My puppy is 10wks old, I removed him from the litter a week ago because he was skin and bones and the other puppies picked on him. He has always been the runt.
I thought he had worms real bad so I wormed him for three straight nights and he seemed to be getting better,
his appetite improved and he was able to run around and play.
This morning his stomach as become bloated the size of a softball and he won't go to the bathroom.
I believe he is extremely constipated.
He's now to weak to stand and won't do anything but moan.
I keep giving him water through a seringe to keep him from becoming dehydrated. He acts like he's thirsty but his stomach makes really wierd noises as the water goes down.
His stomach feels cold.
Please give me some advice ASAP, I cannot afford to take him to the vet:( So please give me some remedies of what I can do at home.

Amber - unless you take this puppy to a vet IMMEDIATELY it most probably will die :(  You say you can't afford a vet?  If you are on low income, you can take the puppy to the PDSA (I'm assuming you are in the UK).  If this doesn't apply, beg or borrow the money from a relative, friend, neighbour - whatever - but get the poor little thing to a vet.

Nobody can diagnose this over the internet and obviously you can't treat the puppy either.  Teri

I fully agree with Teri and would just like to add that this does NOT sound like constipation. There are several other conditions it could be, all very much more serious.

UK vets have an obligation to treat animals, and most when faced with a seriously ill animal will accept for you to pay them off in installments or later when it is a case of life and death. Likewise YOU have an obligation to the puppy and to do nothing COULD even get you into trouble with the RSPCA as it is illegal to allow an animal to suffer.

Marianne

If you can't afford the vets why have a litter of pups???? :( - very sad indeed! I would suggest you find some pennies asap to get the poor pup to the vet to get him checked over!

I think Amber might be in the U.S.

If you want to save this puppy, the vet is the only person who can help you right now.

Yes I am in the U.S. and live in a small town where there isn't many vets. This isn't my litter of puppy, they are my brothers but he had to go out of town to train for a new job a won't be back for a few weeks.

u need to get this pup to the vet asap otherwise he may well die.  if u care at all about the life of this puppy then id advise u to either borrow the money off someone or pay the vet at a later date, but u need to get the pup to the vet NOW!
it sounds to me like bloat? this is a potentially fatal problem and needs to be sorted now!

Amber, you say there aren't *many* vets in your small town - so there's at least one!

Please, please get the puppy seen now as an emergency.  No decent vet will refuse and I'm sure will make a payment schedule for you.  Let us know how you get on.  Good luck, Teri

Hi,
You do need to take the puppy to the vet's.
Won't they bill you if you ask, If you are selling your pups, you could pay them then.
I personally would have hand reared a weak pup.
Is he pooing and weeing. There may be a blockage.
You won't forgive yourself if you don't. Take him.
Regards
Denese

Vets must be really different in the UK because in my small town the vet charges a large fee just for the office visit and then more to treat the dog. It's very sad vets are just in it for the money in my town and the animal hospital is to far to take him.
BUT I would like to inform you all that the puppy's conditions have improved.
He was very constipated, he would try to go and just couldn't. I kept giving him water throughout the day.
Then I gave him a very small dose of Maalox.
I gave that 30 minutes to work, and he still didn't have a bowel movement.
I checked to make sure there wasn't a anal blockage and there was not one.
So I performed a home made enema, I used water mixed with epson salt and warmed it up to dissolve the salt.
Once I got it to a nice temperature I sucked it up in a syringe and rubbed the syringe in petroleum jelly, before inserting it into the rectum I made sure the anal canal was lubricated.
He pooped an unreal amount and threw up some too.
He got up and drank and whole lot of water on his own.
He is now very alert and much more active:)
Pray this works and his conditions will continue to improve.
I know the procedure I performed sounds risky and dangerous, but I seeked out wise advice before going about it and I do have a CNA license, so I have assisted in performing this on people.

>Vets must be really different in the UK because in my small town the vet charges a large fee just for the office visit and then more to treat the dog.

No, that sounds the same. But it's not one of the optional extras in animal ownership. If you can't afford vet fees, you don't have the animals. I'm curious as to why the litter hasn't been homed at 10 weeks?

