I been given home work got to be in Thursday can any one help me, ive got to say whether the breeds below are traditionally clipped scissored hand stripped natural or a mixture of these styles.

airedale
afghan
bichon
border terrier
border collie
bedlington terrier
bearded collie
boxer
briard
chow chow
clumber
cocker S
dalmation
deerhound
GSD
german spitz
havanese
Hungarian puli
irish terrier
italian spinone
jap aktia
jap spitz
kerry blue
komondor
lakeland
lapphund
lhasa apso
lowchen
maltese

some more later

for the ring,border collies should have their feet tidied ,pasterns trimmed & ears tidied!!

(thank god i dont show ,me & sisscors are a lethal combination!)

Dalmatians are best groomed with a rubber glove to loosen the hair, then brushed with a bristle brush. No trimming of anything, not even whiskers.

Most have their feet/ears scissored, except Cavaliers (interestingly not mentioned?) who keep their slippers on.  Short coated breeds need dead hair removing with a rubber glove, bristle brush and then polished.  Most handstrips have scissored feet/heads.

airedale - hand stripped
afghan - natural
bichon - scissored
border terrier - hand stripped
border collie - natural
bedlington terrier - scissored/clipped
bearded collie - natural
boxer - natural
briard - natural
chow chow - natural
clumber - natural/handstrip
cocker - handstrip
dalmation - natural
deerhound - handstrip
GSD - natural
german spitz - natural/scissor
havanese - natural/scissor
Hungarian puli - corded
irish terrier - handstrip
italian spinone - natural
jap aktia - natural
jap spitz - natural
kerry blue - clipped
komondor - corded
lakeland - handstripped
lapphund - natural
lhasa apso - natural
lowchen - natural/clipped
maltese - natural

Do you know what these breeds look like ?

bearded collie-big no no breed standard does not allow for any clipping/scissoring etc(doesn't  stop some people mind you !)
GSD -au natural

Will add Cavalier King Charles Spaniels just in case-only the underside of padded trimmed again against KC standard(& again it doesn't stop some people)

LOL

> only the underside of padded  <

Should be only the underside of the pads :D

That's what I read!!  Funny how you read what you expect it to say! :)

LOL so did I Val ;)

Michelle mentioned trimming bits of BC's  that is of course the rough coated ones Smooths like my Roy don't need any trimming :D & are a dream to bath & dry :D

and the rest are

newfoundland
norwich T
norfolk T
oes
otterhound
pappillion
pekinese
polish lowland
pomeranian
poodle
curly coat R
rhodesian ridgeback
saluki
samoyed
schipperke
schnauzer
scottish terrier
sealyham T
shar pei
skye T
soft coated wheaten terrier
swedish vallhund
tibetan spaniel
weimaraner
westie
yorkshire T

thanks val very helpful. ive got a book called the ultimate dog book, has very good photos and clear and big. in the back of the book it has the dogs show names, So i take it these dogs in the picture will have show clips etc

newfoundland - natural
norwich T - handstripped
norfolk T - handstripped
oes - natural
otterhound - natural
pappillion - natural
pekinese - natural
polish lowland - natural
pomeranian - scissored
poodle - clipped/scissored
curly coat R - scissored
rhodesian ridgeback - natural
saluki - natural
samoyed - natural
schipperke - natural
schnauzer - handstripped
scottish terrier - handstripped
sealyham T - handstripped
shar pei - natural
skye T - natural
soft coated wheaten terrier - scissored
swedish vallhund - natural
tibetan spaniel - natural
weimaraner - natural
westie - handstripped
yorkshire T - natural

So i take it these dogs in the picture will have show clips etc

I don't know the book.  It depends if is giving correct pictures or chocolate box pictures! ;)

Ran through them very quickly - hope I've got them all right?  I'm sure that I'll be corrected if the fingers and brain didn't co-ordinate! ;)

I'm not being cheeky, here, but do any of you who groom for a living, have soft coated wheatens who come regularly? The reason I ask is because too often owners are disappointed with the trim they get from proffessional groomers (most often because the fringe and beard are removed)and we are always looking for groomers who know what a wheaten trim should look like, as not all breeders can put owners in touch with a local owner or breeder who can help. Please send me a private message with your details as then I can post them onto a breed forum.

