You know what I'm going to say, don't you?  Took dog for walk, way out in the sticks, down a clearly marked public footpath and she ran under an electric fence which was put up, along with post and rail, to keep horses in.  Seemed a bit stupid, as the post and rail was in very good repair. Anyway, dog yelped like crazy and was very clingy on the way home.  Oh, and it was fairly thick metal cable, not the white plasticky covered stuff.

Can farmers/lifestock owners legally do this?  Can they put up electric fences where a child/elderly person/dog etc might bash into it?  Yes, I should have put her lead on when I saw the fence but as I was going over a stile into the field, the dog ran under the fence - no time to do anything.

Your view, please!!!!!!

IMO I suppose you would have to ask the owner to understand why electric fences are needed.  Perhaps it's as much to keep unsavouries out as the horses in.  However, I think when public footpaths run adjacent to electric fences there should be another simple type single or double wired fence as a barrier.  If they can afford to run an electric fence then surely they could do this. 

I understand what a nuisance some people are to landowners/farmers but generally I would say they are the minority.  We get a bit peeved when the farmers plough over the trodden down paths on the edges of crops fields knowing full well they are public right of way.  We then have to tread down the newly growing crops on the edge to re-establish it.

I was stroking our dog and felt a lump on her back, found a bloody lump to which my OH said "oh must have happened when she dived through the barbed wire" turns my stomach as she's done that with me and of course the problem is then that she dives back again.

>We get a bit peeved when the farmers plough over the trodden down paths on the edges of crops fields knowing full well they are public right of way.  We then have to tread down the newly growing crops on the edge to re-establish it.

Can you do that legally I mean? I know you said it was a public right of way, but does that give you the go ahead to damage it just because it is 'public property'?

I know this sound's like I am having a go, I'm not honestly, just genuinely interested! :D

As far as I understand it it is the farmers responsibility to ensure the footpath is clearly visible if it's on his land

Well, you learn something new everyday!! :D

Farmland is privately owned, even though there may be a public right of way across it. Farmers are perfectly entitled to plough paths, though they should run a roller over it when work is completed to re-mark its position. Electric fences (marked) or barbed wire alongside are perfectly legal too.
:)

Legally, your dog should not have been off lead on a public footpath. The landowner is perfectly within their own right to use electric fencing to keep the horses in - regardless of the fencing - providing they are not obsructing the path itself. That said, folk using the path should have dogs on leads and should continue walking - not stopping to have a picnic like they do here. Horses can destroy fencing, might be on restricted grazing - whatever - we have post and rail and still use electric fencing to divide the grazing and protect the fences.

Edit to say - a zap with a fence is unpleasant - but probably a good thing for the dog to get. She won't do it again!

Hi,
As it is the farmer private land, and many people do abuse it,
I would imagine it would be to also stop dogs annoying and snapping his
horses legs. Not all dog owners, keep there dogs under control.
They can cause a lot of harm and stress to live stock.
Regards
Denese

Electric fence is used on posts and rails to stop the horses rubbing on it and breaking it. A zap from one will give you a little shock but isn't harmful, my dog has licked ours before !!

I think it depends on the dog though; a friend who owns horses accidentally got her doberman too close to her fence and the dog was not happy about going back with her to the fields for over a month!
A sensitive dog will remember it for a long while; a less sensitive one will probably not be affected so much.

Lindsay
x

yes its perfectly legal to run an electric fence nr a public footpath  if we were unfortunate to have any footpaths on our land i would do it!  However you are meant to put "warning electric fence" signs on it at  specific intervals.  this is for humans benefit as dogs cant read!!! If the dog ran under the electric then it was not under control.........the owners fault entirely.  We put electric on post & rail to stop the horses chewing the top rails :(. we also use it with the cattle as they tend to barge through any non electric fencing if it takes their fancy to do so!!

Out of interest Sam, is it a legal requirement to put up a sign?
Just wondered, it seems the courteous thing to do :)

Lindsay
x

By law, all electric fences must carry an approved warning sign, when they are installed in proximity to the general public, for example footpaths.

The maximum permitted distance between warning signs is 100m.

What is the proximity though - I think its 12 metres? Could be wrong though!

According to this (hope it works!) there's no minimum distance of fence from path.

I read it differently - that fences should only be marked if alongside or adjacent to the PROW?

Sorry, I misunderstood you. :o If the public has no right of access to the field with the fence it doesn't need to be marked at all.

From what I gather from various sites about rights of way, a footpath need be no more than 1 metre wide if it crosses a field, but 1½ metres wide of at the edge. (A bridleway is up to 2½ metres.) If a person (or dog) strays off this then they're committing a trespass. As long as a person on a right of way cannot touch the fence from the path then it can't be construed as a hazard.