It's exactly the same here in the UK but we ensure that we have enough money put by for eventualities like this.  He still needs to go to the vet IMHO.

I do hope the puppy thrives - but I do not think that this is a procedure that can be recommended as "self-medication" for inexperienced owners.

Margot

I am not an inexperienced owner I have played a role in breeding and raising dogs for 18 years, I have also done clinicals in a vets office. Our family ran a small farm for a long time, until my father passed away and a I learned alot from my dad. I'm sure if you took a poll of all the people in my neighborhood you would find barely nobody takes their dogs to the vet. People learn from others how to do things. Please don't get upset with me, it's just how things around here are done in the rural parts of the U.S.

Amber,

There may be different attitudes in different communities never mind countries but your subject heading for this post is bound to get attention - that you don't like the tone of the attention is unfortunate but not the fault of members who, quite rightly, put the interests of this poor puppy before the feelings of the owner.

I hope to God that what you've done is sufficient to save this little pup - but can't condone your methods nor your determination to deal with the puppy without proper professional qualified care being sought.

Fingers crossed you can provide for the puppy in every other way.  Good luck, Teri

Hi sweet am2000,
I can understand, countries are diffrent. We are very lucky in England we have a place called the P.D.S.A. were, if we can't afford treatment for our animals they do it free. We also have a free Health Service,
so we do find it hard to understand how people do not attend a doctors or Hospital or Vets.
As abroad you have to pay so much. I doubt many of us would attend the doctors, Hospital or Vets
very much if we had to pay a private fee. Would a warm flannel placed on the tummy, then rubbing softly but firmly, stimulate the bowel movment. Try a little white sugar in a little milk see if that will act as a
laxative. (they use that in prem. babies) it might help.
Best of Luck!!
Regards
Denese

You have to be on benefits to get help from the PDSA.  Like millions of others in the UK I pay a private fee to consult a vet, which in the UK is certainly not cheap, but would go without something else if veterinary attention was required.
I am very pleased that Ambers puppy appears to be improving but I would not like anyone to read this thread and think, well OK, its alright not to seek veterinary help if money is short.  Breeding dogs is perhaps something not to be undertaken in the first place if proper financial arrangement have not been put in place bearing in mind Amber does not live in an underdeveloped country and has local access to vets.

Hi Isabel,
Yes!!! I pay private Vet fee's as well!!! But!! we do have a chose of vet's there are some that rip
you off, And, there soul concern is there profit margin. Some Vet's charge double for the same
treatment. But! in a lot of countries they are so few of them they just name there price.
Again, in some contries if you have a car crash and NO Ins. they just leave you on the kerb side.
So I doubt if they are bothered about animals. As we were asked for help, I think we should respond the best we can, don't you? And always help them not as privileged as ourselves.
Regards
Denese

The best advise offered was seek veterinary help.  In rural England and certainly Scotland you may have a limited choice of vet but as they all seek to run viable businesses they will rarely price themselves above the market I expect it is the same in America.  Amber may be underprivileged, we don't really know, but what we do know is she lives in one of the wealthiest countries in the world.  In countries that have a high consumer spending power, unlike underdeveloped countries, there will almost always be some other luxury to give up at times like these and after all breeding dogs is a matter of choice.

Just like to point out that the PDSA will not help everyone on benefits only the people that live within the city postcode where they are based.  If you haven't got a PDSA in your city then you can't get any subsidised treatment I'm afraid.

Hi Anna,
That sounds a little worrying I didn't know that! Of course taking a pup to the vets
is the best thing to do!! but! if the money isn't there and the pup needs help!
And the vet's who are suposed to be animal lovers will not see him with out upfront
payment what can be done!! I know breeding is a chose, but no- one can determin
the unexpected. I can undestand the panik if you care about the pups.
They are here now and have to be seen to, don't they.
I just hope some one on here can help her!!
Regards
Denese

>And the vet's who are suposed to be animal lovers will not see him with out upfront

payment what can be done!!
There is nothing to suggest that Ambers vets are not animal lovers nor that they would demand money upfront the only thing she has said is she can't pay she does not seem to have approached them at all about paying later which is what I would have done if I was desperate.  As I say she is living in one of the richest nations in the world I'm sure the money can be found if something else is willing to be given up.

