Hi - its my first time on here, so bear with me!

We have had our 9 week old cocker spaniel for a week now and she is doing really well - "doing her bizz" in the garden and on the paper, sleeping well in her crate during the night, waking us to go out for wees etc.  In fact, we have been surprised at how well she's settling in.  There is just one problem, tho, which I don't want to make worse by not doing the right thing for her now....

Maddy sleeps in her crate in our bedroom at the mo while she gets settled in.  (This arrangement is due to her raising merry hell the first night we brought her home - we put it down to her not being used to the crate).  She whimpers several times a night to let us know she needs the toilet, and we take her outside and she does her stuff.  Then its back in the crate until the next time she needs to go, and she settles and goes back to sleep.

On a morning whilst I get ready for work (and my husband is still in bed) I go for my shower, and she is quite happy to lie awake in her crate, as my husband is still there with her (albeit asleep).When my husband gets up for his shower, and I am in the room, she is still quite happy to sit and watch me get ready (we don't like to let her out whilst we are not in a position to fully supervise her).  However, as soon as me and my husband BOTH leave the room, she starts to cry immediately, and paws at the crate to try and get out.  And when I say cries, I mean cries (not just little whimpers).  Now, we are only in the bathroom, and she can here us moving about, but immediately its like she starts to panic that she can't see us.

I put my head around the door and tell her "No! Quiet" or "No! That's enough" in my stern voice and she stops and looks at me.  If I stay there, she lays back down, but if I go back out of the room, she starts again immediately.  Now, I don't want to take her out of her crate whilst she's making such a fuss, as that may teach her that making a fuss will get her what she wants.

I need to let her know that being on her own in the crate for a little while on her own is OK, yet I'm not sure how to go about this.  During the day she follows myself or my husband round constantly (she even seems to know when we leave the room whilst she's asleep!) and I need to make sure that eventually she will be secure enough to be left alone (and happy) for a short while when necessary. 

Any suggestions?

Cheers

Claire

Hi Claire and welcome :)

Do you put Maddy in her crate in any other rooms in the house during the day?  If not I'd suggest moving the crate into somewhere like the kitchen or lounge and popping her in for a few minutes with a treat or toy while you're doing housework (dreaded word I know :D ) - literally just put her in for a couple of minutes maximum, and if she remains quiet and content let her out again.  Also try feeding ALL of her meals in the crate - you don't need to shut her in to do this.

Ideally you want to aim for her choosing to go into her crate for a nap etc and the best way to do this is to encourage her to go in with something pleasant and preferably not shut the door over - I know, sounds easy but in reality it takes a bit of time, patience and scullduggery ;)  Perhaps put a worn T-shirt, nightie etc of yours in there for her to cuddle up to.

Regards, Teri :)

Hi Teri, thanks for the response

Yes, we put her crate downstairs in the dining/living room during the day, however she does also have a little cushion type bed which she likes to fall asleep on during the day.  We started to put her into her crate whenever she fell asleep and close the door, and then when she woke we let her out and took her straight outside for her wee, but since she has been doing really well with the house training, we have been happy for her to sleep in her little cushion during the day instead of the crate.  We also play near the crate, and entice her into it with her toys, and she has been inside it of her own accord on a couple of occasions on her own (once when my husband switched on the hoover, and she shot inside like a whippet!) So she knows its her place and that its safe.

I also have a sweatshirt of mine in the crate which she snuggles up to sometimes on a night, and she does enter her crate herself at bedtime with a little enticing on a night no problem.  The problem only occurs when she is in the crate with the door shut and she is not in a position to follow us when we leave the room.

How about if I try putting her in it for a few minutes each day and closing the door, but remaining in the room with her, and let her out after a few minutes if she's been quiet, then once she's used to that, then try it again, but leave the room for a few moments and see what happens, and then gradually build up the time she's left in there on her own from say 3 seconds to 10!! as that's about as long as she'll last at the mo! :o)

I'll also try feeding her her meals in the crate instead of in the kitchen and see if that helps - I've noticed aswell that she will eat whilst me or my husband are in the room, but again, as soon as we leave the room, she stops eating and follows us, and we have to go back to the kitchen to try and get her to eat again.  So I'm not sure if its a crate problem or a separation problem.