When you say electric fences "MARKED" do you mean clearly sign posted to inform the general public that it is there?

Yes.

It will clearly say 'beware electric fence' or something very similar.

Thank you for replying. I thought as much but wanted to double check.

The local farmer has been fencing of ALL the fields in my local area lately with electric fencing. But he has not put up 1 warning sign anywhere and in one of the fields he has blocked off public foot paths which only leaves a small space around the out side of the field to walk our dogs which is only about a foot and a half wide. He has also done it in sections but only keeps his live stock in one section at a time? if a farmer does not have live stock within the fenced off area surely he can not turn the electric fence on? I tried to talk to him yesterday about the fact there are no warning signs in any of these fields, he was so rude and unreasonable I just couldn't get anywhere with him. When I walked my dog the other night I walked straight into the electric fence and so did my dog, (talk about shocking) at first I thought I had missed the signs because it was dark so I double checked the following morning, NO signs. There are no live stock in 2 of the fields he's fenced off but the electric fences are powered up?? Do you or anyone else know who I would have to contact to report the farmer? If the general public have to stick to the laws surrounding these fences then so should the farmer

DILLIGAF
Thank you for replying. I thought as much but wanted to double check.

After reading all of the above post I would contact the local council (environmental health dept?) & ask whichever council dept was responsible to formaly take it up - it sounds to me quite a deliberate act to obstruct public rights of way access on the part of the farmer, for whatever reason
.

Thank you. Yes you are right! As he told me when I spoke to him that he has done this on purpose as dog walkers do not respect the country side :/ why he thinks all dog walkers are trouble I do not know I for one love the country, I have always respected my local area and public foot paths. It is a beautiful place to live and I feel lucky to be here but he seems hell bent on ruining it for everyone else. And he's getting worse. I did try to explain that respect works both ways and maybe if he had tried to talked to people rather than screaming and shouting things would be a lot different but he wouldn't have it. He has shouted at EVERY dog walker in the area over the years and not because they was on his land! But for silly things like throwing a ball or a stick. I love my regular daily walks with or without the dog, as I also like to go walking with my nieces who are only 4 and 5 (I can't put a lead on them!) lol but even taking them out is impossible now as one of them has a heart condition and I feel it's to much of a risk in case we stumble into a electric fence.

Thanks again for your help

committing a trespass

The cops can & do act against bailiffs on that one, see vid link.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=usdqo6u2AVg
.

Another group to contact, and to get some information about rights and wrongs of your footpath and the farmer, is the Ramblers Association. They are having a big drive on at the moment to sort out rights of way particularly those that are blocked for some reason or a farmer is being a bit difficult. They may take on the problem and contact the farmer on your behalf. Worth a try anyway.

No notices are needed for fields across which there is no public access.  Only those through which there is a Public footpath.

I can see both sides of this.

Livestock or no you can't blame him for making his land more secure as sadly people do allow their dogs loose and damage crops.  Public footpaths need to be stuck to and they are only a meter wide across fields, even the best behaved dog 'off lead' will stray from that, as will children.

As for leads on kids, they still make leading rains and hand straps.

The voltage is only unpleasant not enough to harm you, and will tech both kids and dogs to not stray into them.

They are not cheap to buy (the energisers, wire, isolators, Batteries) so the farmer must have felt a real need to resort to this.

The Countryside is not a theme park for the use of the general Public it is a place of work and someone's livelihood and property.

i use to rent 22acr feild for my horse on outskirt of town i put electic fancin up along the river with loads warning signs we had loads prob with people and their dogs coming in at other side of river
apollo my horse was chased and bitten by dogs and people throwin beer cans the lady that owned feild contacted police the police came and said that it was traspassing and to contact police if we seen people in feild we had loads signs up saying livestock in feild etc
we had horrendus time even had electric feencing cut !!! so owner and her husban put up proper fencing
instead of electric
apollo got chased and bitten 2twice by people dogs one of neighbours heard and seen people makin their dogs chase apollo!!!
apollo is 18.2hnd clyd so laid back.
please keep dogs on lead round livestock
apollo had horrendus time he had nasty bites on his legs

forgot to say if you need any help or advice pm me

Facebook replies:

Nicole Wild says: I am a horse keeper myself, the reason why I would put up an electric fence as well as post and rail is to deter dogs and such like coming in, to stop ponies leaning over the fence to get other bits of food or to stop people feeding them, stop them biting the fence and chewing it etc. Also legally, if you're on a footpath your dog shouldn't have been off the lead.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Clare Marriott says: I agree with Nicole. Some horses do not respect post and rail fencing and need that bit of electric fence. As long as the electric was in line with the fence or inside the field it is allowed to be there. If it was on the outside of the fence then shouldn't have been. As a dog owner I will always put my dog on a lead if going through a field with animals in as many animals do not like dogs due to attacks etc and I do not want to risk my dog being injured. She is fantastic around animals but they may not be fantastic around her. My dog has also been zapped by an electric fence but didn't take her long to get over it. She also learned quickly to respect fences

