I've been told my baby boy Acorah is no good for show cos his colours are not good enough, im totally gutted. I still love him but its a bit of a blow :(

Did you buy him for showing?

I'd have liked to but I cant. Soesnt bother me particularly now, what will be will be. (I'm a novice you see.....)

It's just that if you'd told the breeder you were interested in showing, you shouldn't have been allowed to buy a pup that wasn't up to the mark. Enjoy him purely as the lovely pet I'm sure he already is!

I did tell her I'd like to show him when he was a bit older. I've been had, I'll learn for next time :)

Did the breeder show her/his dogs?

No, his rellies are working dogs so I've been told. Ah well I love him and I dont care :) Hes perfect to me :D

That's good! ;)  If you do want to show then you'd stand a better chance if the pup was bred from successfully shown parents.  If Acorah's breeder didn't show, then they wouldn't have understood what is required.

Oh well, best start saving again :D

I think thats your problem if you had brought a puppy from someone who shows then they would have been keen to sell you one who was good enough to go in the ring with their affix attached.  Never mind though I have got one of the spottiest dogs in the world but I still love just as much as the ones I show. :)

Wanna see him?

i do

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v497/baileys_mum/Picture004.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v497/baileys_mum/Picture0071.jpg

Aaaaawwww!!!! What a cutie!! :D How old is he?? I have a (not so little) puppy too. But he is growing VERY fast!! ;-)

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12 weeks today. Copy and paste the link to the url bar

Mine is 21 weeks yesterday, so quite a bit older than yours! Your pup is gorgeous!!! :D

Sweetie.  Have a look here at show cockers
http://www.shenmore-cockers.co.uk/

ahhhhhhhhhh so cute

what a lovely bunch you have. I'd really like another one for Acorah cos he gets so lonely, even though I'm with him all day

Thank you :D

Acorah,

Before you write-off your lovely pup, have a look at this website, it explains all the colours and variations of colours acceptable in Cocker Spaniels in the UK :)  It also explains the Breed Standard

http://www.thecockerspanielclub.co.uk/colours.htm

"There is no such thing as a mismarked roan or particolour! " this quote is from the site :) :)

If your pup is KC registered perhaps you could consider showing in Companion and Open Shows, they are great training grounds for novices and you would have some fun and meet other Cocker owners :) :)
At the very least you would be learning the ropes and making contacts for when you are able to buy a top quality show dog :) :)  You would also be learning about conformation etc ;) ;) :D :D :D  And who knows? You may get a few rosettes too :)

Acorah if you've got a working spaniel then you need to be thinking of ways to stimulate him and keep him occupied other than buying another pup.  I would hope that his breeder could help you with this.  I guess you don't want to work him but could you think about agility.

I would also be nice to think that you've managed to sort your other problems and housing situation satisfactorily before considering another pup at this stage.

I am sure lots of people here will be able to offer suitable advice as to the ideal age for having another dog, but I would certainly advise waiting a while yet. 

As the owner of two working spaniels (who both work) I know how demanding these dogs can be and how much time you will need to give to training.  You will also find a show variety spaniel a different 'cup of tea'.

Acorah, they're not my Cockers!!!  Just a quality show kennel that I know!! :)
This has come out in the wrong place!!

Sorry Val lol, my mistake! If I hadnt gone into the background of A's then I wouldnt have known he was a working cocker as by breeders dog isnt used for working either. I will look at the cocker site and get back to you, thanks :)

It looks like I would either need the Kennel Club to look at him and tell me, or a KC judge. Any of these on here wanna look?

Acorah
just enter him in a couple of open shows! You'll get the judges opinion,get to meet other cocker exhibitors and get a taste of the showring! Its not expensive to enter open shows and its fun....give it a go!
Archer

I judge Cockers but not sure exactly what it is you want to know? Acorah is at least part Working Cocker & from his photos is predominantly black (ie a solid) with some white/roan markings. As someone has said above, there is no such thing as a mismarked particolour but unfortunately Acorah is a mismarked solid which does rule him out of showing as the Breed Standard only allows white on the chest in solid Cockers. This does not mean you cannot have fun at Companion Shows but there would be little point in showing him at any formal shows. Of course there are other activities you could get involved in and enjoy like agility or flyball (or even gundog training) but I would say showing is out, sorry.

