I have just read with great interest several postings concerning aggression in 'rescue dogs' and whilst I COMPLETELY understand the utter frustration of having to protect your dog from the advances agressive or otherwise of an out of control dog... I feel i MUST address the balance here!!!!!!

I have recently taken under my wing a Siberian Husky, who has not had the best start in life having fallen into the misfortunate catagory of dogs that look great and are fashionable and have owners who buy them for this purpose andhave no idea how close their husky is to the wild dog blueprint and then cant cope or look after or house this breed properly, and in my poor fella's case... ruin their happy disposition!!

My Boy... a natural roamer was cooped up in a tiny two up two down for the best part of his life.... whata  life huh!?

anyyyyyyyyway!....... his lack of socialisation in the vital early puppy years (he's now 1yr and 4 months so hope is not lost) has meant that he views all approaching dogs as a potential threat and feels he has to put on an aggressive show... and boy does he!!!!! he should get an oscar for his portrayal of 'mean Alaskan Wolf' !

suffice it to say.. we'r working on this and making great progress.....slowly but surely!!!!

ok now here's my gripe: I know my boy is likely not to socialise to well, so we'r working on it, now Sibes dont go off the lead anyway (roamers! like I said) but even so with his temprament as such at the minute he'd be kept on a lead anywway............. It INFURIATES me just how many (and believe me its the majority not minority!) people walking their dogs off the lead allow their dogs to come bounding up to mine.
now Im wise to this and so when we do spot another dog always some distance away I start to make sure the owner can see that we are deviating away from them, I even have to call out to ask the owner to call their dog back... which is always met with the same reply.... "its ok!!! he's ok!!! "

Hmmmmm!!! well your dog might be... but mine isnt.... and you dont know that!!!!!!
dear god what are these people thinking!!!?????? does the fact he's on a lead anyway not give anything away!!?

ok..... got that off my chest!
and anyone experiencing the same thing I'd love to hear from kindred spirits!! ;O)

Hi I walk my dogs on a disused railway line. and every day i come accross this as soon as i see other dogs with their owners mine go straight back on their leads, not because any of mine are nasty or aggressive just to safe guard mine as i am not aware if the dog approaching is as friendly or socialised like mine are.but i get the same every day oh he/she is ok. that might be but please can you put them on their leads whilst i get passed.I often wonder what these people think.
regards polly_45

Polly.... I think you've hit the nail on the head there!!

Basic good manners!!!

alot of time is taken up in this forum it seems (Im a new member and intruiged!!) on us all bemoaning dogs 'bad habits' but it seems we  as owners (and master who should be setting a good example to our pack!) forget OUR manners!

if I walk past some one in a narrow corridor I'd move slightly to the side to allow them free passage... basic manners!!

how come we forget this!?

they probably think if you are walking your dog in popular off lead dog walking areas that your dogs are well adjusted enough to meet other dogs with no major issues.

I certainly would find it a real pain to have to leash my five girls every time I spot another dog or dog walker in the park.

Surely those with iffy dogs would avoid such places that most dogs and owners happily socoalise in?

what an ETREMELY narrow minded view....
It would seem with all due respect your knickname is entirely apt!!
'Brainless'

Let me please expand and hopefully you'll appreciate then what most rational people can already:

This dog.. through NO fault of its own (hellloooooo!!! Huskys are social pack and team player dogs!!!!!) but the fault of several bad or incompetant owners before me has developed the Brain thought process that any dog approaching him will attack.

Now he has the scars to prove this... from being kept in a council house as a pup with an aggressive breed of dog.... not the best start in life!!! its the same with any animal.. human..canine..blah blah we have expectations based on our life experience. this is how we learn... if we dont have a responsible owner we learn WRONGLY.

SO!!!!!!!!... I am trying to teach this poor little chap that there is nothing to fear,.. that he CAN eventually meet and play happily with other dogs. its a slow process and to do this we need to be in the vicinty of other dogs and these very communal areas are vital to my dogs rehabilitation and his general happiness.. he DESERVES to be able to learn again to socialise!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I  have the luxury of living in a rural area, and most of our walks are on our own property which stretches miles...... I am responsible in that.. I would never have agreed to take on this dog and help it could I have not been able to provide him with this and many other things.

