be his 2nd week at home with me.

Please can you help me as my trainers don't seem to concerned at the moment but my concern is growing. My main fear is if he does need this 3rd poo then if he doesn't do it on a walk or in his pen then he may poo at work or in a shop.

my dad has a new guide dog too-his oldie retired at 10, the new one seemed to be far too young, little more than a puppy, 14-15months i think he was, hes eaten money -cigarettes whole, then sicked them up into his bed, my mams there too , just as well as theyre now not keen of leaving him in the house, hes shredded newspapers. eaten slippers etc, my dad can see very little and certainly couldnt pick a poo up- however his dog can be given every oppourtunity to go but will then still go while out walking with my dad, this he finds upsetting as hes having to just leave it where its dropped, i feel so sorry for my parents as theyre nearly 70 and could of done with a lot calmer dog at that age, -hes very clingy to my dad and sits gazing at him and draping himself all over him, my dad now makes excuses for him as he feels sorry or him,
as for your problem copuld you change his feed time ,perhaps to bedtime instead of the morning, although dad tried this once and because hed not been fed in the morning as usual when they went out for their walk it was more like a run-the dog shot him out flew him around and had him home in the blink of an eye :D

have you contacted the guide dog centre,this doesnt sound right to me I have two friends who are guide dog trainers and they are amazed at this behaviour

dad told them about most of the problems-the messing outside they werent too bothered about!!!! when he was allocated the dog he was warned he'd pick things up so hed have to be careful not to let him . the sad thing is at 70 the week or fortnight that dad stayed at the guide dog centre training with the dog really took it out of him, hes no spring chicken, and i dont think he could go through it again, so if this dog has to be returned then hed probably do without, when he first came home he leapt up at everyone coming through the door, often knocking my mam against the wall,-they had a short weekend away and the dog stayed with a guide dog volanteer who often takes them for a break- he was shocked at how he jumped up on folk,---the only way he can leave the dog for a while is to give it a variety of smoked bones, chews etc, which hes only allowed when they go out, he has other play things daily but the special ones are kept back,---i dont feel that a dog with these problems are ideal for someone of there age, as my sister and i both show dogs also my neice we dont take any nonsense from him and hes not as pushy with us, however he consistently try's to force his kong into my neices mouth!!!!much to her disgust,-he is improving but its been a long hard slog for someone of that age,

Thak you for replying. Mine too gets very excitable and tends to jump up at me and guests. I've been told it's purely down to his age. I learnt from talking to other guide dog owners that some time back they tried speeding up the process of training the dogs and indeed the new owners. This failed and a lot of dogs we recalled back to the centres for further training. I've been talking to the guide dog centre today and they are not overly concerned about the spending either. I know with my last dog, spending when out was a big no no and even spending when free running was not highly thought of. Now they are not concerned at all if the dog spends while free running. When you speak to people the one thing they always say is how guide dogs don't spend when they are out. This appers not so important anymore. I am having to be so much stricter with my new dog or he can get out of control. I know exactly how your father feels having to constantly clamp down and correct the dog which is meant to set an example in much respects. I know after all said and done they are only dogs and when off harness are like normal pet dogs but still you don't expect them to be so naughty.

Regarding the spending problem I would get on to guide dogs again and pressure them for someone to come out to you and talk things other. I've been told a few things to try, one of them I will try tonight and will keep you posted with the success or failure. Many thanks again for replying, in some respect it's nice to know I'm not alone on this one!!!! If anyone else has any input please let me/us know.

where abouts in the country are you-perhaps theyre from the same litter and centre, ?

I'm from the North West. He was puppy walked in Oxon. I've just tried on the things my trainer suggested. She said after his feed, spend him as usual (he does a poo and wee). He leave it an hour and then spend him again. If he does nothing, whizz him round the block for literally 2 minutes then pop him back in the pen when you get home.

So I did this and sure enough he spent after feeding. I put him in his pen to spend again but nothing, only a wee. So I just whizzed him round the block and put him back in his pend, told him to get busy and hey presto - he did a poo!

My trainer said it maybe he needs stimulating more to spend and that hopefully by doing this, in time, he won't need to be shot round the block everytime because he will learn he needs to do it all in the pen before he goes out. And oh, when he spends properly, lots of praise, give a tit bit or have a game in the garden with him so he knows he's done well.

You dad may want to try this and see how he goes. She said it getting him into a routine but one that works. I will keep you posted. If you want to email please feel free and I will be more open with locations, etc.