These fields DO have public access with public footpaths. Which have been blocked by these electric fences with only about 2ft of space round the edge to walk your dog round. And I'm sorry I do not agree with having to tie up your kids. We have as much rights as anyone to walk along a public footpath as the farmer has to the land. The country may not be a theme park but I have just as much rights to go out and enjoy it! In fact my home is completely surrounded by the country. No matter where I go I have to use public foot paths to get there if I am not driving. No one has the rights to say who and who can not go for a walk in the sticks.

Thank you. I will contact them asap

Thank you

> No one has the rights to say who and who can not go for a walk in the sticks.

Oooh yes they do!    I agree that farmers have to observe PUBLIC footpaths, but in terms of free roaming, no way.   If only from an insurance point of view - if somebody is hurt when crossing a farmer's field, see how fast he ends up being involved in an attempt to sue him!!   This he doesn't need.   Further, if you have ever seen the result of livestock worrying, by dogs, you'd understand why landlowers do feel the need to take steps to avoid this.

I do not subscribe to all this 'right to roam' simply because rights come with responsibilities, which is something some people don't understand.

In the UK at any rate, owners are required to keep their dogs under proper control which means on the lead mostly, and certainly if posted.    Look at it this way - taking your views further, would you want everybody roaming around your property? - probably not.   So even if a farmer/landowner has acreage, isn't he entitled to the same when it comes to strangers roaming around his property?

I'm sorry I totally disagree with u on a few of your points. I will say again..

1. The farmer is RENTING 2 fields which have public foot paths. He DOES NOT OWN ANY LAND. But regardless of that He still has an obligation to ensure he does not put the public at risk! Signs must be put up warning the general public of the electric fence. Which is law binding!

2. The farmer is blocking the public footpaths completely. People have been using these footpaths for over 50years! These are public rights of way! Hence why myself and others DO have every rights to walk there (in the country side when ever we please)

3. I never let my dog off the lead out in public! Never have never will! I should be able to walk my dog along a public footpath with enough space for my dog to walk next to me without getting zapped.

4. BY LAW! Farmers are required to leave 2metres of public footpath for the general public to walk along. Not a foot and a half. By law he must put signs up warning the general public who are STICKING to the PUBLIC FOOTPATHS, that the fence running along side the public footpath will give u a shock. FACT! If he owned it or rented it then "No Trasspassing signs" must be visible to the general public! By doing this the farmer would be covering himself from an INSURANCE point of view.

Your right my dog is my responsibility. Which I totally understand 100% I keep her on a lead, I clean up after her, I have 100% control over my dog and I totally respect my country side!

You seem to be assuming that dog walkers/general public are only out in the country side to totally disrespect it. You are wrong. There are laws set up for both the farmers and the general public to ensure they are ALL safe and respectful of others. Plus everyone is covered if accidents do happen.

Dilligaf, your anger is palpable and in your case is possibly justified. Landowners do suffer from irresponsible dog owners and sadly in some places the responsible people lose out. Hence why so many places are now out of bounds to dogs, again sadly.

To help you.  https://www.gov.uk/guidance/public-rights-of-way-landowner-responsibilities

Best wishes

> There are laws set up for both the farmers and the general public to ensure they are ALL safe and respectful of others.

I agree that you are clearly very angry about this situation.   Regardless of whether this is a tenant-farmer or not, within reason he is still entitled to make sure the world and their dogs are not wandering across the land he is renting - my comment about insurance is still relevant.

I suggest you take your issues to the local authorities if you feel he's contravening public rights of way, unless you can talk reasonably to this farmer re any notices he maybe should be posting.   I've never seen electric fencing notices - it should be pretty obvious when a fence is an electric one, even if it's not always obvious whether active or not, and it's probably as much to keep his livestock from roaming as people off that bit of land.

The poor man has probably been involved in a bad situation with people on 'his' land (and even if renting, it is still his land whether or not he's paying rent.

The only problem we've ever had with local farmers (previously where we lived) was with unsigned areas that had been sprayed.   I talked to them about that sure enough!

Across a field the path needs only be 1 meter wide, and 1.5m around edges.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/public-rights-of-way-landowner-responsibilities
Minimum width of PROW

Unless stated in the definitive statement held by the local authority, the minimum width you need to keep clear by law is as follows:
•1.5 metres for a field edge footpath, or 1 metre for any other footpath