I choose to take him to a communal area to help him to learn to re socialise, and I take every precaution to  that EXTREMELY responsably!!!!

your points are noted.... I hope your 5 lovely dogs have no problems in the future... their owner seems most ignorant and intolerant to canine needs and issues......... VERY VERY SAD.

Point is your normal socially adept canine would heed his negative body language an give him a wide berth, my lot certainly would as they don't look for trouble and are social with those who are too, so no need to get them on lead all the time and spoil their walks. :D

I meet a lot of people who are equally relaxed with their dogs, and strangely the dogs of all makes and shapes and temperaments manage to understand each other very well.  The young strike up a game, the old codgers are left to trundle around in peace etc.

It is the over protective or paranaoid owners that end up with a problem when they are transfering their own insecurity down the lead.

I have also walked with a friend with several large breed dogs that are commonly viewed with distrust, and we did avoid other dog walkers just to make life easier, but no major problem just keeping ones wits about one, putting them on lead would just have caused tension.

More problems occur between dogs that are on lead than those who have the option to avoid conflict, unless the dog in question is particularly dog dominant/aggressive then off lead interaction with other dogs will lead to fewer problems.  Of course I understand that Sibes cannot be let off lead, but not withstanding it does inhibit natural dog interaction being leashed.

Also if you are trying to socialise him how is this to be achieved if everyone leashes their dogs and beats a hasty retreat?

I would suggest you need to initially get him socialised with known dogs where the meetings can be controlled, long before you take him to public areas which will always have an element of unpredicatability.

I'm sorry brainless.... you'r points there are extremely valid... however I  suggest you perhaps have a little view at info about Siberian huskies!

this is kind of specific.

as a breed they CANNOT be allowed of the leash (regardless of wether there is behavioural problems or not) this is due their genbetic blueprint still being close to the wild... they origionated from the Cuckchi peoples of siberia... a nomadic tribe... Siberian huskys are roamers.... and when they go they will go and go with no regard to roads, railtracks whatever.

I hope this clarifies.
perhaps you need to be more informed before passing judgement?
regards.

I am aware of Husky's special restrictions knowing several owners and breeders, my own breed (a hunting Spitz) is somewhat independent, and in some circumstances would not be able to be let off lead either, and many owners do not let them off, which is sad but understandable if there are no safe areas large enough.

As a result I do need to keep my wits about me, and because of the occsional deaf un that even the best trained one can decide to throw it is imperative that their social skills are first rate to keep them from getting themselves or me into grief as they will always be walking some distance ahead.

This gives me sufficient time to send them on their way past dogs or get them to return, or if already moving a call of steady will bring them to a halt so they are not thundering towards an unsuspecting owner or dog whilst playing with each other, which often consists of mugging one another, playing tag etc, :D.

What I would suggest in your dogs case would be off lead socialisation in a safely enclosed garden or even a tennis court with known non aggressive stooge dogs (a biotch that would just ignore your dog at first until he felt able to approach), training classes where all dogs are on lead, prefereably not in a begginers class but an advanced one with well socialised steady dogs the trainer is sure of, and gradually progress to the stress of the park.

You say you are in the country, but is there a town where you are likely to see dogs walking by where you could sit with your dog and have him ignore the dogs and owners walking past, while he is praised for ignoring them, perhaps close to the park gates on a bench.  If you just sit and he is meant to chill it will be easier than when he is actively engaged in play or walking.

thank you Brainless. :o)

at last now you are posting with some thought and constructive comment rather than your initial post which seemed to be just a sneering jibe!
(not really very helpful in a forumn??)

I appreciate.. perhaps I have not made my case perfectly clear (damn how long did you want me to make my post..'war and peace'!!??)

but to clarify... of course your tips on sitting with him at park gates etc are top notch, and of course this is how we initially approached his re introduction to society (my turn now for the sarcastic.."Duhhhhhhh!")

however you were not to know that! perhaps questioning me rather than sweeping presumption and procastination might be more helpful (?)

its a gentle re introduction of course I have not just thrown him into the lions den so to speak!!!!