What do you think?

Hi Claire - you're doing most of the right things already so you should find introducing her to dining in her cage will help to create the right ambiance in there :)   Hopefully Digger, Lindsay et al will be along soon with more tips but it is a slow process getting a young puppy used to being on it's own without being distressed.  My own dogs follow me everywhere too - you're lucky you both have the bathroom to yourselves :P  My youngest has a shower (literally) with me every day and the others (providing I nip in and shut the door of the bathroom quick enough) lie outside in wait to mug me and steal the towel :D

Come to think of it, me giving advice on behaviour and training is perhaps not a great idea!  Good luck, Teri :)   

Hee hee - thanks Teri.  I'll look forward to Digger and Lyndsey's thoughts on the matter.

Also, one more thing (it looks like our pup is not quite as well adjusted as we'd at first thought!!)...

She has started weeing in the house again.  She did it three times yesterday, although she had been in the garden most of the afternoon and had weed there with my husband there to praise her as we always do.  And she has done it again today - she had had a nap, Steve took her outside for a wee, and she did so (more praise etc).  They had a bit play in the garden then came in, and with no warning at all (non of the tell tale sniffing in circles and looking like she's on a mission) she promptly squatted in the hallway and relieved herself on the laminate flooring!!  Now, as well as taking her outside, we also have newspapers on the floor at the back door, and when instructed, she wees there no problem.  So why do you think she's taking backward steps all of a sudden??

Okay, house training - now I can do that :D :D :D

At 9 weeks she has no bladder or bowel control at all - zippo, zilch, nadda ;)  You have to physically take her out and wait with her to perform roughly every 30-45 minutes during waking hours and immediately after waking, eating or playing.  Have a command word such as "busy" and say that as soon as she begins to perform, then praise and treat.  You want her to learn to make the association of eliminating only outdoors so for your own sake as much as her don't leave papers down - this is confusing and slows up the training process.  So relax, she hasn't taken a backward step, you've simply been lucky up to now that she's not had many accidents :)   Never tell her off if she does go indoors - it's always our fault for getting the timing wrong or missing signals.  Pups don't sniff and circle simply to urinate hence why they catch us out by suddenly squatting mid-game and then carrying on like nothing happened :P

Regards, Teri 

^ I've always disagree'd with people using puppy pads and putting down newspaper. I'd rather have my puppy wreck the hardwood floor then teach it TOO eliminate in the house. Better yet , catching them in the act!

Thanks Teri, I feel a bit better about it now.  I'll remove the papers and stick to peeing outside (Maddy that is, not me!)

Funny thing is i onced peed in a paper cup and poured it onto our flowers , my sons were on the can.

Alot of these problems occur on these forums i am starting to notice, IGNORE IGNORE IGNORE IGNORE!!

Of COURSE she is crying she wants to get your attention, she hasn't gotten used to being away from her littermates yet and on her own. LET HER CRY , DONT COMFORT HER , the more you comfort her crying the more she will think crying brings attention. Put her in the crate , shut the door and throw in a couple treats and a "good night" then off to bed! In acouple days of being consistant and ignoring her crying then she will start to only cry when she has to be let out. My recent puppy loves his crate now and goes in on his own.

Sorry another thing is learn her night pee schedule if you leave water down , your instincts will tell you when she is crying to go out.

When you let her out , let her out and put her back in the crate immiedtely until you wake up , no play time during sleep time then she will associate her crying as only being let out to do her buisness not to play.

Good point Manny - games in the wee small hours aren't much fun for us humans - although pups need to learn that ;)

Thanks for that MannyG - the problem isn't during the night.  She only cries during the night when she wants a wee.  The problem is on a morning, while she is still in her crate, and I leave the room.  Its like she's OK being in there while I'm around, but as soon as I leave the room, that's it, you'd think I was trying to murder her the noise she makes.

So, should I just ignore her until I choose to let her out of the crate once I'm dressed and sorted etc?

Is this AFTER you take her out to pee when you wake up then put her in so you can do your own thing? If not then i think it means "Let me out i need to pee!"

