I have a three and a half year old working strain cocker spaniel and I am considering using him at stud. As a responsable dog owner I was about to get him hip scored and eye tested, and also to improve his chances of being considered by prospective breeders, I would like to train him for and enter him into Field/Working Trials.  I recall seeing a thread on the forum stating that as far as working cockers are concerned, not many breeders would expect/require hip scoring/eye tests, is this correct? Also as a novice (please excuse my ignorance) I understand there is a difference between Field Trials and Working Trials, can someone explain what this is and how I would go about training him/entering him into competition?

The fact that a lot of the breeders do not hip score or eye test does not mean it should not be done.

Working Trials are based on training obedience and then tracking and patrol dog work.  Field Trials are trials of the dogs ability as a Gundog.

to improve his chances of being considered by prospective breeders
I suspect that the best way to do this is for him to be successful in whatever discipline you choose to train him in.
Breeders looking to produce pups to the breed standard will look for a consistantly winning and producing stud, so those aiming to produce good working pups would surely be looking doe a successful working stud.  No serious breeder would consider using a dog who hasn't proved himself in anything other than producing puppies.

Roly,

Field Trials - A competition where gundogs are tested on an actual shooting day. A spaniel would be expected to hunt within a close range of his handler in often really punishing cover (bramble & thorns etc) and flush any game. This will be shot (or missed!) by some accompanying people. Any game shot -  dead or wounded, to be retrieved by the dog. The dogs are judged on the quality of their hunting, game finding and retrieving. Therefore plenty of training and experience in the shooting field is required. A highly succesful field trial dog can be made up to a Field Trial Champion (FTCh).

Working Tests - These are basically a simulated field trial. No live game is used, and the retrieves are usually on dummies. These are run during the summer, out of the game season. These are good fun, and usually used as a means of getting a dog used to a competitive environment in preparation for field trials.

Working Trials - Completely different, in that they are more based upon the type of work a police or patrol dog would do. A cocker could be trained for this discipline but they are not the best suited breed. A very succesful working trial dog could be a Working Trial Champion (WTCh). Whilst a great achievement in itself, it would be of little interest to someone seeking a working spaniel stud dog.

A rough (& very brief) guide to getting your cocker into field trials would be :
- Get hold of some books and videos on gundog training. A good start would be 'Working Springers & Cockers' by Mike Smith for a book, and the set of four videos / DVDs presented by Edward Martin on cocker training. Follow the training process described.
- Join some gundog clubs and societies who will often run training classes (try and get a spaniel specific class, as those geared around retrievers are only of limited benefit to a trialling spaniel). Unfortunately most classes are spring and summer only. You will need to be a member of these clubs to run in their working tests and field trials.
- Get access to game. To train a spaniel to trialling standard you need access to some ground to train on that has plenty of cover and a population of rabbits and/or game. Once you read Mike Smith's book all will become clear.
- Get yourself some shooting & beating. If you haven't got access to this now then make a start straight away. Unless you live in certain areas of the country it is very difficult getting the right kind of shooting to prepare a spaniel for trials. I know through personal experience, as I am currently in the process of schooling a young springer for field trials.
- Once you have got your dog trained to the required standard, and steady to game (i.e he will flush it but not chase) then you can get him out into the shooting field and get some experience into him.
- The majority of working spaniels stop at this point and spend their lives as non-competitive working dogs. Nothing wrong with this at all, and if your dog can prove himself in the shooting field then you may find some bitch owners may start to approach you to use your dog. However, to a great extent the amount your dog gets used will have more to do with your skills as a trainer than the inherant quality of your dog.
- Once he has had sufficient experience in the shooting field then you can start to think about entering a few field trials.

Many spaniels dont make the grade as field trial performers, as spaniels are judged on pace, drive, style and hunting ability. These are not really things that you can train into a dog, and there is a high proportion of 'wastage' from even the best breeding that just dont have sufficient 'go' for field trials (even though they might make nice shooting dogs).

The difficulty that you may face is that if you have very little training / shooting experience then by the time you get him ready he'll have lost his pace, not many spaniels are run in trials after about five years old for this reason. Also, as a pet you'll probably have allowed him to take in far more ground when he is being walked than would be ideal for a trialling spaniel.

I wouldn't put you off from aspiring to trial him, but realistically starting at his age, then turning him into a useful shooting companian would still be a good and worthwhile achievement. You can learn the ropes with him and then be better prepared to bring on any future pups that you may aquire. 

All of this will require a great deal of time, effort and money. In the early years it would cost a lot more to bring a spaniel on to trialling potential than any stud fees that might be gained. There are certainly easier ways of making money. However, as a hobby and dog sport it is superb. If you view it in this way, then at some stage it becomes a bonus if your dog or bitch can start to recoup some of your expenses.

Very few trialling cockers and springers are hip scored and eye-tested. To be honest, those that are tested tend not to be from the more succesful trialling competitors. Breeders will tell you that this is because there isnt a problem in the breeds, although my view is that they just would prefer not to turn over that particular rock! There are certainly rumours that a well used FTCh cocker regularly throws bad hips.

My feeling is that so many young spaniels in trialling hands get 'moved on' to non-competitive homes between 6 months and 2 years old due to having insufficient trialling potential, that competitors just dont want to shorten the odds any further by testing.

It would be a very positive thing if you tested your own dog, although without working achievement, good health results would count for very little.

If you want to find out more about working / trialling your dog then let me know and I'll do my best to help.

Wow what helpful advice. I don't have a spaniel or do field trials but I have learnt a lot from your post anyway, as I am sure has the op. Thanks Havoc. :)

Brilliant post Havoc!! :)
And so informative to those of us who have little understanding of those disciplines.

Thank you. Its a bit of a challenge trying to condense a subject that fills books into a post. :-)

Yeah, I'm not interested in Spaniels at all, but that was fascinating!

Wish I could be so concise :D  Very interesting.

I agree...great post & very informative :)

Havoc,
Wow! I must concur with the previous replies, concise but to the point. The information is very much appreciated and I will certainly get hold of the books/DVD's you recommend and also get in contact with a club. I am just concerned that I may have left it too late in the day for my dog to acheive any potential he might have. He has a brilliant disposition as a family pet, so anything else would a bonus. I guess it is a case of "playing it by ear", training him, entering him into working tests and then reassessing the situation if he proves himself. Again many thanks, very informative.

Roly,

I'm pleased you've got something from my post. As I read it again, there is so much more I could have added, but I think I've given you a start.

As i said, if you've got any question then let me know. I can also give you details of a couple of friendly & helpful gundog training forums.

Havoc,

I would appreciate the details of the forums please. You given me quite a lot of food for thought!

please could i also have the details of the forums too. i train working labradors and was thinking of eventually getting a spainel too.

Roly / ikkledevil,

I'll pm you both.....