Further more, this afternoon after reading some of the postings here I headed off to the park.. somewhat disheartened..... and is always the way when black clouds loom..... a ray of sun broke through..... in the form of a cracking owner and his even more cracking little cavalier king charles:

we passed on a wooded path way the spaniel was leashed, I stepped off the track to allow them decent space of passage, now as the situation was a calm passing of ships both dogs paused to asses the situation, both calmly, as their owners had control (and were calm... I have no paranoia thanks Brain!) and it was a chilled meeting.. they decided they liked each other and played quite happily.

we walked some way together... and of course owners striking up conversation I was soo glad to have the owner say how nice it was for his dog to not be bull dozed for once by another dog (which terrifies him.. thedog!)
so thank you john and 'pickles' !! (I know your watching after our conversation today! xxx)

Now: my point.... perhaps I wasnt clear Brainless:

My dog is intimidated by a stampede towards him, in this situation, yes at this stage of the game, I start to walk him away from the careering dog hurtling towards us... he will display an aggressive FACADE.

however dogs we meet, leashed OR unleashed that do not intimidate but trott over or past he will not bat an eye lid.

SO THIS IS WHY I FEEL I CAN WALK HIM IN COMMUNAL AREAS.

I HAVE NEVER SAID ALL DOGS SHOULD BE LEASHED OFF COURSE NOT!
BUT MERELY OWNERS AS THE ONES THAT MUST SET EXAMPLE TO THEIR DOG MUST SHOW CONSIDERATION. THIS DOES NOT NESC. MEANING LEASHING BUT SIMPLY RECALL OR SIT STAY COMMAND TILL THE OWNER IS CLOSE ENOUGH TO JOINTLY ASSES THE SITUATION.!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

for those posting from people who have their beloved companions injured or worse had fatal encounters with aggressive dogs... in the true sense... all i can say is PERSONALLY, if my dog had done this or displayed this I would muzzle.. most definately.... we have other places we can go to play and play ball.. but this walk is his learning curve walk... its work.. ties in with play.

BUT.... as highlighted by another owner... his aggression is an act he growls alot but if he comes into direct contact with an un relenting dog trying to then ignore his warning shots... he will just 'Bounce them' or try the 90 degrees stand over dominant thing... nothing worse. tho' I am minded anything could happen.

is it really tooooooooo much to ask for a little understanding?????????

Im lucky I get to walk my sibe 4 times a day we have the luxury of having some out in the wilds walks where we wont come across anyone, and we have our walk once daily in the park this is work or school for my dog.. the other 3 walks are fun away from the madding crowds.

brainless: my dog aside, but looking at the big picture.. what about the owners who have posted here who say they have nervous dogs... that whilst not aggressive suffer in the same way from over exuberant overly sociable dogs (and is it really sociable to be a bully??? playful or no... still bullying to the intimidated dog!)

THE WORLD IS A BIG PLACE THERE'S ROOM FOR US ALL..IS IT TOO MUCH TO ASK TO BE OPEN MINDED AND CURTEOUS????????????????????????????

with the best will in the world x

Here we are talking about what I am saying, well socialised dogs should not be overbearing, and should move on after a polite greeting if the other dog or owner so wish, and should be encouraged/made to so do by their owners. 

It is just this idea that we should all be putting our dogs on lead as soon as we spot another simply because the other person may have a problem we are unaware of.  If our dogs are well mannered then there won't be a problem as they will leave the nervous aggressive etc dog alone. 

I can't see though how a dog can learn good canine manners if he can never practice them, so lots and lots of opportunities for them to play with appropriate dogs (for the nervy ones) is needed. 

Unfortunately and understandabley many people with small or large (like my dobe owning friend) dogs avoid contact with others to the detriment of their dogs social skills, which is sad. 

Perhaps owning a medium sized very confident sociable dogs does help as they tend not to frighten the smaller dogs or invite bullying from the bigger ones, and as mine are so used to other dogs of all shapes and sizes coming into their own home let alone on walks they are actually more interested in the humans than the canines.