This happens AFTER we let her out to pee - if Steve's in the bedroom, she's fine.  If I'm in the bedroom, she's fine.  If NEITHER of us are in the bedroom with her, THAT's when the yowling starts.  She's already peed, and she's been happily watching us get ready in the morning, just as long as she can see one of us.  As soon as she can't see either of us, she starts.

Only thing i can really say is to ignore it , if she's not hungry or needs to pee then she just wants to play and get some attention. Wouldn't it be ok to let her run around the house while you all get ready?

Hey if football is soccer in europe then what is american football called, hand ball?

We could let her run round the house - but we'd rather have her where we can see her so she can't get into any trouble, plus we need her to recognise that us being in the next room for 5 minutes isn't the worst thing in the world for her

Regarding the football question, I'd regard American football as rugby, but for wimps (rugby players don't use all that namby pamby body armour you guys have (lol)

We call American Football just that Manny (not that it's played that much here - we have rugby league and rugby union for men who want to get beaten up ;))

As I see it, what's happening here is she's concerned because she can't see you, and when she makes a noise, you reappear, and even though you're not happy, it's reassuring to her that you are still there.  I'd suggest a) talking to her while she's quiet, even though she can't see you b) NOT returning until there is a break in the noise - it WILL get worse before it gets better, because she's learnt she can call you back, when you don't come, she will get even more frantic (it's called an 'extinction burst' in behavioural terms)  In the mean time, can you train her to accept being in the crate without you in the room for very short periods - to start with, leave the crate door open and turn around, then return to her and praise her for staying still for the shortest period.  Slowly build up on this, and start to close the door so you are training the behaviour you DO want......

HTH

Just what I was about to say ............... :D  Cheers Digger, now about my showering with a 15 monther ............... :rolleyes: :D

What about a food toy like a Kong or some greenies , i know that would calm all my boys down for 10 minutes and get their mind off what is on hand (my meat loaf). I only pull these out on special occasions because heck , greenies are damn expensive.

PS: any of you have sleep squeakers? 2 of my boys are squeaking in sync as i type.

Hi Digger

Thanks for the advice - I can guarantee you tho that as soon as I open the door and walk out the room, she will follow me.  She hasn't really spent a lot of time in the crate with the door open - she goes in OK on occasion, but doesn't tend to stay there.  If we put her in there when she falls asleep and leave the door open, as soon as she wakes, she gets out of the crate (and we take her for a wee).

I'm going to try feeding her in her crate to get more used to it. I'll also try putting the little cushion/bed type thing which she likes to snooze on in the crate to try and persuade her that's where she should nap during the day. What do you think?

hello i'm not experienced - going throuh the crate routine too but my first thought was that it may have been a mistake to introduce a bed. I wondered why my crate training was going backwards then i found out that my daughter was letting rory on the sofa on her duvet! of course he loved that so it has been removed. If rory falls asleep on the carpet then i pick him up and put him in the crate. Sorry about bad typing he is snuggled on lap and i am enjoying the moment. it sounds a good idea to put bed in crate. good luck!

Hi June

Funny you should mention that - I was thinking myself that perhaps having the soft squashy bed during the day was more preferable to her, hence she's not using the crate.  Last night I put the bed in the crate, and I also put a duvet cover over the top and three sides of the crate, so she can't actually see when I've left the room.  I've sneaked out twice this morning for at least 5 mins a go , and guess what - no yelping!!!  There was the tiniest bit of whimpering at first, but I left her to it.  When I returned to the crate and peeped in, she was laid quietly in her bed in the crate!  What a result!  I know its early days, and she may not get used to it overnight, but it certainly seems to be a small step in the right direction.

Also, we fed her her tea in the crate last night and she was perfectly happy being in there whilst she ate.  As soon as she'd finished, tho, she came straight out.  It remains to be seen if she'll send any time in her crate of her own accord whilst the door is left open.

Thats great. I have been assured that they get there eventually. I'm not too worried about leaving the door open, I think that will be the very last stage. as long as I can leave him in there with the door shut and he's happy that will do me.   Good luck.