Jane

Yeah thays what i expected. I will keep my eye out for the opens and get him into agility then, ty

If as Jane says he is a mismark then as she says he probably wouldn't do much in  formal shows....however it doesn't stop you entering and getting some practice with him.You would also then see some show bred cockers and meet some cocker people who show for future reference
Archer

:)

It's a good idea to enter him at companion and open shows, as archer says - you can make all your handling mistakes on him then without worrying that you are spoiling his chances! Then when you are ready and able to manage another puppy, you can get one and know how to handle him properly in the ring!

I can highly recommend this idea, I showed both of my girls before I got Beard Boy...I did ok with Kayla(only did open shows with her) but more often than not got chucked with Chloe but I learnt alot along the way and then when I got Idõ I hit the ground running really(was quite nervous at his first show tho!) and felt quite confident about entering, going to shows, getting in the ring etc

As others have said, there is nothing to stop you entering, you'll learn lots and have some fun along the way :)

Emily

And who knows - he may even get placed, colour isn't as important as conformation, there may still be dogs there who aren't as good ;)

And never ever forget - YOU always take the best dog home again :D :D :D

I'm sorry but there really is very little chance that a noticeably mismarked solid would get placed at an Open Show, especially bearing in mind the puppy is not from show breeding but from Field Trial lines. Working Cockers & show-type Cockers can look almost like different breeds & I feel it far better to encourage the owner of this puppy to go for activities her dog would be more suited for. It's great to encourage newbies but we've got to be realistic too ;-)

Jane

Jane
since the owner wants to show there is nothing wrong with using the dog to gain some experience and 'be seen' around the cocker ring.She may even meet someone who may mentor her in the future and guide her to a more suitable show prospect next time round.
Archer

I would agree with Jane, by all means go to shows, if an interest in what goes on there develops be seen showing an interest amongst the regulars who I am sure will be helpfull in guiding you towards a more suitable choice as a show prospect but I see little point in taking a dog that, frankly, stands no chance of any placing which is likely to make the whole experience of showing demoralising, financially wasteful (travel expenses soon add up even when entry fees are low) and ultimately tedious.

But most of us waste our money at shows, whether we win or as msotly happens (even with top notch dogs) don't :D

Well I'm not sure we see it as a waste when we win :D  Just to get a placing is nice and makes it all worthwhile for many of us but to have no chance at all..............

I can't believe that this dog has been classed as unfit for show simply on the photographs - no matter how good the judge I can't believe that they could possibly say whether the dog is good enough for show or not from any photographs and these photographs are just not clear enough, they don't even show both sides of the dog, or the dog standing up!!  - and yes I have read the advice on markings in cockers!!

Not all working cockers are so different from the show cockers, it depends on the strain, and this can't be seen from the photographs either.

So why shouldn't the owner go to a few LOCAL open shows and have some fun.  They may never take the dog to Crufts but then how many first dogs ever get into a champ show anyway?   The emphasis in all the advice about going to shows has been on LEARNING THE ROPES, LEARNING ABOUT COCKER TYPES, HAVING SOME FUN (remember fun?) and  MEETING BREEDERS who would be able to help when the owner is ready for their first Show Quality dog.  This will cost as much or as little as the owner feels they can afford.

since the owner wants to show there is nothing wrong with using the dog to gain some experience and 'be seen' around the cocker ring.She may even meet someone who may mentor her in the future and guide her to a more suitable show prospect next time round

I diasgree. In my experience there is nothing more demoralising than showing a dog that looks absolutely nothing like the others in the ring with you & I really can't see that anyone would enjoy that kind of "being seen" unless they have an astonishingly thick skin! If Acorah seriously is interested in showing, she can still go to shows without her puppy & learn about the breed & meet other exhibitors who can guide her in the future - this is what we did when we realised (very quickly!) that our first pet Cocker was nowhere near the required standard for anything other than exemption shows (and she was at least show-type).