Now herin lies a problem, stopping people feeding and attracting my girls to the point where they sit at peoples feet while I fast disappear into the distance :D  Seriously they do come away reluctantly.

Brainless.... and believe me I hate to hone in on you again, But you seem somewhat conflicting in your correspondance (!?) see two comments i have cut and paste from your posts below:

dogs avoid contact with others to the detriment of their dogs social skills, which is sad.  

the above was from your last post, where as your first post said:

'surely those with iffy dogs would avoid such places that most dogs & owners happily socialise in'

so here's the rub:

you acknowledge (do I hear a chorus of "at last!!!" frm other owners!)
that social skills suffer and this is sad (your damn right sugar!!!!!!!!!!!!!)
HOWEVER
your solutiion is that those socially inept are not to be given the luxury of socialising (its a luxury now????????) they are to exiled... ghetto'd, kept away from the happy normal people....... hmmmmmmmm.

I wonder if Brainless had the same control over the human world as he has over his canines world:
would we see the homosexuals...the disabled... the 'iffy' people who dont conform to the happy norm.... would they have to go away and not spoil your Utopian day!!!!!!?????????????????????????????????????????????????????

((((((((((((((((((( DEEP SIGH ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

* and tongue firmly fixed in cheek!!!!! *

Your last paragraph demonstrates exactly how little you know of Brainless!

of course (hopefully) your absolutely right jeanie.

the phrase is borne of frustration.... and forgive me that.

the old (but still the best) cliche..... behaviour breeds behaviour... rings loud here I feel.

I should not have allowed myself to stoop to the sniping that was instigated.

but please... No defamation of character intended merely irony to highlight a point.... see my 'tongue firmly in cheek' . Im not seeking to just snipe.

apologies.

You have taken that outmof context I worote many people avoid other dogs because they can't be doing with the hassle.

Sorry HuskyGal but i have to disagree with you here!!

You cannot say "as a breed they CANNOT be allowed of the leash" my sister has two adorable Husky's which she has had from puppies ( they are now 5 ys & 3 yrs old) and they spend 90% of lead in public places and to be honest their recalls are fantastic.

I must admit when I was at an obiedience class with my young male Lab he was savaged and attacked by a rescued Cocker Spaniel (I came ofthe worst) but unfortunately it meant that I was so anxious when out that I never let Duke of his lead and if I did if there was another dog I felt sick and immediately put him on his lead and came home.  After a few months of this a lady in our local park asked why I had put him on his lead when we saw her and I explained and she was great (she had a Cocker Spaniel) our dogs have now become the best of friends and so have alot of others and she put it to me that a dog like mine needs the excercise off the lead to stay in shape so I'm with Brainless on this one

When I had a dog who was dog-aggressive (as is usual, he was worse on the lead than off it) we walked him either at unsocial hours or in areas where few other people walked. It's a bit like having an in-season bitch - you simply walk them elsewhere.

When I first got one of my dogs he was like Taz the cartoon tasmanian devil spinning and freaking out on the end of a lead every time he saw another dog and even if it was a speck in the distance his hackles were up and he was on his toes growling.  People he eyeballed as he went past and if there was any eye contact from them to him then he'd attack ....... nice! :rolleyes:
If I'd avoided everyone by walking in unsociable hours or in isolated areas I wouldn't have the lovely dog I have now that can run free when other dogs and people are in the same place without bothering them.  It's damned hard work to turn a dog around but it can be done and it's worth it in the long run.
Aggressive dogs on leads shouldn't be excluded from areas and dogs running free should be under their owners control.

As i have often said before there is nothing nicer than being able to have a sociable dog that you can enjoy meeting other dogs and their owner and having walks with. 