I've recently retired but I used to trim to the breed standard.  I was always full with a waiting list and that's why I try to encourage others who are learning (or trimming already without any training) to do the same.  It would appear that most think it's easier and quicker - and I wouldn't agree ;) - to clip everything short!

Im just learning been doing since end of Sep. enjoying myself very much, shame it only 1  day a week.

what book can you recommend Val to buy to show good clipping etc

Have a look at this
http://www.amazon.com/gp/reader/0876054033/ref=sib_dp_pt/104-2095109-9395941#reader-page

Thats the problem, I'm afraid. You can imagine how awful it is to get a picture of one bred by you looking like a surprised newborn lamb, and owners despairing that they paid good money for it

Yep! :(

I often see hacked dogs in the street.  I say to the owners "I see that you trim your dog yourself?"  I have no problem with owners trimming their own dogs if they don't have the money for groomers, but mostly they'll say "No, I take her to Sally's (sorry any Sallys out there!) Parlour!"  And I say, "You've paid good money for THAT?" :(
There have been sooooo many times that I've been tempted to start again!

newfoundlands used to be shown just tidied up with scissors on the neck, ears & feet but they are now quite heavily sculptured sadly :(

You're quicker than me MM, I was going to point out that the reason Cavaliers aren't on the list is because they aren't trimmed except for under the pads! :-D (though a lot of people nip off the long eyebrows!)

LOL @ Val :D

You must be living in my town   there are a number of dog groomers who trim to 'breed' standard round here  NOT

the hacked dogs I see are usually westies, cairns, welsh terriers, schnauzers, etc.  All given the same strange crop, nowt on back, looong skirt, and really strange faces/tails, I have to say I really take my hat off to these groomers, after all it must be hard if you have to use a white stick :D

Go Faster,
If you learn to groom a Bedlington properly then you will be very popular with the owners, most groomers 'poodle' them which is totally incorrect and looks appalling.  There aren't any trimming guides for english Bedlingtons in most of the books available (American only) but you can buy a trimming guide from the secretary of the National Bedlington Terrier ClubYou will also find good clear pictures of CC winners on the members page ;)
Briefly, the neck should be short with no 'crest', the body should be slightly longer, don't poodle the feet and don't cut out holes for the eyes, the topknot should be arched and have an unbroken line, seen from the front and from the side :) and should be in line with the cheeks (seen from the front)

thanks very much val i have printed your info off and put it in my folder.

Val  i need your help what sort of coat type do these breeds have

Smooth?
Wool?
Wire?
Silky?
Double?

Same breeds i listed above

You make a start and I'll fill in what you don't know!!!  If I give you all the answers, you won't remember them all! :)

airedale,wire
afghan  silky
bichon  wool
border terrier  wire
border collie    double
bedlington terrier  wool
bearded collie     silky
boxer         smooth
briard         silky
chow chow   smooth
clumber        smooth
cocker S      silky
dalmation    smooth
deerhound   wire
GSD          double 
german spitz  double
havanese   double
Hungarian puli  double
irish terrier  wire
italian spinone  wire
jap aktia    smooth
jap spitz   smooth
kerry blue  smooth
komondor ????
lakeland  wire
lapphund ????
lhasa apso   silky
lowchen  silky
maltese  Silky

Nit sure of a couple.  please correct me if im wrong on the breeds as not 100% sure of some of them. will do the next list

newfoundland  Double
norwich T   Wire
norfolk T   wire
oes  Double I know this one did a OES last week!!
otterhound  wolly
pappillion silky
pekinese  double
polish lowland double
pomeranian  double
poodle   double
curly coat R  ????
rhodesian ridgeback  smooth
saluki   silky
samoyed  double
schipperke  smooth
schnauzer   smooth
scottish terrier  wire
sealyham T  wire
shar pei  smooth
skye T  silky
soft coated wheaten terrier  smooth
swedish vallhund  ?????
tibetan spaniel  silky
weimaraner  smooth
westie   wire
yorkshire T  silky

lapphund  double?

komondor  double?

Komondor - corded

We got a demo clip of 2 Westies at grooming college, and guess what? They immediately got out their 5F blades and clipped away! But at least they did say that show people usually handstripped rather than clippping!! :-) Just hope I can control them when I take my Yankee in at the end of the month!