This may be a totally off the wall idea, but what about putting dog sanitary pants on the dog? This might just make the dog disinclined to want to go when on a walk!

have you been drinking :rolleyes:- it never put a baby off pooing in its nappy did it-and could you imagine the comments and jokes made, the poor owner would be less embarrased letting it poo on the street

Hi ya, Well I've just got back from doing an extremely long walk (which I could always guarantee he would poo) and he never spent. Fingers crossed! That's the first time in 2 weeks he hasn't gone to poo on the evening walk.

well im pleased you seem to be sorting your problems out-[WITHOUT A PAIR OF UNDIES ], our lots still hiding their ciggies and money, :)

I have nothing to add to this thread. I have posted to say how horrified I was to see the problems these dogs have! To me there is no way they should have come out of training with these faults. Certainly in the old days they never would. I was involved on the fringes of guide dogs at one time, having had a number of puppy walkers in the area referred to my club and most of the troubles detailed here would have been sorted by the puppy walkers.

The only constructive comment I have to make is that for her entire life up to now she has lived to a routine which you have now changed. That is OK, she has to fit in to your lifestyle but she is not going to be able to change instantaneously. She will need time to get into the new routine.

Hoping things soon settle, Regards, John

No, teetoatal mostly:D

From what i have been told, when bitches wear those pants they won't go to the loo in them, I haven't used them so don't know if they might not have an inhibiting effect!

i havent used them either! :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

If I put sweaters on my two that still have the stupid rear leg straps on them, they will not pee/poo at all.
I found that out by accident when hubby put new sweaters on without cutting the straps off. [couldn't figure why they were walking so stiffly until I took a closer look] I imagine if I actually put "panties" on them, it would definitely stop them, esp. after the leg strap incident. ;)

mam and dad where off on a trip today organised by the blind club, they nearly backed out of going as it meant leaving the dog-----they could of taken him but then it means mam looking after dad and dog!!!!--they arranged with the family to drop in at intervals to let him out etc--i drew the first slot-they left at 11ish, i went at 2 and hed ripped a paper to shreds and chewed a slipper to bits!!!-i wanted to pop home and take a cage down to stick him in but dads not happy about the idea of cageing him :rolleyes:- so we cleared up and dont know yet what the second round produced!!!

Hi ya, remember me?? Well that little walk round the block worked once and it hasn't worked since! DOH! Back to the drawing board I think.

How long has your dad had the dog for again? We have a pet german shepherd and she does exactly the same when you leave her. We had a word with a dog bahaviourist (spelt wrong) and she said it was due to the dog is used to having us around all the time and once we leave it feels insecure. We were told to leave her 2 minutes, go back, if she hasn't destroyed anything lots of praise and over time increase it. She said failing this they can now treat this condition with medication. She said if we couldn't overcome it and didn't like the idea of giving the dog medication they we would have to consider putting her in a kennel when whe leave her. So in the end we had a kennel built in the back garden specially for her.

I would ring guide dogs again because the whole idea of you dad having a guide dog is to give him fredom and not to create more of a mobility issue where as you can't leave the dog. If they don't seem bothered, go to your vet and ask for help there and just let guide dogs know what your doing. Personally I think a lot of this (both mne and your problem) is down to how young these poor dogs are, bless them.

sorry to hear yours has fallen back into his old ways???? i think dad qualified with the dog about 6 months ago, --he is very very clingy!but because hes needing to be checked so much-which needs dad taking hold of him by his collar,now when you hold his collar for anything he dribbles, --anyhow theyve decided that seeing as all the damage he's done is papers, slipper and an odd ciggie, theyre just going to have to make sure theres nothing at all for him to chew, -im picking them up tommorow as one of the clubs where we live give them use of one of their rooms on a monday afternoon, they have tea and raffles. play games etc, organise trips-so hell be left for around 3 hours,

How did he manage 3 hours on his own?

mam had the flu so couldnt go-i picked dad up and took him , seemingly the dog cried most of the time he was away and eventually lay with his head on mams feet,

That's a shame, I hope your mum gets well soon. Are you Irish by any chance? There's no change my end. I took him to the vets today and he's lost a kilogram in weight. I think I might put him on Eukanuba Large Breed Performance instead. Dogs who'd have 'em hey?!

shes still not out and about----come on then, tell me ,what made you think i might be irish, is it cos we say mam and dad, whereas most of you have mums???? im a geordie!!