This has to be a process and I am sure at first you took things easy and you were the one reponsible for ensuring the socialisation process progressed in stages that he could cope with, and actually now you both enjoy interacting with other owners and their dogs. :D

Brainless, i've got to disagree with you on that. Sometimes other people can just be a nuisance. LOL. I take my dog for a walk because i want to enjoy some time with my dog, not socialise with other people in a park. I know most of you will say i'm wrong, BUT i have nothing against my dog socialising with other dogs that i know, but i dont want people letting their dogs jump all over mine especially when i dont know them. There was one incident of what you are all talking about in my local park, with someone who always kept their dog on a lead(a staffie) when other dogs came near, the dog was also muzzled, because it could have a tendancy to take a dislike to being jumped all over by so called freindly dogs. One of these so called freindly dogs with its owner over the other side of the park not really paying much attention, decided to bite lumps out of this poor staff who WAS muzzled and couldn't even fight back. The owner of the staff decided the only way to stop it was to kick it, which was about the same time the other owner decided they was going to pay attention, then had the audacity to blame the staff !!! Everbody with a dog should be aware of others and not let their dogs just go up to other dogs.

But surely you wouldn't choose a crowded Park to walk in if you want to be alone with your dog?  there are plenty of places to walk a dog on led alone, so why not leave the Parks full of freindly dogs and owners to enjoy the socialising they enjoy.  Maybe because I am single and walking the dogs is my chance to get out and meet people I belong to the social kind of dog walker as opposed to the get away from everyone to get some peace type, each to their own.

Surely it is a bit like soemone going to a crownded place like a pub and then complaining that it is noisy and people keep wanting to talk to you, whereas a quiet trip to the Library woudl have got them some peace and quiet?

PMSL :D So you have never gone to a pub for a "quite" drink ? I do understand that people enjoy walking their dogs to socialise, and i would stand and have a conversation i didn't want to have rather than be rude. Bu the fact that a park is busy doesn't excuse the fact that SOME people are just inconsiderate, and just because the park is busy doesn't mean that someone who wants to be alone shouldn't be there. It could be the nearest place and the most convienient to get to.

As far as i know librarys dont sell beer :D

If I want a quiet drink I go to an off-licence and take it home (along with a book from the library! ;)). If I go to have a drink in a public place I expect to be surrounded by other people - some of whom will no doubt be unpleasant. But that's life! If I don't want to meet them I go somewhere else, not demand that they do! :D

Yes I see the point but as you admit in the park you do expect to meet people (and realise that you will run into sometimes not perfectly behaved though generally harmless canines) even if you would prefer to be alone :D  So I am sure you don't go around saying as my Dad does when driving, "why are all these people here" :D :D :D

Now wouldn't that be a good enterprise, would certainly get me into the Pub, a Library that sells Beer :D  Mind I am more a Bacardi Breezer or Shandy kind of Gal :D

What would make it perfect would be for them to allow the dogs to sleep at your feet with a bowl of water

No im with your dad on this one, if they are in my way they shouldn't be there :D

His comments about horseriders are scandalous :D

Hi Lara
Would you please pm me with how you managed to achieve stopping the agression. I have been to training classes and also a bahaviourist but with no change. I was beginning to think that nothing could be done how super to hear from someone who has had success. Gabi is 20 months old. When she was young she would always lunge at other dogs but we just thought she was being over friendly and exited. The older she got the worse she got and now I'm scared to take her out as she is so strong.

Hi Brainless yes i do find it a pain to have to put my three back on their leads, and the disused railway line i use is a very common place for dog walkers.not one of my three are what you call IFFY dogs.But as most people are aware boxers just go bounding in. As i walk them all together i wouldnt like to be hit with a situation where there is just one possibilty that they may come accross another dog that isnt socialised like mine are.I CERTAINLY dont want to try and split one of mine up from a fight, with the possibility the other two would go bounding in as if they were playing, sorry Brainless my dogs saftey is paramount at all times so it will continue being a pain to put them back on their leads.regards poly_45