Youre gonna love this - out of my 4 poodles - one of them is given face feet and toes with a 15, the rest of him, including legs and tail is a 7 !!!! He HATES being brushed/groomed with a vengenance - despite being put on the table since a teeny baby - so I gave up putting him through it - and just clip him right off. It doesnt help that he is white  so you get that awful pinkiness showing through, and the only decent bit of hair on him is his pom pom - we call him Skeletor !!!

Text book stuff eh ???

Jane

Soft coated wheaten is silky

NOOOOOOO LUCY DON'T DO IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I took in a pet Bedlington in to my grooming class to demonstrate the show Bedlington trimming.  There isn't a lot of difference between the pet trim and the show trim, unless you're an exhibitor, then you'd see a world of difference ;)

I was asked to do this as the person teaching us wanted to know how to do it correctly ;)

So I did the grooming and trimming and he looked pretty good, I could have taken him to a show and not disgraced myself :)
Then the 'teacher' grabbed the clippers saying I'd done it all wrong and proceeded to clip all the fur off the feet to the leg, clip more coat off the body and neck as I'd 'done it wrong' and reshaped the topknot to have holes for the eyes and a definate double pompom effect   The leg hair was reshaped and the defining shape of the dog was lost, he also looked like he'd been chewed by rats :( - I almost cried.  Luckily the owner was expecting it but had invited friends along for the laff   and they did -loudly ;)

The coat texture of the Bedlington isn't really like wool, it's a mixture of cotton-woolly and harsher hair with a definate twist to it.  

Well, I understand you usually work on your own dog, so I will be very careful not to let go of the clippers unless it's someone I trust. One of the tutors does show Great Danes, so at least they understand that a show trim is different from a pet trim, even if they don't know how to do it any more than I do! Thing is Dill, if you ever saw my poor coatless Yankee you would know that even if Mike Gadsby came and clipped him for me, he would still be last in every class, so it doesn't really matter if they do make a mess! :-D

Lucy,

I work on my own dogs but I work on other dogs too ;)  my first love is Bedlingtons tho, they're soo easy and quick to do :D :D  But then I was trained by show/breeders who are experts and have had the priviledge of being taught by some of the best :D :D

If you're talking about George - he's gorgeous :D :D (had a peek at your website - hope you don't mind)  Looking at the photos he lives MUCH too active a life to be having a full Yankee coat :D :D :D   My own dogs are the same ;)  compared to some other Beddlies at the shows they haven't got such full furnishings, but I'd have to keep them out of the rough stuff for that, and that's no fun :D :D  Luckily it only makes a difference with some judges :D :D

I think what upset me most about the pet Bedlington is that the tutor who did it shows their terriers (very stylish ones ;) ) so should really have known better :( :(

I think an otterhound has quite a harsh wirey coat, although not the same as a terriers wire coat .. not a groomer, could be wrong.

Schnauzer - handstrip, wire
Kerry Blue - handstrip wire
chow chow -errr dont know but it aint smooth - double, standoff coat
briard -- its not silky, having stroked one -- hard dense coat, like an OES should be, but straighter and longer

em

No, sorry - Kerry = silky clipper/scissor!

A Briards coat is certainly not silky,  it's very dry and to use my breeders terminology,  it is "goat like". :) Like Roni with her Beardies, Briards coats at shows look silky because of the grooming and time that has gone into them, with damp inclement weather you'll see the true coat.

According to the KC: It is slightly wavy (in my experience it depends on individual dog, one of mine is almost curly when damp and the other conforms to slightly wavy) the coat is very dry with a fine dense undercoat. The length should be no less than 7 inches. My boys is 11 inches long and his fathers is 12 1/2.

Swedish Vallhunds have a double coat, soft undercoat, harsh top coat.  No trimming etc needed - just a brush

Can I advise (I'm by no means being nasty!)  That yo find some pictures on the internet on some of these breeds to look for yourself.  Just looking at pictures should help you with what coat type is.  Some of them you do have wrong but I know you really don't want other people to do your homework for you and you would much rather research!!! :D

Good luck and have fun! :D

A bearded collie coat is not silky ...sorry.....(maybe looks silky at shows because some handlers blow the coat straight and smooth!!)

it should be fairly harsh outer coat  and plenty of undercoat.

as stated in BCC

If you search the web, its easy to find grooming and trimming guides for many breeds, breed club websites also have breed standards detailing the type of coat ;)

Thats very true dill!  All answers should be on the KC website!!! :D