Well I have a Mum [$ Dad but also a Mam - in- law]) I feel so bad for you both having this trouble. I have a retired guide dog who we've had since he was 6, who had his probs when he arrived, but from all I've heard about him he was fab at his job:D He is now fab at being a pet:D

I hope yours both settle soon and become everything you need them to be and I hope your Mum feels better soon Dizzy:D

Anita

Hey, you sussed me. I have a lot of friends from Dublin and they call there mum's mams. :)

for all i say [ mam], it always sounds odd when i write it down, ----also youve got it wrong!!! we dont call our mums mam!!!!!!
you call your mam, mum :D :D :D :D

Hi ya,

How are things going your end - still the same? I've had a right couple of weeks! I dropped my dogs food to get him to stop spending and we seemed to be making progress. Then last week he went all slow on me, like he had no energy. So I rang guide dogs up and they weren't overly concerned and so took him to the vet to make sure he wasn't ill. Medically everything was fine and the vet said he isn't getting enough from his food and is basically no energy. So we have now changed his food to Eukanuba Performance. The life has come back into him and yesterday he was working great for me but tonight he spent on a walk. I'm baffled as what to do now. I just don't get it .Both my retired dog and my pet German Shepherd don't spend on walks and the GS is just a pet. I walked him round the block on a short walk to try and stimulate him but that worked once and he's never spent since on his return. Anyone got any ideas?

im suprised that on the maintanence food he wasnt getting enough to convert into energy, -its got 24% i think, what do you do with him-sprint-jog , he surely should be able to do it on a good food of that protien, -thats what the crackpot weve got eats, and he certainly has enough energy, -mams just starting to get over her illness now, so hes still not been left !! but when i go in its like a battle to get past him, hes very very pushy and in your face, i was talking to dad today and the dog was perstering him, dad was moving away, moving his hands etc, it wasa driving me nuts, --it reminds me of a spoilt kid that needs to be the centre of attention--BUT,hes stopped plopping outside!!!!, when he was doing it dad was giving him a load of verbals!!!. think it made a difference as hes a very sensitive clingy beast!

I do walk very fast, I used to have my trainer puffing and panting when we went for walks. So we've put him on this performance for a while, it has a much higher protein content than maintenance. The vet said he will only be on it for say 2 years and then he will probably go back onto maintenance again. Funny you should say that about him pooing and your dad telling him off. I did it today and will continue to do so. I feel that in training if the dog pooed then it was looked over because it wasn't a positive thing and they didn't want a negative thing to be used. But the problem is the dog (I think) has learnt that it's ok to do it. My old dog started doing it a year or so back. I then ignored it and it happend again and then I started giving it a really deep NO and she hasn't done it again since. So I think I will have to start that one with him. He needs to learn that it wrong and he just wasn't getting it on training in my view.

Another thought I had whilst reading your reply. Does your dad put him on the lead when he mis-behaves? Mine used to play me up in the student lounge and one night a chap was sat with me who had 35 years experience under his belt and after a week and a half of this dog going crazy on me every so often and not being able to control him this chap showed me what to do and it sorted the dog straight way. He told me that if he started acting up, walk off with him on the lead and then walk back to you seat, making the dog sit, wait, down, wait, sit, etc and then when your back to your seat put him down. If he starts again do it all again and be real firm, even if that means checking him with telling him to sit. He said that it because the dog wants to play but it's on the dogs terms and not yours. If you ignore him and he start jumping, barking, growling, etc he's saying hey look at me. Since doing what he told me my mut has never mis-behaved like he used to. Does your dad's dog have a half check collar on? If he does, put him on a full check when he plays up. Why I say this is my dog is like a mad dog possesed with a half check collar on because he knows he can get away with things because it's not as uncomfortable as a full check when being used in correction. As soon as I put a full check on he is like a little angel!

I hope this helps a little but it suddendly sprung to mind and I thought I must tell you. Keep me posted.

In Dublin it is usually the Ma or the Da the girl friends are the mots
the Father the auld fella
In waterford it is mammy or mother [mudder]
and dad or me father :) for that useless bit of info I get whacked , Mari

CARRTIM1-= it was my parents golden anniversary on friday, the whole family went out for a meal---there was flowers cards etc, delivered through the day, i drove them through for the meal with my family, they waited in the street. away from the window as the dog was up leaning on the sink watching out of it, we left at 7, they where back around 10----hed destroyed the lid off a set of wine glasses, hed eaten-shredded one of the cards, and spilt a vase of flowers!!!.hes now 2 years old, theyve had him just over 6 months,ive seen a slight improvement in his behaviuor towards people coming into the house, but theyre still having to check and clear things away at bedtime and also when they go out, its wearing my mother down-dad reckons hes going to give him a real telling off next time---i dont see it making any difference!!!---i see the problem as hes much too clingy, he has to be touching dad, head on foot etc, follows him all over, i went today and was sitting next to him, the dog was unsettled cos it couldnt squash into the space and drape itself around dad-when it tried i kept shoving it out!!!!
ive tried explaining this to him, he thinks im just being hard!!!ive offered to lend them a cage, again he thinks its cruel---i wouldnt hesitate, hed be in it and unable to cause any trouble-hed also get put in a few times a day to let him see he cant be attatched at the hip!!!!-but we all know what our parents are like, how would we possibly be right !!! :(