My dog is not a rescue dog but I agree with what you say.  My dog doesn't appreciate being approached by other dogs.  Her walks are mostly off lead and if we see dogs walking directly towards us she will actually come back to have the lead put on whereby she then pretends she actually brave and stands on back legs and has a go.  If she looks like approaching other dogs I can recall her, it's not difficult but then I don't think she's really that interested.  A couple of weeks ago a dog ran directly across the width of the park obviously intent on checking out my dog.  My dog ran in circles around me.  I think the other dog was just checking her out but she didn't appreciate it.  The dog's owner sauntered over calling his dog who was not taking a blind bit of notice.  The owner got to us just in time to see my dog turn and have a go at his dog.  Both dog and owner looked surprised and I think I just looked peed off.  My dog is not perfect but has always been very good off lead but when she was a pup she was chased that often that she feels threatened by dogs she doesn't know.  It feels like a no win situation

Hi. I know what you mean. I come from the other side of the story like the last lady who replied. My dog is a very bouncy friendly dog and would just run up to anyone or any other dog to play. As I know this can be dangerous for him and the other dog when I see any other people coming with a dog I don't know I immediately put him back on the lead and stay a ways back to let the other person pass. My dog has been attacked twice by an owner who just refuses to train his dog and this dog has also attacked other dogs in the area. The latest owner of a dog he attacked has reported him to the police. The sad thing is no-one blames the dog, we blame the owner for not getting his behaviour problems sorted or even trying to work with him. I've even come across a guy with a Rottweiler who not only had him off the lead but who didn't even have a lead with him. I try to tend to walk with other people now just to avoid this happening again.

hmmmm.. Im afraid i'd have to disagree with your comment that no one blames the dog.

I think you even evidenced it very well.. the blame DOES lie with the owners... especially in the 2 instances you gave an owner who cant be bothered or wont train (you dont NOT send your kids to school do you!) and thee owner who doesnt put a potentially aggressive dog on a lead whilst near others.

with My boy his 'aggresiveness' to other dogs is purely down to his life experience: first owner locked him in a council house with an aggressive older dog.. when he was just a little pup.. he still has the scars.
the next owner again gave him a bad experience left chained up with absolutely no contact with people or other dogs.

so His life experience has been that another dog will hurt an attack him... hence when we meet another dog he puts on a show.... tries to pretend he means business attack being the best form defence to his mind.

and that life experience was purely down to OWNERS not him!!!!
Had he had his puppy life with an experienced Sibe owner or even to that matter ANYONE who knows dogs he would not have this mentality!!!!

Huskies are amazingly sociable..c'mon they are pack dogs and team working dogs!!! this is NOT in his nature it has been put there by people!!!!!!!

HuskyGal, I do understand what you're saying and I wanted to show a bit of support for you because I know the rehabilitation work is a long, slow business and there are people who show very little understanding towards you whilst you're trying to do it.

I know that sometimes people can't see the victim that lies behind the snarling monster and just condemn you without knowing the circumstances.  This can make you feel extremely discouraged.

However, then you meet someone who understands about fearful dogs and get a fix of encouragement and know you're on the right track.

I hope this helps and I would like to know just how big people's eyes get (size of saucers?) when your dog does the mean Alaskan wolf thing :-D

I'm with Brainless on this one.  My dog was attacked on a beach where dogs can run free.  He went up to a dog on a lead and ended up with some nasty injuries.

She shouted at me for not keeping him away!  Why walk a dog where dogs run free if he needs to be kept away from others?  Doh!?!!

I think if dogs are running off lead(and one of mine usually does in safe areas) then it is reasonable to expect that their owner can call them back before they run up to a strange dog Jackyjat.One of my other dogs doesn't get off his lead unless I can see far enough to spot other dog walkers and call him back before he bounces up to play....tho he isn't a huge dog he's big enough and bouncy enough to give another dog who doesn't want to play rough a bit of a shock(not to mention the other person with the dog!).
Oops,forgot to say he's fine if an off lead dog comes to see him when he's on his lead,thinks he's won a watch!

I can't believe the total lack of consideration that exists nowadays between dog owners.  So, so sad! :-(

What is the problem with putting a dog on lead in close proximately of other strange dogs and showing some respect to other strange people out for a nice enjoyable walk with their dog who is under control?  Not everyone wants to be bothered by a strange, unmannerly dog never mind the on lead dog.  Just because the dog is on lead doesn't necessarily mean he is aggressive or iffy, he may be old or in ill health, perhaps undergoing rehab, being walked by a responsible owner or maybe even a retired guard dog.