>They are here now and have to be seen to, don't they.

Exactly :)
It is precisely because you don't know quite what to expect when breeding that you should not embark on it unless you have a good contingency fund, treating this puppy would have been chicken feed compared to what can happen during a bitches confinement, delivery and the rearing of a litter.
I think she has been very lucky to have succeeding in treating the puppy herself I wonder how sympathetic you would feel if she had pierced the rectum on this little pup giving it that enema.

Hi Isabel,
I understand what your saying, Yes!! I also would have asked if I could make payments,
At a later date. You see Isabel, they say in England with the state system, no one should
starve,But!! they do! we send money abroad for starving babies, But! there are many in
this country. Yes!! U.S. is a rich country But! that doesn't mean everyone in it!
I have had babies given to me that are worse than the one's on the Telly, and even though
I worked for the Goverment, and should have been paid! if they were in a state I wouldn't
turn them away, I do love children. So! I see the Vets in the same light! if they have to wait
a few weeks for payment, and save a dogs life, they should, if they care! I hope you see were
I am coming from. Most Vet's are more financially sucure than I am.
Regards
Denese

I do see where you are coming from but these vets do not seem to have been given the opportunity to show they care so there is every possibility they may have done.

Vets fees in the uk can be pretty hight too please take your pup to the vet you will get the money back when you come to sell him , its either mabe let him die and get nothing or pay out now and let him live with the fact the buyer will be paying to save his life , you just have to find the money in the mean time

just like to point out our doctors/hospital isent free if you pay tax's you pay .... I do anyway :P and if you dont pay your tax's some poor bugger is paying for you lol :D

I wish the pups were homed...they are indeed getting very old to be sold. We are down to nine, we did have 14. I live very far out in the country and this season the parvo virus has been killing whole litters of puppies. We were afraid our pups were getting it so we didn't want to sell sick puppies to people, but thankfully we caught the ones the had it quickly and seperated them from the rest. Our litter is hound puppies and they don't sell to well this time of year. Our local magazine that we place ads in messed up our ad and so hopefully this week they will appear in their again.

Hi Amber - it's probably hard for people who live in the UK to understand what things are like in your community.
Ideally it would have been good if you'd been able to get the pup checked by a vet but I reckon you've done pretty well in the circumstances.
I hope the pup continues to improve and you find good homes for them all.

Best wishes.

The UK has a long traditional of animal husbandry with much known about folk remedies too which is fine for minor conditions but we also now have laws that require you to seek veterinary help when any animal is suffering, perhaps they don't exist is the US but it is common sense that some conditions will be more quickly and more effectively treated with professional care thus reducing suffering.  If Amber had been totally confident folk remedies could sort this they would not have posted such an alarmingly titled item on a message board.  I have travelled to many places in the world where veterinary help is not available for hundreds of miles so I do appreciate that it can be very difficult sometimes but Amber has vets locally and it would appear it is just boiling down to money.  As the puppies are to be sold presumably there is money in the pipeline and I am sure the vets would appreciate that.

UK vets charge a consultation fee on top of treatment too whether you would describe it as a large fee is a matter of opinion I don't know any vets that charge more than a private human Doctor, for instance, if they did not charge their business would not be viable and they would have to pack up and go back to live with Mother and that would not benefit us any.  However the vast majority of them here, and I am sure they are cut from the same human mould in the US, are not heartless I really think you should have at least contacted one and discussed coming to some agreement about paying over a period of time.  I am glad your puppy appears to be improving but any reversal in that really should not be neglected again.

