We attend puppy training classes which I mainly wanted for the socialising but they don't let the dogs play off lead, they teach that dogs need to get used to other dogs around them but that the owner is much more fun, so there is no off lead rough and tumble, only on lead(slack lead) polite sniffing etc

As Oscar is a small breed I want him to be well socialised and know how to react to all breeds,with my last puppy(it was 12 years ago) they allowed puppies some free time to play off lead under supervision. Have things changed since then? saying that my last dog did love other dogs and Oscar seems to be not that bothered either way!!

The key to good puppy classes is the trainer knowing what pups can be let off with others. For example, I attended pup classes first at a vets; we had free off lead play and 2 bc pups from the same home bullied the shyer pups and created general mayhem. A boisterous pup such as a boxer could terrify a Sheltie who tend to play very differently, and so on. The young Sheltie could then learn to be overly defensive and snap to keep dogs away, and it would be set up for problems later in life. It's important to let dogs play, (and that includes pups off lead) but not for them to learn bad behaviour such as bullying and chasing the shyer ones. It's all a question of balance.

Pups need to be off lead sometimes because a good game can help with learning about bite inhibition.

It's good that the class is teaching that owners are more fun :) and any good class should be doing this.

>It's good that the class is teaching that owners are more fun  and any good class should be doing this.

I agree 100% with that.  I wish more clubs would run their classes that way.

We do a play time at the end of each class where I work, BUT the shyer ones are kept aways from the really boisterous ones and little ones are not able to be squashed by the larger ones etc... It all depends where ya go. :)

The class we go to is the same. The last 5 mins and only 3 at a time. The trainer pics the 3 that will be best off together.

Glad Caz has raised this point. I too have a shih tzu and have started puppy training classes.  So far it has not gone well. He's ok with me on a leash but when they are all let of leash Taffie is petrified as he is bundled to floor by more than one dog at any one time. ~Last night a disaster. On recall off the leash he headed straight through the gate as if to say I know whats going to happen GET ME OUT OF HERE. This also has happened in the park. He has bee pinned to the floor by other dogs and held down as he has not got the strength or size to stand his ground. Four dogs on top of him last night.I did intervene and remove him from the situation .What I have done is speak to the trainer after class and vented my frustration at the fact the Taffie is being attacked, albeit in play mode ,bythe others and is snapping back. Ok - he's sticking up for himself, but I want to encourage good manners whilst playing. What do I do if for example another pup approaches Taffie in an over zelous manner and pinns him hurts him and Taffie decided enough is enough and he causes damage to the other pup by hanging off their lip/eye. Trainer said the other pups owner should be aware that their dog has approcahed Taffie and he is in defense mode- you try telling them that - they just state there only playing!. Not very positive- would you like to be thrown to the ground and punched pulled thrown to the floor and expect not to be defensive? It's like palyground bullies!!! Taffie reacts completely differently to a milder tempremented dog and plays really nicely. We have problems at the moment getting him to walk on the leash. I can only assume that he associates this with the fact the when the lead goes on it means he going to be in trouble and have to defend himself. Not a very positive experience for him. Trainer has told me to keep him on leash next week as a precaution.HELP!!!!

Tams I am soooooo glad you have realised the possible outcome of your current 'trainer's' methods - so many dogs have learnt that when in a situation that may be potentially threatening they have no course of action barr using their teeth - and often this moves on from dog to dog situations to dog and human ones :(  Please think long and hard about continuing a course with somebody who has so little regard for the eventual outcome of their 'training'....

Try www.puppyschool.co.uk for a trainer near you who definitely will not subject small pups to this kind of problem :)
I would avoid your class from now on, as to be honest, it sounds as if the trainer is causing more harm than good.

Good luck
Lindsay
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