An individual has the right to walk their dog in a public place (that allows dogs) without harassment and they have an obligation to ensure others can do the same without being harassed.  That means having the dog under control at all times in a public place.  Incidentally, our next dog neighbour lost her dog a few weeks ago, he ran up a strange dog and he killed him. Quick as a flash!

Huskygal, I very much sympathise with you, I know what it's like trying to rehab a rescue dog in a world full of idiots.  Well done for taking him on, they are beautiful dogs, Sibes, I wish you every success.

Oh Lillith!!!!!!!
((((((((((Big siberian Hugs)))))))))) coming your way!!
thank you! truly.
( I did need that!) x

Ooh, Siberian hugs, yummy :-D

So, Jackyjat ... you can walk wherever you want and let your dog run up to any other dog it wants and any problems will always be the fault of the person with the leashed dog for being out at all?

I truly am sorry that your dog got injured but I think it's a bit unfair to send all owners of defensive dogs into exile.  Can't we be a bit tolerant on this one and make an effort to control our extroverts if we are lucky enough to have them?

What a load of twaddle! Why on earth should anyone have to put up with dogs good or bad running up to an on lead dog????
My dog is muzzled, on lead AND walked as early as poss so I dont bump in to people. I do let him off when know one is around (muzzled) but it really upsets him if a dog NORMALLY SMALL THINGS come running up to him and the owners couldnt care less!!! They can see I dont want the dog there.... just because a dog is not aggressive does not mean it should be able to run up to whatever the hell it likes!!

Should all aggressive on lead dogs only be allowed on pathways then? Ban them from all parks etc where others are just so peoples precious dogs can torment whoever the hell they want? Rediculous! I cannot be anymore considerate to other people, I TRY TO KEEP MY DISTANCE so other people should have manners too!

Have to agree - I own two very well socialised dogs, but living with an aggressive one allows me to see both sides of such a situation.  And personally, I don't appreciate any dog running up to mine in any situation - friendly or not.  Actually, the friendly ones annoy me more - I've had quite a few sociable dogs try to follow my two around while their owner plods along far behind them, it is infuriating when you're trying to get on with a walk.

As for not walking aggressive dogs where other dogs walk - rediculous!!  I walk my brother's dog Tia a fair bit, and she can be extremely aggressive - but as Zoe does, I time my walks carefully; I don't walk her where we're likely to run into other dogs, nor do I put her in a situation that might trigger aggrssion, if I can help it.  But I won't avoid popular dog walks compeltely - they are often popular for a reason, and round here, the popular walks are really nice, fields and woods, lovely and interesting places for both me and Tia.  Why should I avoid that because some people won't control their sociable mutt?  When I'm walking my friendly pair, they are restrained as soon as I see any dog whatsoever, even if I know it to be friendly - it's good manners, and it also reinforces the concept that they are NOT allowed to go gallavanting up to any dog on a whim, they may do it only if I say they can.  This applies whether it's a strange dog, or one we play with often.

HuskyGal, well done for taking on your husky bud, he'll be a lot of work I dare say but well worth it :)

Im very much afraid that dogs approaching my on lead, and thus under control dog, may well get either bitten, or kicked by me.

My dog is on a  lead because he has been attacked by other dogs. He can no longer be trusted off lead in a lot of situations, however if he is on lead, i WILL NOT MUZZLE HIM.

Why? Because im not taking away the remaining enjoyment of his walks, to protect the dogs whose owners are either too inconsiderate, or too lazy, to train their dogs.

If he is muzzled, i cannot give him treats, i cannot play ball wth him etc etc. Also he finds being muzzled very uncomfortable.

If dogs even just approach, read his 'go away' language and back off, that is STILL giving him a negative message, reinforcing the message taht other dogs MUST be agressed at and chased off.

Whoopee, just what i want to reinforce, NOT.

Yes, we can try and find places where there are no off lead dogs... not easy though is it. We dont all drive, we cant all get to the back of beyond to walk our dogs.