You all are jumping to so many assumptions and you do not have the facts.
So you all just keep dragging this thing, around and around in circles.
Yes the US is a very wealthy COUNTRY, that definitely does not mean everyone nor even a majority has money.
I consulted a man that has just as much experience with dogs as a vet does and he gave me advice.
There are much worse things going on in the US than what I did. In fact, most people would honor what I did because several cruelity cases have been on the news lately and it is so sad.
In the part of the US I live in the medications for animals are sold in certain stores, so that people do not have to take their animals to vets. If I had of taken the puppy to a vet we're talking about several hundreds of dollars, if not thousands.
So please tell me what I could give up to pay off that much money.
And I did what I did out of love, these aren't even my puppies as I said earlier. And it wasn't expected that we were going to have puppies. The mother and father are hunting dogs, hunting is a big deal in my part of the state, and if you let the dogs go out on a hunt and they decide to breed well then it's just one of those freak accidents of nature.
For those of you who prayed and gave me your best wishes, Thank you. To the others of you, maybe you should open up your hearts and minds and learn about other cultures (and not just the USA... in Haita the people are so poor and their dogs are so skinny they have to lean against trees to bark or how about in the Phillipines where they eat dogs)
instead of spending so much time up here with your negative feedback.
Please don't be offended, know that I love dogs, but here sadly enough most people would have taken that poor puppy out and shot him atleast I am trying to help him and his conditions have improved.
In fact he's almost back to normal now. Also, I am not advising anyone else to ever do what I did it was risky, I would tell anyone to take their pet to the vet or atleast to someone that has knowledge in treating animals. I have 18 years of observing and helping treat all kinds of animals successfully with the help of my father. He has passed away now (mainly the reason my money isn't abdunant) and so I did my best to treat this puppy. Sorry to have asked advice on here and started such a big controversy. I promise never to make that mistake again.

>we're talking about several hundreds of dollars, if not thousands.

Away with ya, for an enema!  :) Did you ever ask them what treatment would have cost and if you could spread payment?
Hunting folk here know when their hounds and dogs are in season and they don't just let them breed willy nilly.
We also have people claiming to know more than vets but as they have never been examined by a reputable college on that knowledge it would be very hard to say whether they are quacks or not so people would be taking a risk on their animals behalf consulting them.
I'm glad to see you are recommending that others do not do the same as you and I am glad the puppy is still thriving :).

We only had the facts as you told them - how can we respond to what we don't know?   Crystal balls don't come with computers!

Margot

I agree with you Isobel.   Using another countries example of cruelty does not make it right and the countries you are talking of are third world countries.  Taking a bitch and dog out when one is in season is not a freak accident of nature no more than it would be if I let Thomas roam around the girls when they are season!

Perhaps most where you live - or most of the people you know, but NOT most of the people in the US.  I'm Canadian, living in the UK.  I lived on teh US border for years.  Things aren't so different between Canada and the US.  I lived in RURAL'ish Canada and if we have a pup that is in the condition you describe it goes to the vet.  If anyone I know who lives on the farm had a pup in that condition it would get medical attention from a vet.  If it's a farm dog and the farmer can't be bothered - then he'd probably kill it to put it out of its misery - but he would not continue to let it live like it is without some form of proper medical intervention.

So don't give that line that 'most would...' because that's entirely not true.

If an animal is sick seek medical attention - PERIOD.  To do anything else is neglect.  If you can't afford the medical attention then don't breed.  PERIOD.

I usually get really upset when I read how some posts come across as judgemental and I try very hard not to do that myself, but in this case you asked for advice and were given SOUND advice and are sitting there making up all kinds of excuses about why you can't follow it.  If you didn't want to hear it then don't ask.

I'm not making any assumptions here - you asked for advice - take the flipping puppy to the vet or get it put down.

And if you can't afford proper medical care for your animals when circumstances are outside the norm, then STOP BREEDING.

Wendy

>if you let the dogs go out on a hunt and they decide to breed well then it's just one of those freak accidents of nature.

I'm sorry, but that's nonsense! If you don't want your in-season bitch to be mated (and it's very easy to tell when she's in season!) you keep her shut away from other dogs till she's over her season. It's as simple as that. No way is it a 'freak accident of nature' - it's intentional. If an owner is so clueless that they can't comprehend that then they're not fit to be responsible for an animal.