Jane

Some of us don't find losing demoralising....I spent the first 12 months of showing getting thrown out or placed last...and I loved every minute!! ...in fact I think it taught me how to lose with good humour and win graciously!!
I knew my dog was not 'up to standard' and yet chose to waste my money on a pleasant day out 'learning the ropes.
I can see what you mean but I think it depends on what the owner wants/expects from entering.
Archer

Also you will learn how to show your dog, so thereby not ruining the chances of your next better quality dog.

What I ahd meant to say in the grand scheme of thigns we are all wasting our money at shows.  What do we actually get a bit of cardboard, even when we make our dogs into champions.

Ask your non doggy freinds and family they will say we are mad wasting our money.

Then of course lots of people waste money going to teh Pub to meet with theri freinds when a bottle of wine at home would cost a lot less. :D

Archer,

I had the same experience too, the first 18 months of showing I was lucky to be placed last :D :D  I too learned to accept with good grace whatever happened in the ring, but I wouldn't have missed that time for anything, I learned so much about showing.  I never considered the money wasted.  I find it very sad that anyone should be told don't show your dog as it isn't good enough when the dog hasn't actually been seen, and let's not forget that different judges will prefer different dogs.

I have to say that if this is the attitude in Cockers I am very glad not to be showing one, at least in Bedlingtons the working dogs are given a chance in the ring alongside the 'show types' and often do well and win, as it's acknowledged that the dog has to be fit for the purpose it was bred for (and if a working dog isn't fit for the purpose I don't know what is ;) )  And we don't get sniffy if a dog isn't trimmed 'properly' either, everyone has to start somewhere and we're only too glad to encourage and help.

I think there cannot be such a marked difference between the two types then as there is in Cockers.  For what it is worth I think the Show dogs often carry far too much coat for the standard which requires it to be "not too profuse" however show dogs can and do show working ability conversely though the working cocker is bred with absolutely no regard as to looks.  Don't get me wrong I think they a super dogs and often are very attractive, my friend has one that regularly wins prettiest bitch at companion show but they are bred with no regard for breed type and therefore do not lend themselves to any kind of judging in that sphere. True taking any dog to a show will help you learn to loose with good humour but I don't think taking a working cocker will give you the oportunity to learn about winning graciously ;).  If the OP thinks they can hack taking a working bred cocker to a show and enjoy the experience as just a day out then by all means they can do so but they are not going to benefit in terms of learning anything about the dogs faults etc as it just cannot be judged within the same criteriaa, in a way it has no showing faults because it is not a showing dog, if you follow me.  As to learning about the good or bad points of the other dogs I feel this may be better done as an observer unencumbered to wander about the benches, cages whatever chatting and asking for a hands on.
I truely believe no Cocker judge whose opinion is worth having would give this dog a placing and not simply because of the missmark not many of them are super picky about grooming either if the dog is good enough.

Completely agree Isabel ;-) I feel as a cocker person there is a HUGE difference between a working cocker and a show type cocker even down to the point that they are constructed completely different. I haven't shown...yet ;-) but I have spent 3 years going to as many shows as humanely possible, gaining experience and making firm friends and really working out if showing is for me, as it isn't for everyone. I've been to ringcraft (including matches), I've been to companion shows and I've handled a couple of dogs for friends.
The problem is that alot of people don't actually know that there is a distinct difference between show and working (in our breed anyway) They then buy their cocker wondering why it doesn't eventually look anything like the one they've seen in all the books, it happens ALL the time. I don't think anyone intended to offend the OP, only suggested what is more suited to the type of cocker she has, and I think from the post that she genuinely didn't know the difference.

>I have to say that if this is the attitude in Cockers I am very glad not to be showing one

It's not just cockers! If you tried showing most working-bred labradors they'd come 6th in a class of 5!

And yet these are all dogs that originated TO WORK   So the standard would originally have been written describing the working dogs ;)   How tragic then that the dogs which are actually able to do the job they were originally bred for aren't recognisable in the show version :(  

In many cases both sides have gone away from the dogs described by the original standards. Neither side is blameless.

I think this is where interpretation has a lot to answer for.  Doesn't stop it being a shame tho :(