So yes, it might be a pain to recall your dogs, however many there are, but in the interests of common courtesy, dont you think it might just be worth it?

I could, of course, leave my now agressive dog OFF lead. After all, he doesnt actually HURT other dogs, he pins them down, scares them stupid and chases them.

Quite honestly, that is the option im leaning towards these days when so many people leave their dogs to approach mine in usually a fairly rude ill mannered way!

Em

Well said :)

If people cannot be considerate to on leaders then why should we try so flippin hard to be considerate to them??

In Response to theemx
Im very much afraid that dogs approaching my on lead, and thus under control dog, may well get either bitten, or kicked by me.

lol @ theemx! Is that you biting the dog too?
If a dog comes up to me and my dog (particularly if it is a GSD as she is terrified of them) I keep her off the lead and she can then run away/avoid direct contact with whatever is spooking her rather than have to face it and fight.  i know a lot of people would not agree with this as this is me corroborating with her over her fears but it works for us and I would rather she avoided a potentially agressive dog than have to split up a staffy fighting which would be distressing for all involved and would no doubt contribute to people slagging the breed (again).

Possibly!

See, mine would rather chase the other dog off/have a fight, than run away. Thus he is on a lead.

But even so, sometimes im on my way somewhere, cutting across the fields.

With four dogs on the lead, i do NOT want them all trying to kill/greet/play/hump an off lead dog that has been allowed to approach them!

Em

I have to say, (and I am in no way disagreeing with what you have all said about not letting dogs run up to those on the lead) if my dog ran up to someone and they kicked it, I would NOT be amused.

I'd only kick a dog if it was trying to fight my dogs, personally - if a dog is pestering mine, the first thing I do is stamp my foot and shout "AAA!" at them - scared the life out of a horrible little Chi a while back, no-one said a word because it's always running up to dogs and snapping at them.  Haven't seen it since, actually..

It wouldnt be my first reaction.

However it is ONE of my reactions and quite frankly, i think you would be LESS amused if my dog bit yours! Which is of course one of the other options available should you choose to leave an untrained dog off lead to approach mine!

So if you think that wouldnt amuse you, how about training your dog a decent recall, and putting it on a lead when you see another on lead dog approaching!

Quite easy really

Em

theemx,
I presume your very patronising answer is directed at me.  Don't just assume that I have a dog that I cannot recall- I don't actually have a dog at the moment. And when I do get my pup, I will always make sure I put him on the lead if I see another leashed dog approaching (as I have done with all my dogs in the past), as I would respect that there was a reason for the dog being on a lead.

You said IF your dog ran up to mine.... im not assuming anything im answering the point you made in your post!

That presumes taht you dont have any recall. So yes, if it wouldnt leave my dog alone and no other method would get it off my dog, kicking is an option.

IF your dog was off lead, by your side, started to approach and was called back and stayed with you, then no, of course not!

Dear all,

thank you soo much for your support! and comment.
I had placed this post with in honesty the express intent to play 'devil's advocate' to open up discussion.

we are all (its only natural) very quick sometimes to throw stones from which ever the side of the fence you stand.

Its been nice to get us all together on the fence for a while and view BOTH sides' opinions ideas and experiences.

hopefully this gives us all food for thought.
(you never stop learning)
and sometimes we just didnt appreciate the bigger picture, we were'nt nescessarily being 'irresponsible' owners.... but like we dont not educate our kids or our dogs.... neither so should we stop learning!

and on that note its nearly time for our second walk of the day, we've had our fun 5 mile run this morning.. so this one is 'school time' for the Boy!

we'r off to the park!
and you know what.... damnit I'm gonna practice what I preach. I reward my
dog for good responsible behaviour.... I'm gonna extend that out to owners!

So me and the Boy are headin' out witha coupla' bottles of wine stashed in my pocket.

If your in the Surrey area and you come across us... and you display good mannerly control off your dog.... I will gladly hand you over one of my wines!!!

hope to see those of you who have tolerance understanding and a genuine care for all things canine!!!
Chablis or Champers??????????????

with Very best wishes and thanks xxxx