As for charging hundreds or even thousands of dollars for a consultation - I'm afraid I don't believe you! My US friends tell me it would be $50 maximum.

Hi,
I have read all your comments, and can not understand! We would all change the
past and probly have done things diffrently. But!! this puppy is here NOW!!
and needed help and advice!! there is NO!! money for Vets fee's!!
So the problem has to be dealt with doesn't it!! I thought the experienced breeders on
here would have been more compassionate! to a person that was asking for help with a puppy.
You ALL say you care WHAT!!! were is your help in this situation!!!
People have children and treat them worse than this, and never asked for help! just leave them,
I worked in childcare for years helped over 150 babies Not!! my own I would NEVER
dream of saying, I will not help, take them to the doctors its your fault!!If you can't
afford to feed them so what!! shouldn't have had them. They are here and NEED help.
If she had been in our country, I would have fetched the pup and seen if I could have
helped it. A lot of you have shocked me!! No one is born with ALL knowledge we have
to learn, You have!!
Regards
Denese 

Sorry, but I wouldn't help to perpetuate this sort of puppy producing.  If this poor puppy is homed in a similar situation, because the poster tells us that this is how all the dogs are kept in her area, then it's no better than helping a puppy farmer, or buying from one of those puppy dealing pet shops to save it.  It just subjects more dogs to this sort of life. :(

I am more than happy to help anyone who wants to learn about ethical breeding.:)

PS I wouldn't change any of my past denese! ;)

Hi Val,
I agree But!! the poor pup needed help! Some people would have dumbed them in dustbins,
like they do in Spain, for the bin men. Some drown them. Probly I care to much.
But!! Help was needed, even if she was told don't let it happen again.
Regards
Denese

Denese - from the first post, it would seem that this was someone with no knowledge - but three or four posts down the line she was boasting about her knowledge!    Now I've had quite a lot of experience with dogs & puppies, but no way would I have behaved in the way she did!

Margot

Hi Lookie mum,

I would never have attempted to do, what was done, my self because of perforation
But! I would have gone to the Vets, I would hope mine, would come to some kind of arrangment,
Or the plastic would!! To have the pup seen to or PTS. But! this wasn't the case.
This poor little mite was in pain and needed your help! There is very experienced breeders
on here, that probly know more than some vet's. To be experienced you need hands on experience.
Not just qualifications.
Regards
Denese

Denese,
I read the mail, and for what it is worth I have worked as a vet nurse so I do have some medical experience. To me, the description sounded like it could be a case of either gastric torsion or intussusception, and there would have been absolutely NOTHING the poster could have done about that at home, a vet would have been essential or the puppy would have died in pain.  To me the description did not sound like a simple case of constipation (and I said so). If any of us would have suggested home remedies of any sort and the puppy had died, I think we would all have felt awful about it. It would have been different if it was something simpler, say my puppy has a sore paw, bad ear, runny eyes, diarrhoea, but this DID sound DEADLY serious -especially if you consider the heading saying the puppy was *dying*.  I believe it would have been very irresponsible to try to suggest to do something except see a vet. (I also don't think there would have BEEN anything to suggest.)

Marianne

Denese, don't forget that in the UK (where this site is based!) it's illegal for non-vets to give medical advice. You seem to be suggesting we should break the law and diagnose and treat over the net. Even a vet needs to examine the patient before diagnosing!

It's very obvious that your heart is in the right place denese :) :) :)
There was a time when obvious puppy farmers would post on this board for advice.  You could almost hear them saying 'It'll be OK.  If I have a problem, those people on Champdogs will tell me what to do!"  To be honest I thought that they were extracting the urine at time.  To help these sort of pups would just be subjecting another generation to a miserable life.  Those of us who have been here for a few years are a little more selective about who will help, although you will see a occasional puppy producer offering advice.;)

Hi Val,
I wouldn'd change my past, But!! probly would have done thing diffrently.
Lack of knowledge, I think!!
Regards
Denese

I know this post is old but id just like to point out that if there isnt a pdsa in your area then your animal will still be seen by a nominated p.v (pdsa will pick who u go to)

The poster was in the US. :)

Marianne